Does God Place Conditions on His Gift of Salvation?

[phipps]

Be careful mate, the naughty step....
"Who is it that beats the world? Only he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God" (1 John 5:5)

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Does this verse change anything I've posted? Remember, always remember the Bible does not contradict itself. Obviously if one believes that Jesus is the Son of God, they believe that Jesus is Lord and Saviour. He is the same Person with different names and titles in the Bible. He is the Son of man, the creator of the universe and of this world and all that is in it, He is the Messiah, He is High Priest in the heavenly sanctuary, He is the Word, He is the Judge, He is the Saviour, He is God etc.

So this verse you posted goes hand in hand with what Paul and Silas said to the prison keeper, “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household” (Acts 16:31).

 

[Clout]

Jesus said- “Who do you say I am?”
Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven." (Matt 13:16/17)
So if Jesus was God, why didn't he say to Peter "Wrong, I AM God..

 

[phipps]

Jesus said- “Who do you say I am?”
Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven." (Matt 13:16/17)
So if Jesus was God, why didn't he say to Peter "Wrong, I AM God..

Your problem is you're thinking of Jesus being the Son of God in human terms. God is not a created or procreated being. He is the Son of God because of His unique birth into this world to save us. Out of the three Persons of the Godhead, that title only belongs to Jesus. The Father never went through the birth process. The Holy Spirit never went through the birth process. Only Jesus did. And He did it to come into this sinful world to save us.

I've just shown you its one of His titles. He has other titles that prove He is God and does things only God can do. The Bible tells us He created this world. Only God creates universes, the atmosphere, the sun, moon stars, the seas, animals, human beings. But you reject all Jesus' other attributes and titles that tell us clearly Jesus is God and focus only on the Son part of Him.

Peter was right to call Him the Son of God because He is and Jesus had no problem with that. He Himself called Himself the Son of God. He was /is still God and still divine.

Now I'm never discussing this topic with you again. Pray to God to help you accept all His truth including that Jesus is God and is the only One through whom we can be saved.

Bye.

 

[phipps]

 

[Clout]

Jesus said-"God is spirit".. (John 4:24)
i.e, NOT flesh and blood..
The early Christians got it right-
"God, spoke in times past by the prophets, has in these last days spoken unto us by his Son" (Hebrews 1:1-2)

 

[phipps]

Salvation is a gift of grace, but it is not an unconditional gift. Everybody in the world will not receive it. It is a gift that is given on certain explicit conditions, and the condition that the person saved must develop a Christ-like character through the grace provided through the Holy Spirit.

“Man has fallen; and it will be the work of a lifetime, be it longer or shorter, to recover from that fall, and regain, through Christ, the image of the divine, which he lost by sin and continued transgression. God requires a thorough transformation of soul, body, and spirit in order to regain the estate lost through Adam.” T vol. 2, 448.

 

[phipps]

On what condition did Jesus say we will receive the Holy Spirit?

In John 14:15-17, Jesus said; "If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you."

 

[phipps]

 

[elsbet's cat ^. .^]

Salvation is a gift of grace, but it is not an unconditional gift.

Impossible.
That's like saying: 'Lunch is free today, as long as you pay for it.'

Gift | δῶρον
Ephesians 2:8
gift, present, a sacrifice
The same word is also used for offering.

Ellen White redefines the word "gift."

Everybody in the world will not receive it. It is a gift that is given on certain explicit conditions, and the condition that the person saved must develop a Christ-like character through the grace provided through the Holy Spirit.

“Man has fallen; and it will be the work of a lifetime, be it longer or shorter, to recover from that fall, and regain, through Christ, the image of the divine, which he lost by sin and continued transgression. God requires a thorough transformation of soul, body, and spirit in order to regain the estate lost through Adam.”
T vol. 2, 448.

There's more...
Volume 5 - Testimonies, continued:

Ellen White
Not one of us will ever receive the seal of God while our characters have one spot or stain upon them. It is left with us to remedy the defects in our characters, to cleanse the soul temple of every defilement. 5T 214.2

That isn't true from a biblical perspective.
1 John 1:7

"... apart from me you can do nothing."
Jn 15:5

We're all free to believe whomever we choose, but this is another doctrine-- it shouldn't be confused with the Bible.

 

[phipps]

FAITH AND WORKS.

"Without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him” (Hebrews 11:6).

There are many in the Christian world who claim that all that is necessary to salvation is to have faith; works are nothing, faith is the only essential. But God’s Word tells us that faith without works is dead. Many refuse to obey God’s commandments, yet they make a great deal of faith. But faith must have a foundation.

God’s promises are all made upon conditions. If we do His will, if we walk in truth, then we may ask what we will, and it shall be done unto us. While we earnestly endeavour to be obedient, God will hear our petitions; but He will not bless us in disobedience. If we choose to disobey His commandments, we may cry, “Faith, faith, only have faith,” and the response will come back from the sure Word of God, “Faith without works is dead” (James 2:20).

Such faith will only be as sounding brass and as a tinkling cymbal. In order to have the benefits of God’s grace we must do our part; we must faithfully work and bring forth fruits meet for repentance.

We are workers together with God. You are not to sit in indolence, waiting for some great occasion, in order to do a great work for the Master. You are not to neglect the duty that lies directly in your pathway, but you are to improve the little opportunities that open around you.

 

[phipps]

WITHOUT THE FAITH of Jesus, no one can truly obey the Law of Liberty from the heart. Christ's Spirit must be the controlling spirit of the heart.

Romans 8:2, "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death (Free from the works of the flesh - Galatians 5:19-21)."

 

[A Freeman]

Impossible.
That's like saying: 'Lunch is free today, as long as you pay for it.'

It's more like saying "lunch is free today for those which hunger and thirst for it (Matt. 5:6)".

Unfortunately very few hunger and thirst for that which truly satisfies (Matt. 7:13-14; John 6:35).

 

[phipps]

10 INDISPUTABLE FACTS ABOUT THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.

Any healthy debate among Christians about God’s law must begin with how God Himself defines the terms. Without this step, it’s impossible to find a biblical consensus. Yet by letting God define our terms in this discussion, it won’t take long to realize that the evidence compelling us to obey His Commandments today, in the New Covenant faith, is overwhelming.

Here are 10 indisputable facts, or definitions, about the Ten Commandments from the Old and New Testaments—two witnesses, or dictionaries, of God’s message to humanity.

1. God wrote them. “And the tables were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, graven upon the tables” (Exodus 32:16).

2. They are eternal, meaning they will not change or be erased. “All his commandments are sure. They stand fast forever and ever” (Psalm 89:34).

3. They are perfect as they are. “The law of the Lord is perfect” (Psalm 19). If they were perfect, would their function or purpose need to change? We’ll die if we break them. “He poured out his life unto death … [bearing] the sin of many.” (Isaiah 13:9). Satan was first to convince a human otherwise.

4. It is our job to obey them. “Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man” (Ecclesiastes 12:13).

5. These first five points are taken from the Old Testament. Many of those who want to display the Commandments argue that the laws are an Old Covenant relic meant for the Jews, and Christians aren’t subject to them because they are outmoded in our relationship with Jesus.

Although points 2 and 3 each seem to shatter this argument, we’ll see later from the New Testament that Jesus also denied the claim that the Commandments have been nullified.

The New Testament, even after Jesus’ death, doesn’t regard the law itself any differently than the Old Testament. In fact, it is easy to conclude that the New Testament also affirms that God’s law is forever and ever.

6. Breaking them is still wrong. “Sin is the transgression of the law” (1 John 3:4).

7. Humanity still needs them. “I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law said, Thou shall not covet” (Romans 7:7).

8. Obeying them is still a sign of loyalty. “If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15).

9. They are still eternal. “It is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail” (Luke 16:17). Jesus exalted them! God established the law with His own voice; might it need Jesus’ voice to do away with them? Yet He never does, before or after His death!

10. They are still perfect. “Think not that I come to destroy the law … but to fulfill” (Matthew 5:17-18). Jesus did not change any part of them.
It’s clear that Jesus wants us to keep the laws of God—the Ten Commandments. Jesus continued to call the Commandments “laws,” and He never defined them differently. So this next verse is a clear message: “Whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all” (James 2:10).

Of course, Jesus also obeyed them exactly the way they were intended, "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love" (John 15:10).

So Christians surely cannot conclude that they are not meant to follow them as Jesus followed them. Isn’t that what Christians are? A reflection of Christ?

 

[Clout]

Ah, but what exactly ARE "works"?
For example my late dad was a workaholic (literally) and once said to my mam- "That shoe factory's my life," and he eventually went half-nutty with overwork.
By contrast, monks shut themselves away in monasteries and don't do any physical work at all, so who does God approve of the most, workaholics or monks?

 

[A Freeman]

Ephesians 2:8-10
2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
2:10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good WORKS, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them (do them - good works).

Every single thought, word and deed/action should be actuated by the Holy Spirit with the Love of God and our fellow man in mind.

A man's actions always tell what is in his heart and mind (good or evil).

 

[Clout]

When i was unemployed some 30 years ago, the jobcentre sent me to apply for a job at a convenience store, so I walked in, took one look at the rack of magazines on display (including porno and gay mags), and at the cigarette shelf and thought "I ain't handling stuff like that" and walked straight back out and got in hot water with the jobcentre..
Another time, they sent me and other unemployed people on a compulsory "community programme" to refurbish a Hindu temple in Leicester (England) but I refused pointblank to go, so they reduced my dole for a while.
Was God annoyed at me for refusing to work at those places?

 

[A Freeman]

When someone is born into slavery, and lives in slavery throughout their entire human existence, they are programmed to think as a slave, equating all "work" (labor) with employment (slavery).

"Employee" is just a modern-day corporate word for "slave". Serving a corporate fiction means doing their bidding, which is designed to place the company's materialistic "bottom line" and/or their stock/share-holders above all else. It's all about the money, where everyone is divided and in competition against everyone else, and where everyone is attempting to build their own little kingdom here on Earth.

Corporate fictions (corporations) can take on many forms, and make up every single worldly institution. Governments are corporate fictions. All organized religions are corporate fictions. Every courtroom is a corporate fiction. Every policing agency/department/constabulary is a corporate fiction. And even on an individual level, most people on Earth are corporations. Birth certificates, driver's licenses, professional registrations (for nurses, engineers, accountants, attorneys, etc.), and every other fee, license, and tax are levied by a corporation (government) against another corporation (each individual seeking those things).

All corporate fictions (lies) are part of the worldly BEAST system. This is why we are told we MUST come out of the beast system (Rev. 18:4) and that we CANNOT serve both God and materialism (Matt. 6:24). There is no other way to achieve true freedom than a complete return to Father's Law (Mal. 4), found in the first five books of the Bible, where there are no corporate fictions (lies) and everyone shares the gifts that God has given us.

So, while it may be hard work/labor to be a slave, that isn't what is meant by "works". Works are simply the fruit of our labors. They can be good works or they can be evil works.

Good works serve God's Purpose and thus are the doing of His Will. And, in serving God (our heavenly Father), all good works are helping to build His Kingdom here on Earth, where everyone is doing His Will, as is done in heaven (Matt. 6:9-13). Father's Kingdom always serves the greater, common-good, where everyone shares in the benefits, thereby eliminating both greed and poverty, exactly as Promised in Father's Law.

Evil works serve the "self" (Satan really), and thus are doing Satan's bidding. When everyone is divided against one another, and working to build their own selfish little kingdom, they find new ways and new rules to steal from one another, to temporarily make a few individuals filthy rich at the expense of everyone else, just as has happened with the world we live in today.

It should be self-evident that what we have today is not only unsustainable, but has placed us on a path that invariably leads to the total extinction of all life on Earth, under the evil rules of men.

 

[phipps]

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Ah, but what exactly ARE "works"?
For example my late dad was a workaholic (literally) and once said to my mam- "That shoe factory's my life," and he eventually went half-nutty with overwork.
By contrast, monks shut themselves away in monasteries and don't do any physical work at all, so who does God approve of the most, workaholics or monks?

First lets describe what faith is. Faith is believing and trusting God. We believe that what God says and does is true, even if we can’t see proof of it yet. We trust that He has saved us, we accept the love that He has for us, and that trust and acceptance impacts our internal moral compass (God's law written in our hearts). As a result, our actions—the works that stem from our hearts—reflect Him. Obviously faith comes first (James 2:14-18).

Works are our behaviour or actions. In the Bible, we see many examples of good “works” referring to acts of service to help others or obedience to God’s law etc.

We also see references to bad/evil/sinful/wicked “works” when describing Satan, or people following the influence of sin. And it seems that the worst of these bad works are those that also hurt or corrupt others, not just the person doing the evil/sinful work.

But works are not just physical actions like volunteering at a local soup kitchen, attending church, or honouring God’s commandments. Or bad works might be punching someone, stealing money, or gossiping.

Good and bad works are also internal, because for starters before we do any works or actions we have to make a decision internally. Examples of internal evil works can be harbouring hate or jealousy, or wishing ill upon another person. But internal good works can be praying, depending on God, letting go of fears, or cultivating a quiet heart.

If we have have faith, we are not going to do evil works visibly or invisibly because of what God does in our hearts first. Good works are evidence of genuine faith in Jesus Christ.