Are you for Traditional Values? What do you think about Muslims and Christians joining together to uphold Conservative Values in the West?

[DesertRose]

Greetings!

Patrick Bet David (Christian Pod-caster) had a realization regarding the need to join forces on select issues such as family values in the West.
What do you think about this idea?
Can we work together despite our theological differences to fix these issues?
It is apparent that the opposition is uniting and promoting their values and pushing their agenda of immorality on our children and that Muslims and Christians need to join forces to repel these agendas.
What do you think? Doable or Not?
As for my stance as you can tell from my posts I am for this, but then again I was one of those home-school moms who would drive out to the Canadian boonies (distant farm areas) to home-school book fairs full of conservative Christians.
There are good and bad people in every group.
Only dislike psychopaths from any religion.
I do not agree with the stereotypes promoted by the media.
If someone is a stereotyping bigot that is their problem, not anyone else's.
Life's too short.

"Game Over" - What Muslims & Christians Have in Common

Please note, they bring up Usury or interest however we do not consider usury as we do trade and the Quran directly addresses this issue!
Those who consume interest cannot stand [on the Day of Resurrection] except as one stands who is being beaten by Satan into insanity. That is because they say, “Trade is [just] like interest.” But Allah has permitted trade and has forbidden interest. So whoever has received an admonition from his Lord and desists may have what is past, and his affair rests with Allah. But whoever returns to [dealing in interest or usury] – those are the companions of the Fire; they will abide eternally therein. 2:275
For a greater understanding of this ruling:

https://www.islamweb.com/en/fatwa/84764/why-usury-is-prohibited

This response includes footage of Ilhan Omar supporting the progressive agenda of LGBTQ+, needless to say, she is going against our teachings.
Patrick Bet-David - What Muslims & Christians Have in Common - Response

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

Can we work together despite our theological differences to fix these issues?

Yes, so long as Muslims don't call Christians idolaters for proclaiming Jesus Christ is the son of God.

Other than that, i really appreciate the Muslim community's resistanse to the lgbtpqwth+ agenda. Often times us Christians are silenced regarding these issues by being told things like "you're not supposed to judge!" as if proclaiming the word of God is "judging ".

For whatever reason, the same liberals that scream that at Christians have in the past been reluctant to say similar things to Muslims (though i realize that in recent times the opinion may be changing). In the meantime, im all for using that to our collective advantage.

 

[DesertRose]

Yes, so long as Muslims don't call Christians idolaters for proclaiming Jesus Christ is the son of God.

Thank you for your response.
I hope that as PBD has understood we can set aside our differences to cooperate on some worldly matters.
In regards to your statement, that would be denying our beliefs.
This is not acceptable to us, we would be held accountable by the Creator for hiding or changing the message.
Asking us to do this is no different than the left-wingers asking us to only be 'free' to be like them not to be who we are.

We believe it is the greatest sin to worship other partners with The One God.
Prophet Jesus peace be upon Him is respected as one of His Prophets and Messengers of strong will and the Messiah.
Prophethood is the pinnacle point for human beings.
This is our message, the same message that was sent with all the Prophets from the time of Prophet Adam peace be upon all of them.

“They (Jews and Christians) took their rabbis and their monks to be their lords besides Allaah (by obeying them in things which they made lawful or unlawful according to their own desires without being ordered by Allaah), and (they also took as their Lord) Messiah, son of Maryam (Mary), while they (Jews and Christians) were commanded [in the Tawraat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] to worship none but One Ilaah (God — Allaah) Laa ilaaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He). Praise and glory be to Him (far above is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him)”
[al-Tawbah 9:31]


“O people of the Scripture (Christians)! Do not exceed the limits in your religion, nor say of Allaah aught but the truth. The Messiah ‘Eesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), was (no more than) a Messenger of Allaah and His Word, (‘Be!’ — and he was) which He bestowed on Maryam (Mary) and a spirit (Rooh) created by Him; so believe in Allaah and His Messengers. Say not: ‘Three (trinity)!’ Cease! (it is) better for you. For Allaah is (the only) One Ilaah (God), glory is to Him (Far Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belongs all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allaah is All-Sufficient as a Disposer of affairs”
[al-Nisa’ 4:171]
​

 

[Daze]

For what its worth Islamic prophecy speaks of a Muslim / Christian alliance near the end. So its gonna happen whether people like it or not.

The prophet of Islam sure gets alot of hate here but even the haters can't say he has ever been wrong. So much of what he prophesied 1400 years ago has already come true in our very own life time.

Yes, so long as Muslims don't call Christians idolaters for proclaiming Jesus Christ is the son of God.

Other than that, i really appreciate the Muslim community's resistanse to the lgbtpqwth+ agenda. Often times us Christians are silenced regarding these issues by being told things like "you're not supposed to judge!" as if proclaiming the word of God is "judging ".

For whatever reason, the same liberals that scream that at Christians have in the past been reluctant to say similar things to Muslims (though i realize that in recent times the opinion may be changing). In the meantime, im all for using that to our collective advantage.

For what its worth we should focus on that fact that we have way more in common then what we have that separates us.
However i have to respect DesertRose for telling the truth and not walking on eggshells in her 2nd post.
I've argued with just about every trinny on these boards and while i don't want to fight with you, I'd just like you to reflect on 2 points.

Can a man who worships Prophet Abraham ever get into heaven?

2nd, Recall when Jesus said "I ascend unto My Father and your Father, to My God and your God.” (John 20:17)

I humbly request you to ponder on these 2 points as they are meant for reflection. Not to strike up a debate for the 10,000th time.
Ask God himself to show you the truth. This is the only way any of us can ever find it.

Peace.

 

[A Freeman]

The ONLY Way for Christians and Muslims to truly unite is to get rid of ALL of their religious superstitions, doctrines and traditions and return to keeping The Law/Commandments of God that are found in the first five books of the Bible.

This very simple message has been shared with all of us for thousands of years, throughout the Old Covenant/Testament, New Covenant/Testament and the Koran/Quran, the latter of which was sent to confirm the Scripture came before it.

The organized religions/sects/denominations/cults, etc., all of which Satan invented to divide and conquer us, are what stands in The Way of all of us uniting into a single brotherhood, determined to DO God's Will.

That is exactly what the King of kings' Bible was given to us to do. It is a free-gift from God during these end-times.

People can never be united in a single cause while they are continually divided by differing misunderstandings about what is right and what is wrong. Everyone can however be united to fight for what is right once everyone shares the exact same view of what is right and wrong, according to how God defines right and wrong, rather than what everyone picks and chooses to believe (Deut. 12:8).

One very simple example of this is the abominable practices of trafficking/merchandising others, including children and sexual exploitation of others, including children, which are capital crimes under The Law/Commandments that God gave us. It should be self-evident that if the people of a nation do not protect their children, they will cease to exist. So our continued refusal to keep and enforce God's Law/Commandments against the child-traffickers, pedophiles, pederasts, and the rest of the sexual deviants and child predators -- which is the ONLY Way to rid ourselves of this evil -- is what allows this evil to continue. Under The Law, all that do such things should be lawfully executed. THAT is The Law that God gave us, to protect us from all of this evil and to keep and set us free.

 

[A Freeman]

From The Law:-

Deuteronomy 24:7 If a man be found stealing any of his brethren of the children of Israel, and maketh merchandise of him, or selleth him; then that thief shall die; and thou shalt put evil away from among you.

From the Gospel:-

Matthew 18:6-7
18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and [that] he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
18:7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

From the Koran/Quran:-

Sura 6:151. Say: "Come, I will rehearse what "I AM" hath (really) prohibited you from": join not anything as equal with Him; be good to your parents; kill not your children on a plea of want;- We provide sustenance for you and for them;- come not nigh to shameful deeds, whether open or secret; take not life, which "I AM" hath made sacred, except by Way of Justice and Law: thus doth He command you, that ye may learn Wisdom.

Anyone who is unwilling to give up their religious superstitions to protect children from the child predators is only paying lip service to God, and doesn't really desire to do His Will. God would NEVER want us to allow such evil, and that is what each and every sexual pervert/deviant/queer/sodomite/p***phile, etc. really is: selfish and EVIL.

 

[DesertRose]

So far we have 2 Yes, @Daze and Myself
One Maybe @ToxicFemininitySucks
One No @Afreeman
Looking forward to more answers.
Let's answer the actual question not rehash the theological debates that are always on this forum.
Can we agree with Patrick Bet David that this is a time to join and defend the values while setting aside the theological differences?

 

[A Freeman]

Malachi 4
4:1 For, behold, the Day cometh, that shall burn like an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the "I AM" Lord of hosts, that it shall leave of them neither root nor branch (nothing).
4:2 But unto you that fear My name shall the Sun of Righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in The Day that I shall do [this], saith the "I AM" Lord of hosts.
4:4 Remember ye and return to The Law of Moses My servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, [with] the Statutes and Judgments.
4:5 Behold, I will send you EliJAH the Prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful Day of the "I AM" (Sura 43:61):
4:6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse (see verse 4:1 above for details of the curse).

Anyone who refuses to remember and return to The Law that God gave us, which sorts out ALL issues of family values, will burn for it.


Sura 70:11-15
70:11. Though they will be put in sight of each other,- the sinner's desire will be: would that he could redeem himself from the Penalty of that Day by (sacrificing) his children,
70:12. His wife and his brother,
70:13. His kindred who sheltered him,
70:14. And all, all that is on Earth,- so it could deliver him:
70:15. By no means! For it would be The Fire of Hell!-

 

[Seekeroftruth55]

Just as long as there are those who believe in Shariah Law, there can be no unity between the two. Anyone who can't see the obvious infiltration is a total idiot.

 

[Orwell's mentor]

Just as long as there are those who believe in Shariah Law, there can be no unity between the two. Anyone who can't see the obvious infiltration is a total idiot.

Oh I don't know. There are some states in the US that still have the death penalty, yet, you're still hung up on "shariah law"? I think it's time you broaden your understanding of what's really going on in the world.

 

[Seekeroftruth55]

Oh I don't know. There are some states in the US that still have the death penalty, yet, you're still hung up on "shariah law"? I think it's time you broaden your understanding of what's really going on in the world.

Nah, not interested.
Plus I don't even believe in the death penalty.
I just think you all need to get the sticks out of your behinds and realize how dumb this crap all is.

 

[Orwell's mentor]

Nah, not interested.
Plus I don't even believe in the death penalty.
I just think you all need to get the sticks out of your behinds and realize how dumb this crap all is.

Evidently, the world doesn't revolve around your views. It's why I suggested you broaden your understanding of what's unfolding worldwide.

So far we have 2 Yes, @Daze and Myself
One Maybe @ToxicFemininitySucks
One No @Afreeman
Looking forward to more answers.
Let's answer the actual question not rehash the theological debates that are always on this forum.
Can we agree with Patrick Bet David that this is a time to join and defend the values while setting aside the theological differences?

After listening to Leslie Manookian, one might ask (perhaps rhetorically), where are the Muslims and Christians in:

• the military industry complex
• the pharmaceutical industry, and
• the monetary system.

Needless to say, there are numerous NGOs, that are clearly unelected that have been calling the shots for quite a few decades and subverting our privacy and freedom. I'll bet the farm that none of them have any members that are God-revering or God-fearing.

 

[Daze]

Evidently, the world doesn't revolve around your views. It's why I suggested you broaden your understanding of what's unfolding worldwide.



After listening to Leslie Manookian, one would might ask (perhaps rhetorically), where are the Muslims and Christians in:

• the military industry complex
• the pharmaceutical industry, and
• the monetary system.

Needless to say, there are numerous NGOs, that are clearly unelected that have been calling the shots for quite a few decades and subverting our privacy and freedom. I'll bet the farm that none of them have any members that are God-revering or God-fearing.

I seen a tweet arguing the other day about Muslims being in the American military. I have to agree the very oath itself can pull one out of the religion.


-----------------------------------------------------

For the last 20 years those foreign enemies have been Muslim lands.

I remember when i was a child and adults used to talk about the pledge of alliance. All the kids had to recite it in school every day, first thing in the morning. Its basically giving support to the state in whatever path they deem "moral". I was surrounded by only Christians back then and remember some people had problems with what is essentially worship of the state.



Worship might be a little strong for some people but what would you call pledging allegiance and giving unending fealty to people you've never met and probably never will?

My entire life I've only known the US to be a war state. War after war after war. The war in the middle east is not over yet we have started another proxy war in Ukraine.

Does this look like a nation that is interested in peace, with anyone?




This is what i pledged allegiance to what must have been 500 times as a child.

 

[Apheirox]

@DesertRose,

Other than the regular activities of these forums what is it - in detail - you propose we do?

 

[DesertRose]

Other than the regular activities of these forums what is it - in detail - you propose we do?

Hi Apheirox, it is more like an informal poll.
I was getting a feel for how posters felt about Pat Bet David's suggestion specifically in regards to Muslim parent groups and Christian parent groups meeting to put a stop to the grooming of children in the school system.
I think that the government is overreaching its authority not just with this issue but with many.
Traditionally we used to meet up with left-wingers on anti-war platforms but would stay away from other left-wing agendas.
Currently, the left-wing agenda has been weaponized to be enforced by these governments specifically with regards to the gay agenda, gender identity, and preferred pronouns legislation.
The proposal has nothing to do with Christians or Muslims forgetting their religious differences.
Rather, while being fully aware that we do not see eye to eye theologically I wondered if other posters also concluded that it is a good idea to reach out and work on these imminent problems in the West.
I am aware that certain Christian groups and Muslim groups have and will continue to work together and I hope that more are open to the idea.
Was checking if posters on this forum understood what was at stake and if they are open to that idea as well.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@DesertRose,

Other than the regular activities of these forums what is it - in detail - you propose we do?

Stand for what is good and true in our own social circle?

 

[DesertRose]

Stand for what is good and true in our own social circle?

Exactly, Red, not just social but at school boards, town halls, and other places where such legislation is made.
So the political arena, the legislative arena etc.
The problem is that these values are being legislated.
Your social circle can mobilize to stop the legislation.

 

[Apheirox]

Your social circle can mobilize to stop the legislation.

My ´social circle´ (a political group) here close to Copenhagen has already tried this, for years. Nothing much has come of it. 99.9% are fast asleep and cannot currently be reached with these concerns.

 

[DesertRose]

My ´social circle´ (a political group) here close to Copenhagen has already tried this, for years. Nothing much has come of it. 99.9% are fast asleep and cannot currently be reached with these concerns.

That sucks!
Unfortunately, that is the case in many areas around the world which is why we are being ruled by the worst people.

 

[DesertRose]

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