Why is Feminism much worse than Cancer nowadays that is caused by women which keeps most men single?

[Cintra]

So that is MGTOW then? That accurately represents there grievances? That there wives refused to have sex with them....

I thought it was women on tinder who wouldn't have sex with them, but whatever.
No one has a right to demand intimacy and emotion from another.

 

[lightseeker]

Yeah I think the view that women should be subordinate to men definitely necessitates feminism. If you want a balanced relationship between the sexes seeing both as complimentary counterparts, having complimentary strengths, is the only way.
I read this article from a woman a while ago who said she left feminism because she was exhausted by how it said that women were subordinate to men and need to rebel or revolt, but people arguing for that stance makes it unavoidable.

Why I Left Feminism

Until a few years ago, I spent my entire life being a feminist.

www.eviemagazine.com

 

[Lyfe]

Look, you havent been able to prove any positive intent for patriarchy. You havent been able to provide a good reason as to why women werent allowed to be educated for example. Women being under men is an entirely different thing to children being under adults. If you can answer the question as to why women would need to be under men that is in anyway similar to why chidren should be under parents, then maybe we could get somewhere. Because "feminists logic" is that there is no reason for a grown women to be treated like a perpetual child. Do you see the dissonance of your comparison? You're trying to dismantle the need for feminism by using the metic of abuse as the common factor between the two examples without realizing that the very premise is flawed.

How can I provide proof to prove something that can only be viewed subjectively? You will argue something is bad based off of your own personal opinion. Not only that, but you wanted me to go on a google crusade and link and quote various sites and spend a good portion of my day fetching information. You can do that and spend your time here doing that.

I didnt live back then. Neither did you. You cant fully understand the context of the times. You state that patriarchy is purely anti women and that it not only subjugated them, but oppressed them. I don't know how your examples and laws failing to protect women prove that or even accurately begin to portray the life of the average woman during that time. Wives werent the only women. There were mothers, sisters, daughters, and grandmothers. To say that men didn't honor and revere these women and that these women can only identify their own male kids and grandkids, fathers, and brothers as abusive all around is an incredible statement that you haven't proven, yet keep inferring. You say that patriarchy was a system created purely with intent to exploit the weaker sex. Feminists get offended by that idea of women being the weaker sex, but it must be the weaker sex afterall if men were able to exploit you, right? I dont have all the answers your looking for and I dont pretend to, Im not going to go googling for you. To say that patriarchy and forms of governance that made up the past are at large defined by their abuse of women without proper context is incredibly irresponsible and bias.

 

[Cintra]

I don't even know if I am a feminist.
I think all people should be considered equal in value, and they should be able to make relationships on a basis of equality, and pursue their goals on an equal footing.

I don't know if that is feminism or not these days.
It was when I was young, but I don't know about now.

 

[lightseeker]

I don't even know if I am a feminist.
I think all people should be considered equal in value, and they should be able to make relationships on a basis of equality, and pursue their goals on an equal footing.

I don't know if that is feminism or not these days.
It was when I was young, but I don't know about now.

Feminism got mixed in with queer theory sometime in the last few decades. I think your stance is what some feminists still believe, and I think it’s called radical feminism. I as well am not fully up to date with it

 

[Lyfe]

I thought it was women on tinder who wouldn't have sex with them, but whatever.
No one has a right to demand intimacy and emotion from another.

Actually,

The majority of men in MGTOW comprise of men who were cheated on and/or left for someone else, in allot of occasions more than once, suffered divorce while their wife took their kids and a bountiful portion of their finances as well through the legal system. Allot of these instances the husband made exponentially more money and was left for someone else despite already having already exhausted allot of these finances toward taking care of his wife and kids. No other reason was given for this other than the wife didnt feel the same way anymore after years of marriage.

So with that said and marriages all over taking a tank and the legal system favoring women so much in divorce, why should a man focus his efforts on seeking a family rather than taking care of himself and going his own way?

 

[Cintra]

Actually,

The majority of men in MGTOW comprise of men who were cheated on and/or left for someone else, in allot of occasions more than once, suffered divorce while their wife took their kids and a bountiful portion of their finances as well through the legal system. Allot of these instances the husband made exponentially more money and was left for someone else despite already having already exhausted allot of these finances toward taking care of his wife and kids. No other reason was given for this other than the wife didnt feel the same way anymore after years of marriage.

So with that said and marriages all over taking a tank and the legal system favoring women so much in divorce, why should a man focus his efforts on seeking a family rather than taking care of himself and going his own way?

And no man ever trades in his aging wife for a younger woman because he just 'doesn't feel the same about her now she has had kids and put on weight'?

Also if women were equal they should he getting equal pay.
If men generally make exponentially more money it is unequal to begin with.

And if one person works while the other stays home and looks after their kids, she is entitled to half his pay because its a bloody hard job, and you don't get to clock out. Ever.

Also the MGTOW guy who started this thread said that feminism was worse than cancer because he couldn't get a shag.
All the womens fault.
He is entitled to a shag and some woman has to provide it for him, he doesn't have to earn it, he just has to demand it.

He can't get his end away, but that's nothing to do with him, or his behaviour, or his anger. It is because all women are bitches who need to be put in their place.

And really, that kind of attitude tends to turn women off.

 

[Lyfe]

You clearly have no idea what MGTOW is about.

Ok then whats it about? I gave Cintra a little background of the men that eventually go mgtow.

Its all about benefit and loss really. Men who go MGTOW conclude marriage to be a loss, but its primariily due to the times.

If there is equality and balance in marriage and an equal exchange of providing the other persons needs, and compromise and etc etc... Should not a woman give her body to the husband and vice versa? Im pretty sure most men will just give his body over to the wife any time they desire it. What about one sided marriages where one person is doing most of the sacrificing and striving? Women dont want to cook or give up their bodies, and allot of them make less money, they don't want to clean... If marriage is a fair exchange and a man provides most of the resources in a particular marriage, he is doing other duties to fulfill the duties of marriage and a woman isn't then isn't that a problem? What is a woman contributing to a marriage or something of fair exchange if they refuse their body, they don't cook, they dont clean, and etc etc.... Now dont twist my words, please, but in relationship like marriage where fair exchange, compromise, and equality is all encouraged then why is it right for a woman to always withhold her body from a husband if he is doing his part in the marriage?

 

[Lyfe]

The truth is if you constantly withhold your body from your husband that is ultimately a form of abuse and manipulation, its a power bid. Its not loving at all. I can understand not being in a mood, but to constantly withhold your body is failing to fulfill your marriage duties no matter what gender you are.

 

[KoncreteMind]

Then link me to the starting post. Simple.

It’s you who wants to discuss it tho. You go to that thread and look for my post and bring it up. I don’t feel like sifting thru and finding the posts. If you want to have the discussion go to the thread and look for my last posts and we can start from there. Start from there mind you, IN THAT THREAD. Not in this thread that has nothing to do with that topic

Nice strawman. I'm comparing black people's lack of achievement in comparison to whites to women's lack of achievement and contribution compared to men.

Again, feminism was supported by the bankers. That’s literally documented. Not to mention the push in the media it gets. The amount of feminists that are given a platform in the media. now with blacks people? When they started their movements in the civil rights era govt created a secret monitoring organization to monitor, discredit, infiltrate and ultimately dismantle their movements. Yet you’re comparing whatblack people went thru to women? The leaders of their movements were jailed, killed, or chased into exile. Guess what happened after that? The govt supported the drug cartels that were supplying the US with crack cocaine while also “cracking” down on drug users in the US with the three strikes rule. Sending people to jail to where they could then be in involuntary servitude as the 13th or 14th amendment puts it. And yet you’ll STILL compare this to what women went thru?

My link was a compilation of linguists and scholars who surmise ezer's definition as well as its context in relation to Eve. If you dont understand what the articles Jess and I linked means just say so. Because its actually embarrassing how badly you misread it.

Yea people have all types of opinions but that’s why I posted the definitions so no matter what reasoning you tried to twist in there, everyone could see that the world help (ezer) is still in there.

Adam named Eve, not women as in the collective sense. Hagar gave God a name as well. Eve named her firstborn son, thanking God for helping her bring forth a man. Naming does not indicate authority or hierarchy. That's reading into the text.

“Naming doesn’t indicate hierarchy” lol. That’s laughable.If you’re arguing against that then it’s like I’m arguing with someone who will walk outside and argue with me that the sky isn’t blue. It’s pointless to continue because you’re literally arguing against reality with this one.

And no Hagar gave God a name FOR HER to address Him by because she did not know His name nor have a personal relationship with Him. If she literally gave Him a name then that name would stick when Moses came around but it didn’t. The Name God have Moses was not the name Hagar gave in her time of distress. To be comparable towhat we’re talking about the name would have had to stick.

You didnt even have the integrity to address the rest of the Corinthians passage lol.

If I hired you and said “you’re here for me but I’m not here for you” are we equal on a hierarchy ? Of course not. Yet instead of addressing that, you want to do the “what about” game.

It's pertinent because women financially supported men including Jesus. Women were commended for following Christ and for working in ministry, with no mention to what you consider to be a woman's primary purpose. Ok so where does God give Adam alone dominion? Verse where its stated please.

Umm the role of a man is bigger than just giving money. Did these women go out and get food for Jesus? Did they put a roof over his head? Did they protect him from danger? Did they lead him in righteousness to God? Offfff course not.

And the Bible clearly says it gave man AND women dominion over the earth. But the man has dominion over the woman. And that’s shown when God gave multiple wives to certain men in the Bible. Or when He said that 7 women would attach themselves to one man. Or when he denigrated israel for having women and children reign over the men

 

[KoncreteMind]

No. I don't pay taxes.

What you personally do is not relevant to the point being made about feminism tricking women into trading submissiveness to a husband for submissiveness to corporations

 

[Cintra]

The truth is if you constantly withhold your body from your husband that is ultimately a form of abuse and manipulation, its a power bid. Its not loving at all. I can understand not being in a mood, but to constantly withhold your body is failing to fulfill your marriage duties no matter what gender you are.

This seems to have nothing to do with people like the OP appea= to be.

It also smacks of the old fashioned view of sex in marriage as the man's right and the woman's duty.

How two people who have chosen to be together run their partnership is between them. It is different for every couple.
Checks, balances and compromises.
If it doesn't work they should split up.

 

[Lyfe]

This seems to have nothing to do with people like the OP appea= to be.

It also smacks of the old fashioned view of sex in marriage as the man's right and the woman's duty.

How two people who have chosen to be together run their partnership is between them. It is different for every couple.
Checks, balances and compromises.
If it doesn't work they should split up.

Ill write to you what I wrote Drifter

If there is equality and balance in marriage and an equal exchange of providing the other persons needs, and compromise and etc etc... Should not a woman give her body to the husband and vice versa? Im pretty sure most men will just give his body over to the wife any time they desire it. What about one sided marriages where one person is doing most of the sacrificing and striving? Women dont want to cook or give up their bodies, and allot of them make less money, they don't want to clean... If marriage is a fair exchange and a man provides most of the resources in a particular marriage, he is doing other duties to fulfill the duties of marriage and a woman isn't then isn't that a problem? What is a woman contributing to a marriage or something of fair exchange if they refuse their body, they don't cook, they dont clean, and etc etc.... Now dont twist my words, please, but in relationship like marriage where fair exchange, compromise, and equality is all encouraged then why is it right for a woman to always withhold her body from a husband if he is doing his part in the marriage?

 

[Cintra]

What you personally do is not relevant to the point being made about feminism tricking women into trading submissiveness to a husband for submissiveness to corporations

You asked, I answered.

If it wasn't relevant you shouldn't have asked.

 

[Cintra]

Ill write to you what I wrote Drifter

If there is equality and balance in marriage and an equal exchange of providing the other persons needs, and compromise and etc etc... Should not a woman give her body to the husband and vice versa? Im pretty sure most men will just give his body over to the wife any time they desire it. What about one sided marriages where one person is doing most of the sacrificing and striving? Women dont want to cook or give up their bodies, and allot of them make less money, they don't want to clean... If marriage is a fair exchange and a man provides most of the resources in a particular marriage, he is doing other duties to fulfill the duties of marriage and a woman isn't then isn't that a problem? What is a woman contributing to a marriage or something of fair exchange if they refuse their body, they don't cook, they dont clean, and etc etc.... Now dont twist my words, please, but in relationship like marriage where fair exchange, compromise, and equality is all encouraged then why is it right for a woman to always withhold her body from a husband if he is doing his part in the marriage?

And I will repeat what I said before.

How two people who have chosen to be together run their partnership is between them. It is different for every couple.
Checks, balances and compromises.
If it doesn't work they should split up.

 

[Lyfe]

And I will repeat what I said before.

How two people who have chosen to be together run their partnership is between them. It is different for every couple.
Checks, balances and compromises.
If it doesn't work they should split up.

You inferred that men's grievances in mgtow was basically summed up with their wives not having sex with their husband. I gave you a context for the kind of marriages many of these women divorced from. Do you think its right for a woman to leave a man and take his resources and kids away in circumstances where abuse, cheating, and maltreatment isn't present? ....in some instances for another man? Because, that is what these men in mgtow relate to.

Women who always withhold sex from their husband when their husband just needs a release are manipulative, controlling, and they surely dont love their husband if they arent even willing to sleep with him once in a while. Its not even about sex its about having an unloving wife or a wife that doesnt love her husband enough to please him every now and then to understand hes human and he needs those needs met. Period That is what allot of husbands report. Sexless marriages where the man is doing his duty in the marriage contract.

 

[Cintra]

You inferred that men's grievances in mgtow was basically summed up with their wives not having sex with their husband. I gave you a context for the kind of marriages many of these women divorced from. Do you think its right for a woman to leave a man and take his resources and kids away in circumstances where abuse, cheating, and maltreatment isn't present? ....in some instances for another man? Because, that is what these men in mgtow relate to.

Women who always withhold sex from their husband when their husband just needs a release are manipulative, controlling, and they surely dont love their husband if they arent even willing to sleep with him once in a while. Its not even about sex its about having an unloving wife or a wife that doesnt love her husband enough to please him every now and then to understand hes human and he needs those needs met. Period That is what allot of husbands report. Sexless marriages where the man is doing his duty in the marriage contract.

I inferred that men's grievances in MGTOW was that women on Tinder wouldn't have sex with them.

I don't recall mentioning men having marital problems until you brought it up.

Maybe you are confusing my posts with someone elses.
There are about 4 intersecting conversations going on in this thread.

 

[KoncreteMind]

You asked, I answered.

If it wasn't relevant you shouldn't have asked.

well you whittled the post down as if that’s all I asked or said. Fair enough tho

 

[Cintra]

well you whittled the post down as if that’s all I asked or said. Fair enough tho

The rest of the post seemed based on the assumption that I paid taxes and worked for a corporation.

As the initial assumption was incorrect the rest of the post seemed irrelevant to me.

 

[Lyfe]

I inferred that men's grievances in MGTOW was that women on Tinder wouldn't have sex with them.

I don't recall mentioning men having marital problems until you brought it up.

Maybe you are confusing my posts with someone elses.
There are about 4 intersecting conversations going on in this thread.

So do you believe there should be a support group for men who fall into the category I described?