Location of hell

[Lisa]

The Bible doesn't tell us who the righteous and Christ will rule over. It just tells us they will rule and judge with Christ.

If they are going to rule and judge then there has to be someone to rule and judge over...is Jesus goodness to just create people to rule over...or are they gonna come out of the great trib?

REVELATION‬ ‭19:15‬ ‭
From His mouth comes a sharp sword, so that with it He may strike down the nations, and He will rule them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty.
​

You sure get Revelation 20:7-10 wrong...you’re reading too much into a very straightforward text. Jesus has been ruling what’s left of the world for a thousand years. At the end of those thousand years, God let’s satan our of his prison to deceive the nations and it looks like he’s done a great job, because he is able to get people to turn away from God and assemble again to fight God, but God easily puts down their army by fire. The lake of fire is a different place that the devil is cast into. The text does not say that the earth is the lake of fire there.

No, new Jerusalem comes down after satan deceives the nations and God takes out the nations. Then the white throne judgement where people learn their fate. People who’s names are not written in the boom are thrown into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teethe and then God makes a new heaven and a new earth and a new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven.

‭‭REVELATION‬ ‭22:12‬​

“Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done.”
You left out the rest of the verse @phipps, He is going to render to each man, not just the righteous.

There is nothing that says God made a new heaven and a new earth because the old earth is hell. I think you’re very wrong in how you read Revelation.
‭‭ ‭

 

[Lisa]

So you die but you don't die at the same time?

You are punished for eternity it’s called the second death by God.

 

[Thunderian]

The Bible doesn't tell us who the righteous and Christ will rule over. It just tells us they will rule and judge with Christ.

Of course it tells us. We will rule and judge the same nations that Satan will deceive when he is released after the 1000 years. Why do you insist on making the Bible so difficult to understand?

Rev 20:7​

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,​

​

Rev 20:8​

And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.​

 

[polymoog]

God doesn't create suffering, we do. God doesn't hurt humans, other humans do. Is it God's fault some kids in Africa are starving or it's fault our perverse economical system ? To stop suffering now God should wipe out half of humanity. And God didnt create earth the way it is now. Earth was perfect. God doesn't do things halfway. We are ruining and destroying it. The end times which most agree we are in now. Is a time when we screw up so badly that yes, God actually going to intervene and end the misery. Experiment where we are ruling ourselves will be over. If God wanted to make a point, he succeeded. Without him we only good for creating misery and pain...

ok, thats acceptable, but what about from the beginning-- beings consuming other beings which creates pain? why not create lifeforms that never need to create suffering in order to survive? for example, why not create human beings that function on photosynthesis?

 

[phipps]

If they are going to rule and judge then there has to be someone to rule and judge over...is Jesus goodness to just create people to rule over...or are they gonna come out of the great trib?

REVELATION‬ ‭19:15‬ ‭

From His mouth comes a sharp sword, so that with it He may strike down the nations, and He will rule them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty.

​

You sure get Revelation 20:7-10 wrong...you’re reading too much into a very straightforward text. Jesus has been ruling what’s left of the world for a thousand years. At the end of those thousand years, God let’s satan our of his prison to deceive the nations and it looks like he’s done a great job, because he is able to get people to turn away from God and assemble again to fight God, but God easily puts down their army by fire. The lake of fire is a different place that the devil is cast into. The text does not say that the earth is the lake of fire there.

No, new Jerusalem comes down after satan deceives the nations and God takes out the nations. Then the white throne judgement where people learn their fate. People who’s names are not written in the boom are thrown into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teethe and then God makes a new heaven and a new earth and a new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven.

‭‭REVELATION‬ ‭22:12‬​

“Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done.”
You left out the rest of the verse @phipps, He is going to render to each man, not just the righteous.

There is nothing that says God made a new heaven and a new earth because the old earth is hell. I think you’re very wrong in how you read Revelation.
‭‭ ‭

If they are going to rule and judge then there has to be someone to rule and judge over...is Jesus goodness to just create people to rule over...or are they gonna come out of the great trib?

REVELATION‬ ‭19:15‬ ‭

From His mouth comes a sharp sword, so that with it He may strike down the nations, and He will rule them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty.​

Yes there must be someone to rule over. However the Bible doesn't tell us that during the 1000 years in heaven. The Bible does tell us in Revelation 5:10 that we will reign on earth but that will be after the thousand years. "And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth." We know Christ rules over the whole universe because He is God. If the Bible doesn't specify something, it means its not something that God wants us to know until the time comes for knowing. However the Bible is clear as I posted from Revelation 20:4-6 that the saints will reign and judge with Christ in heaven for a thousand years. Do not dismiss these or any scriptures in the Bible just because you don''t understand or agree with them. I already explained about the judgements but I will add, God's judgment will be declared righteous (Romans 2:5, 2 Thessalonians 1:5, Psalm 19:9). In this millennial judgment, God's dealing with the evil angels and rejecters of His truth will be scrutinized (Hebrews 10:26-27; 2 Peter 2:4,9; Jude 6). God's people will thus judge the world.

1 Corinthians 6:2-3, "Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world will be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life."

You've misunderstood Revelation 19:15. Lets read it in context shall we? Revelation 19:11-16, "Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself. He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS."

All over the Bible from the Old to new Testament words like "sharp sword" and "rod of iron" have been used a few times. What do they mean?

A "sharp sword" or "sharp, two-edged sword” is the Word of God.

Hebrews 4:12, "For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart."

Ephesians 6:17, "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God;"

To “rule all or strike the nations nations with a rod of iron” references Psalm 2:9 which says, "You shall break them with a rod of iron;You shall dash them to pieces like a potter’s vessel.’ ” This means that Christ will be victorious over His enemies.

So Revelation 19:11-16 is about Jesus coming to smite the wicked nations, who have waged war against Him, His saints and His church. He has laid aside his priestly garments and put on “crowns” and kingly attire; He is coming as “KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.”

You sure get Revelation 20:7-10 wrong...you’re reading too much into a very straightforward text. Jesus has been ruling what’s left of the world for a thousand years. At the end of those thousand years, God let’s satan our of his prison to deceive the nations and it looks like he’s done a great job, because he is able to get people to turn away from God and assemble again to fight God, but God easily puts down their army by fire. The lake of fire is a different place that the devil is cast into. The text does not say that the earth is the lake of fire there.

You're wrong because Revelation 20:7-10 clearly says the saints will reign with Christ for 1000 years. Its really hard to miss that bit. Also we know at the end of the 1000 years the holy city comes down out of heaven and Satan is loosed and the wicked destroyed. The a thousand years will begin after Jesus' second return for His people. This earth will be a bottomless pit and that is why Satan will be prisoner with nothing to do or no one to tempt until after the second resurrection of the lost.

The fire raining down from heaven will create a lake of fire Hell is not going to be moved somewhere else is it? Not according to the Bible any way. And all the wicked including the devil and his angels will be cast into it. Right here on earth. That is in harmony with the rest of the Bible. I've shown you scripture saying these things but you choose to dismiss them.

No, new Jerusalem comes down after satan deceives the nations and God takes out the nations. Then the white throne judgement where people learn their fate. People who’s names are not written in the boom are thrown into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teethe and then God makes a new heaven and a new earth and a new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven.

No, read the scriptures again. New Jerusalem comes down as Satan is loosed and the wicked have resurrected the second time.

Revelation 20:5, "But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished." These are the wicked since the righteous are alive in heaven for the thousand years.

Revelation 21:2, "Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

Revelation 20:7-10, "Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever."

All these events happen at the end of the 1000 years clearly.

‭‭

REVELATION‬ ‭22:12‬

“Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done.”
You left out the rest of the verse @phipps, He is going to render to each man, not just the righteous.

I don't deny that but the righteous will have their rewards before the 1000 years. Then the wicked will get their rewards after the 1000 years when they will be judged and then punished and destroyed in hellfire here on earth.

There is nothing that says God made a new heaven and a new earth because the old earth is hell. I think you’re very wrong in how you read Revelation.

I have proved from scripture that hell is going to be right here on earth. You on the other you haven't proved to me that hell or the lake of fire won't be on earth. You keep disagreeing but I see no proof.

“All the proud, yes, all who do wickedly will be stubble. And the day which is coming shall burn them up” (Malachi 4:1).

“The elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up” (2 Peter 3:10).

“You shall trample the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet” (Malachi 4:3).

“Nevertheless we, according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells” (2 Peter 3:13).

God will cleanse the earth from sin; He will also, in deep sadness, cleanse the earth from those who would continue in sin. Then God will make a perfect new earth.

 

[phipps]

Oh boy how must it hurt that they arent included in the life of jesuschrist but thats they problems. I will not sit back and let the bible, quran or tower of babblers try to dictate the life of jesuschrist!!

The Bible is the Word of God, it doesn't dictate the life of Jesus Christ. It tells us of Jesus Christ. So if you dismiss Bible then you have nothing do you? The Word is Jesus too.

John 1:1, 14, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth."

 

[phipps]

What will happen to the wicked in hellfire?

“The cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death” (Revelation 21:8).

Answer: The wicked die the second death in hellfire. If the wicked lived forever being tortured in hell, they would be immortal. But this is impossible because the Bible says God “alone has immortality” (1 Timothy 6:16). When Adam and Eve were driven from the Garden of Eden, an angel was posted to guard the tree of life so that sinners would not eat of the tree and “live forever” (Genesis 3:22–24). The teaching that sinners are immortal in hell originated with Satan and is completely untrue. God prevented this when sin entered this earth by guarding the tree of life.


When and how will hellfire be kindled?

“So it will be at the end of this age. The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will ... cast them into the furnace of fire” (Matthew 13:40–42).

“They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them” (Revelation 20:9).

“If the righteous will be recompensed on the earth, how much more the ungodly and the sinner” (Proverbs 11:31).

Answer: The Bible says that God will kindle hellfire. After the holy city comes down out of heaven (Revelation 21:2), the wicked will attempt to capture it. At that time, God will rain down fire from heaven upon the earth, and it will devour the wicked. This fire is Bible hellfire.

How big and how hot will hellfire be?

“The day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up” (2 Peter 3:10).

Answer: Hellfire will be just as big as this earth because it will be the earth on fire. This fire will be so hot as to melt the earth and burn up all “the works that are in it.” The atmospheric heavens will explode and “pass away with a great noise.”


How long will the wicked suffer in the fire?

“Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work” (Revelation 22:12).

“He will reward each according to his works” (Matthew 16:27).

“That servant who knew his master’s will, and did not ... do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few” (Luke 12:47, 48).

Answer: The Bible does not tell us how long the wicked will be punished before receiving death in the fire. God does specifically state, however, that all will be punished according to their deeds. This means some will receive longer punishment than others, based upon their works.


Will the fire eventually go out?

“Behold, they shall be as stubble, the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame; it shall not be a coal to be warmed by, nor a fire to sit before!” (Isaiah 47:14).

“I saw a new heaven and a new earth. ... And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away” (Revelation 21:1, 4).

Answer: Yes. The Bible specifically teaches that hellfire will go out—that there will not be left “a coal to be warmed by, nor a fire to sit before.” The Bible also says that in God’s new kingdom all “former things” will have passed away. Hell, being one of the former things, is included, so we have God’s promise that it will be abolished.

If God tortured His enemies in a fiery horror chamber throughout eternity, He would be more vicious and heartless than men have ever been in the worst of war atrocities. An eternal hell of torment would be hell for God also, who loves even the vilest sinner.


What will be left when the fire goes out?

“ ‘Behold, the day is coming, burning like an oven, and all the proud, yes, all who do wickedly will be stubble. And the day which is coming shall burn them up ... that will leave them neither root nor branch. ... You shall trample the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day that I do this,’ says the Lord of hosts” (Malachi 4:1, 3).

Answer: Notice the verse does not say the wicked will burn like asbestos, as many today believe, but rather like stubble, which will be burned up. The little word “up” denotes completion. Nothing but ashes will be left when the fire goes out. In Psalm 37:10, 20, the Bible says the wicked will go up in smoke and be completely destroyed.


Will the wicked enter hell in bodily form and be destroyed both soul and body?

“It is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell” (Matthew 5:30).

“Rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell” (Matthew 10:28).

“The soul who sins shall die” (Ezekiel 18:20).

Answer: Yes. Real, living people enter hell in bodily form and are destroyed both soul and body. The fire from God out of heaven will fall upon real people and blot them out of existence.


What is God’s real purpose in hellfire?

“Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels” (Matthew 25:41).

“Anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:15).

“For yet a little while and the wicked shall be no more. … The enemies of the Lord … shall vanish. Into smoke they shall vanish away” (Psalm 37:10, 20).

Answer: God’s purpose is that hell will destroy the devil, all sin, and the unsaved to make the world safe for eternity. Any vestige of sin left on this planet would be a deadly virus forever threatening the universe. It is God’s plan to blot out sin from existence for all time!


Isn’t the act of destroying the unsaved foreign to God’s nature?

“ ‘As I live,’ says the Lord God, ‘I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die?’ ” (Ezekiel 33:11).

“The Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives but to save them” (Luke 9:56).

“The Lord will rise up … that He may do His work, His awesome work, and bring to pass His act, His unusual act” (Isaiah 28:21).

Answer: Yes—the work of God has always been to save rather than to destroy. The work of destroying the wicked in hellfire is so foreign to God’s nature that the Bible calls it His “unusual act.” God’s great heart will ache at the destruction of the wicked. Oh, how diligently He works to save every soul! But if one spurns His love and clings to sin, God will have no choice but to destroy the unrepentant sinner when He rids the universe of the horrible, malignant growth called “sin” in the fires of the last day.


What are God’s post-hell plans for the earth and His people?

“He will make an utter end of it. Affliction will not rise up a second time” (Nahum 1:9).

“I create new heavens and a new earth; and the former shall not be remembered or come to mind” (Isaiah 65:17).

“Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain” (Revelation 21:3, 4).

Answer: After hellfire goes out, God will create a new earth and restore it to His people—with all the beauties and glories of Eden before sin entered. Pain, death, tragedy, woe, tears, sickness, disappointment, sorrow, and all sin will be banished forever.

Sin Will Not Rise Again
God promises that sin will never rise again. His people will be filled with perfect peace, love, joy, and contentment. Their lives of complete happiness will be far more glorious and thrilling than mere words could ever describe. The real tragedy of hell is in missing heaven. A person who chooses not to enter this magnificent kingdom has made the saddest choice of a lifetime.

https://www.amazingfacts.org/media-library/study-guide/e/4988/t/is-the-devil-in-charge-of-hell-

 

[Vytas]

ok, thats acceptable, but what about from the beginning-- beings consuming other beings which creates pain? why not create lifeforms that never need to create suffering in order to survive? for example, why not create human beings that function on photosynthesis?

That's how it was in Eden (no death), and that's how it will be after armageddon. Isa 11-6..For the earth will be filled with knowledge of the lord...

 

[Lisa]

Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron.

The verse right there says who Jesus will be ruling over in the millennium. He will strike the nations and He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. To say the Bible doesn’t say is wrong..it sure does say.

REVELATION‬ ‭11:15-18‬ ‭
Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.” And the twenty-four elders, who sit on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God, saying, “ We give You thanks, O Lord God, the Almighty, who are and who were, because You have taken Your great power and have begun to reign. And the nations were enraged, and Your wrath came, and the time came for the dead to be judged, and the time to reward Your bond-servants the prophets and the saints and those who fear Your name, the small and the great, and to destroy those who destroy the earth.​

‭‭God is seen as ruler of the earth while His wrath is on the nations.

You're wrong because Revelation 20:7-10 clearly says the saints will reign with Christ for 1000 years. Its really hard to miss that bit.

I didn’t miss that bit, I was more focused on who Jesus would be ruling. Of course scripture says that the martyrs from the 5th seal and the ones who didn’t get the mark would be the co-rulers. It is hard to miss that bit..but its also hard to miss the bit that he will rule the nations with a rod of iron too..

The fire raining down from heaven will create a lake of fire Hell is not going to be moved somewhere else is it? Not according to the Bible any way. And all the wicked including the devil and his angels will be cast into it. Right here on earth. That is in harmony with the rest of the Bible. I've shown you scripture saying these things but you choose to dismiss them

How is that, when we read about people burning the weapons from the war for 7 years...Jesus has his kingdom on earth during the millennium. After He reigns on earth (with the martyrs) then satan is let out again and that’s when God takes out the rebels with fire and then He brings down a new heaven and a new Jerusalem.

You keep talking about harmony with the rest of the Bible..but that’s not harmony to say that hell is on the earth when we don’t know where hell is. You keep trying to fit different parts of words into your theory to make it work, when it doesn’t really work at all.

No, read the scriptures again. New Jerusalem comes down as Satan is loosed and the wicked have resurrected the second time.

Revelation 20:5, "But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished." These are the wicked since the righteous are alive in heaven for the thousand years.

Revelation 21:2, "Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

Revelation 20:7-10, "Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever."

All these events happen at the end of the 1000 years clearly.

New Jerusalem comes down after God has taken out the rebels and satan not as He is taking care of them. Then there is the white throne judgement when all people, even the dead, come before God to be judged. That is the first time we see that the dead will come out of their graves and be judged. Satan and the people who’s names were not written in the book of life are thrown then into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then, God brings down the new earth and new Jerusalem where He will be the light everyone needs and live among us.

 

[phipps]

The verse right there says who Jesus will be ruling over in the millennium. He will strike the nations and He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. To say the Bible doesn’t say is wrong..it sure does say.

REVELATION‬ ‭11:15-18‬ ‭​

Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.” And the twenty-four elders, who sit on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God, saying, “ We give You thanks, O Lord God, the Almighty, who are and who were, because You have taken Your great power and have begun to reign. And the nations were enraged, and Your wrath came, and the time came for the dead to be judged, and the time to reward Your bond-servants the prophets and the saints and those who fear Your name, the small and the great, and to destroy those who destroy the earth.​

‭‭God is seen as ruler of the earth while His wrath is on the nations.


I didn’t miss that bit, I was more focused on who Jesus would be ruling. Of course scripture says that the martyrs from the 5th seal and the ones who didn’t get the mark would be the co-rulers. It is hard to miss that bit..but its also hard to miss the bit that he will rule the nations with a rod of iron too..


How is that, when we read about people burning the weapons from the war for 7 years...Jesus has his kingdom on earth during the millennium. After He reigns on earth (with the martyrs) then satan is let out again and that’s when God takes out the rebels with fire and then He brings down a new heaven and a new Jerusalem.

You keep talking about harmony with the rest of the Bible..but that’s not harmony to say that hell is on the earth when we don’t know where hell is. You keep trying to fit different parts of words into your theory to make it work, when it doesn’t really work at all.


New Jerusalem comes down after God has taken out the rebels and satan not as He is taking care of them. Then there is the white throne judgement when all people, even the dead, come before God to be judged. That is the first time we see that the dead will come out of their graves and be judged. Satan and the people who’s names were not written in the book of life are thrown then into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then, God brings down the new earth and new Jerusalem where He will be the light everyone needs and live among us.

I disagree and so does the Bible. I'm not going to continue this conversation with you though because I know what I'm telling you is the truth of the Bible and it harmonises with it from the Old to the New Testaments. I've proved it through scripture so its up to you to believe the Word of God or your doctrine that isn't biblical. I pray that God reveals the truth to you and you accept it.

 

[phipps]

Does the word “hell” as used in the Bible always refer to a place of burning or punishment?

Answer: No. The word “hell” is used 54 times in the Bible (KJV), and in only 12 cases does it refer to “a place of burning.”

The word "hell" is translated from several different words with various meanings, as indicated below:

IN THE OLD TESTAMENT
31 times from "Sheol," which means the "grave."

IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
10 times from "Hades," which means "the grave."
12 times from "Gehenna," which means "the place of burning."
1 time from "Tartarus," which means "a place of darkness."
54 TIMES TOTAL

Note: The word “Gehenna” is a transliteration of the Hebrew “Ge-Hinnom,” which means the “Valley of Hinnom.” This valley, which lies immediately south and west of Jerusalem, was a place where dead animals, garbage, and other refuse were dumped. Fire burned constantly, as it does at modern sanitation dump sites. The Bible uses “Gehenna” or the “Valley of Hinnom” as a symbol of the fire that will destroy the lost at the end of time. The fire of Gehenna was not unending. Otherwise, it would still be burning southwest of Jerusalem today. Neither will the fire of hell be unending.

 

[phipps]

Thought Questions

1. Doesn’t the Bible speak of “eternal torment”?

No—the phrase “eternal torment” does not appear in the Bible.

2. Then why does the Bible say that the wicked will be destroyed with unquenchable fire?

Unquenchable fire is fire that cannot be put out, but which goes out when it has turned everything to ashes. Jeremiah 17:27 says Jerusalem was to be destroyed with unquenchable fire, and in 2 Chronicles 36:19–21 the Bible says this fire burned the city “to fulfill the word of the Lord by the mouth of Jeremiah” and left it desolate. Yet we know this fire went out, because Jerusalem
is not burning today.

3. Doesn’t Matthew 25:46 say the wicked will receive “everlasting punishment”?

Notice the word is punishment, not punishing. Punishing would be continuous, while punishment is one act. The punishment of the wicked is death, and this death is everlasting.

4. Can you explain Matthew 10:28: “Do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul”?

The word “soul” has three meanings in the Bible: (1) a living being, Genesis 2:7—(2) the mind, Psalm 139:14—and (3) life, 1 Samuel 18:1. Also, Matthew 10:28 refers to the soul as the eternal life that God guarantees to all who accept it. No one can take this away.

5. Matthew 25:41 speaks of “everlasting fire” for the wicked. Does it go out?

Yes. According to the Bible, it does. We must let the Bible explain itself. Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed with everlasting, or eternal, fire (Jude 1:7), and that fire turned them “into ashes” as a warning to “those who afterward would live ungodly” (2 Peter 2:6). These cities are not burning today. The fire went out after everything was burned up. Likewise, everlasting fire will go out after it has turned the wicked to ashes (Malachi 4:3). The effects of the fire are everlasting, but not the burning itself.

6. Doesn’t the story of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke16:19-31 teach an eternal hell of torment?

No! It is a parable Jesus used to emphasize a certain spiritual lesson. The point of the story is found in verse 31. Parables should not be taken literally—otherwise, we would believe that trees talk! (See Judges 9:8–15.) Here are some facts making it clear that Luke 16:19–31 is a parable:

A. Abraham’s bosom is not heaven (Hebrews 11:8–10, 16).

B. People in hell can’t talk to those in heaven (Isaiah 65:17).

C. The dead are in their graves (Job 17:13; John 5:28, 29). The rich man was in bodily form with eyes, a tongue, etc., yet we know that the body does not go to hell at death but remains in the grave, as the Bible says.

D. People are rewarded at Christ’s second coming, not at death (Revelation 22:12).

E. The lost are cast into hell at the end of the world, not when they die (Matthew 13:40–42).

7. But the Bible speaks of the wicked being tormented "forever," doesn't it?

The term forever is used 56 times in the King James Bible in connection with things that have already ended.* It is like the word “tall,” which means something different in describing men, trees, or mountains. In Jonah 2:6, “forever” means “three days and nights.” In Deuteronomy 23:3, it means 10 generations. In the case of mankind, it means “as long as he lives” or “until death.” (See 1 Samuel 1:22, 28; Exodus 21:6; Psalm 48:14.) So the wicked will burn in the fire as long as they live, or until death. This fiery punishment for sin will vary according to the degree of sins for each individual, but after the punishment, the fire will go out. The unbiblical teaching of eternal torment has done more to drive people to atheism than any other invention of the devil. It is slander upon the loving character of a gracious heavenly Father and has done untold harm to the Christian cause.

 

[Lisa]

I've proved it through scripture so its up to you to believe the Word of God or your doctrine that isn't biblica

Lol, really? You didn’t prove anything except that you are stringing together different scriptures to try to prove you’re right. The scriptures that I’ve given you actually say what I’m saying is correct..yours does not.

 

[Lisa]

Thought Questions

1. Doesn’t the Bible speak of “eternal torment”?

No—the phrase “eternal torment” does not appear in the Bible.

2. Then why does the Bible say that the wicked will be destroyed with unquenchable fire?

Unquenchable fire is fire that cannot be put out, but which goes out when it has turned everything to ashes. Jeremiah 17:27 says Jerusalem was to be destroyed with unquenchable fire, and in 2 Chronicles 36:19–21 the Bible says this fire burned the city “to fulfill the word of the Lord by the mouth of Jeremiah” and left it desolate. Yet we know this fire went out, because Jerusalem
is not burning today.

3. Doesn’t Matthew 25:46 say the wicked will receive “everlasting punishment”?

Notice the word is punishment, not punishing. Punishing would be continuous, while punishment is one act. The punishment of the wicked is death, and this death is everlasting.

4. Can you explain Matthew 10:28: “Do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul”?

The word “soul” has three meanings in the Bible: (1) a living being, Genesis 2:7—(2) the mind, Psalm 139:14—and (3) life, 1 Samuel 18:1. Also, Matthew 10:28 refers to the soul as the eternal life that God guarantees to all who accept it. No one can take this away.

5. Matthew 25:41 speaks of “everlasting fire” for the wicked. Does it go out?

Yes. According to the Bible, it does. We must let the Bible explain itself. Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed with everlasting, or eternal, fire (Jude 1:7), and that fire turned them “into ashes” as a warning to “those who afterward would live ungodly” (2 Peter 2:6). These cities are not burning today. The fire went out after everything was burned up. Likewise, everlasting fire will go out after it has turned the wicked to ashes (Malachi 4:3). The effects of the fire are everlasting, but not the burning itself.

6. Doesn’t the story of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke16:19-31 teach an eternal hell of torment?

No! It is a parable Jesus used to emphasize a certain spiritual lesson. The point of the story is found in verse 31. Parables should not be taken literally—otherwise, we would believe that trees talk! (See Judges 9:8–15.) Here are some facts making it clear that Luke 16:19–31 is a parable:

A. Abraham’s bosom is not heaven (Hebrews 11:8–10, 16).

B. People in hell can’t talk to those in heaven (Isaiah 65:17).

C. The dead are in their graves (Job 17:13; John 5:28, 29). The rich man was in bodily form with eyes, a tongue, etc., yet we know that the body does not go to hell at death but remains in the grave, as the Bible says.

D. People are rewarded at Christ’s second coming, not at death (Revelation 22:12).

E. The lost are cast into hell at the end of the world, not when they die (Matthew 13:40–42).

7. But the Bible speaks of the wicked being tormented "forever," doesn't it?

The term forever is used 56 times in the King James Bible in connection with things that have already ended.* It is like the word “tall,” which means something different in describing men, trees, or mountains. In Jonah 2:6, “forever” means “three days and nights.” In Deuteronomy 23:3, it means 10 generations. In the case of mankind, it means “as long as he lives” or “until death.” (See 1 Samuel 1:22, 28; Exodus 21:6; Psalm 48:14.) So the wicked will burn in the fire as long as they live, or until death. This fiery punishment for sin will vary according to the degree of sins for each individual, but after the punishment, the fire will go out. The unbiblical teaching of eternal torment has done more to drive people to atheism than any other invention of the devil. It is slander upon the loving character of a gracious heavenly Father and has done untold harm to the Christian cause.

Sometimes @phipps the Bible means exactly what it says it does...no reading into it is necessary.

 

[Todd]

Sometimes @phipps the Bible means exactly what it says it does...no reading into it is necessary.

Unless of course we are talking about the Trinity right?

 

[Lisa]

Unless of course we are talking about the Trinity right?

What do you mean?

 

[Todd]

What do you mean?

You have to “read into the Bible” to come up with the Trinity doctrine.

 

[Lisa]

You have to “read into the Bible” to come up with the Trinity doctrine.

I don’t think so.

 

[phipps]

Why Some are Lost

Summary: The sacrifice God made is sufficient to save everyone, so why is not everyone saved?


We often ask God why He will not save everyone. The Bible is clear that Jesus’ sacrifice was complete enough for all to be saved:

"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life " (John 3:16).

The key is in the words “whosoever believeth in Him.” And this has always been the condition of our eternal existence with God.

When God placed the tree of knowledge of good and evil in the midst of the garden, He gave humankind one of the most important gifts of all; He gave us the power of choice. Throughout the centuries of hardship and the results of sin ravaging the planet, many have asked why a loving God would permit these things. Why did He not just prevent Satan from tempting Adam and Eve? God allowed Adam and Eve to be tested to allow them the freedom of choosing to serve God out of love and not force.

Throughout His Word, the Lord constantly entreats us to serve Him, not because we have to, but because we love Him and understand that His form of government is fair and the only way we can be truly happy. When we trust God by obeying Him, we show that we believe in Him and everything He stands for.

Why some are lost and some are saved is really very simple. We ourselves chose our destiny. In the most loving and compassionate way, God calls His children:

"I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live" (Deuteronomy 30:19).

"And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD" (Joshua 24:15).

So then why do some choose not to believe in Jesus? The Bible gives us the reason for this as well:

"For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD: They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof. Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices" (Proverbs 1:29-31).

It is not God who decides who will be lost and who will be saved, it is we ourselves who will choose this individually.

God has given us a fair example of what happens when we choose to rebel against His law and government. He wants everyone to be warned about the results their choices will have in this life and in the life to come.

"Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good" (Isaiah 7:15).

"But if ye will not do so, behold, ye have sinned against the LORD: and be sure your sin will find you out" (Numbers 32:23).

"If ye will fear the LORD, and serve him, and obey his voice, and not rebel against the commandment of the LORD, then shall both ye and also the king that reigneth over you continue following the LORD your God: But if ye will not obey the voice of the LORD, but rebel against the commandment of the LORD, then shall the hand of the LORD be against you, as it was against your fathers" (1 Samuel 12:14-15).

"The LORD is with you, while ye be with him; and if ye seek him, he will be found of you; but if ye forsake him, he will forsake you" (2 Chronicles 15:2).

God loves us too much not to respect our freedom of choice. He has done everything He can to prove His love by sending His Son to take our punishment and giving us a second chance to believe in Him so that we may be saved.

https://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception_end-time_millennium_judgment_sacrifice

 

[Stephania]

Some Christians are taught that hell is a place located deep within the earth where the wicked burn forever, beginning the moment they die. Others teach that hell is located somewhere in the far reaches of the universe. Which one is true?

This is another area where the Bible leaves nothing to doubt.

Revelation chapter 20 says that a thousand years after the saints are resurrected, the wicked will be released from their graves. “They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them” (Revelation 20:9).

According to the Bible, the lost are then burned “on the breadth of the earth.”

One of the great promises of the Bible to His people on the earth is that we can “look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells” (2 Peter 3:13).

Just as God cleansed the earth in the days of Noah, He will cleanse the earth again at the end of the world, this time with fire. As in Noah’s day, sinners will again receive their recompense, and once more it will happen “on the breadth of the earth.”

God’s plan is to recreate this sin-marred earth and return it to its original Edenic splendour. The earth will be transformed into what the Bible calls a “lake of fire” (Revelation 20:10). Every last vestige of sin will be burned up, and the curse will be obliterated.

https://www.helltruth.com/free-resources/article-library/id/1872/where-is-hell

IMHO.. hell is not a place but knowing that you are stuck in the mortal world and cant access eternity... until the lake of fire destroys everything of you on final day forever.