Atheists And Morality

[Kung Fu]

Atheists, where do you get your morality and guidance from?

 

[Lurker]

I'm not really an atheist, but common decency should be enough.

 

[UnderAlienControl]

I always wondered what good it does to swear in a witness in a trial if they don't believe in a God...

 

[Mr.Grieves]

Atheists, where do you get your morality and guidance from?

My fellow human beings and the better natures they exhibit, my education, my understanding of history, and the force of empathy within.

I always wondered what good it does to swear in a witness in a trial if they don't believe in a God...

Working in law, I can't count the number of times I've watched a witness lay their hand on the bible, swear to tell the truth, and then lie through their teeth.
Having a religion and having integrity are not the same thing. A person with integrity who swears to tell the truth tells the truth because they swore too, and stand by their word. If the only thing keeping a person from breaking their word and lying to a court is the fear of some punishment or judgement from on high, that's a lack of integrity.

 

[UnderAlienControl]

My fellow human beings and the better natures they exhibit, my education, my understanding of history, and the force of empathy within. Working in law, I can't count the number of times I've watched a witness lay their hand on the bible, swear to tell the truth, and then lie through their teeth. Having a religion and having integrity are not the same thing. A person with integrity who swears to tell the truth tells the truth because they swore too, and stand by their word. If the only thing keeping a person from breaking their word and lying to a court is the fear of some punishment or judgement from on high, that's a lack of integrity.

Right. And the funny part about that probably is that a lot of those people if asked would say they believe in God...and they lie anyway...smh

 

[Kung Fu]

I'm not really an atheist, but common decency should be enough.

What you find decent another human might not or do we all believe the same things to be decent?

 

[Kung Fu]

My fellow human beings and the better natures they exhibit, my education, my understanding of history, and the force of empathy within.

Working in law, I can't count the number of times I've watched a witness lay their hand on the bible, swear to tell the truth, and then lie through their teeth.
Having a religion and having integrity are not the same thing. A person with integrity who swears to tell the truth tells the truth because they swore too, and stand by their word. If the only thing keeping a person from breaking their word and lying to a court is the fear of some punishment or judgement from on high, that's a lack of integrity.

What makes what you feel to be right more justifiable than another person's thoughts on what they believe to be good or bad?

 

[Lurker]

What you find decent another human might not or do we all believe the same things to be decent?

For the most part, I think we do. Sociopaths and such don't, but a religious text won't change them either.

 

[Mr.Grieves]

What makes what you feel to be right more justifiable than another person's thoughts on what they believe to be good or bad?

Potentially nothing, it depends on the person and the belief. That's why I don't traipse around here insisting religious people abandon their gods and beliefs and do things 'my way'; because I've no strong moral objections to 'their way' so long as 'their way' isn't doing harm. Unlike the religious, I don't make the claim that my morality is perfect and beyond all debate. When harm is done however it's apparent to all those with unclouded empathy, and I'm lucky enough to live in a country where unclouded empathy tends to thoroughly work its way into rule of law. I do believe unclouded empathy comes more naturally to the secular, as religion is very often the bringer of clouds where empathy is concerned, allowing folks to justify things like brutally group-lynching a young man for touching another young man's butt with his penis, or a young woman for trying to elope with the man she loves, or an albino for no other reason than being born albino. Unclouded empathy rejects all these acts as atrocious.

 

[Kung Fu]

For the most part, I think we do. Sociopaths and such don't, but a religious text won't change them either.

If we do than why do we all disagree so much on what we deem moral and what deem immoral?

What makes what you believe to be good more superior to another person's thoughts on what he/she believes to be good?

 

[Lurker]

If we do than why do we all disagree so much on what we deem moral and what deem immoral?

Because of holy books.

What makes what you believe to be good more superior to another person's thoughts on what he/she believes to be good?

Not superior, just going on - No harm, no foul.

 

[Mr.Grieves]

Because of holy books.

 

[Kung Fu]

Because of holy books.

I didn't know Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Bush, Egyptian pharaohs, Alexander of Macedon, and etc. followed holy books. They legit though what they were doing was good and they had a whole lot of backing by their people who didn't follow any kind of holy book.

Not superior, just going on - No harm, no foul.

Then what Stalin did to the Ukranianswas perfectly cool because what he thought he was doing was good, right?

 

[Lurker]

I didn't know Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Bush, Egyptian pharaohs, Alexander of Macedon, and etc. followed holy books. They legit though what they were doing was good and they had a whole lot of backing by their people who didn't follow any kind of holy book.



Then what Stalin did to the Ukranianswas perfectly cool because what he thought he was doing was good, right?

Both examples were doing harm. They knew it, just didn't care because of psychopathy. Straw man much?

 

[Kung Fu]

Both examples were doing harm. They knew it, just didn't care because of psychopathy. Straw man much?

What about the harms that police officers do to "offenders" people seem to be okay with that but not when it comes to the harms that Stalin did?

What about a consenting father and consenting adult daughter having intercourse?

Hitler and Bush, legit thought they were doing good so please don't lie to us and tell us they didn't. Hitler believed he was cleansing his nation. He thought he was doing good and so did a lot of his people.

Keep squirming my friend.

 

[Faker He-Man]

What about the harms that police officers do to "offenders" people seem to be okay with that but not when it comes to the harms that Stalin did?

What about a consenting father and consenting adult daughter having intercourse?

Hitler and Bush, legit thought they were doing good so please don't lie to us and tell us they didn't. Hitler believed he was cleansing his nation. He thought he was doing good and so did a lot of his people.

Keep squirming my friend.

harm is still harm and is a tangible thing that exists regardless of anyone's ignorance or belief otherwise. this is not a difficult concept, Kung Fu.

 

[Lurker]

What about the harms that police officers do to "offenders" people seem to be okay with that but not when it comes to the harms that Stalin did?

There are many pigs that identify as religious, yet still cause harm.

What about a consenting father and consenting adult daughter having intercourse?

Consenting adults. Icky, yes, but still consenting.

Hitler and Bush, legit thought they were doing good so please don't lie to us and tell us they didn't. Hitler believed he was cleansing his nation. He thought he was doing good and so did a lot of his people.

Never heard of the deep state huh?

Keep squirming my friend.

How am I squirming?

 

[Kung Fu]

There are many pigs that identify as religious, yet still cause harm.

Is all harm bad? If I wanted to protect myself from an attacker I would have to do some harm.

Consenting adults. Icky, yes, but still consenting.

So it's perfectly find for a father and daughter to have intercourse?

Is it perfectly fine to give crack to a crack addict despite it not causing any harm?

Never heard of the deep state huh?

What does the deep state have anything to do with the people following their leaders thinking they're doing good while millions of others across the world think they're doing bad?

How am I squirming?

Because you still haven't given me an answer on what's good or bad and who has the authority to deem what's good and or bad?

 

[Kung Fu]

harm is still harm and is a tangible thing that exists regardless of anyone's ignorance or belief otherwise. this is not a difficult concept, Kung Fu.

Is harm bad or good?

 

[Lurker]

Is all harm bad? If I wanted to protect myself from an attacker I would have to do some harm.

No, that would be force.

So it's perfectly find for a father and daughter to have intercourse?

If they are consenting adults, yes.

Is it perfectly fine to give crack to a crack addict despite it not causing any harm?

Sure. What do I care if they do crack? Where is the victim?

What does the deep state have anything to do with the people following their leaders thinking they're doing good while millions of others across the world think they're doing bad?

Psychopathy, we can't control that without hunting Dick Cheney style.

Because you still haven't given me an answer on what's good or bad and who has the authority to deem what's good and or bad?

Do no harm. But, OK, only your book can define harm.