Prophetic Expectations
- Thread starter Red Sky at Morning
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Red Sky at Morning
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I am not scared of bogeyman under my bed, but I am scared of big wasps in the garden.
You should only be scared of things that could really happen ;-)
Bacsi
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That was exactly my point.
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I actually watched both videos and enjoyed them. I'll probably watch more of him. I think he's exactly what's needed as a link between the pig-headed, lost, so-called Jews and Christianity, especially the super-lost Talmudic Jews.. I would bet Porat's ministry has helped get many Jews converted. Since Porat doesn't rightly divide, he's not that knowledgeable about the NT. He still has at least a few toes in Judaism, but that's great, with his calling. If he knew more, he wouldn't be able to do what God has obviously called him to do - preach Christ Jesus to Jews. Since he doesn't rightly divide, he probably won't see the truth in Paul's post-Acts books and, thus, probably won't go the heaven, but, if he ends up being resurrected in the Land, along with the early nation Israel, he will probably be in a better position to do a great job for our Lord.
The 1st video is on Carl Gallup's channel. I've been reading on a Carl Gallup book, Gods and Thrones, for about 6 months, and still am only about halfway through it. It's a fascinating book, but the subject matter is less important, to me, than the other 10 books I'm presently wading through. Every 2 or 3 months. I pick up a supply of free bookmarks from the library.
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Karlysymon
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That is comforting. That in your eyes, iam not a full-blown heretic that should have been pilloried like two days ago
Its not about hating on Israel. This is where iam coming from.That relationship is just way too intimate to not hint at something deeper.
I mean, if Hillary had been elected President, she'd continue 'blessing' Israel with billions, despite her spirit cooking.
For me this is too glaring to ignore. Ex:The language is pretty much the same, so who stole from whom?
And pg 52 of this
1 Timothy 1:15
This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
Red Sky at Morning
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It is one thing to have an awareness of prophetic possibilities and another to "push" for military fulfilment. The Rapture will take place precisely when the Lord determines, regardless of human military or political efforts!!!That is comforting. That in your eyes, iam not a full-blown heretic that should have been pilloried like two days ago
Its not about hating on Israel. This is where iam coming from.That relationship is just way too intimate to not hint at something deeper.
I mean, if Hillary had been elected President, she'd continue 'blessing' Israel with billions, despite her spirit cooking.
For me this is too glaring to ignore. Ex:The language is pretty much the same, so who stole from whom?
And pg 52 of this
1 Timothy 1:15
This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
rainerann
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Not to mention that it is illegal for Israel to develop nuclear weapons without disclosing this information to the US while they are receiving aid from the United States. There was a lawsuit about this, which I don't know much about yet, but I would love to hear something good come out of pursuing accountability for this violation.That is comforting. That in your eyes, iam not a full-blown heretic that should have been pilloried like two days ago
Its not about hating on Israel. This is where iam coming from.That relationship is just way too intimate to not hint at something deeper.
I mean, if Hillary had been elected President, she'd continue 'blessing' Israel with billions, despite her spirit cooking.
For me this is too glaring to ignore. Ex:The language is pretty much the same, so who stole from whom?
"The lawsuit warns that the U.S. gave Israel about $234 billion in foreign aid since the passage of the International Security Assistance and Arms Export Control Act of 1976, despite a ban on support for secret nuclear weapons programs."
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/46882.htm
It was confirmed that Colin Powell knew about Israel's nuclear program through leaked emails. All of this is somewhat old news at this point. Yet, Israel is still getting aid and pursuing the development of nuclear weapons without disclosing this information and there is no mention on MSM about that changing anytime soon. Are we all drunk?
"For all the nations have drunk the wine of her sexual immorality, which brings wrath. The kings of the earth have committed sexual immorality with her, and the merchants of the earth have grown wealthy from her excessive luxury. " (Revelation 18:3).
"After decades in which Israel has stuck to a doctrine of nuclear ambiguity, Mr Olmert let slip during an interview in Germany that Israel did indeed have weapons of mass destruction."http://www.twf.org/News/Y2006/1213-IsraelsNukes.html
The World's Most Secretive Nuclear Weapons Program (No, Not North Korea)
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/the-worlds-most-secretive-nuclear-weapons-program-no-not-24922
Israel has '200 nukes all pointed at Iran', former US secretary of state Colin Powell says in leaked private email that has Washington on edge
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3793582/Powell-discusses-secret-Israeli-nukes-leaked-2015-email.html#ixzz5Ez0HrZcq
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
"People worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, "Who is like the beast? Who can wage war against it?"(Revelation 13:4).
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Karlysymon
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I think there's been a little bit of this. The PTB create so much chaos, emotionally exhausting the average person, who then clamours for a saviour. Trump, pretty much was elected as a result of the above, yet there's not much of a divergence regarding policies. Apparently, the Bluebeam project will be activated after an economic collapse, what one financial analyst called, "a rollercoaster through hell." Which makes sense because then, people will be so desperate for relief, regardless of the source: terrestrial or extraterrestrial. Hence being ripe for deception.
Couldn't agree more. Even though he is a powerful being, thankfully, there are limitations, things he is incapable of. So this is where technology might be employed. He cannot simultaneously appear across the globe (the Mona Lisa was beamed into space not too long ago), nor fake a mass resurrection of the dead, nor put out out the lights,(the sun will grow dark, moon will not give its light and stars will fall), which will affect the entire solar system. If the sun grows dark, so will other planets be deprived of a source of light and heat. Jupiter's 67 moons won't give off light, as moons don't have their own light but only reflect the sun's.
Joel 2:10
The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:
The Grand Hoax - the absolute total lie that Israel becoming a nation in 1948 was a result of the fulfillment of prophecy. Israel has not existed in God's eyes for 1950 years, due to their failure to accept Jesus Christ. All prophecy and, therefore, all fulfillment of prophecy, involves Israel and, since there has been no Israel for 1950 years, it is impossible that any prophecy has been fulfilled in the last 1950 years. Plus, the Satanic Talmudic Jews, the children of the Pharisees, but 100 times worse, surely are totally unacceptable to God, due to their total reliance on oral tradition, which always makes God's Word of none effect. When God does finally fulfill this prophecy, and move the true Israel into the land, everyone in the world will know it. It will be nothing like the fake Israel that is there now. Here's a quote from something I'm reading that I agree with completely.
"The Israeli government, today, is made up of unbelieving Jews administering a socialistic government which depends mostly upon the U.S.A. for its sustenance. When the true descendants of the three Patriarchs occupy the Land, they will depend on the LORD their God, and in no-one else will they trust. They will be totally dependent upon the Lord Jesus Christ. And, He will meet every need of His re-gathered people."
"The Israeli government, today, is made up of unbelieving Jews administering a socialistic government which depends mostly upon the U.S.A. for its sustenance. When the true descendants of the three Patriarchs occupy the Land, they will depend on the LORD their God, and in no-one else will they trust. They will be totally dependent upon the Lord Jesus Christ. And, He will meet every need of His re-gathered people."
Well i've been searching the Scriptures and found that after 2000 years God would bring His people back into His land.
Leviticus 25:23 "'The land shall not be sold permanently, for the land is Mine; for you are strangers and sojourners with Me.'"
Hosea 6:1"Come, and let us return to the LORD; for He has torn, but He will heal us; He has stricken, but He will bind us up. 2After two days He will revive us; on the third day He will raise us up, that we may live in His sight."
2Peter 3:8"But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."
Red Sky at Morning
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I know, there are many more verses besides. It comes down to how you view a number of issues regarding prophecy, "rightly dividing" etc. Some things only come to us as the Lord reveals them.
I found this video helpful on the topic...
Karlysymon
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I've always read Hosea 6:2 as a reference to the Resurrection but reading it alongside 2 Peter gives it a new and interesting angle that I've never seen before.
So the decision to "return to the Lord" in verse 1, is it a spiritual return or merely physical? Seeing as its often said that the Jews are still steeped in unbelief but will come around soon enough. And if it isn't a spiritual revival, where are the verses exclusively describing the spiritual rebirth?
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Karlysymon is one person that's on a very short list of people on this forum that speak truth. I would hate to see her/him get sucked into your inaccuracies concerning the fake Israel of today.
The Hosea quote is valid, but you've used the wrong 2000 years.The 2000 years period we're in now, fits your quotes far, far better than the 1st 2000 year period you're using. In this present 2000 year all Gentile period, starting when Israel lost their temple in 70AD, there has been NO Israel, in God's eyes. Israel will ALWAYS have to keep the law, even on the New Earth. Today, with no temple, one reason they are not God's people, is because they can't keep the law. However, this present period, for the collection of saved Gentiles to occupy Heaven, will be over in about 50 years, at which time, Israel will be back on the scene and prophecy will again be fulfilled, probably starting with that revival from your quote in Hosea 6. In Hosea 1, the present 2000 years is spoken of as a period when Israel is Loammi, not my people.
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Red Sky at Morning
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Well... Another question ...
To who or what does Ezekiel 37s vision of the dry bones refer to? How long do the bones stay dry? Does it take a miracle (whilst said bones are in situ) to change things?
The hand of the Lord was upon me, and carried me out in the spirit of the Lord, and set me down in the midst of the valley which was full of bones,
2 And caused me to pass by them round about: and, behold, there were very many in the open valley; and, lo, they were very dry.
3 And he said unto me, Son of man, can these bones live? And I answered, O Lord God, thou knowest.
4 Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the Lord.
5 Thus saith the Lord God unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the Lord.
7 So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone.
8 And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them.
9 Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord God; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live.
10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.
11 Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13 And ye shall know that I am the Lord, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the Lord have spoken it, and performed it, saith the Lord.
First a physical return... and when the fullness of the Gentiles has come in... then a spiritual one as well.
Romans 11:25"For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
26And so all Israel will be saved,as it is written:
'The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.'
28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.
29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
30For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience,
31even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy.
32For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all."
Red Sky at Morning
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I found these perspectives interesting on the question of whether God has finished with the Jews...
God Has Not Rejected the Jews
by Loren Jacobs | Mar 1, 1985
Have you ever heard someone say, The Jews rejected Christ, so God has rejected the Jews”? That statement contradicts the teaching of Scripture. In the 11th chapter of Romans, starting with verse one, the Apostle Paul gives a seven-fold rebuttal of this “rejection idea” when he writes, “…Hath God cast away his people? God forbid…”
The Covenantal Argument
The first refutation of the “rejection idea” appears in Romans 11:1 in the use of the word “his.” Paul refers to Israel as still being God’s people. Since Paul obviously wrote Romans after the Crucifixion and Resurrection, this indicates that there remains a special covenantal relationship between God and Israel, even though Israel as a nation did not recognize her Messiah. God’s promises do not fail. In Jeremiah 31:35-37 God promises that as long as the sun, moon and stars continue to exist, the seed of Israel will remain a special nation before him.
The Biographical Argument
Paul writes further in Romans 11:1, “…For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.” Here Paul argues that his own encounter as a Jew with the living Christ, and his subsequent calling to preach the gospel are evidence that the Jews are still God’s people.
The Theological Argument
Paul’s third refutation, based on the foreknowledge of God, is found in Romans 11:2a: “God hath not cast away his people whom he foreknew.” It came as no surprise to the Almighty that all Israel did not accept his Messiah. In fact it was predicted in the Old Testament. Isaiah wrote, “He is despised and rejected…he was despised, and we esteemed him not” (53:3). God knew that this would happen, and Israel’s rejection of the Messiah was part of his universal plan. (Read Acts 2:23 and 4:28 and Romans 11:11 and 25.)
The Historical Argument
The fourth refutation is historical, from Romans 11:2b-10. Paul argues here that it has always been just a minority within Israel that has been faithful to God. This minority is called the “remnant.” Paul gives four examples of this remnant: in Elijah’s day, in Paul’s own day (the Apostles and early church up to Acts 10), in Moses’ day and in David’s day.
The Argument of Origins
Paul’s fifth refutation appears in Romans 11:16. Paul argues that good beginnings result in good endings: the Jewish people and the promises and covenants to the fathers were good; they will eventually result in a good conclusion.
The Botanical Argument
The sixth refutation of the idea that God has rejected Israel as his people is found in Romans 11:17-24. Paul here argues “botanically.” He says that it is natural for the natural branch (the Jews) to be grafted back into the original olive tree. If God can graft a wild olive branch (the Gentiles) into a cultivated olive tree, it’s easy to expect him to graft back the natural branches.
The Prophetic Argument
The seventh refutation is found in Romans 11:25-27. Here Paul (undoubtedly from his knowledge of Hebrew Scripture) argues that Israel’s hardening is only partial and temporary, for there is coming a time when God will once again resume his dealing with Israel—when the fullness of the Gentiles has come in, and all Israel will be saved (see Zechariah 12:10). Who is the Israel of Romans 11:26? It is the same Israel of verse 25 which has been partially blinded.
Conclusion
From these seven arguments in Romans 11, we draw the following conclusions to state that God has not rejected the Jewish people:
Covenantally: Israel is still God’s earthly people.
Biographically: Paul, himself an Israelite, was called and used mightily of God.
Theologically: Israel’s general unbelief was in God’s foreknowledge and part of his universal plan of salvation.
Historically: there has always been just a faithful minority within Israel, the “remnant.”
The logic of origins: grace beginnings result in grace endings; Israel’s ultimate destiny is to be in God’s grace.
The botanical metaphor: we can expect that Israel, the natural branch, will be grafted back into the olive tree.
Prophetically: all Israel eventually will be saved in the end times (Romans 11:15) because the entire nation of Israel will then turn to her Savior according to Zechariah, chapter 12.
God said He always has a remnant, but I don't know about this parenthetical period we live in.
Romans 11, written about Acts 20, is where the mid-Acts Dispensationalists claim that it is said that Israel has been set aside. That is why this Christian or Messianic Rabbi (What does that mean? Isn't that an oxymoron?) picked it out. However, no one told Paul about that, because he continued going on as normal, going to the Jew first and trying to convert them., so Christ would return and start Israel's Kingdom. As late as Acts 28, Paul spent an entire day trying to convert a bunch of Pharisees, the religious leaders of Israel.
The real setting aside of Israel came in Acts 28:28, several years after Romans was written. The salvation of God was taken from Israel and passed to the Gentiles. Paul's post-Acts books are all Gentile, with a brand new Church and a brand new Calling - Heaven. No one during Acts had a calling of Heaven. In Paul's Acts books, the word Abraham was used 19 times and the phrase, "it is written", 31 times. In his 7 post-Acts books, neither is used once. Israel hasn't existed in 1950years.
One learns something every day. In actuality, in this 2000 year period we're now living in, there is no Jew and no Gentile. Every person is treated by Gpd as an individual. No nations. No National privileges at all.
Had the late Mr. Jacob used Ac 28 as the real time for Israel's demise, for his argument, instead of the obviously fake Rom 11, it would have been impossible for him to make a case.
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Matthew 24:32"'Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near.'"
The Pulpit Commentary is a commentary on the Bible published in 1880. And on Matthew 24:32 the commentators end their commentary on this verse with a question: "Did he [Jesus] intend to symbolize the revival of the life of the withered Jewish race in the time of the end?"
In 1880 the Jews were a withered race and in 1945 they were dead. Game over.
And so God asked Ezekiel: "'Son of man can these bones live ?'"
It is an absolute miracle (and that's an understatement) that the Jews are now not only back but flourishing
The Pulpit Commentary is a commentary on the Bible published in 1880. And on Matthew 24:32 the commentators end their commentary on this verse with a question: "Did he [Jesus] intend to symbolize the revival of the life of the withered Jewish race in the time of the end?"
In 1880 the Jews were a withered race and in 1945 they were dead. Game over.
And so God asked Ezekiel: "'Son of man can these bones live ?'"
It is an absolute miracle (and that's an understatement) that the Jews are now not only back but flourishing
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Paul conversed with the risen Christ and even went to the third Heaven and so he has an unusual high understanding of the spiritual side of reality.
And what he is trying to drive home here according to my ability to understand is that a member of God's people has a Christlike mindset which is love compassion mercy goodness etc etc instead of just ritualistically follow the letter of the law.
Serveto
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I appreciate your explanation, but Paul says, very clearly, that they are not Jews who are Jews outwardly and are circumcised in the flesh. I don't think it takes the gift of prophecy -or any gift, other than the ability to understand a letter originally written to Romans in Greek and translated by the KJV into English- to understand Paul in this case.
At what point in scripture did he do an about-face and either say or imply, if not in so many words, that, when they coalesce into an ethnocracy, or nation state, they can be rightly -and accurately- called Jews?