The Saudi Regime Is 2- Faced!

[Thunderian]

I hope you didn't mean iam for Muslim Brotherhood. I actually find them to be Islamic/Arabic Freemasons, in bed with cloak-and-dagger outfits, hiding behind their alms or charitable works. Just like Western Freemasons hide behind their charities. Check out my thread: Fire in the minds of Men.

https://www.vigilantcitizenforums.com/threads/fire-in-the-minds-of-men.604/

Link therein is to an excellent but very long piece. If you don't want to read the whole thing, there is a chapter on MB. We'll talk after that...

Thank you, I`ll watch that later.

If that isn't Baghdadi,(source please) where is he now? How can he evade capture for so long?

He`s dead. An ISIS cleric confirmed it in prayers Friday and was burned to death for it.

As for how he evaded capture, it`s not like he was hiding out in London. He was in undisclosed locations, in ISIS-held territory. Not the easiest guy to find, obviously.

However, he was not the guy who met McCain, because that doesn`t even make any sense. The man who met McCain has been confirmed by many people as Ahmed Hayyad who was with the FSA at the time. I don`t say this to defend Hayyad or the FSA or McCain. As I said, my motivation is truth.

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It used to be that al-Baghdadi was supposed to be this guy:

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... a Mossad agent. Turns out that guy was this guy:

Not a Mossad agent, but some party animal named Motaz Hattar.

People think any picture of a Middle Eastern-looking fellow with thick eyebrows is al-Baghdadi, but al-Baghdadi`s provenance as an Iraqi Islamic terrorist has been confirmed by people who have known him his whole life. People who insist he`s a Mossad agent or whatever are just too lazy to look into it, and as I said, it diminishes the real truth on sites like this when lies like that continue to be posted.

Turkey, a NATO member btw, has been buying oil from ISIS. Where is the outrage or retaliatory action against Turkey? Have the middle men remained so tight-lipped about the main man?

Syria is by far the largest consumer of the oil that ISIS peddles. What do you think should be done?

 

[AspiringSoul]

@Thunderian
must you be so one-sided?

it certainly isn't the guy on the bottom right.

also all other arguments like the identity of this 'simon elliot' or whether or not it's 'baghdadi'
fact remains

-usa is allied with house saud who are allied with the wahabi sect...
-they've used wahabism and their pals in the subcontinent, the fanatical deobandi elements to further their cause in various places
it includes the pakistani general zia ul haq who was hand picked by the saudi regime to head the jordanian army during black september..where thousands of palestinians were killed, once again serving israeli interests.
zia was the guy who transformed pakistan into right-wing state trying to implement the hudood ordinance in a place that didnt want it
creates isi who created taliban and many of the terrorist groups in pakistan today.
These groups have been slaughtering the more spiritually minded muslims left right center.
anyone who's a benefit to muslims, is killed off.

meanwhile, israel
http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Syrian-UNHRC-envoy-Israel-aiding-al-Qaida-linked-terrorists-484676
reported in jewish media ffs
http://www.mintpressnews.com/israel-reconfirms-commitment-to-treating-wounded-syrian-al-nusra-fighters/226714/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3315347/Watch-heart-pounding-moment-Israeli-commandos-save-Islamic-militants-Syrian-warzone-risking-lives-sworn-enemies.html

you know one day you'll be questioned on these matters, why would you purposely believe what mystery babylon is putting out in the media?
you can clearly see they're playing games..and prophecy tells us they deceive the world.

 

[Thunderian]

 

[DesertRose]

President El-Sisi: Egypt’s Antihero and the Broader Regional Implications
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/47360.htm
Excerpt:
"Fifty years on, the war rages on and Israel has a different set of cronies. In sharp contrast to Nasser, el-Sisi, Egypt’s antihero has thrown his lot in with Israel and Saudi Arabia against his Arab brethren. El-Sisi’s betrayal has been so outlandish and stark that even the neocon leaning New York Times published a scathing article titled: “Egypt’s Lost Islands, Sisi’s Shame” by Adhaf Soueif. This is a remarkable piece rarely seen in the pages of the NYT given its reputation (see LOOT for example).

Soueif rightly calls el-Sisi’s to task for handing over the Tiran and Sanafir Islands at the mouth of Gulf of Aqaba to Saudi Arabia. More telling is the fact that the transfer had been discussed with, and had received the blessings of Israel, according to Israel’s Defense Minister Moshe Yaalon. The implications of an Israeli-Saudi-Egyptian alliance are enormous; though hardly the first act of treason by el-Sisi.

In his article Soueif also touches on the dam being built by Ethiopia (the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam) which was opposed to by former President Mohamed Morsi who was ousted in a coup by el-Sisi. It is crucial that this project be further explored as it relates not only to Egypt, but also the past and future politics and geopolitics of the region.



Netanyahu Fostering Extremism And Fascistization; Israel's Former Defense Minister
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/47370.htm
BBC HardTalk

Stephen Sackur speaks to the former Israeli defence minister Moshe Ya'alon, who has become a harsh critic of prime minister Netanyahu.

On the face of it, Israel has achieved a form of stability - led by the same man for eight years, locked in a state of hostile non-communication with the Palestinians, confident of strong support from Washington.

But look a little deeper and cracks appear. Prime minister Netanyahu is under investigation and Israeli society appears ill at ease with itself. How fragile is Israeli unity?

 

[Karlysymon]

K the second wave establishment have no real connections to masonry nor does the general membership.
I agree that Al Afghani may have been suspected as such by some though, and the Creator knows best.
Will check some more.....

That may be true, but i just find them strange (for lack of a better word). They are to Islam what Jesuits are to the Catholicism, maybe not to the same degree and it maybe a poor comparison, but i hope you get the point iam trying to make. Collins' piece aside, Iam just generally wary of orders and brotherhoods. Ofcourse there are people who join these fraternities with a genuine desire to effect positive change but the hierarchy and core ideology always remain problematic or at odds with that positive change.

 

[Karlysymon]

Thank you, I`ll watch that later.



He`s dead. An ISIS cleric confirmed it in prayers Friday and was burned to death for it.

As for how he evaded capture, it`s not like he was hiding out in London. He was in undisclosed locations, in ISIS-held territory. Not the easiest guy to find, obviously.

However, he was not the guy who met McCain, because that doesn`t even make any sense. The man who met McCain has been confirmed by many people as Ahmed Hayyad who was with the FSA at the time. I don`t say this to defend Hayyad or the FSA or McCain. As I said, my motivation is truth.

[/url]

It used to be that al-Baghdadi was supposed to be this guy:

[/url]

... a Mossad agent. Turns out that guy was this guy:

Not a Mossad agent, but some party animal named Motaz Hattar.

People think any picture of a Middle Eastern-looking fellow with thick eyebrows is al-Baghdadi, but al-Baghdadi`s provenance as an Iraqi Islamic terrorist has been confirmed by people who have known him his whole life. People who insist he`s a Mossad agent or whatever are just too lazy to look into it, and as I said, it diminishes the real truth on sites like this when lies like that continue to be posted.



Syria is by far the largest consumer of the oil that ISIS peddles. What do you think should be done?

For some reason, my mind just won't accept that the guy is dead. Even when i read the RT article, it didn't 'register'. If he is, i expect as much jubilation in the US as there was when news broke of Osama's death but its yet to be seen or even a comment from Sean Spicer.

Ofcourse all mainstream publications claim that McCain was meeting with FSA but if you read the article (in my thread) in entirety, you then know he is supporting the rebels to effect regime change, with or without Baghdadi, just as the April 6th Movement got training or help from NED (National Endowment for Democracy), Freedom House, et al. This goes beyond him and the rebels. So who benefits from that desired change? Why was so much invested into the Arab Spring? Certainly not an organic mov't. We all want the truth. Btw, i've never looked at NGO offices the same way i did before the Arab spring.

Really? Syria as the largest consumer of ISIS' oil? I don't think Assad would be dumb enough to enrich the very people who want him dead. Or the fact that when Russia entered the scene, it bombed alot of those oil tankers.

 

[Thunderian]

Sometimes Russia says and does things that are at odds with other things it has said and done, and that's all I can say about that. I wouldn't hang the hat of my argument on their actions or say-so, ever.

As for the oil trade with Syria, ISIS pumps the oil, but has no refining operations, so it's collected by independent contractors who refine it and truck it into Syrian territory. Some goes to Turkey, but the vast majority of it goes to Syria. This is all fairly common knowledge and accounts for millions of dollars in trade each week.

Furthermore, ISIS has kept natural gas pipelines open and is selling it to Syria as well. We know this because they continue to pump it, but instead of going by truck it goes by pre-existing pipes, all of which lead to refineries within Syrian territory. In return, Assad sells electricity to ISIS, which taxes it and makes it available to those within the areas it controls.

 

[Kung Fu]

As for the oil trade with Syria, ISIS pumps the oil, but has no refining operations, so it's collected by independent contractors who refine it and truck it into Syrian territory. Some goes to Turkey, but the vast majority of it goes to Syria. This is all fairly common knowledge and accounts for millions of dollars in trade each week.

Furthermore, ISIS has kept natural gas pipelines open and is selling it to Syria as well. We know this because they continue to pump it, but instead of going by truck it goes by pre-existing pipes, all of which lead to refineries within Syrian territory. In return, Assad sells electricity to ISIS, which taxes it and makes it available to those within the areas it controls.

Unless you really are a Mossad shill everything you have said in this post is conjecture.

 

[DesertRose]

k got what you are saying, ikwan/brotherhood has a different understanding/connotation in Arabic than in English. In English, people could associate it to fraternal orders such as the Jesuit and masonic. I can see that now I also see the push by some to classify them as such which is really strange.
I can see ISRAELI sympathizers pushing for a designation of terrorism.....
labels are for jars.

In Arabic it is based more on the Quranic understanding without a doubt they do not follow the tenets of freemasonry, if they did they would be rejected by mainstream Muslims.
NB: in this speech he says ayuhal Ikwat ul Muslimeen which means "oh you Muslims brothers/sisters."
( This speech shows how Muslims call each other brothers and it is also to showcase that the Al-Saud, the house of Saud did have members that supported Palestine and Islam against aggression and injustice.)

Here is an article by the Brookings institute a US meddler.

"There is not a single American expert on the Muslim Brotherhood who supports designating them as a Foreign Terrorist Organization.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/unpacked/2017/04/11/is-the-muslim-brotherhood-a-terrorist-organization/

 

[Karlysymon]

Sometimes Russia says and does things that are at odds with other things it has said and done, and that's all I can say about that. I wouldn't hang the hat of my argument on their actions or say-so, ever.

As for the oil trade with Syria, ISIS pumps the oil, but has no refining operations, so it's collected by independent contractors who refine it and truck it into Syrian territory. Some goes to Turkey, but the vast majority of it goes to Syria. This is all fairly common knowledge and accounts for millions of dollars in trade each week.

Furthermore, ISIS has kept natural gas pipelines open and is selling it to Syria as well. We know this because they continue to pump it, but instead of going by truck it goes by pre-existing pipes, all of which lead to refineries within Syrian territory. In return, Assad sells electricity to ISIS, which taxes it and makes it available to those within the areas it controls.

I knew you'd bring up independent contractors but put yourself in Assad's shoes for now. Would you actually do what you (sources used) claim him to be doing? It just doesn't make any sense. You do realise that its a chain. ISIS money moves into KSA, european and american banks further enriching the very people trying to pull the rug from under him. Unless its claimed that his actions are a necessary evil, dealing with devil, so to speak. I need sources, please. And Israel has bought that oil too, through Turkey. Obviously, not an outright admission
http://timesofisrael.com/arab-paper-claims-israel-biggest-buyer-of-islamic-state-oil/

@DesertRose
i found some articles that mentioned MB as partly responsible for the current crisis. Its all confusing.

 

[DesertRose]

 

[Thunderian]

I knew you'd bring up independent contractors but put yourself in Assad's shoes for now. Would you actually do what you (sources used) claim him to be doing? It just doesn't make any sense. You do realise that its a chain. ISIS money moves into KSA, european and american banks further enriching the very people trying to pull the rug from under him. Unless its claimed that his actions are a necessary evil, dealing with devil, so to speak. I need sources, please. And Israel has bought that oil too, through Turkey. Obviously, not an outright admission
http://timesofisrael.com/arab-paper-claims-israel-biggest-buyer-of-islamic-state-oil/

@DesertRose
i found some articles that mentioned MB as partly responsible for the current crisis. Its all confusing.

It's pretty convoluted, but the boiled down version is that ISIS sells oil to finance it's caliphate, this oil is then re-sold to some of its enemies, including Syria, the Kurds, Turkey, and even some European nations. They need oil, ISIS needs money, and everybody gets what they need. Just because it's an arrangement that seems counter-intuitive to us doesn't mean it's not taking place. Trade continues, even in war, and it wouldn't be the first time enemies have carried on commerce with each other in the middle of conflict.

It's not as if there are tankers that say ISIS Oilco pulling up at the border with Israel and unloading. It's all done through middle men and yes, there are a lot of people getting rich from it.

One reason we know Assad is using ISIS oil is a pretty big discrepancy between the barrels they use each day and the barrels they buy and/or refine. They aren't really trying to hide it, and as I said, it's pretty common knowledge.

I can post a bunch of articles of you want, but would they convince you? I know from past experience with you that once your mind is made up about something nothing will sway you. Your mind seems pretty made up about this, so I don't know what I could show you to change it.

 

[DesertRose]

Saudi Arabia Has Handed the Emir of Qatar an Opportunity to Redirect History
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2017/07/paul-craig-roberts/saudi-arabia-handed-emir-qatar/


Behind the Scenes at the Saudi-Qatari Pissing Contest
https://www.counterpunch.org/2017/07/03/behind-the-scenes-at-the-saudi-qatari-pissing-contest/

"The Emirates capital city would have to import Liquified Natural Gas (LNG) which it doesn’t have the infrastructure prepared for as well as convert its electrical generators to LNG from natural gas, something that could take over a month to get up and running, no matter the $Billions the Emirates have to throw at the problem.

So the Saudis picking a fight with their long time villains, the Qatari’s, could crash the Emirates economy and put a serious strain on the so called “coalition of the willing”, that is those still committed to the quagmire in Yemen and its assorted crimes, another source of strain between the two allies."

 

[Haich]

For some reason, my mind just won't accept that the guy is dead.

Me too. The news coverage of his death isn't fantastical enough. I expected fireworks and a parade fronted by Trump. Even if the Russians supposedly killed him, there isn't a worldwide celebration, which is what I would've expected.

 

[Thunderian]

@Thunderian
must you be so one-sided?

it certainly isn't the guy on the bottom right.

also all other arguments like the identity of this 'simon elliot' or whether or not it's 'baghdadi'
fact remains

-usa is allied with house saud who are allied with the wahabi sect...
-they've used wahabism and their pals in the subcontinent, the fanatical deobandi elements to further their cause in various places
it includes the pakistani general zia ul haq who was hand picked by the saudi regime to head the jordanian army during black september..where thousands of palestinians were killed, once again serving israeli interests.
zia was the guy who transformed pakistan into right-wing state trying to implement the hudood ordinance in a place that didnt want it
creates isi who created taliban and many of the terrorist groups in pakistan today.
These groups have been slaughtering the more spiritually minded muslims left right center.
anyone who's a benefit to muslims, is killed off.

meanwhile, israel
http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Syrian-UNHRC-envoy-Israel-aiding-al-Qaida-linked-terrorists-484676
reported in jewish media ffs
http://www.mintpressnews.com/israel-reconfirms-commitment-to-treating-wounded-syrian-al-nusra-fighters/226714/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3315347/Watch-heart-pounding-moment-Israeli-commandos-save-Islamic-militants-Syrian-warzone-risking-lives-sworn-enemies.html

you know one day you'll be questioned on these matters, why would you purposely believe what mystery babylon is putting out in the media?
you can clearly see they're playing games..and prophecy tells us they deceive the world.

Apparently al-Baghdadi played guitar for Oasis until 1999. Here he is with Liam Gallagher.

 

[DesertRose]

@Karlysymon, Islam and Freemasonry are diametrically opposed.
The Order of the Temple of Solomon changed their name to Free Masons they have secret rites and rituals.(based on the kabalah)
(think crusades)

 

[Karlysymon]

It's pretty convoluted, but the boiled down version is that ISIS sells oil to finance it's caliphate, this oil is then re-sold to some of its enemies, including Syria, the Kurds, Turkey, and even some European nations. They need oil, ISIS needs money, and everybody gets what they need. Just because it's an arrangement that seems counter-intuitive to us doesn't mean it's not taking place. Trade continues, even in war, and it wouldn't be the first time enemies have carried on commerce with each other in the middle of conflict.

It's not as if there are tankers that say ISIS Oilco pulling up at the border with Israel and unloading. It's all done through middle men and yes, there are a lot of people getting rich from it.

One reason we know Assad is using ISIS oil is a pretty big discrepancy between the barrels they use each day and the barrels they buy and/or refine. They aren't really trying to hide it, and as I said, it's pretty common knowledge.

I can post a bunch of articles of you want, but would they convince you? I know from past experience with you that once your mind is made up about something nothing will sway you. Your mind seems pretty made up about this, so I don't know what I could show you to change it.

That is a huge assumption to make here. I haven't made up my mind about this at all. Just trying to wrap my head around what you said, that Assad has no choice but to deal with the devil. Ofcourse we are both arm-chair analysts here. You aren't on the ground and neither am i. To me,its totally crazy if infact that is what's happening.

Its also interesting to note that in the list of parties you mentioned, Israel didn't show up. Can you atleast publicly admit that they've bought the oil, indirectly, through the middle-men? Because if you claim that, that hasn't happened in all these years, then it makes it all the more questionable given ISIS is selling the oil at rock bottom prices. How then would Israeli oil companies pass up on that simply because its 'the enemy'? Isn't the bottom line more important? Also, if european countries are buying from their sworn enemy, why enrich 'him'? They should know better by strangling ISIS economically. But no, it remains business as usual, while crying foul over Manchester and Bataclan. Turkey should have been expelled aeons ago from NATO for supporting terrorism but everyone seems to be sitting on their hands. Odd, if you ask me.

@DesertRose
i hear you sister. But are you willing to entertain the idea of a partnership with intelligence agencies? Since you brought up the crusades (not trying to argue with you here), did you know that lots of generals ,on both sides, of the American civil war were Freemasons? Inotherwords, after a day on the battlefied, they'd all end up in the lodge and laugh away the day's events. Enemies huh? We live in one crazy world! And iam glad you brought that up because one gets to examine that chapter of history in a new light.

 

[Thunderian]

Its also interesting to note that in the list of parties you mentioned, Israel didn't show up. Can you atleast publicly admit that they've bought the oil, indirectly, through the middle-men?

I am pretty sure that I did.

It's not as if there are tankers that say ISIS Oilco pulling up at the border with Israel and unloading. It's all done through middle men and yes, there are a lot of people getting rich from it.

 

[Karlysymon]

I am pretty sure that I did.

Iam sorry. My bad.

 

[Thunderian]

Iam sorry. My bad.

I'm sorry for assuming your mind is made up.

You do keep a firm grip on your beliefs, though.