Location of hell

phipps

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IMHO.. hell is not a place but knowing that you are stuck in the mortal world and cant access eternity... until the lake of fire destroys everything of you on final day forever.
That's not biblical though is it? Hell will definitely be a place and it will be right here on earth (the breadth of the earth) where the wicked will be destroyed along with the devil and his angels. The lake of fire will be created by the fire raining down from heaven.

“And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are” (Revelation 20:9-10).

Edit: Hope this video can help explain hell and its location better. https://manna.amazingfacts.org/amazingfacts/website/multiple/video/HellTruthLongVersion24pHD.mp4
 
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phipps

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Would Everyone be Happy in Heaven?

Summary: What will it be like in heaven? Is it universally enjoyable, like popular media tells us?

If you were to ask, do you want to go to heaven? The vast majority of people will answer yes. For many that answer might spring from the reason that they do not want the alternative. But if the wicked were to be admitted into heaven would they enjoy being there? Would they be happy? God is in heaven. Would they be happy with God? What is God’s character like?

God is love

"He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love" (1 John 4:8).


"If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen? And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also" (1 John 4:20-21). 


If someone holds grudges and has a spirit of hatred they would find heaven an unsuitable place to harbor their feelings.

God is pure

"Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him" (Proverbs 30:5).

But speaking about the wicked the Bible says this:

"They have corrupted themselves…they are a perverse and crooked generation" (Deuteronomy 32:5). 



"He that walketh in his uprightness feareth the LORD: but he that is perverse in his ways despiseth him" (Proverbs 14:2).

If people hate God’s purity it would be torture for them to be in God’s presence.

God is truth

"He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he" (Deuteronomy 32:4). 



"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved" (2 Thessalonians 2:10).

In order to be happy in heaven we must love truth.

God is holy

"Exalt the LORD our God, and worship at his holy hill; for the LORD our God is holy" (Psalm 99:9).

The wicked would be extremely uncomfortable in a holy place:

"For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God" (2 Timothy 3:2-4).

God is righteous

"…for the LORD our God is righteous in all his works which he doeth" (Daniel 9:14).

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

"And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved" (John 3:19-20).

God would be a constant rebuke to those who do not posses His character.

So, would everyone be happy in heaven?

It is evident that the atmosphere of heaven would be torturous to the wicked because their character is in complete opposition to God’s. God respects the choice of those who would retain their sinful nature and does not force them to live in a place where they would be miserable.

The only ones who would truly be happy in heaven are they that love God and everything about Him. They have allowed God to take away their carnal nature and tendency toward evil and have been born again with Jesus character to take the place of their own.

"Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you" (Romans 8:7-9).

And for them who have chosen this new life this has been promised:

"Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him" (1 Corinthians 2:9)

We choose whether or not we go into heaven. It isn’t really up to God at all. We call Him the great Judge, and we talk about going before Him to determine where we are going, but in reality, in the judgment He will only finalize the decision we have already made.

Are you preparing to be happy in heaven? Are you developing a taste for God’s presence?

https://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception_end-time_millennium_heaven_righteous
 

Lisa

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IMHO.. hell is not a place but knowing that you are stuck in the mortal world and cant access eternity... until the lake of fire destroys everything of you on final day forever.
That’s not Biblical..you’re making things up now?
 

phipps

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The Man Who Unlearned Hell

Shortly after Thanksgiving, Edward Fudge, a retired attorney who lived in Houston, Texas, passed away. His family announced his passing via social media.

His death at the age of 73 would be relatively unremarkable except for one thing: Fudge’s acceptance, decades earlier, of a $3,000 challenge to prove or disprove the notion that the unsaved end up in an ever-burning hell. What Fudge, at the time a young preacher, discovered would change the course of his life forever.

Fudge was a native of Athens, Alabama, and became a pastor in the Church of Christ. His father, William, led one of the church’s publishing houses. As with most people in that denomination, William believed that those who died unsaved would suffer eternal torment in the fires of hell. Edward held the same belief—until that challenge spurred him into a year of study.

When he completed his study, Fudge concluded that the mainstream teaching about hellfire was wrong. Those who do not choose to follow Jesus would suffer “eternal destruction,” as Paul notes in 2 Thessalonians 1:9, but not eternal punishing. The “fire” of hell destroys; it doesn’t torment eternally.

With that discovery, anchored in what the Bible actually says, Edward Fudge “unlearned” what he’d been taught for years, and he started sharing the truth he had learned.

As you might imagine, taking a stand for his beliefs came with a price. After publishing a book on the subject in 1982, it wasn’t long before Edward Fudge lost his job as a pastor, as well as work with the church-backed publishing house, because of his views.

Fudge and his family relocated to the Houston area, where he practiced law for nearly thirty years. He remained a member of his denomination but never recanted his belief about hell. In 2012, a biographical film, “Hell and Mr. Fudge,” produced by LLT Productions, won praise from viewers and critics alike.

What Edward Fudge learned surprised him and turned his life upside down. But taking a stand for truth is always the right thing to do—whether it was Daniel refusing to worship Nebuchadnezzar, or Peter continuing to preach the good news of Jesus when religious leaders of the day ordered him to desist.

The truth about hell is too important to ignore. Not only can it bring comfort to those worried about lost loved ones, but it also vindicates God’s character: God is love, and He will not allow the everlasting torment of those who rebelled against Him.

https://www.amazingfacts.org/news-and-features/af-blog/article/id/19882/t/the-man-who-unlearned-hell
 
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The Man Who Unlearned Hell

Shortly after Thanksgiving, Edward Fudge, a retired attorney who lived in Houston, Texas, passed away. His family announced his passing via social media.

His death at the age of 73 would be relatively unremarkable except for one thing: Fudge’s acceptance, decades earlier, of a $3,000 challenge to prove or disprove the notion that the unsaved end up in an ever-burning hell. What Fudge, at the time a young preacher, discovered would change the course of his life forever.

Fudge was a native of Athens, Alabama, and became a pastor in the Church of Christ. His father, William, led one of the church’s publishing houses. As with most people in that denomination, William believed that those who died unsaved would suffer eternal torment in the fires of hell. Edward held the same belief—until that challenge spurred him into a year of study.

When he completed his study, Fudge concluded that the mainstream teaching about hellfire was wrong. Those who do not choose to follow Jesus would suffer “eternal destruction,” as Paul notes in 2 Thessalonians 1:9, but not eternal punishing. The “fire” of hell destroys; it doesn’t torment eternally.

With that discovery, anchored in what the Bible actually says, Edward Fudge “unlearned” what he’d been taught for years, and he started sharing the truth he had learned.

As you might imagine, taking a stand for his beliefs came with a price. After publishing a book on the subject in 1982, it wasn’t long before Edward Fudge lost his job as a pastor, as well as work with the church-backed publishing house, because of his views.

Fudge and his family relocated to the Houston area, where he practiced law for nearly thirty years. He remained a member of his denomination but never recanted his belief about hell. In 2012, a biographical film, “Hell and Mr. Fudge,” produced by LLT Productions, won praise from viewers and critics alike.

What Edward Fudge learned surprised him and turned his life upside down. But taking a stand for truth is always the right thing to do—whether it was Daniel refusing to worship Nebuchadnezzar, or Peter continuing to preach the good news of Jesus when religious leaders of the day ordered him to desist.

The truth about hell is too important to ignore. Not only can it bring comfort to those worried about lost loved ones, but it also vindicates God’s character: God is love, and He will not allow the everlasting torment of those who rebelled against Him.

https://www.amazingfacts.org/news-and-features/af-blog/article/id/19882/t/the-man-who-unlearned-hell
And you posted this (because you believe him?) You will know more about hell if you go there. We do not trust Christ because we are afraid of hell, but because we love Christ. Self willed religion is not of God. Catholicism has been around for millenniums and they believe the lies to their death this very day and would die for it. But that will not save them. If Christ said there is a hell...then there is one.
 

Lisa

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And you posted this (because you believe him?) You will know more about hell if you go there. We do not trust Christ because we are afraid of hell, but because we love Christ. Self willed religion is not of God. Catholicism has been around for millenniums and they believe the lies to their death this very day and would die for it. But that will not save them. If Christ said there is a hell...then there is one.
Would you say self willed and steadfast are the same things? The Bible does have something to stay about being steadfast.
Jude tells us in verse 21 to keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting anxiously for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to eternal life. Part of faith is having it isn’t it?

I would fix your last sentence...Christ said there is a hell so there is one.
 

Thunderian

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hen he completed his study, Fudge concluded that the mainstream teaching about hellfire was wrong. Those who do not choose to follow Jesus would suffer “eternal destruction,” as Paul notes in 2 Thessalonians 1:9, but not eternal punishing. The “fire” of hell destroys; it doesn’t torment eternally.
I'm sure the distinction will make their eternal destiny much more palatable.
 

phipps

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I'm sure the distinction will make their eternal destiny much more palatable.
Its better for the saved to know their loved ones will die and not be tormented for eternity in the lake of fire. That distinction is very comforting actually and like I posted, it vindicates God's character. Also the saved will understand why their loved ones will die eternally because they will judge in heaven with Christ in heaven for 1000 years and will be present for the judgement of the lost after the millenium.

Then, "God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." Revelation 21:4.
 

Lisa

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Its better for the saved to know their loved ones will die and not be tormented for eternity in the lake of fire.
But that’s not true, should the saved believe in lies so they can be comforted? Is that what God does? Why would God’s character need vindication?
 

phipps

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And you posted this (because you believe him?) You will know more about hell if you go there. We do not trust Christ because we are afraid of hell, but because we love Christ. Self willed religion is not of God. Catholicism has been around for millenniums and they believe the lies to their death this very day and would die for it. But that will not save them. If Christ said there is a hell...then there is one.
And you posted this (because you believe him?) You will know more about hell if you go there.

I believe the Bible and what it says about hell which the man I posted about above believed too. So you see, its not him I believe, its God I believe. What I know about hell is enough, I don't want to experience it and I'm sure neither do you. This is about truth.

We do not trust Christ because we are afraid of hell, but because we love Christ.
As usual you've completely missed the point. What I posted is about the truth of hell that many Christian religions have been preaching the wrong doctrine about, that it has turned many people away from God because they think He will torment the unsaved for eternity.

No one's relationship with Christ should be based on fear of hell. It should be based on love. This just happens to be the topic I posted about. Its got nothing to do with fear.

Self willed religion is not of God.
I know that, hence why I posted and post what I do here and in other forums.

Catholicism has been around for millenniums and they believe the lies to their death this very day and would die for it. But that will not save them.
I wasn't thinking of Catholics when I posted what I posted. I know Catholics have a twisted theology about hell that isn't biblical but they aren't the only ones in Christendom. For example, on this very forum I posted about the location of hell from the Old and New Testaments and most here disagree with the clear Word of God. I doubt any of them are Catholic.

If Christ said there is a hell...then there is one.
Everything Christ says is the pure truth but lets be clear about what Christ said about hell. He said, there will be a hell, its not in existence yet. Hell will exist after the second resurrection of the unsaved when the lost will be judged and fire rains down from heaven.
 
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Daciple

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If Hell results in someone being Annihilated then why would Jesus make this statement?

Matt 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.

Jesus says that the end result of Judas the man who betrayed him is WORSE than if he had never been born. Annihilation results in the exact literal thing as not being born.

If I am destroyed then absolutely nothing I did mattered, I wont remember it, including the rejection of Christ or any pain associated with Hell itself. That state is literally what every Atheists says he will receive when he dies.

It is pointless for God to create a Hell and Judge people and place them into it, if the end result is they disappear.

And Scripture also shows that Hell does NOT destroy the False Prophet or the Beast, but you want to tell others it destroys humans?

Where in Scripture can you show that humans are made different than the False Prophet or the Beast?

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

So the Beast and the False Prophet are in the Lake of Fire, still being tormented, for however long, before Satan in thrown in. They were nor will be destroyed and neither will any other person that goes into the Lake of Fire, they too will be tormented day and night for ever and ever...
 

phipps

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But that’s not true, should the saved believe in lies so they can be comforted? Is that what God does? Why would God’s character need vindication?
Its true according to the Bible. The unsaved are NOT going to burn in hell for eternity. That would mean they would be immortal. The Bible is clear only the saved will be immortal. Read 2 Corinthians 5:1-8 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-53. Plus all the rest I explained to you on this very forum. So it vindicates God's character when we tell the truth of what hell will be, where it will be and how all the unsaved will die the second death from which they will never exist again.

I don't believe in a God who will torture people who barely lived in this world for less than 100 years but torment them in hellfire for eternity. And the Bible agrees with me as I showed you. You're the one who believes in lies, please study the Bible and you will see that what I'm posting here is the truth and nothing but.

"And fear not them which kill the body ... but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." Matthew 10:28.
 
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Lisa

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So it vindicates God's character when we tell the truth of what hell will be, where it will be and how all the unsaved will die the second death from which they will never exist again.
Isn’t it up to God what His punishment will be for sin? Since that is so, why should God need vindication in the first place? God dying for sins means that sin is really that bad to Him. Jesus tells us in Matthew 25:46 As the righteous go into eternal life, the unrighteousness go into eternal punishment...its forever either way.
 

Lisa

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No Lisa, They are opposites. Self willed means the intrusion of self will into divine authority. Steadfast means to contend for the faith of divine authority.
Steadfast means to contend for the faith? I don’t think so.
stead·fast\ˈsted-ˌfast also -fəst\
adjective
: very devoted or loyal to a person, belief, or cause : not changing

A Christian wants to be steadfast, loyal and sometimes doesn’t that take self will?
self–will\-ˈwil\
noun
: stubborn or willful adherence to one's own desires or ideas : obstinacy
Synonyms: bullheadedness, doggedness, hardheadedness, intransigence, mulishness, obduracy, obdurateness, obstinateness, opinionatedness, pertinaciousness, pertinacity, pigheadedness, self-opinionatedness, self-will, stubbornness, willfulness

I think many fundamentals can be called some of those synonyms.
 

phipps

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Isn’t it up to God what His punishment will be for sin? Since that is so, why should God need vindication in the first place? God dying for sins means that sin is really that bad to Him. Jesus tells us in Matthew 25:46 As the righteous go into eternal life, the unrighteousness go into eternal punishment...its forever either way.
Isn’t it up to God what His punishment will be for sin?
God has told us what the punishment for sin will be in detail from the Old to the New Testaments. I've posted the actual scripture here. Do you not believe it?

Since that is so, why should God need vindication in the first place?
The vindication is about His character. God has been misrepresented about many things and about hell too. No doubt it all begins with Satan. God has been represented as a tyrant who will punish the unsaved for eternity which is not like His loving character as written of in His Word. To tell the truth about God is to prove He would never punish even the devil for eternity.

God dying for sins means that sin is really that bad to Him.
Yes, there is no denying that, but He has explained to us that if we do not repent and accept His gift of salvation and live according to His precepts, we will pay for our own sins. Its important we know, so we know the choices we have to make to either eternal life or eternal death.

Jesus tells us in Matthew 25:46 As the righteous go into eternal life, the unrighteousness go into eternal punishment...its forever either way.
The opposite of eternal life is eternal death. Only the righteous will live eternally, not the the unrighteous. I'm going to add something else I posted a long time ago and hopefully you will understand what "eternal punishment" means biblically.


God is love. Even in judgment He does not torture anyone forever.

How could anyone enjoy Heaven while knowing that their loved one(s), who did not make it, was/were being tortured by God in hell? Could you enjoy Heaven or love a God like that?

Malachi 4:1, "…and the day that cometh shall “burn them up.”

Malachi 4:3, "And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be “ashes” under the soles of your feet…"

1) While on fire, yes, they will experience torment.

2) But subsequently the fire will burn them up.

3) Ashes denotes complete destruction of what was previously on fire.

4) The fire that can not be quenched simply means that no one, not Satan, not the elite, not man, no one, can put it out until it accomplishes the work of totally destroying the wicked.

Hell does not currently exist. After Christ returns to gather His people then the wicked who remain, and Satan and his demons, will eventually be burned with the earth. We will understand and agree with God’s righteous judgment. Then God will make all things new after the fire completes its cleansing work. The results will be eternal. There will be no reappearance of the wicked or Satan ever again. Forever.

Remember that Satan will always look to misrepresent the character of God.
God is love, not someone who tortures. He is merciful and He longs for us to turn to Him but He will not force us because He is love.

We have a choice.

God Bless.
 
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Everything Christ says is the pure truth but lets be clear about what Christ said about hell. He said, there will be a hell, its not in existence yet. Hell will exist after the second resurrection of the unsaved when the lost will be judged and fire rains down from heaven.
Hell (Hades) is the place of departed unsaved souls who can see the afar off of their judgment in the region of.(the Lake of fire) The second judgment is when they are cast into the lake of fire.(Rev. 20:10-15)
 

Thunderian

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Its better for the saved to know their loved ones will die and not be tormented for eternity in the lake of fire. That distinction is very comforting actually and like I posted, it vindicates God's character. Also the saved will understand why their loved ones will die eternally because they will judge in heaven with Christ in heaven for 1000 years and will be present for the judgement of the lost after the millenium.

Then, "God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." Revelation 21:4.
So what you’re telling people is that Hell is not so bad?
 
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Steadfast means to contend for the faith? I don’t think so.
stead·fast\ˈsted-ˌfast also -fəst\
What do you think contending for the faith is...being loyal, devoted to the belief and not changing from what you have been taught!
adjective
: very devoted or loyal to a person, belief, or cause : not changing

A Christian wants to be steadfast, loyal and sometimes doesn’t that take self will? Self will is never a part of the born again believer. If you are a self willed Christian, Then you do not have the power of the Holy Spirit. You must be born again...really! It is not I (self will), but Christ in me.( He is our will), but not of self! He is our driving force who is continually and constantly guiding us.
self–will\-ˈwil\
 
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