Did Evolution Really Happen?

[Antipapirus]

Y'all sound like some ancient Greek philosophers staring at their thumbs and saying "... And you see, my dear Etaglocius, this is why obviously the universe must be shaped like my thumb". A.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

appreciate it!

Just a question - please don't answer straight away but have a think...

Do you;

Wish you could believe in a creator but sadly find the current scientific establishment in favour of "evolution"* i.e. Biological evolution, Big Bang, multiple universes etc

Or;

Feel glad you are not "accountable" to a creator, do not wish one to exist and find the approval of that view by the scientific establishment reassuring.

 

[elsbet]

Indeed they do, and I can by no means claim to know as a certainty that they're wrong.
It's important though to know what it is you're dismissing before you dismiss something. Concepts like the big bang and evolution are challenging to be sure, but it's better to accept the challenge and wrap as much of your brains around them as you can before deciding either way. You can far more reasonably and intelligently confront scientific theory you doubt if you make an effort to learn/understand that theory, as Red Sky often demonstrates.

I believe there may be aspects of nature we don't yet understand and thus could be perceived as 'super', but no, I don't believe in the 'supernatural' in the traditional sense, particularly in relation to ghosts/afterlives/magic.

That's amazing.
To each his own, though. Appreciate the reply.

 

[Mr.Grieves]

Just a question - please don't answer straight away but have a think...

Do you;

Wish you could believe in a creator but sadly find the current scientific establishment in favour of "evolution"* i.e. Biological evolution, Big Bang, multiple universes etc

Or;

Feel glad you are not "accountable" to a creator, do not wish one to exist and find the approval of that view by the scientific establishment reassuring.

That's a tough sort of question, and I don't really think I fit into the either/or of it, given my feelings on religion/creationism aren't quite so deeply rooted in science as one might think, given the way I talk on this forum.

While I'll certainly make no grand claims about my own intelligence or insight, not overly confident in either, I'm not ashamed to claim I've always been a fairly astute observer, and as a child I had a very keen interest in learning everything I could about the world. My family wasn't religious, but they weren't atheist either, and made no active efforts to 'turn me off' religion. Thus, in my youth, I was very willing to consider the Supernatural, to toe the waters of religion, and contemplate belief in a creator.

I attended church, bible studies, and youth activities many times with my more religious friends, watched their strange religious cartoons portraying the story of David and Goliath, Moses, etc., and saw the appeal of belief to the extent an outsider could. I had questions though, lots and lots of questions, and when I put these questions to my religious friends, their religious parents, the preachers and teachers and authority figures of their religious meetings/activities, the general response was annoyance, and the insistence that these things weren't to be questioned.

As a highly curious kid that was a big turn-off, and what was more, I couldn't help but notice an emptiness to rituals they all suggested should be full and enriching. Often I heard people talking about prayer as a conversation with God, often I heard people claim that God spoke to them, that they felt God, knew God, and if I prayed with them, or ate the piece of bread, or sang along, or took a knee, I too would know/hear/feel God. Alas, every time I tried- and tried I did- I felt every bit as alone with my thoughts as I had previously, and a strong pressure from the others to pretend otherwise. This actually upset me quite a bit, and I remember tearfully confessing to one of these authorities that it wasn't working for me, that I wasn't feeling it, and that it felt wrong and bad to pretend, his response to my memory being to the tune of: 'Just keep trying, and eventually you will.', a sort of 'fake it till you make it' suggestion that I just couldn't maintain.

It was around that time that I became a fan of two new (to me) television programs, the WWF, and Benny Hinn's televangelism program. I loved both these shows for generally the same reason: massive crowds, crazy theatrics, people getting smacked and falling down (albeit for very different reasons), colorful costumes, and all with total conviction. It didn't take an astute observer to soon realize both these productions were fakes however. They were both using the same techniques and same tactics to tell generally the same lie; each portraying 'contact' that never actually takes place. The more Benny Hinn I watched, the more ridiculous it became, and the more people- massive crowds of people- seemed to believe it in spite of its obvious falsehoods, the more critical I became of religion in general, as I increasingly saw the reflection of his method present in all of it.

More and more it seemed to me that religion was a scam... every bit as amusing, distracting and in the end hollow of truth as The Undertaker's choke-slam, as Benny Hinn's tears, and the feeling I was supposed to feel but didn't when I prayed was the same feeling that the crowds of wrestling fans got when they chose to believe that choke-slam was real, that the match isn't rigged, that the cancer has been healed. I began to associate religion with self-deception.

Again, this was as a child, long before I had any real conception of what evolution was, what the big bang was, or how those theories conflicted or clashed with religious beliefs. While science has absolutely informed my atheism, it's by no means the source of it. As I've grown up and gotten older my skepticism has spread over much of the supernatural, some of that having to do with science, but a lot of it admittedly informed by my own experience and observations.

Work, for example, with the victims of serious brain-trauma, seeing the dramatic effect brain-injury has on a person's memory, personality, emotions, behaviors and beliefs, has made it extremely difficult for me to consider any kind of afterlife where those aspects of self remain intact. If a bump on the noggin can completely obliterate the person you were prior too it, that same person isn't going to survive the outright death of the brain.

Honestly, I'd like to be proven wrong. Preferably not with some apocalyptic scenario if it can be helped, but if Jesus came floating down from the heavens one day and said "Yo guys, totally real.", I'd be down. If a booming God-Voice echoed across the earth saying 'You guys need to chill out.' for all to hear, I'd be totally down. If a ghost introduced himself to me/the world, if a priest slapped a demon out of my sister, I'd be down. If ghosts and Gods and magic suddenly revealed themselves as real and didn't instantly go all Hellraiser on us, I'd likely be happier for it.

I just don't have it in me to pretend.

 

[elsbet]

That's a tough sort of question, and I don't really think I fit into the either/or of it, given my feelings on religion/creationism aren't quite so deeply rooted in science as one might think, given the way I talk on this forum.

While I'll certainly make no grand claims about my own intelligence or insight, not overly confident in either, I'm not ashamed to claim I've always been a fairly astute observer, and as a child I had a very keen interest in learning everything I could about the world. My family wasn't religious, but they weren't atheist either, and made no active efforts to 'turn me off' religion. Thus, in my youth, I was very willing to consider the Supernatural, to toe the waters of religion, and contemplate belief in a creator.

I attended church, bible studies, and youth activities many times with my more religious friends, watched their strange religious cartoons portraying the story of David and Goliath, Moses, etc., and saw the appeal of belief to the extent an outsider could. I had questions though, lots and lots of questions, and when I put these questions to my religious friends, their religious parents, the preachers and teachers and authority figures of their religious meetings/activities, the general response was annoyance, and the insistence that these things weren't to be questioned.

As a highly curious kid that was a big turn-off, and what was more, I couldn't help but notice an emptiness to rituals they all suggested should be full and enriching. Often I heard people talking about prayer as a conversation with God, often I heard people claim that God spoke to them, that they felt God, knew God, and if I prayed with them, or ate the piece of bread, or sang along, or took a knee, I too would know/hear/feel God. Alas, every time I tried- and tried I did- I felt every bit as alone with my thoughts as I had previously, and a strong pressure from the others to pretend otherwise. This actually upset me quite a bit, and I remember tearfully confessing to one of these authorities that it wasn't working for me, that I wasn't feeling it, and that it felt wrong and bad to pretend, his response to my memory being to the tune of: 'Just keep trying, and eventually you will.', a sort of 'fake it till you make it' suggestion that I just couldn't maintain.

It was around that time that I became a fan of two new (to me) television programs, the WWF, and Benny Hinn's televangelism program. I loved both these shows for generally the same reason: massive crowds, crazy theatrics, people getting smacked and falling down (albeit for very different reasons), colorful costumes, and all with total conviction. It didn't take an astute observer to soon realize both these productions were fakes however. They were both using the same techniques and same tactics to tell generally the same lie; each portraying 'contact' that never actually takes place. The more Benny Hinn I watched, the more ridiculous it became, and the more people- massive crowds of people- seemed to believe it in spite of its obvious falsehoods, the more critical I became of religion in general, as I increasingly saw the reflection of his method present in all of it.

More and more it seemed to me that religion was a scam... every bit as amusing, distracting and in the end hollow of truth as The Undertaker's choke-slam, as Benny Hinn's tears, and the feeling I was supposed to feel but didn't when I prayed was the same feeling that the crowds of wrestling fans got when they chose to believe that choke-slam was real, that the match isn't rigged, that the cancer has been healed. I began to associate religion with self-deception.

Again, this was as a child, long before I had any real conception of what evolution was, what the big bang was, or how those theories conflicted or clashed with religious beliefs. While science has absolutely informed my atheism, it's by no means the source of it. As I've grown up and gotten older my skepticism has spread over much of the supernatural, some of that having to do with science, but a lot of it admittedly informed by my own experience and observations.

Work, for example, with the victims of serious brain-trauma, seeing the dramatic effect brain-injury has on a person's memory, personality, emotions, behaviors and beliefs, has made it extremely difficult for me to consider any kind of afterlife where those aspects of self remain intact. If a bump on the noggin can completely obliterate the person you were prior too it, that same person isn't going to survive the outright death of the brain.

Honestly, I'd like to be proven wrong. Preferably not with some apocalyptic scenario if it can be helped, but if Jesus came floating down from the heavens one day and said "Yo guys, totally real.", I'd be down. If a booming God-Voice echoed across the earth saying 'You guys need to chill out.' for all to hear, I'd be totally down. If a ghost introduced himself to me/the world, if a priest slapped a demon out of my sister, I'd be down. If ghosts and Gods and magic suddenly revealed themselves as real and didn't instantly go all Hellraiser on us, I'd likely be happier for it.

I just don't have it in me to pretend.

Give it time.

Oh, and Benny Hinn is a charlatan.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@Mr.Grieves - thanks for your reply, and apologies for giving you an either/or question that you could not easily choose from.

You and I are more similar in background and mental process than might at first be apparent. I don't believe in pretending either. Good to talk with you and maybe we might get chance to chat some more. I don't get angry at tough questions, even if I don't have a quick answer.

 

[Antipapirus]

That's a tough sort of question, and I don't really think I fit into the either/or of it, given my feelings on religion/creationism aren't quite so deeply rooted in science as one might think, given the way I talk on this forum.

While I'll certainly make no grand claims about my own intelligence or insight, not overly confident in either, I'm not ashamed to claim I've always been a fairly astute observer, and as a child, I had a very keen interest in learning everything I could about the world. My family wasn't religious, but they weren't atheist either and made no active efforts to 'turn me off' religion. Thus, in my youth, I was very willing to consider the Supernatural, to toe the waters of religion, and contemplate belief in a creator.

I attended church, bible studies, and youth activities many times with my more religious friends, watched their strange religious cartoons portraying the story of David and Goliath, Moses, etc., and saw the appeal of belief to the extent an outsider could. I had questions though, lots and lots of questions, and when I put these questions to my religious friends, their religious parents, the preachers and teachers and authority figures of their religious meetings/activities, the general response was annoyance, and the insistence that these things weren't to be questioned.

As a highly curious kid that was a big turn-off, and what was more, I couldn't help but notice an emptiness to rituals they all suggested should be full and enriching. Often I heard people talking about prayer as a conversation with God, often I heard people claim that God spoke to them, that they felt God, knew God, and if I prayed with them, or ate the piece of bread, or sang along, or took a knee, I too would know/hear/feel God. Alas, every time I tried- and tried I did- I felt every bit as alone with my thoughts as I had previously, and a strong pressure from the others to pretend otherwise. This actually upset me quite a bit, and I remember tearfully confessing to one of these authorities that it wasn't working for me, that I wasn't feeling it, and that it felt wrong and bad to pretend, his response to my memory being to the tune of: 'Just keep trying, and eventually you will.', a sort of 'fake it till you make it' suggestion that I just couldn't maintain.

It was around that time that I became a fan of two new (to me) television programs, the WWF, and Benny Hinn's televangelism program. I loved both these shows for generally the same reason: massive crowds, crazy theatrics, people getting smacked and falling down (albeit for very different reasons), colorful costumes, and all with total conviction. It didn't take an astute observer to soon realize both these productions were fakes however. They were both using the same techniques and same tactics to tell generally the same lie; each portraying 'contact' that never actually takes place. The more Benny Hinn I watched, the more ridiculous it became, and the more people- massive crowds of people- seemed to believe it in spite of its obvious falsehoods, the more critical I became of religion in general, as I increasingly saw the reflection of his method present in all of it.

More and more it seemed to me that religion was a scam... every bit as amusing, distracting and in the end hollow of truth as The Undertaker's choke-slam, as Benny Hinn's tears, and the feeling I was supposed to feel but didn't when I prayed was the same feeling that the crowds of wrestling fans got when they chose to believe that choke-slam was real, that the match isn't rigged, that the cancer has been healed. I began to associate religion with self-deception.

Again, this was as a child, long before I had any real conception of what evolution was, what the big bang was, or how those theories conflicted or clashed with religious beliefs. While science has absolutely informed my atheism, it's by no means the source of it. As I've grown up and gotten older my skepticism has spread over much of the supernatural, some of that having to do with science, but a lot of it admittedly informed by my own experience and observations.

Work, for example, with the victims of serious brain-trauma, seeing the dramatic effect brain-injury has on a person's memory, personality, emotions, behaviors and beliefs, has made it extremely difficult for me to consider any kind of afterlife where those aspects of self-remain intact. If a bump on the noggin can completely obliterate the person you were prior too it, that same person isn't going to survive the outright death of the brain.

Honestly, I'd like to be proven wrong. Preferably not with some apocalyptic scenario if it can be helped, but if Jesus came floating down from the heavens one day and said "Yo guys, totally real.", I'd be down. If a booming God-Voice echoed across the earth saying 'You guys need to chill out.' for all to hear, I'd be totally down. If a ghost introduced himself to me/the world, if a priest slapped a demon out of my sister, I'd be down. If ghosts and Gods and magic suddenly revealed themselves as real and didn't instantly go all Hellraiser on us, I'd likely be happier for it.

I just don't have it in me to pretend.

If you really like searching for answers I super recommend this book
Journey of Souls: Case Studies of Life Between Lives
In short, there is an expert in Hypnosis and he interviewed under hypnosis over 600 people around the world about the after life and what he found out blew my mind.
I would like to discuss what your thoughts are on the subject if you"ll decide to read it

 

[Camidria]

@Mr.Grieves I also do not get angry at the tough questions, it saddens me greatly to hear what that church did... We are supposed to have answers for people, not shy away and get angry.

 

[Mr.Grieves]

If you really like searching for answers I super recommend this book
Journey of Souls: Case Studies of Life Between Lives
In short, there is an expert in Hypnosis and he interviewed under hypnosis over 600 people around the world about the after life and what he found out blew my mind.
I would like to discuss what your thoughts are on the subject if you"ll decide to read it

Taking a look at this, but what insight are living hypnotized people supposed to have into the afterlife? Even if they're all people who've had near-death experiences, near-death and death are exceedingly different things.

At Mr. Grieves: I have only one question for you. Are you grateful to be alive?

I'm grateful to my parents for having and raising me, I'm grateful to my country/community for it's beauty and the peaceful, affluent life available to me and mine, and I feel very lucky to be a human being.

 

[KoncreteMind]

That's a tough sort of question, and I don't really think I fit into the either/or of it, given my feelings on religion/creationism aren't quite so deeply rooted in science as one might think, given the way I talk on this forum.

While I'll certainly make no grand claims about my own intelligence or insight, not overly confident in either, I'm not ashamed to claim I've always been a fairly astute observer, and as a child I had a very keen interest in learning everything I could about the world. My family wasn't religious, but they weren't atheist either, and made no active efforts to 'turn me off' religion. Thus, in my youth, I was very willing to consider the Supernatural, to toe the waters of religion, and contemplate belief in a creator.

I attended church, bible studies, and youth activities many times with my more religious friends, watched their strange religious cartoons portraying the story of David and Goliath, Moses, etc., and saw the appeal of belief to the extent an outsider could. I had questions though, lots and lots of questions, and when I put these questions to my religious friends, their religious parents, the preachers and teachers and authority figures of their religious meetings/activities, the general response was annoyance, and the insistence that these things weren't to be questioned.

As a highly curious kid that was a big turn-off, and what was more, I couldn't help but notice an emptiness to rituals they all suggested should be full and enriching. Often I heard people talking about prayer as a conversation with God, often I heard people claim that God spoke to them, that they felt God, knew God, and if I prayed with them, or ate the piece of bread, or sang along, or took a knee, I too would know/hear/feel God. Alas, every time I tried- and tried I did- I felt every bit as alone with my thoughts as I had previously, and a strong pressure from the others to pretend otherwise. This actually upset me quite a bit, and I remember tearfully confessing to one of these authorities that it wasn't working for me, that I wasn't feeling it, and that it felt wrong and bad to pretend, his response to my memory being to the tune of: 'Just keep trying, and eventually you will.', a sort of 'fake it till you make it' suggestion that I just couldn't maintain.

It was around that time that I became a fan of two new (to me) television programs, the WWF, and Benny Hinn's televangelism program. I loved both these shows for generally the same reason: massive crowds, crazy theatrics, people getting smacked and falling down (albeit for very different reasons), colorful costumes, and all with total conviction. It didn't take an astute observer to soon realize both these productions were fakes however. They were both using the same techniques and same tactics to tell generally the same lie; each portraying 'contact' that never actually takes place. The more Benny Hinn I watched, the more ridiculous it became, and the more people- massive crowds of people- seemed to believe it in spite of its obvious falsehoods, the more critical I became of religion in general, as I increasingly saw the reflection of his method present in all of it.

More and more it seemed to me that religion was a scam... every bit as amusing, distracting and in the end hollow of truth as The Undertaker's choke-slam, as Benny Hinn's tears, and the feeling I was supposed to feel but didn't when I prayed was the same feeling that the crowds of wrestling fans got when they chose to believe that choke-slam was real, that the match isn't rigged, that the cancer has been healed. I began to associate religion with self-deception.

Again, this was as a child, long before I had any real conception of what evolution was, what the big bang was, or how those theories conflicted or clashed with religious beliefs. While science has absolutely informed my atheism, it's by no means the source of it. As I've grown up and gotten older my skepticism has spread over much of the supernatural, some of that having to do with science, but a lot of it admittedly informed by my own experience and observations.

Work, for example, with the victims of serious brain-trauma, seeing the dramatic effect brain-injury has on a person's memory, personality, emotions, behaviors and beliefs, has made it extremely difficult for me to consider any kind of afterlife where those aspects of self remain intact. If a bump on the noggin can completely obliterate the person you were prior too it, that same person isn't going to survive the outright death of the brain.

Honestly, I'd like to be proven wrong. Preferably not with some apocalyptic scenario if it can be helped, but if Jesus came floating down from the heavens one day and said "Yo guys, totally real.", I'd be down. If a booming God-Voice echoed across the earth saying 'You guys need to chill out.' for all to hear, I'd be totally down. If a ghost introduced himself to me/the world, if a priest slapped a demon out of my sister, I'd be down. If ghosts and Gods and magic suddenly revealed themselves as real and didn't instantly go all Hellraiser on us, I'd likely be happier for it.

I just don't have it in me to pretend.

The problem could have been you went to man (especially man who didnt have answers themselves) for guidance instead of that which you allegedly were seeking (the Creator).

Its like me not understanding physics and going to someone who also doesnt understand physics for understanding. That would get me nowhere and if I wasnt inclined to actually pursue physics, may cause me to just throw my hands up and give up based on the lackluster explanation that was given to me by someone who didnt know much if anything about physics. Most people in the church, even the authority figures, are like that (imo)..

 

[Mr.Grieves]

The problem could have been you went to man (especially man who didnt have answers themselves) for guidance instead of that which you allegedly were seeking (the Creator).

If prayer receives no reply, response, or even vague sense of having been heard, and the rituals meant to bring one closer to God have no effect or impact on the effort to establish a connection, how do you suggest one goes to God him/herself for guidance?

Its like me not understanding physics and going to someone who also doesnt understand physics for understanding.

Given your opinions about gravity, the shape of the earth, the size of the solar-system, and a plethora of other physics related issues, it's absolutely clear to me that you've done this exact thing many times over. Your misunderstanding of physics is clearly derived from those uneducated on the subject, or your own ill-informed assumptions and casual observations.

 

[KoncreteMind]

If prayer receives no reply, response, or even vague sense of having been heard, and the rituals meant to bring one closer to God have no effect or impact on the effort to establish a connection, how do you suggest one goes to God him/herself for guidance?

Well what do you mean by "prayer"? One time prayer? Multiple times? How many times a day/week/month? Dd they pray alone? Behavioral change even small/incremental? Did they not only ask for things but also give thanks for what they already had since they were "legitimately" seeking God? And since people call all types of things "G/god", I'd ask what or who they were praying to? And I''d ask all these things to see if they were actually serious in their "search" of just kind of half assing it. Half assed attempts arent going to get answers

Given your opinions about gravity, the shape of the earth, the size of the solar-system, and a plethora of other physics related issues, it's absolutely clear to me that you've done this exact thing many times over. Your misunderstanding of physics is clearly derived from those uneducated on the subject, or your own ill-informed assumptions and casual observations.

I see I shouldnt have used physics as an example. But anyways my point was that going to the wrong people for answers concerning the bible, doesnt mean the truth doesnt exist. It doesnt mean its false. Just as going to the wrong people for physics can lead to a misunderstanding or even rejection of physics. As for me? No. I had to take physics/calculus classes in college so its not a case of me going to the wrong people for understanding well unless you view it as I do now lol. In reality though, I understood it just fine with enough study/practice. So its definitely not a case of misunderstanding anything. More like rejecting certain things.

Of course the points themselves are better put in another thread, to which you would do as you did here in regards to the REAL point being made, and not respond. It is what it is though...

 

[Mr.Grieves]

Well what do you mean by "prayer"? One time prayer? Multiple times? How many times a day/week/month? Dd they pray alone? Behavioral change even small/incremental? Did they not only ask for things but also give thanks for what they already had since they were "legitimately" seeking God? And since people call all types of things "G/god", I'd ask what or who they were praying to? And I''d ask all these things to see if they were actually serious in their "search" of just kind of half assing it. Half assed attempts arent going to get answers

The 'They' in this case was me personally as a young boy, and typically the only thing I prayed for was a sign/response of some kind. When I engaged in earnest prayer it was, I suppose, to the Christian God, as the church in question was Christian, protestant I think. I wasn't asking for any wishes to be fulfilled or miracles/magic to be performed, I was simply looking for the 'connection' that others claimed to experience and cited as their proof of God. I'm not sure how many times I tried really, this was all some time ago, but I know that I was really serious about it for at least a couple of months, as I didn't want to disappoint the friend/his family who'd been inviting me.

In reality though, I understood it just fine with enough study/practice.

I can't imagine you'd have passed a college-level physics class when high-school level physics elude you so completely, but I suppose anyone can get lucky where multiple-choice testing is involved.

So its definitely not a case of misunderstanding anything. More like rejecting certain things.

You've told me in no uncertain terms you believe feathers are weightless and 'float', something you maintained adamantly even after seeing a bowling ball and a feather fall at the same speed in a vacuum, going so far as to insist this actually proves your point, because 'earth doesn't exist in a vacuum.'. That's a pretty massively grave misunderstanding.

Of course the points themselves are better put in another thread, to which you would do as you did here in regards to the REAL point being made, and not respond. It is what it is though...

Huh?

 

[KoncreteMind]

I know that I was really serious about it for at least a couple of months, as I didn't want to disappoint the friend/his family who'd been inviting me.

Umm yea, then you probably approached the situation with the wrong intent if your motivating factor was to satisfy/not disappoint family and friends...

I can't imagine you'd have passed a college-level physics class when high-school level physics elude you so completely, but I suppose anyone can get lucky where multiple-choice testing is involved.

Nope. Not "anyone" can get lucky and pass college-level physics classes especially in classes where work must be shown in regards to getting your answer.

You've told me in no uncertain terms you believe feathers are weightless and 'float', something you maintained adamantly even after seeing a bowling ball and a feather fall at the same speed in a vacuum, going so far as to insist this actually proves your point, because 'earth doesn't exist in a vacuum.'. That's a pretty massively grave misunderstanding.

Cant say I remember saying feathers have no weight and if I said they float, I meant in reality (not a vacuum) and that they float on its way down. The only one misunderstanding is you. I can reject christianity while understanding the beliefs that entail it. I can reject being a "liberal" or "conservative" while at the same time understanding the beliefs that entail it. Just as I can reject the physics concerning the things you mentioned in your last post, while understanding the beliefs that physics hold concerning those things. Its not a "if you dont accept it you dont understand thing" just as it isnt with anything in life. Thats your lazy and overly simplistic view on things when you cant actually address the points being made.

Anyways at the time I took the class, I didnt take it to "test" what they said as being true or false. I simply took the class and accepted what they taught and did my best to regurgitate the information back to them for the highest grade possible. Hardly a case of "misunderstanding" anything. It wasnt until later that I came to the realization that there wasnt any proof to alot of the things espoused in science when it comes to the earth.. Just theory upon theory. Kinda like evolution to tie it back to the thread. But these topics as far as physics is concerned would be better put in another thread than this one as I said. But heres an example of what you would do if we were to even engage in that:

Huh?

Again, the point wasnt about physics. I could have said geography. I could have said Islam and had the "person" in the analogy going to a buddhist to learn about Islam. The point was going to the wrong people to learn about a specific subject can lead to a misunderstanding and worse a rejection of said subject because of receiving wrong information. Instead of addressing the point of my analogy, you take the "physics" part out and start bringing up things that you dont even want to discuss anyways. Just as if I were to engage you in discussing these things, you'd just end up avoiding that which you didnt want to adddress for the random tangents you could create that you could address...

The real truth of the matter is that I have you in your feelings from old threads still while I brush ish off and kept it moving lol. I didnt come in this thread with any of that in mind, just read thru the last couple of pages and responded to something you said. As I said before, it is what it is though...

 

[Faker He-Man]

It wasnt until later that I came to the realization that there wasnt any proof to alot of the things espoused in science when it comes to the earth.. Just theory upon theory.

LOL Do you even science, bro? http://www.diffen.com/difference/Hypothesis_vs_Theory

 

[elsbet]

@Mr.Grieves
"The 'They' in this case was me personally as a young boy, and typically the only thing I prayed for was a sign/response of some kind. When I engaged in earnest prayer it was, I suppose, to the Christian God, as the church in question was Christian, protestant I think. I wasn't asking for any wishes to be fulfilled or miracles/magic to be performed, I was simply looking for the 'connection' that others claimed to experience and cited as their proof of God. I'm not sure how many times I tried really, this was all some time ago, but I know that I was really serious about it... "

This makes more sense to me, now.
Timing-- that's all this, imo. If you were seeking earnestly, you will be contacted.

For some odd reason, God just doesn't adhere to our timetables.

 

[A.J.]

I thought of something the other day watching a video of my daughter as a toddler....babies are hardwired to develop language....that sounds like just one aspect of intelligent design/creation to me......

 

[KoncreteMind]

LOL Do you even science, bro? http://www.diffen.com/difference/Hypothesis_vs_Theory

Is this your way of saying that science is built off theories and hypotheses? If so, I agree.

And for the record by science I mean the mainstream science touted by the establishment that lies about everything EXCEPT science according to some of you.

 

[mecca]

the establishment that lies about everything EXCEPT science

The establishment doesn't lie about everything. There are aspects of science that they may not divulge or be truthful about but not all of it... same with everything else they do.

 

[KoncreteMind]

The establishment doesn't lie about everything. There are aspects of science that they may not divulge or be truthful about but not all of it... same with everything else they do.

So what's an example of something they're not truthful about when it comes to science?