MUSLIMS......Why??

Mohammed_123

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What does Pakistanis have to do with Muslims? Is every American a Christian?

Its true that there is excessive estrogen in the water but this does not make one gay. Sexual preferences really has nothing to do with testosterone level.

the majority of pakistanis are muslim...not all i know but most are.

it all depends on the hormones that you were introduced too in the womb and then you drink water with the same hormones...read the link.

thanks
 






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A Freeman

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But all normal Christians don't believe that for a moment, heck there are even female clergy nowadays like these Church of England women..:)
Proving all "normal Christians' do NOT follow The Law or the Gospel (Christ's Teachings) found in the Old Covenant and New Covenant, and thus serving the liar/opposer (Satan) instead of God and His Christ.

From The Law:

Genesis 3:16 Unto the woman He said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire [shall be subject] to thy husband, and HE SHALL RULE OVER THEE.

From The Gospel of Jesus (Teachings of Christ):-

Matthew 5:17-19
5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy The Law, or the Prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to FULFILL [i.e. to fully preach The Law (The Torah) and fulfill the prophecies about the first coming of the Messiah].
5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no way pass from The Law, till ALL be fulfilled.
5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least COMMANDments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in The Kingdom of heaven (the lowest of the low in God's Eyes): but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in The Kingdom of heaven.

And elsewhere in the New Covenant, confirming the teachings of Christ:-

1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God.

1 Corinthians 11:7-9
11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover [his] head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
11:8 For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.

1 Corinthians 14:34-35
14:34 Let your women keep silence in the communities: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but [they are commanded] to be under obedience, as also saith The Law.
14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a disgrace for women to speak in the community.

Ephesians 5:22-29
5:22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.
5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the community: and he is the saviour of the body.
5:24 Therefore as the community is subject unto Christ, so [let] the wives [be] to their own husbands in every thing.
5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the community, and gave himself for it;
5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of [Living] water by the Word,
5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious community, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
5:28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
5:29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the community:

1 Timothy 2:11-15
2:11 Let the woman learn in SILENCE with all subjection.
2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to USURP authority over the man, but TO BE IN SILENCE.
2:13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
2:15 Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

Titus 2:4-5
2:4 That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their [husband's] children,
2:5 [To be] discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.

1 Peter 3:1-6
3:1 Likewise, ye wives, [be] in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the Word, they also may without the Word be won by the conversation of the wives;
3:2 While they behold your chaste conversation [coupled] with fear.
3:3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward [adorning] of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;
3:4 But [let it be] the hidden Man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, [even the ornament] of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
3:5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands:
3:6 Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.

Prophecy from 3000 years ago, warning today's so-called "Christian" nations...

Isaiah 3:12 [As for] My people, children [are] their oppressors, and women rule over them. O My people, they which lead thee cause [thee] to err, and lead thee astray, TO THY DESTRUCTION.
 






A Freeman

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That "God" disgusted with homosexuality, mentioned several times in this thread ... where is it?
From God's Law:-

Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [homosexuality] [is] abomination.

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them.

Romans 1:22-31
1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
1:25 Who changed the Truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, Who is blessed for ever. Amen.
1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet (AIDS).
1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a mind void of Judgement, to do those things which are not convenient;
1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
1:31 Without Understanding, Covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
1:32 Who knowing the Judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
 






arhur12

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Thank-you. It's imperative to NEVER confuse Satan's organized religions with The Word of God, and this subject emphasizes that critically important point.

ALL organized religion was created by Satan to keep people AWAY from God.

Using the 3 allegedly "monotheistic" organized religions as examples, please consider:

1) Talmudic Judaism is based upon the Talmud, even though it falsely claims to be based on God's Law. The writing or teaching of the traditions of the fathers/elders, aka the Talmud, are capital offenses under The Law that God gave us, because they make the Commandments of God of no effect. Talmudic Judaism rejects the New Covenant and the Koran (Quran) that came after it.

2) "Christianity" is based upon the teachings of "the mother church" (Roman Catholicism, aka the traditions of the fathers/priests), which is repeatedly condemned throughout Scripture. Roman Catholicism (the Great Whore) gave birth ALL of the protestant denominations and to "Islam" as well. Even though the "Christians" are at least open-minded enough to include the Old Covenant with the New Covenant in the Bible, they twist the words of Christ, Who plainly stated that heaven and earth would pass away before the slightest punctuation mark was changed in The Law that God gave us.

3) "Islam" is based upon the Hadith, i.e. the alleged teachings of Muhammad (peace be upon him), even though Muhammad himself condemned the self-contradictory Hadith and warned his companions against writing down his personal sayings, out of concern they would be mixed together with the Koran (Quran), exactly as happened. The Hadith in "Islam" is the equivalent of Talmud in Judaism, as it too is the traditions of fathers/elders. Instead of turning to The Law and the Gospel that God gave us, as the Koran (Quran) COMMANDS, and says it was sent to confirm, "Muslims" instead pretend the Old Covenant and New Covenant no longer exist, even though the Koran (Quran) warns that could NEVER happen.

The reason God gave us His PERFECT Law of Liberty, was to protect us from all of this evil, and to set and keep us FREE. Homosexuality is a capital offense under The Law for good reason: when a spirit-Being (Soul) has lost control over the body it lives inside of, and been corrupted to the point that it allows it to engage in such obviously unnatural abominations like homosexuality, the best thing for all involved is to free that spirit-Being from that evil human body, so it can start over.

That sends the correct message to everyone that unnatural behavior, all of which goes AGAINST nature's Creator (God) will NOT be tolerated.

Instead, we've done the exact opposite, and then wonder why the world is now filling up with queers and pedophiles, after opening the proverbial "Pandora's box", by not only legalizing sodomy, but promoting it as an "alternative lifestyle"..

Links between homosexuality and paedophilia:

  • 33% of homosexuals admit to minor/adult sex (having sex with children)
  • NAMBLA (North American Man-Boy Love Association) is an overt, in-your-face homosexual child molestation organization with THOUSANDS of members
  • 33% of all reported child molestations are committed by homosexuals, which make up roughly 1% of the total population. That means that a homosexual is 50 times more likely to be a child molester than a heterosexual.

  • 73% of all male homosexuals have had sex with boys under the age of 19.
Source: Homosexuality and Its Negative Effects on Society


Homosexual Health Care Costs Borne by Society

NEW YORK – The government’s own statistics affirm that LGBT citizens are responsible for an enormously disproportionate share of health care costs, which now will be placed on the backs of healthy citizens under the Affordable Health Care Act, known commonly as Obamacare.
  • over 60% of all HIV/AIDS infections are caused by homosexual acts
  • the published estimated lifetime cost of treating AIDS in 2014: $450,000 each
  • over 60% of all syphilis cases are homosexual
  • 17% of all hospital admissions
Source: Stats Don't Lie: Gay Health Costs Coming Your Way


Understanding the Homosexual Lifestyle
  • One study reports 70% of homosexuals admitting to having sex only one time with over 50% of their partners.
  • One study reports that the average homosexual has between 20 and 106 partners per year . The average heterosexual has 8 partners in a lifetime.
  • Many homosexual sexual encounters occur while drunk, high on drugs, or in an orgy setting.
  • Many homosexuals don’t pay heed to warnings of their lifestyles: “Knowledge of health guidelines was quite high, but this knowledge had no relation to sexual behavior”.

The story of the destruction of Sodom (which was filled with Sodomites) and Gomorrah (which was filled with sexual exhibitionism), is found in The Law (Gen. 19) that God gave us, to serve as a constant reminder that anyone who engages in, promotes or allows such abominable behavior, will burn for it. The Law regarding homosexuality (Lev. 18:22, 20:13) is confirmed in the New Covenant (Rom. 1:27) and again in the Koran/Quran (e.g. Sura 7:80-84).

Because "Islam" is the newest of these three organized religions, the ill effects of such abominable behavior are a more recent development, which will only increase as time goes on, because we do not keep God's Law, found ONLY in the first five books of the Bible, namely:
Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.
Since I am a muslim I can't deny the importance of hadith but I will say many of the fundamental problems such as homosexuality have been discussed in the Quran Prophet Lut's (A.S) story is written clearly in the Quran but many so called reformists who are indoctrinated by western ideology look for alternative interpretations they try to twist the original meaning to fit their narratives and that's why we see so many muslims being soft towards homosexuals today
 






billy t

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Because they have unfortunately been indoctrinated with liberal idealogies. The Prophet salAllahu alaiyhi wasallam mentioned that at the end of time those who stick to true Islaam will be seen as strange. This is the case today. People who consider homosexuality as immoral are seen as backwards.

The Prophet salAllahu alaiyhi wasallam said "Islaam began as something strange and it will return as something strange so glad tidings to the strangers".

Islaam is what is in Qur'aan and the teachings of the Prophet salAllahu alaiyhi wasallam. Islaam is free of whatever nonsense misguided Muslims invent in the name of Islaam. This is why innovation is the most serious sin after associating others in worship with God. The Prophet salAllahu alaiyhi wasallam said the worst of all affairs are the newly invented matters (in religion) and every newly invented matter is in the hellfire".
 






billy t

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1- Nope, Jesus never said women can't speak or have authority, you'd better pay more attention to your sunday school teacher..:)

2- Paul paid glowing tributes to women in the early Christian churches -
"I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a servant of the church in Cenchrea..she has been a great help to many people, including me..
Greet Priscilla , my fellow worker in Christ Jesus, she risked her life for me.
Greet Mary, who worked very hard for you..
Greet Tryphena and Tryphosa and Persis, those women who work hard in the Lord.
Greet Rufus, chosen in the Lord, and his mother, who has been a mother to me, too.

Greet Julia.." (Romans ch 16)

If muslim women are happy to go around in them burka things and be bossed about by men it's none of my business.
PS- there are youtube vids of muslim adulteresses being stoned to death.
I think I like Jesus's approach better, he went around rescuing naughty women from fundy jewish mobs..:)

Are you married Tidal? Just curious.

Woman should be treated well but it is in their nature to like men who are assertive and so on. I find that men who promote feminism tend to have problems with staying in a relationship. Woman don't like weak men who let the female take control in the relationship.

Yes, men should let woman express their own opinions etc, and consider their views but in the end the man should have the final say.

Woman themselves want this regardless of what they say. When a man does not have control then woman lose attraction to them. That is a fact. Men are supposed to be LEADERS. Leaders have to have some form of control. It is what it is.

Nobody complains about a boss of a company having too much control but when it comes to marriage then all of a sudden having control is seen as "abusive".
 






A Freeman

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Since I am a muslim I can't deny the importance of hadith but I will say many of the fundamental problems such as homosexuality have been discussed in the Quran Prophet Lut's (A.S) story is written clearly in the Quran but many so called reformists who are indoctrinated by western ideology look for alternative interpretations they try to twist the original meaning to fit their narratives and that's why we see so many muslims being soft towards homosexuals today
Thank-you.

Please consider the following facts:-

1) The only accepted way to "authenticate" a hadith is to compare it to the Koran (Quran) to see if it agrees with what it says in the Koran (Quran). Any hadith out of the 700,000+ hadiths (which is over 1000x the number of ayats/verses in the Koran) that doesn't agree is considered to be a fabrication.

2) If the only acceptable way to "authenticate" a hadith is to see whether it agrees with the Koran (Quran), then there is no need for the "authentic" hadiths.

3) The Koran (Quran) Commands its readers numerous times to read, carefully study and apply The Law (Torah/Taurat) and the Gospel (Injeel), which the Koran was sent to CONFIRM (not to contradict). It also plainly states in the Koran that The Law and the Gospel that we have today cannot and have not been corrupted, and that we should NOT doubt them reaching us. Therefore every real Muslim that is truly in submission to God MUST keep The Commandments and Covenants with God, which are found in the Bible.

4) The hadith was written hundreds of years after the death of Muhammad (peace be upon him) and is based completely (100%) on multiple layers of hearsay. Muhammad himself condemned the writing of the hadith, and for good reason: the writing of the hadith is a capital crime under The Law that Allah gave us (Deut. 4:2, 12:8, 12:32), to which Muhammad was in submission.

5) IF we were truly in submission to The Law that the One True God gave us to protect us from all of this evil and to set and keep us free from oppression, perversion, crime, poverty, etc., there would be absolutely ZERO confusion on this subject. Homosexuality is a capital offense under The Law. So is cross-dressing, being a trans-whatever, p***phile, child-trafficker, etc. Keeping and enforcing The Law would therefore ELIMINATE homosexuality, p***philia, child-trafficking, adultery, and the rest of the unnatural and abominable sexual deviant behaviours that are currently plaguing society today. The Law that God gave us can only protect us from these things if we keep and enforce it.

6) ALL man-made rules, legislation, policies, procedures, rules, "codes", ordinances, traditions, etc. are NOT "laws", and the passing, keeping and enforcing of man-made rules, etc. are likewise a capital offense under The Law that God gave us, because they make the Commandments of God of no effect. It is only because we've adopted these errant rules that we have all of the problems today with the homosexuals, pedophiles, adulterers, war-mongers, professional liars, thieves, etc.

The ONLY Solution is to get rid of all of this fraudulent man-made legislation, etc., and go back to The Law that Allah gave us.

There is simply no other way to truly be in submission to Allah without keeping His Law, found only in the first five books of the Bible.

Sura 32:23. We did indeed aforetime give The Book (The Torah) to Moses: be then NOT IN DOUBT of its (The Torah) reaching (THEE): and We made it a Guide to the Children of Israel.

See Sura 2:53, 2:87-93, 3:1-3, 3:48-50, 4:54, 5:46-50, 6:91-92, 6:154-157, 7:157, 9:111, 11:17, 15:9-10, 17:2-4, 21:48, 23:20, 23:49, 25:35, 28:1-3, 32:23, 35:25-32, 37:117, 40:53, 40:70, 41:45, 42:14-17, 45:16, 46:12, 46:30, 48:29, 53:36-47, 57:25-29, 61:6, 78:2 , which refer us to read, carefully study, keep and apply The Law and the Gospel of Jesus Example of keeping The Law.

See also: Sura 2:97-98, 3:1-3, 4:47, 5:51, 6:92-94, 6:154-157, 10:37, 12:111, 22:52, 35:31, 46:12, 61:6-7, which leave no doubt the Koran (Quran) was sent to confirm the Bible, not to contradict it, supersede it, or claim it has been lost.

The brief summary of Lot in the Koran (Quran) confirms the full story of Lot in The Law, who was saved from the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah by leaving them and never looking back.

Peace be upon you.
 






arhur12

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So this is my think piece on why Muslims are becoming more soft towards homosexuals there are many factors but firstly I would say most of this support is coming from Muslims in the western countries and not from Muslims living in actual Islamic states like Pakistan, Malaysia, Saudi Arabia etc
1- Most Muslims follow secular education system so children are indoctrinated from an early age. Since most of these books are written from a western liberal perspective and most Muslim Parents nowadays atleast in Pakistan do not focus too much on the religious education of their children the youth becomes ignorant and ends up supporting the western ideologies out of ignorance

2- Muslims are too obsessed with western validation these days. Most muslims who live in western countries are attached to the luxurious lifestyle they lead in western countries and are not willing to let go of worldly benefits for the sake of their religion so they resort to appeasing the liberals I have seen so many new videos on how islam is compatible with feminism/western lifestyle filled with lies Ilhan Omar, Sadiq Khan or Linda Sarsour do not represent islam they are only used by liberals to further indocrinate the Muslim youth to spread their propaganda. Muslims have especially after 9/11 become more and more infected by the disease of "Victim Mentality" Back in the days of the sahaba R.A and Prophet Muhammad S.A.W Muslims would migrate to other lands when they faced discrimination from any state or community but nowadays we harp about "Islamophopia" but are not willing to sacrifice our property and luxurious lifestyle for our religious belief.
This is a very controversial opinion and alot of my fellow Muslim brothers and sisters are not going to agree with me on this but I believe Kashmiri Muslims should have Migrated to Pakistan when they had the chance and more Muslims who face discrimination/Islamophobic situations should migrate to Muslim countries and Muslim countries should also be more accepting of refugees staying in non-muslim countries hating their lifestyle and harping on about islamophobia and talking about the superiority of sharia law in a non muslim country is not going to do us any good we should be focusing on trying to make our own countries better places.
So many bright and intelligent Muslims choose to migrate to non muslim countries to get higher education, better jobs if we are truly Muslims and believe in the superiority of islamic lifestyles and systems we should focus on implementing sharia laws in our own countries first we need to become role model states for the world first only then we will be respected by the world.
 






arhur12

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Thank-you.

Please consider the following facts:-

1) The only accepted way to "authenticate" a hadith is to compare it to the Koran (Quran) to see if it agrees with what it says in the Koran (Quran). Any hadith out of the 700,000+ hadiths (which is over 1000x the number of ayats/verses in the Koran) that doesn't agree is considered to be a fabrication.

2) If the only acceptable way to "authenticate" a hadith is to see whether it agrees with the Koran (Quran), then there is no need for the "authentic" hadiths.

3) The Koran (Quran) Commands its readers numerous times to read, carefully study and apply The Law (Torah/Taurat) and the Gospel (Injeel), which the Koran was sent to CONFIRM (not to contradict). It also plainly states in the Koran that The Law and the Gospel that we have today cannot and have not been corrupted, and that we should NOT doubt them reaching us. Therefore every real Muslim that is truly in submission to God MUST keep The Commandments and Covenants with God, which are found in the Bible.

4) The hadith was written hundreds of years after the death of Muhammad (peace be upon him) and is based completely (100%) on multiple layers of hearsay. Muhammad himself condemned the writing of the hadith, and for good reason: the writing of the hadith is a capital crime under The Law that Allah gave us (Deut. 4:2, 12:8, 12:32), to which Muhammad was in submission.

5) IF we were truly in submission to The Law that the One True God gave us to protect us from all of this evil and to set and keep us free from oppression, perversion, crime, poverty, etc., there would be absolutely ZERO confusion on this subject. Homosexuality is a capital offense under The Law. So is cross-dressing, being a trans-whatever, p***phile, child-trafficker, etc. Keeping and enforcing The Law would therefore ELIMINATE homosexuality, p***philia, child-trafficking, adultery, and the rest of the unnatural and abominable sexual deviant behaviours that are currently plaguing society today. The Law that God gave us can only protect us from these things if we keep and enforce it.

6) ALL man-made rules, legislation, policies, procedures, rules, "codes", ordinances, traditions, etc. are NOT "laws", and the passing, keeping and enforcing of man-made rules, etc. are likewise a capital offense under The Law that God gave us, because they make the Commandments of God of no effect. It is only because we've adopted these errant rules that we have all of the problems today with the homosexuals, pedophiles, adulterers, war-mongers, professional liars, thieves, etc.

The ONLY Solution is to get rid of all of this fraudulent man-made legislation, etc., and go back to The Law that Allah gave us.

There is simply no other way to truly be in submission to Allah without keeping His Law, found only in the first five books of the Bible.

Sura 32:23. We did indeed aforetime give The Book (The Torah) to Moses: be then NOT IN DOUBT of its (The Torah) reaching (THEE): and We made it a Guide to the Children of Israel.

See Sura 2:53, 2:87-93, 3:1-3, 3:48-50, 4:54, 5:46-50, 6:91-92, 6:154-157, 7:157, 9:111, 11:17, 15:9-10, 17:2-4, 21:48, 23:20, 23:49, 25:35, 28:1-3, 32:23, 35:25-32, 37:117, 40:53, 40:70, 41:45, 42:14-17, 45:16, 46:12, 46:30, 48:29, 53:36-47, 57:25-29, 61:6, 78:2 , which refer us to read, carefully study, keep and apply The Law and the Gospel of Jesus Example of keeping The Law.

See also: Sura 2:97-98, 3:1-3, 4:47, 5:51, 6:92-94, 6:154-157, 10:37, 12:111, 22:52, 35:31, 46:12, 61:6-7, which leave no doubt the Koran (Quran) was sent to confirm the Bible, not to contradict it, supersede it, or claim it has been lost.

The brief summary of Lot in the Koran (Quran) confirms the full story of Lot in The Law, who was saved from the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah by leaving them and never looking back.

Peace be upon you.
Thanks for your reply May Allah bless you!

This is a sensitive topic so I am not going to reject the hadith outright but I will agree with you on the point that the Gospel and Torah and the bible of today are from Allah. I have a bible at home and I read it frequently and I don't agree with the common misconception among Muslims that Bible is fabricated and should not be studied. All 10 commandments are mentioned in The Quran and their are very few differences between the laws of the Bible and Quran. I would like to add that in the time of Caliph Omar R.A matters regarding jews and christians were settled through the guidance of the Bible. And many stories mentioned in the Quran can be fully understood only if we study the bible. The christians and jews may have tried to twist the narrative of the bible to benefit themselves but the same thing has been happening with the Quran and many reformists are also doing the same thing today which they accuse the jews and christians of doing. So their is no benefit in pointing fingers at christians and jews when we ourselves are also guilty of the same.
I am not going to comment on which hadith is correct or which isn't because I am not a scholar and am not well versed in this topic but I will agree that most of the problems arising today are due to the conflicting opinions of the religious scholars and it is true that the Prophet sallaAllahu alayhi wassalam discouraged collection of hadith and even in the times of the rightly guided caliphs it was not encouraged.
 






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A Freeman

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Thanks for your reply May Allah bless you!
You're welcome. Thank-you. Likewise.

This is a sensitive topic so I am not going to reject the hadith outright but I will agree with you on the point that the Gospel and Torah and the bible of today are from Allah. I have a bible at home and I read it frequently and I don't agree with the common misconception among Muslims that Bible is fabricated and should not be studied. All 10 commandments are mentioned in The Quran and their are very few differences between the laws of the Bible and Quran. I would like to add that in the time of Caliph Omar R.A matters regarding jews and christians were settled through the guidance of the Bible. And many stories mentioned in the Quran can be fully understood only if we study the bible. The christians and jews may have tried to twist the narrative of the bible to benefit themselves but the same thing has been happening with the Quran and many reformists are also doing the same thing today which they accuse the jews and christians of doing. So their is no benefit in pointing fingers at christians and jews when we ourselves are also guilty of the same.
I am not going to comment on which hadith is correct or which isn't because I am not a scholar and am not well versed in this topic but I will agree that most of the problems arising today are due to the conflicting opinions of the religious scholars and it is true that the Prophet sallaAllahu alayhi wassalam discouraged collection of hadith and even in the times of the rightly guided caliphs it was not encouraged.
Agreed. And even the perceived differences are easily resolved through a careful study of the Old Covenant, New Covenant and Koran (Quran).

If everyone read, carefully studied and applied ALL of God's Holy Scriptures, there would be no religious doctrines and superstitions today, we could unite into one single Brotherhood, devoted to doing God's Will, exactly as God always intended.
 






Tidal

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A.Freeman said:
1 Corinthians 14:34-35
14:34 Let your women keep silence in the communities: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but [they are commanded] to be under obedience, as also saith The Law.
14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a disgrace for women to speak in the community.

Think "context" mate..:)
Paul only said that in a letter to the Corinthian church because some loud noisy women were probably disrupting church services and treating the place as a coffee morning for gossip, so he had to tell them to shut it.
Sensible women played a big part in the early churches, for example the evangelist Philip had four daughters who were preachers, and the early Christian sect in Phrygia was led by Montanus and two preachers, Priscilla and Maximilla..

Paul has nothing but praise for sensible women-
"I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a servant of the church in Cenchrea..she has been a great help to many people, including me..
Greet Priscilla , my fellow worker in Christ Jesus, she risked her life for me.
Greet Mary, who worked very hard for you..
Greet Tryphena and Tryphosa and Persis, those women who work hard in the Lord.
Greet Rufus, chosen in the Lord, and his mother, who has been a mother to me, too.

Greet Julia.." (Romans ch 16)

And he reminds us -
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Galatians 3:28 )

And even long before that, God himself had the girl's backs-
"In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will preach, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.
On my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will speak." (Joel 2:28-32)


So you see, it's satanic for anybody to try to put down women, because satan knows it'll put them off christianity..:)
 






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Tidal

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Are you married Tidal? Just curious...
Woman should be treated well but it is in their nature to like men who are assertive and so on. I find that men who promote feminism tend to have problems with staying in a relationship. Woman don't like weak men who let the female take control in the relationship.

1- No mate, I never married because I never met a woman who was on my wavelength, and anyway I never wanted to have noisy smelly kids and be a family man because I'd have felt trapped..:)
2- Yes, a lot of women like assertive men to boss them about, I'm an ex-convict (3-month vigilante rap) so maybe I should brag about it to impress women.
3- I like sensitive caring women but sadly they're very hard to find-

"A wife of noble character who can find?
She is worth far more than rubies.
Her husband has full confidence in her
and lacks nothing of value.
She brings him good, not harm,
all the days of her life.
She opens her arms to the poor
and extends her hands to the needy.
She is clothed with strength and dignity;
she can laugh at the days to come.
Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting;
but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised"

(Bible, Proverbs 31)

Christina Rossetti sounds my type-

 






Alanantic

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Messages
668
Think "context" mate..:)
Paul only said that in a letter to the Corinthian church because some loud noisy women were probably disrupting church services and treating the place as a coffee morning for gossip, so he had to tell them to shut it.
Sensible women played a big part in the early churches, for example the evangelist Philip had four daughters who were preachers, and the early Christian sect in Phrygia was led by Montanus and two preachers, Priscilla and Maximilla..

Paul has nothing but praise for sensible women-
"I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a servant of the church in Cenchrea..she has been a great help to many people, including me..
Greet Priscilla , my fellow worker in Christ Jesus, she risked her life for me.
Greet Mary, who worked very hard for you..
Greet Tryphena and Tryphosa and Persis, those women who work hard in the Lord.
Greet Rufus, chosen in the Lord, and his mother, who has been a mother to me, too.

Greet Julia.." (Romans ch 16)

And he reminds us -
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Galatians 3:28 )

And even long before that, God himself had the girl's backs-
"In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will preach, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.
On my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will speak." (Joel 2:28-32)


So you see, it's satanic for anybody to try to put down women, because satan knows it'll put them off christianity..:)
I never said such a thing! Where did you come up with that? I searched all my past posts and got nuttin'. I VERY RARELY post Christian scipture. And, I certainly never put down women. And, I couldn't care less about the Corinthians...
 






billy t

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Messages
682
Thanks for your reply May Allah bless you!

This is a sensitive topic so I am not going to reject the hadith outright but I will agree with you on the point that the Gospel and Torah and the bible of today are from Allah. I have a bible at home and I read it frequently and I don't agree with the common misconception among Muslims that Bible is fabricated and should not be studied. All 10 commandments are mentioned in The Quran and their are very few differences between the laws of the Bible and Quran. I would like to add that in the time of Caliph Omar R.A matters regarding jews and christians were settled through the guidance of the Bible. And many stories mentioned in the Quran can be fully understood only if we study the bible. The christians and jews may have tried to twist the narrative of the bible to benefit themselves but the same thing has been happening with the Quran and many reformists are also doing the same thing today which they accuse the jews and christians of doing. So their is no benefit in pointing fingers at christians and jews when we ourselves are also guilty of the same.
I am not going to comment on which hadith is correct or which isn't because I am not a scholar and am not well versed in this topic but I will agree that most of the problems arising today are due to the conflicting opinions of the religious scholars and it is true that the Prophet sallaAllahu alayhi wassalam discouraged collection of hadith and even in the times of the rightly guided caliphs it was not encouraged.
There are clearly human elements in the Torah that contradict Islam. For example Jacob supposedly wrestling with God and God telling him to let him go!!!

The Quran says they changed the word of Allah with their own hands. Freeman is an imbecile. Misguided. Astray. Lost.
 






Joined
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Messages
6
Romans 1, bit ironic given your username.
From God's Law:-

Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [homosexuality] [is] abomination.

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them.

Romans 1:22-31
1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
1:25 Who changed the Truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, Who is blessed for ever. Amen.
1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet (AIDS).
1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a mind void of Judgement, to do those things which are not convenient;
1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
1:31 Without Understanding, Covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
1:32 Who knowing the Judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
Who told you all those words are related to "God"? Where is the proof that any word written on the Bible (or the Talmud, or the Koran) is related to any "God", and not only written by humans? Where is the proof of "God" or any deity existence itself?

Even if there were evidence of certain "God" o deity existence and its "law" were reflected on those books, who told you that "God" is unique and is good, and there aren't other deities with other laws or desires?
 






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Daze

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Who told you all those words are related to "God"? Where is the proof that any word written on the Bible (or the Talmud, or the Koran) is related to any "God", and not only written by humans? Where is the proof of "God" or any deity existence itself?

Even if there were evidence of certain "God" o deity existence and its "law" were reflected on those books, who told you that "God" is unique and is good, and there aren't other deities with other laws or desires?
Ironic as you yourself are a proof of a Designer.

They are like darknesses within an unfathomable sea which is covered by waves, upon which are waves, over which are clouds - darknesses, some of them upon others. When one puts out his hand [therein], he can hardly see it. And he to whom Allah has not granted light - for him there is no light. (24:40 Quran)
 






Tidal

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Messages
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I never said such a thing! Where did you come up with that? I searched all my past posts and got nuttin'. I VERY RARELY post Christian scipture. And, I certainly never put down women. And, I couldn't care less about the Corinthians...

Thanks mate, my mistake, it was A.Freeman who tried to put women down, not you..:)
As for the Corinthians, Paul had to visit them to kick their butts-
"I already gave you a warning when I was with you the second time. I now repeat it while absent: On my return I won't spare those who sinned earlier or any of the others" (2 Cor 13:2)
 






arhur12

Established
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Jun 2, 2021
Messages
180
There are clearly human elements in the Torah that contradict Islam. For example Jacob supposedly wrestling with God and God telling him to let him go!!!

The Quran says they changed the word of Allah with their own hands. Freeman is an imbecile. Misguided. Astray. Lost.
As long as it doesn't contradict Quran it can be considered correct many of our own scholars have used biblical narratives to interpret Quran we should be focusing on the similarities between our religions not the contradictions also nobody is saying Muslims should be following every command in the bible of course Quran and Sunnah are the only source of guidance but if we are going to preach islam we should be focusing on the similarities between bible and Quran
 






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