Thoughts On The Original Quranic View Of Women

[Lady]

@rainerann,
Good observations and I can understand your objections to this clothing compulsion in these countries. Probably the most fortunate Muslim women are those in the western nations if they are surrounded by a non-fundamental community that will support them for choices they are free to make by law.

I believe it is this next generation of Muslims that are going to reach their own who still hold to the traditional ways. They will have to demand a voice because it will not be handed to them. Just read some of the thoughts that Mecca and Manama have. Their reasoning is astounding for their age group. It gives me a lot of hope for the women who are persecuted.
Go for it here on the forum, @mecca and @manama! This is your time to practice for the real world.

 

[Lady]

I agree but generally, when you make such a bold claim you need to provide evidence for it.

She is learning and will get there. What 17 yr. old do you know is even on a forum such as this where sometimes very complicated topics are discussed? I don't know of any!

 

[Lady]

LOL! Typical. I can fully debunk this nonsense that you continually bring here but there's no point since your sensitive emotional hurt feelings got the better of you and blocked me.

Can someone of sound knowledge and with an ability to think logically can you please respond to her nonsense.

Well, you can be very brusque and I get pretty ticked at times with you. Not everyone wants to deal with that.
I grew up battling brothers, so guys do not scare me or back me off.

 

[rainerann]

She is learning and will get there. What 17 yr. old do you know is even on a forum such as this where sometimes very complicated topics are discussed? I don't know of any!

She is very special, insightful, and mature for her age.

 

[Tatilina]

Well, you can be very brusque and I get pretty ticked at times with you. Not everyone wants to deal with that.
I grew up battling brothers, so guys do not scare me or back me off.

It's illogical, irrational and unreasonable to dismiss something you don't like especially when its true with what rainerann shared/posted, there isn't anything to debunk because its true.

 

[Kung Fu]

Well, you can be very brusque and I get pretty ticked at times with you. Not everyone wants to deal with that.
I grew up battling brothers, so guys do not scare me or back me off.

It's funny because I've had arguments with her before and she couldn't rebut one. I guess she got tired of getting asked the hard questions and then decided to block me when I didn't say anything offensive to her once. The difference between you and her is that you're willing to stand up for your beliefs and not be a coward when confronted with the difficult questions.

As to the nonsense, she posted earlier. I can guarantee you she has never been to Afghanistan, doesn't know the history of Afghanistan, or that they have been at war for almost 40 years now, and stricken with poverty. Without knowing any of that how could she know anything about what's happening to Afghans?

 

[Lady]

Ok, I am not getting into the middle of this-especially when you two have a history.
I am very impressed with Rainerann, though. She has said a lot of things that have helped me-which is why I am here.

 

[rainerann]

@rainerann,
Good observations and I can understand your objections to this clothing compulsion in these countries. Probably the most fortunate Muslim women are those in the western nations who are surrounded by a non-fundamental community that will support them for choices they are free to make by law.

I believe it is this next generation of Muslims that are going to reach their own who still hold to the traditional ways. They will have to demand a voice because it will not be handed to them. Just read some of the thoughts that Mecca and Manama have. Their reasoning is astounding for their age group. It gives me a lot of hope for the women who are persecuted.
Go for it here on the forum, @mecca and @manama! This is your time to practice for the real world.

The Afghanistan women who objected to it was the most eye opening part to me because so often in the west we are told over and over that choice is always a part of wearing the veil. However, these women were so honest, I just loved them. I would love to find a way to help support them so I will pray for them for now.

There was this one girl. She was just adorable. She said she wanted to serve in the army, and she was struggling with the fact that as she got older, she was learning that she didn't have the same freedoms to do things that she had as a child. It was just heartbreaking. They were just a beautiful family. Her mother was a teacher and they were talking about how they worried about how the Madrassa's would affect the rights women had gained in Afghanistan. The girl went to the state school where she learned other subjects and the mother voiced her objection to the Madrassa's because they did not teach other subjects. She said that it was like they were trying to make the girls illiterate. This is another way to take a person's choice from them. If they don't learn anything else, then they don't really choose to wear the veil. Then, when we copy this practice in the west, I just think it makes us look illiterate as well; and, it is so rare that I hear anyone saying anything like the lady did in the opening post. I am really glad you shared this.

 

[Tatilina]

Ok, I am not getting into the middle of this-especially when you two have a history.
I am very impressed with Rainerann, though. She has said a lot of things that have helped me-which is why I am here.

No one is asking you too Lady. I was just saying, but whatever. I have him on ignore too and just wanted to see what you were responding to, that's all.

 

[Kung Fu]

The Afghanistan women who objected to it was the most eye opening part to me because so often in the west we are told over and over that choice is always a part of wearing the veil. However, these women were so honest, I just loved them. I would love to find a way to help support them so I will pray for them.

You can't see this but I'll leave this here so others can see how illogical your way of thinking is.

Show me anywhere in the Quran where it states that a burqa must be worn?

There was this one girl. She was just adorable. She said she wanted to serve in the army, and she was struggling with the fact that as she got older, she was learning that she didn't have the same freedoms to do things that she had as a child. It was just heartbreaking. They were just a beautiful family. Her mother was a teacher and they were talking about how they worried about how the Madrassa's would affect the rights women had gained in Afghanistan. The girl went to the state school where she learned other subjects and the mother voiced her objection to the Madrassa's because they did not teach other subjects. She said that it was like they were trying to make the girls illiterate. This is another way to take a person's choice from them. If they don't learn anything else, then they don't really choose to wear the veil. Then, when we copy this practice in the west, I just think it makes us look illiterate as well; and, it is so rare that I hear anyone saying anything like the lady did in the opening post. I am really glad you shared this.

How could her mother be a teacher if schools are teaching her kids that women can't work?

Have you ever perhaps thought that a war torn and poverty stricken country might have gotten some parts of Islam wrong because the majority of the country is illiterate thanks to the West?

 

[Tatilina]

Its not my fault people get so offended by the truth and get offended trying to start a fight over it. Truth offends, period. What rainerann has shared is truth, I personally don't see what the fuss is to get offended by.

 

[Lady]

@rainerann i am glad I found the video and that we are all having a very reasonable discussion.
I have a hunch about this subject of women as second class abused citizens-and this goes across all cultures.
I still need to do a study on this, but I think women just may be a direct target for satan's attacks.

 

[Kung Fu]

No one is asking you too Lady. I was just saying, but whatever. I have him on ignore too and just wanted to see what you were responding to, that's all.

LOL! She was liking my comments nonstop last week when I was speaking out against feminism and when she was a witch but when she's had a change of heart in her beliefs she decided to block me so that I don't question her beliefs. Tanya/Aiylish/Chassidy you have been proven as a liar time and time again.

 

[rainerann]

@rainerann i am glad I found the video and that we are all having a very reasonable discussion.
I have a hunch about this subject of women as second class abused citizens-and this goes across all cultures.
I still need to do a study on this, but I think women just may be a direct target for satan's attacks.

Yes, women's right need to become more of an international movement.

 

[Tatilina]

Its okay, I don't mind at all being ignored and excluded, thanks Lady I appreciate it. I'll show myself out of your thread.

 

[Kung Fu]

Its okay, I don't mind at all being ignored and excluded, thanks Lady I appreciate it. I'll show myself out of your thread.

LOL! Are you going to block her too now when she's done nothing wrong?

 

[Kung Fu]

Yes, women's right need to become more of an international movement.

Is this the next strategy that the American government and it's allies are going to use when they bomb and kill millions more in the future?

 

[Lady]

These women are my heroes. They are known in India as The Pink Brigade or The Gulabi Gang. They are fighters for women's rights. They physically fight as necessary-to protect women, as well as to teach men a much needed lesson about respecting women. God bless them!

Sampat Pal, self-styled national commander of the Gulabi Gang, formed her all-female brigade a decade ago to defend the dignity of women in Uttar Pradesh — a network that is now 400,000 strong

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2014/02/gulabi-gang-indias-women-warrriors-201422610320612382.html

 

[Lady]

LOL! Are you going to block her too now when she's done nothing wrong?

Wait, what is going on here? I was busy reading about the Pink Brigade to comeback to some strange goings-on! Tanya....? What did I miss?

 

[mecca]

Clothes have a lot to do with gender. There are plenty of academic books that discuss this issue. Your average male in much of the world have always worn pants of some fashion women, on the other hand, have never worn pants until after WWII.

Priests and others wear flowing robes only during ceremonial rituals and or events but outside of that, it has been some form of pants.

Please, Mecca, stop making claims that you have no evidence for. I know you're young but know that when you make a claim you have to provide the proper evidence for said claim.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clothing_in_the_ancient_world
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_clothing

Everybody wore skirts/skirt type things before pants were invented.