Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible [part 3]

[JoChris]

First, the link to helpful reference lists from the second thread.

Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible (part 2)

This is a continuation of the examination of an e-book that is repeatedly recommended by a new religion's believers. JAHtruth is the religion, Anthony John Hill is the founder. Part one here --- In this first entry, I am re-posting links that are essential to have either in reference or at...

vigilantcitizenforums.com

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The ebook being dissected is JAHtruth's ebook " The way home or face the fire".

English readers need to use the King James Version because that version is the one Anthony John Hill deliberately "mistranslated" to create "King of Kings".
AJH has given NO sign of ANY knowledge of ancient biblical languages or Arabic either.

@A Freeman said this is Anthony John Hill in the previous thread.

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AJH starts to introduce his version of theology more in Chapter 4.

It should not need to be said, but it does unfortunately.

No matter how much patchwork quilting AJH did to make it appear he was cross-referencing the Quran, the Quran will never be part of the bible.

All of the 66 books later chosen to make up the bible was finished by the end of the 1st century AD. History of the bible timeline - Learn Religions

The Quran did not exist until the 7th century AD at the earliest. History of the Quran - Wikipedia.

The Gospel of Thomas is a Gnostic bible. Britannica - Gospel of Thomas

Gospel of Thomas, apocryphal (noncanonical) gospel containing 114 sayings attributed to the resurrected Jesus, written in the mid-2nd century......
The Gospel of Thomas is grounded in gnosticism, the philosophical and religious movement of the 2nd century CE that stressed the redemptive power of esoteric knowledge acquired by divine revelation. Indeed, warnings against it as heretical were made by the Church Fathers in the 2nd–4th century.

The Book of Enoch is quoted in Jude, but it is not part of the bible.

 

[JoChris]

For further research, the evangelical Christian viewpoint on the Book of Genesis: Answers in Genesis is a good place to start.
Their Youtube channel. https://www.youtube.com/user/answersvideos

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The Book of Genesis is the first book of the Bible. When useful, I quote from the KJV bible/ give Christian worldview before showing and addressing what "the way home or face the fire" says.

Genesis chapter 1.

For a very basic overview of the first book:

 

[JoChris]

When I quote the KoK it will be in red for contrast reasons (partly) @A Freeman.

Genesis 1: 1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

Genesis 1:1 By periods (headships) God created the heaven and the earth. https://jahtruth.net/kofk-free/01.htm

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Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

4:1 Once the prison, and the human-animals, had been designed and created, and the souls locked inside, God started the teaching and testing process.
Compare Genesis chapters 1-2.

Gnosticism creation myth
....
To very briefly summarize that underlying model: God the Father gave rise to a host of spiritual beings (“aeons“) who populated Heaven (which the Gnostics called the Pleroma, “Fullness”), including a divine Mother and Christ. One of the last of these beings to emanate from the Father, Sophia, gave birth to a new being on her own, without the involvement of her partner or the approval of the Father. The being born under such circumstances was nothing like the perfect inhabitants of the Pleroma; instead, he was ignorant and malevolent. This was the demiurge, “craftsman,” whom the Gnostics identified with the god of the Old Testament. He created the material world to mirror his own wicked personality and trapped sparks of divinity, fragments of the Pleroma, within humans. It was then up to Christ to awaken humans to their true nature and liberate them from the world.....

 

[JoChris]

Whole Genesis chapter 3

3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.


4:2 The first and very simple test, was in the Garden of Eden, when the devil tempted Eve (woman), with the apple. The devil told Eve, that, if she ate the apple, she would become like God (another lie) (Genesis 3:5).

That is AJH's interpretation.
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6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

4:3 Being closer to the devil, than Adam (man); on a spiritual level, and having less will-power (the will is the eye of the soul), and therefore more easily used by the devil;

Nowhere in the bible does it say that Eve was closer to the devil spiritually or had less willpower.

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1 Timothy 2:13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.


she gave-in to temptation, disobeyed God and ate the apple. Satan tempted Eve first; instead of tempting Adam; because he knew that she would be more likely to give-in, than Adam. Eve, having failed her own test, was not content with that, she had to get Adam into trouble, too.

AJH alleged Eve knew she had failed.
AJH blamed Eve for the Fall.

God held Adam responsible, unlike AJH does. The image deserved being posted twice.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

“4:1 Once the prison, and the human-animals, had been designed and created, and the souls locked inside, God started the teaching and testing process. “

@A Freeman - is there a reason why you don’t include Mormonism in your unification of religion? It might be a more comfortable fit, (with its legalism, works salvation and pre-existent souls) than trying to make the square peg of Christianity fit into the round hole of AJH’s teachings, which seem most like a very pessimistic version of Mormonism than anything else?

 

[JoChris]

The legalism and hatred of the body can be quite extreme among Gnostics!
Please read the article, there are so many quote worthy sentences that are directly relevant to TWHOFTF!!!!

Gnosticism
An Assessment and Impact on the Church
Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow
By Billy C. Sichone


Central Africa Baptist Church

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

The legalism and hatred of the body can be quite extreme among Gnostics!
Please read the article, there are so many quote worthy sentences that are directly relevant to TWHOFTF!!!!

Gnosticism
An Assessment and Impact on the Church
Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow
By Billy C. Sichone


Central Africa Baptist Church

You can certainly see how pride, asceticism, legalism and Gnosticism are related.

You can see why Irenaeus wrote five volumes in his series “Against Heresies”!

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@JoChris

You reminded me of a topic I had a look at a while back:

Sophia and the Archons - Lucifer in a dress?

@Kais_1 mentioned "Sophia and the Archons" to me some time ago, and I must admit it sounded like a children's cartoon series. Turns out it wasn't... If you have a Christian background it is sometimes hard to make sense of what Gnostics even believe so it it worth getting the facts. Many Gnostic...

vigilantcitizenforums.com

 

[The Sojourner]

First, the link to helpful reference lists from the second thread.

Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible (part 2)

This is a continuation of the examination of an e-book that is repeatedly recommended by a new religion's believers. JAHtruth is the religion, Anthony John Hill is the founder. Part one here --- In this first entry, I am re-posting links that are essential to have either in reference or at...

vigilantcitizenforums.com

----
The ebook being dissected is JAHtruth's ebook " The way home or face the fire".

English readers need to use the King James Version because that version is the one Anthony John Hill deliberately "mistranslated" to create "King of Kings".
AJH has given NO sign of ANY knowledge of ancient biblical languages or Arabic either.

@A Freeman said this is Anthony John Hill in the previous thread.

----
AJH starts to introduce his version of theology more in Chapter 4.

It should not need to be said, but it does unfortunately.

No matter how much patchwork quilting AJH did to make it appear he was cross-referencing the Quran, the Quran will never be part of the bible.

All of the 66 books later chosen to make up the bible was finished by the end of the 1st century AD. History of the bible timeline - Learn Religions

The Quran did not exist until the 7th century AD at the earliest. History of the Quran - Wikipedia.

The Gospel of Thomas is a Gnostic bible. Britannica - Gospel of Thomas

Gospel of Thomas, apocryphal (noncanonical) gospel containing 114 sayings attributed to the resurrected Jesus, written in the mid-2nd century......
The Gospel of Thomas is grounded in gnosticism, the philosophical and religious movement of the 2nd century CE that stressed the redemptive power of esoteric knowledge acquired by divine revelation. Indeed, warnings against it as heretical were made by the Church Fathers in the 2nd–4th century.

The Book of Enoch is quoted in Jude, but it is not part of the bible.

The Book of Enoch is also quoted by Jesus, as was shown in the previous thread, but you left that out.
It's also not up to you to decide if the Quran is part of the Bible or not.
That may be your opinion, but opinion does not stand above FACT.
You also can't make it appear that you are cross referencing something, because you either did it, or you did not.

 

[JoChris]

The Book of Enoch is also quoted by Jesus, as was shown in the previous thread, but you left that out.
It's also not up to you to decide if the Quran is part of the Bible or not.
That may be your opinion, but opinion does not stand above FACT.
You also can't make it appear that you are cross referencing something, because you either did it, or you did not.
I hoped, but you do not appear to be even trying to be honest anymore.

Please give Bible quote where Jesus quoted from the Book of **ENOCH**.
The book of Genesis is not the book of Enoch.

The Quran was not, is not, and will NEVER be part of the Bible.
It doesn't matter how many words are used, how much they are repeated or how convincing the argument may be to undiscerning people:
Truth does not change just because you want it to do so.

P.S instead of simply dismissing what I say, how about you find some reputable non AJH- believing historians or non-JAHtruth Bibles/ Qur'ans who also cross-link the Bible and Qur'an because THEY also believe they fit together?

 

[The Sojourner]

Please give Bible quote where Jesus quoted from the Book of **ENOCH**.
The book of Genesis is not the book of Enoch.

I showed that here:

Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible (part 2)

That is what JAHtruth says, and you now believe. The bible is correct and the quran is correct - only if AJH says so and if his pseudo-translation KoK says so. Not only if AJH says so. It is so, regardless of what anyone says, or likes to think, simply because it has to be. He does say it...

vigilantcitizenforums.com

The Quran was not, is not, and will NEVER be part of the Bible.
It doesn't matter how many words are used, how much they are repeated or how convincing the argument may be to undiscerning people:
Truth does not change just because you want it to do so.

That is a matter of opinion. I have read both and believe they are both from God, The Lord of the Universe.

P.S instead of simply dismissing what I say, how about you find some reputable non AJH- believing historians or non-JAHtruth Bibles/ Qur'ans who also cross-link the Bible and Qur'an because THEY also believe they fit together?

Here is one group that I found:

Submit to God in the Religion of Abraham - Qur'anic Warners

Warns of the Last Day and guides with only verses [no personal talking] from the religion of Abraham: the Qur'an, the Gospel, and the Torah

quranicwarners.org

 

[JoChris]

@thesojourner, what do you know - there actually IS a cross-referenced bible-quran app, at least in progress!!!!

Bible Quran App – Contains over 3000 Cross-Referenced Verses from the Qur'an and the Bible

However the motive is similar to AJH's:

Drs. Kaskas’ and Hungerford’s underlying motivation for the translation and inclusion of the extensive footnotes are not intended to promote a particular school of Islam or Christian apologetics. These exist in abundance.
Their goal is to build bridges of better understanding, undermine radicalism and enlighten ignorance.

The King of kings' Bible - Contents

Because of the dire situation in the world, with the objective of ending all conflict and establishing World Peace and God's Kingdom on Earth, The King of kings' Bible has been made available for free online reading, by The King of kings.

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This morning, I will try to find an actual bible-quran cross reference source whose motive is TRUTH (no matter what), not improved relationships between Muslims and Christians.
If I can't do that after two hours of searching I ask for interested surfers to pick up the job.

i.e. identical to JAHtruth's format. Not a search keyword variety.

 

[JoChris]

I showed that here:

Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible (part 2)

That is what JAHtruth says, and you now believe. The bible is correct and the quran is correct - only if AJH says so and if his pseudo-translation KoK says so. Not only if AJH says so. It is so, regardless of what anyone says, or likes to think, simply because it has to be. He does say it...

vigilantcitizenforums.com

That is a matter of opinion. I have read both and believe they are both from God, The Lord of the Universe.


Here is one group that I found:

Submit to God in the Religion of Abraham - Qur'anic Warners

Warns of the Last Day and guides with only verses [no personal talking] from the religion of Abraham: the Qur'an, the Gospel, and the Torah

quranicwarners.org

People have been converted to all types of religions from their own personal belief/ feelings.

Didn't you do engineering or something like that? If yes, you most certainly know you have to go on facts and objective measurements, not gut feelings or intuition.

 

[e-Enoch]

Revelation 22:18

King James Version

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

 

[The Sojourner]

@thesojourner, what do you know - there actually IS a cross-referenced bible-quran app, at least in progress!!!!

Bible Quran App – Contains over 3000 Cross-Referenced Verses from the Qur'an and the Bible

However the motive is similar to AJH's:

Drs. Kaskas’ and Hungerford’s underlying motivation for the translation and inclusion of the extensive footnotes are not intended to promote a particular school of Islam or Christian apologetics. These exist in abundance.
Their goal is to build bridges of better understanding, undermine radicalism and enlighten ignorance.

The King of kings' Bible - Contents

Because of the dire situation in the world, with the objective of ending all conflict and establishing World Peace and God's Kingdom on Earth, The King of kings' Bible has been made available for free online reading, by The King of kings.

---
This morning, I will try to find an actual bible-quran cross reference source whose motive is TRUTH (no matter what), not improved relationships between Muslims and Christians.
If I can't do that after two hours of searching I ask for interested surfers to pick up the job.

Wow! Thank you @JoChris , I will definitely be checking that out. I only knew of the Quranicwarners.org site, that they had also done it - cross-referencing the Bible and the Quran.

Before either of these, I only knew of JAH having done it with the King of kings' Bible. I think this is VERY good news!!
(As far as I know, JAH was the first person in the entire world to have ever done it.)

Now, there are at least 2 more others, that have also done it, and I will definitely look into them. Joy!

 

[The Sojourner]

People have been converted to all types of religions from their own personal belief/ feelings.

Didn't you do engineering or something like that? If yes, you most certainly know you have to go on facts and objective measurements, not gut feelings or intuition.

Yes, I did. That's why that post was done to prove it. Jesus quoted teachings that are only found in Enoch, like the one about the angels. That particular teaching is not in Genesis.

 

[JoChris]

Yes, I did. That's why that post was done to prove it. Jesus quoted teachings that are only found in Enoch, like the one about the angels. That particular teaching is not in Genesis.

Can you give the bible quote from the King James Bible please?
Biblegateway website

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For early stage searches, I often go to archive.org because it is a massive library. You will not get results from Google to come here unless you give archive.org in your search.

It is somewhat unlikely that out of copyright Qurans will give bible references, but just in case: quran (limited to English) results

 

[The Sojourner]

Can you give the bible quote from the King James Bible please?
Biblegateway website

---
For early stage searches, I often go to archive.org because it is a massive library. You will not get results from Google to come here unless you give archive.org in your search.

It is somewhat unlikely that out of copyright Qurans will give bible references, but just in case: quran (limited to English) results

Mark 12:24-25

King James Version


24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?

25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.


That teaching is only found in Enoch, and nowhere else in the Bible, and Jesus said to them that they erred, not knowing the Scriptures.

The passage where that comes from, is in 1st Enoch 15. I gave the link to it there in that post, if anyone wanted to look.

 

[JoChris]

Wow! Thank you @JoChris , I will definitely be checking that out. I only knew of the Quranicwarners.org site, that they had also done it - cross-referencing the Bible and the Quran.

Before either of these, I only knew of JAH having done it with the King of kings' Bible. I think this is VERY good news!!
(As far as I know, JAH was the first person in the entire world to have ever done it.)

Now, there are at least 2 more others, that have also done it, and I will definitely look into them. Joy!

You need to look at results way more carefully.

It gives multiple Gnostism "bible" books. That removes it immediately as a trustworthy source.

Look at the Gospels link. https://quranicwarners.org/gospel/#read

Infancy Gospel of Thomas, Gospel of Barnabas, Epistle of Barnabas, Shephard of Hermas.

 

[e-Enoch]

Bible Search and Study Tools - Blue Letter Bible

www.blueletterbible.org