Baptism: the New Birth Experience

[Flarepath]

I once asked a baptist minister at a big baptist rally "I haven't been baptised so will I be going to hell?" and he replied with a smile "No, you won't"..

If we know we have to baptised as Jesus was and we don't, then I'm afraid we will go to hell, if we don't repent and get baptised. Its how much light we have and what we did with it that matters.

So who shall we believe, the big shot baptist minister who said we won't go to hell if we haven't been baptised, or you who say we will go to hell?..

 

[Flarepath]

I don't know but biblical baptisms have to be immersion baptisms, and we have to be baptised in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. No other kind of baptism is acceptable to God.

Does the holy spirit only come to those who've been baptised?

 

[phipps]

So who shall we believe, the big shot baptist minister who said we won't go to hell if we haven't been baptised, or you who say we will go to hell?..

We should believe the Bible. If a baptist minister speaks contrary to the Bible, obviously you should choose to believe God's Word. Biblically we will go to hell if we don't obey God and not repent and walk in His ways. That's the truth of God's word.

 

[phipps]

Does the holy spirit only come to those who've been baptised?

No. The Holy Spirit comes to us at different stages in our lives if we allow Him. Its the Holy Spirit that convicts us of sin, leads us into truth, leads to us repent and be baptised and all throughout our Christian journey.

But when we get baptised (this includes baptism of the Holy Spirit), we receive the Holy Spirit fully which leads us to live in obedience to God and this will produce the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22-26). These will testify to the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.

 

[Flarepath]

Does the holy spirit only come to those who've been baptised?

No. The Holy Spirit comes to us at different stages in our lives if we allow Him. Its the Holy Spirit that convicts us of sin, leads us into truth, leads to us repent and be baptised and all throughout our Christian journey.
But when we get baptised (this includes baptism of the Holy Spirit), we receive the Holy Spirit fully which leads us to live in obedience to God and this will produce the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22-26). These will testify to the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.

I'm not sure what you're saying mate.
This verse indicates that baptism doesn't guarantee that the holy spirit will come to people even if they've been baptised-
"..the Holy Spirit had not yet come on any of them; they had simply been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus" (Acts 8:15-16)

And this verse indicates that the holy spirt can come to people BEFORE they've been baptised-
"The Caesareans have received the holy spirit ,so let's baptise them" (Acts 10:47)

 

[phipps]

@Flarepath

I'm not sure what you're saying mate.
This verse indicates that baptism doesn't guarantee that the holy spirit will come to people even if they've been baptised-
"..the Holy Spirit had not yet come on any of them; they had simply been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus" (Acts 8:15-16)

I actually posted about this in this very thread here, here and here. That's because they'd not been baptised by the Holy Spirit and only with water. So in this case Peter and John were sent to lay hands on them and baptise them with the Holy Spirit. Jesus makes it clear that we've got to be baptised by both water and the Holy Spirit. "Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God” (John 3:5).

And this verse indicates that the holy spirt can come to people BEFORE they've been baptised-
"The Caesareans have received the holy spirit ,so let's baptise them" (Acts 10:47)

Sometimes receiving or being baptised with the Holy Spirit and water happen at separate times. For most it happens on the same day like with Jesus' baptism. Either way they've got to make sure they get baptised by both water and the Holy Spirit as the Bible shows us in this story.

This was when Peter went to the Centurion's house and preached the gospel and they received the Holy Spirit like the disciples did on Pentecost day and they too could speak with tongues/different languages too.

Acts 10:44-48, "While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered, "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."

 

[Flarepath]

Is everybody who's been baptised automatically saved and remain saved for the rest of their lives?

 

[phipps]

Is everybody who's been baptised automatically saved and remain saved for the rest of their lives?

No. They have to have a continuing relationship with Christ and obey and submit to Him until they either die or Jesus comes back the second time.

 

[Flarepath]

Is everybody who's been baptised automatically saved and remain saved for the rest of their lives?

No. They have to have a continuing relationship with Christ and obey and submit to Him until they either die or Jesus comes back the second time.

Why isn't baptism one of the 10 commandments?

 

[phipps]

Why isn't baptism one of the 10 commandments?

I don't know. That is a question that only God can answer. What I can say is that baptism is the act of being buried with Jesus Christ through baptism into death in the watery grave and being raised to a new life in Him. It symbolises the crucifixion of the old life and is the public confession and commitment to God and acceptance of Christ as our Saviour. Its the new birth or conversion. When this happens we become commandment keeping people. Also when we are baptized into Christ we are baptized into His body and His body is the church.

 

[phipps]

 

[Flarepath]

Why did Jesus ask John to baptise him?

 

[phipps]

Why did Jesus ask John to baptise him?

Jesus did not ask John to baptise Him. John baptised many people and preached the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins in that area. Jesus came to him to be baptised while John was baptising others.

Why did John baptise Jesus? Because he was the witness to the true light and prepared the way for Jesus as all four gospels tell us, Matthew 3:1-6, Mark 1:1-4, John 1:6-13. He also preached the good news that the Messiah was coming soon.

Luke 3:3-6 says, "And he went into all the region around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins, as it is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet, saying: “The voice of one crying in the wilderness: ‘Prepare the way of the Lord; Make His paths straight. Every valley shall be filled And every mountain and hill brought low; The crooked places shall be made straight And the rough ways smooth; And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.’ ” So John the baptist was the fulfilment of a prophecy in Isaiah 40:3-5.

It was only apt that John baptise Jesus. He recognised Jesus even though many around him didn’t. John wasn’t drawn aside by the popular thought of the Jews that the Messiah would overthrow the Romans with power. Instead he read the Bible and its prophecies and looked for the Messiah based on what the Bible said and not the people around him.

His birth was unique too and was announced by an angel who told them that his name would be John (Luke 1:5-21). He was born around the same as Jesus plus his mother Elizabeth was a cousin to Mary Jesus' mother and they met while pregnant and the Bible tells us, "And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. Then she spoke out with a loud voice and said, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! But why is this granted to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For indeed, as soon as the voice of your greeting sounded in my ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy. Blessed is she who [h]believed, for there will be a fulfillment of those things which were told her from the Lord” (Luke 1:41-45).

I suppose its best to say Jesus chose John the Baptist to baptise Him. He specifically came into this world to prepare the way of the Messiah.

 

[phipps]

 

[Flarepath]

I haven't been baptised because it was simply an old-time ritual and I've never felt the need. But if people want it, good luck to them if it strengthens their faith as long as they don't think it automatically makes them receive the holy spirit..
Paul sensibly never regarded baptism as the first priority- "Jesus sent me not to baptise, but to preach the gospel" (1 Cor 1:17)
And baptism doesn't automatically confer the HS- "...they prayed for the new believers there that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come on any of them; they had simply been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus" Acts 8:15-16)
The HS can come even without baptism- "The Caesareans have received the holy spirit, so let's baptise them" (Acts 10:47)

 

[phipps]

If we refuse to get baptised we are rejecting God.

This is what the Bible says about the seriousness of Baptism. Luke 7:30, "But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the will of God for themselves, not having been baptized by him." So if we refuse to get baptized we are not rejecting men but rejecting God by not doing His will and following His example too.

 

[phipps]

Where did the act of baptism come from?

The practice of baptism is firmly rooted in the New Testament. Jesus first modelled it at the beginning of His ministry (Mark 1:9).

He went down to the Jordan River to be baptized by John the Baptist, the man who had been preparing the way for Jesus’ arrival (Matthew 3:3).

John resisted baptizing Jesus because he believed that Jesus should be baptizing him. But Jesus answered,“Permit it to be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness” (Matthew 3:15).

What did it mean for Jesus to “fulfill all righteousness”?

Jesus came to Earth to both be our sacrifice and live a perfect, sinless life as our example.

His baptism was a public demonstration of His faith in His Father and also of His death and resurrection. Since He was setting an example for us, He went through the baptism we are to go through.

As John baptized Jesus, the Holy Spirit came down from Heaven in the form of a dove. And God’s voice accompanied it, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased” (Matthew 3:17).

All three persons of the Godhead were present at the baptism of Jesus.

And this fact is so important that later in His life, when Jesus gave His followers a charge known as the Great Commission, He said:

“All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age” (Matthew 28:18–20).

As His disciples—followers—preached the gospel to the whole world, they were to baptize new believers in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Jesus singled out this ritual as something significant at the beginning of the Christian life.

 

[phipps]

How does someone take the step of baptism?

The most crucial part of baptism starts with believing in God, which leads to baptism. The Word of God makes that part explicit, “He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned” (Mark 16:16).

“So they said, ‘Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household’” (Acts 16:31).

Notice how these verses say that belief comes first, then baptism.

Belief, not baptism, is what saves.

While the Bible teaches that the practice of baptism is important, it is not a means of salvation. Salvation is by faith alone.

Then, when we love God so much that we wish to follow Him wherever He leads, it only makes sense to commemorate this decision with a meaningful ceremony.

Similar to how weddings celebrate the union of people pledging their lives to one another, baptism celebrates one of the greatest joys we can fathom—that Jesus died for us, cleansed us of our sins, and rose again so that we could have eternal life with Him.

Jesus encouraged His followers to make disciples and teach them. People should study the Bible and understand the decision they’re making before being baptized.

 

[phipps]

The Bible says that when we are baptised, we are all brothers and sisters in Christ regardless of our tribes, gender or professions.

Galatians 3:26-29 says, “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise."

 

[phipps]

Baptism is a most solemn renunciation of the world. Those who are baptized in the threefold name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, at the very entrance of their Christian life declare publicly that they have forsaken the service of Satan and have become members of the royal family, children of the heavenly King. They have obeyed the command: “Come out from among them, and be ye separate, ... and touch not the unclean thing.” And to them is fulfilled the promise: “I will receive you, and will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be My sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.” 2 Corinthians 6:17, 18. 6T 91.3