Who is Michael the Archangel?

Red Sky at Morning

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So you're not going to respond with what the Bible says? I don't base my beliefs on what SDA's believe. I studied my Bible and have done for years. They so happen to be the religion that preaches the truth of the Bible. If you think they are wrong prove it! Challenge me on all those things you've posted and show me where they are wrong biblically or else don't waste my time!

Like Daciple you've gone to a site right now that is against SDA's and posted lies about them too. You do not know anything about SDA's to just believe what you've posted without first checking them out. This is very lazy.
I’m sure you are vastly more informed on SDA beliefs than I am. As to spending valuable time squabbling with you over them, I think there is a principle and a consideration to take into account:-

Opportunity / Cost

“In microeconomic theory, the opportunity cost, or alternative cost, of making a particular choice is the value of the most valuable choice out of those that were not taken. In other words, opportunity that will require sacrifices.

When an option is chosen from two mutually exclusive alternatives, the opportunity cost is the "cost" incurred by not enjoying the benefit associated with the alternative choice.”

John 4
35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.
36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.

As for me, I believe time may be short. It is for us who know the Lord to share the true gospel with those who need to hear it, not waste time on secondary things.
 

phipps

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I’m sure you are vastly more informed on SDA beliefs than I am. As to spending valuable time squabbling with you over them, I think there is a principle and a consideration to take into account:-

Opportunity / Cost

“In microeconomic theory, the opportunity cost, or alternative cost, of making a particular choice is the value of the most valuable choice out of those that were not taken. In other words, opportunity that will require sacrifices.

When an option is chosen from two mutually exclusive alternatives, the opportunity cost is the "cost" incurred by not enjoying the benefit associated with the alternative choice.”

John 4


35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.


36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.

As for me, I believe time may be short. It is for us who know the Lord to share the true gospel with those who need to hear it, not waste time on secondary things.
Who was squabbling? You're the one who wants to squabble by that very weak, lazy and escapist stuff you've posted about SDA's. We were having a debate about the Archangel and instead of responding about the actual subject you chose to pull out supposed things SDA's got wrong about their doctrine that you don't even know much about. Because of that you posted lies. At least get your facts right. You just posted what you found on google that supported your opinions about SDA's and you don't have a clue because you've not bothered to check up on any of those things to know whether they are right or not. You are wrong!

Just because someone else did it on here doesn't mean you have to copy them. You copied their lying.

I post what I believe to be true and its fine if you don't agree but to do what you did was wrong and nothing you post is going to change that. I will continue to post the truth about the Bible no matter what. If just one person sees something I've posted and it makes them study the Bible more that will be good. I do it for God and you can try these tactics over and over again but it won't faze me.
 
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phipps

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Revelation 12 The Characters
Summary: The narrative of Revelation 12 is full of symbolic characters. Where do you and I fit into this story?

The two great adversaries in the war of Revelation 12 are Michael and the Dragon. Also present is a woman who gives birth to a son. Each character represents a spiritual being.

Michael
The name Michael means “He that is what God is.” Michael is Christ, the leader of the angels. Who would contend with Satan over the body of Moses (Jude 9) other than Christ Himself? And the voice of the archangel that calls forth the dead at the Second Coming of Christ can only be the voice of Christ Himself.

“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: And the dead in Christ shall rise first” (1 Thessalonians 4:16).

In the Old Testament, Christ is called the “Angel of the Lord” or the “Angel of His Presence,” and Michael is called the great prince:

"And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people" (Daniel 12:1).

"The Angel who redeemed me from all evil" (Genesis 48:16).

"And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire" (Exodus 3:2).

"For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour. In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them" (Isaiah 63:8-9).

The Woman
The woman symbolizes the Church (see Isaiah 54:5-6; 62:5; Jeremiah 6:2). In 2 Corinthians 11:2, Paul called the Corinthian church the bride of Christ: “for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.”

What an apt description of the Church of Christ! She has not committed fornication with the world, and her doctrines are pure. The sun, moon, and stars represent the light of heaven that illuminates her.

The Catholic Church teaches that this woman, clothed with the sun, is Mary, because she gave birth to Jesus. However, according to Revelation, the woman is persecuted by the Dragon, flees into the wilderness, and is taken care of for 1260 days (see Daniel 7). Then, the Dragon makes war on the remnant of her offspring. The symbol refers to God’s faithful people (of which Mary was a member). It was out of God’s people that the Messiah was to come.

The Child
"She bore a male Child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne" (Revelation 12:5 NKJV).

This child is Christ. It is He that will rule the nations, and He that ascended into heaven. Psalm 2:7-9 says this:

"I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, “You are My Son, Today I have begotten You. Ask of Me, and I will give You the nations for Your inheritance, And the ends of the earth for Your possession. You shall break them with a rod of iron; You shall dash them to pieces like a potter's vessel" (NKJV).

https://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception_Great_Controversy_Christ_Michael_woman
 

TokiEl

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Revelation 12 Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. 2 Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth.


The above verse might also be an astronomical mark in time.



Jupiter the star of Bethlehem (which was a sign of the times to the wise men) just spent 9 months in the womb of Virgo in 2017.
 

TokiEl

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Revelation 12 7 And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, 8 but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. 9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.


Joshua 5 13 And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted his eyes and looked, and behold, a Man stood opposite him with His sword drawn in His hand. And Joshua went to Him and said to Him, “Are You for us or for our adversaries?”

14 So He said, “No, but as Commander of the army of the Lord I have now come.

And Joshua fell on his face to the earth and worshiped, and said to Him, “What does my Lord say to His servant?”

15 Then the Commander of the Lord’s army said to Joshua, “Take your sandal off your foot, for the place where you stand is holy.” And Joshua did so.


Exodus 3 5 Then He said, “Do not draw near this place. Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you stand is holy ground.” 6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.



Michael is the Commander of God's angels and that Commander is God.
 

phipps

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NOTICE

In Daniel chapter 3 we see Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego being thrown into a furnace of fire because they refused to bow before king Nebuchadnezzar's golden idol. As bible students, most of us are aware that Jesus Himself appears in the midst of the fire to not only protect the three students of Daniel, He is also there as confirmation they were right not to bow before that idol. As Christians this is not something we question. All know that Jesus Himself did in fact appear in that fire. It is recorded thusly...

Daniel 3:24-25, "Then King Nebuchadnezzar was astonished; and he rose in haste and spoke, saying to his counselors, “Did we not cast three men bound into the midst of the fire?” They answered and said to the king, “True, O king.” “Look!” he answered, “I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

The king realizes something amazing has just happened. He acknowledges also that he does indeed see a fourth person in the furnace. And then he declares that fourth person to be the Son of God. Now notice this...

Daniel 3:28, "Nebuchadnezzar spoke, saying, “Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego, who sent His Angel and delivered His servants who trusted in Him, and they have frustrated the king’s word, and yielded their bodies, that they should not serve nor worship any god except their own God!"

King Nebuchadnezzar boldly proclaims the fact that the Father had sent His Angel, and His Angel is in fact the Son of God!
 
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TokiEl

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Michael the Archangel is the only Archangel in the Bible and is also said to be the King of the Jews... and is the only one with the authority and ability to help angels.

That means Michael is not a mere angel but God.
 

neptunejoo

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In Islamic tradition Michael is one of the chief of angels. Mikail is responsible of the forces of nature by providing nourishment for bodies and souls while also being responsible for bringing rain and thunder to Earth.

Mikail doesn't have desire, Mikail only purpose is to obey God. However it doesn't mean Mikail does not have characteristics, some say Mikail was shocked when hell was created, make Mikail never smiles again.
 

TokiEl

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In Islamic tradition Michael is one of the chief of angels.
What Islam Kabbalism Gnosticism Buddhism Hinduism etc etc have to say about Michael are a pack of lies at best. What matters is what the Bible says...

Daniel 10 13“But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.


In english bibles this on the surface looks like Michael is just a chief angel... but the translated word chief Strong's H7223 - ri'shown actually means first.

As in Michael is number one.
 

TokiEl

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God in Exodus 3:5 said to Moses... "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground.”

And this same thing God in Exodus 5:15 said to Joshua.


God is the Commander of the angelic army of God.
 

Axl888

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Revelation 12 7 And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, 8 but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. 9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.


Joshua 5 13 And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted his eyes and looked, and behold, a Man stood opposite him with His sword drawn in His hand. And Joshua went to Him and said to Him, “Are You for us or for our adversaries?”

14 So He said, “No, but as Commander of the army of the Lord I have now come.

And Joshua fell on his face to the earth and worshiped, and said to Him, “What does my Lord say to His servant?”

15 Then the Commander of the Lord’s army said to Joshua, “Take your sandal off your foot, for the place where you stand is holy.” And Joshua did so.


Exodus 3 5 Then He said, “Do not draw near this place. Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you stand is holy ground.” 6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.



Michael is the Commander of God's angels and that Commander is God.
The only difference is that in the Book of Joshua, no specific name was mentioned for the commander of the army of the Lord except for a description of a "Man...with His drawn sword in His hands". In the Book of Revelations on the other hand, explicitly mentioned "Michael and his angels".
 

Red Sky at Morning

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Hebrews 1

1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; 3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; 4Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

5For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
 
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Hebrews
1:9 Thou (i.e. Christ) hast loved righteousness, and hated inequity; therefore God, [even] thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows (spirit-beings).

Hebrews 1:5-6
(To Michael - Matt. 3:17, Hebrews 1:2)

Revelation
12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon (Lucifer); and the dragon fought and his angels,
12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out to the earth, and his angels (you - Luke 9:55) were cast out with him (Matthew 25:41).
12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the Kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Michael - His Christ (God's Anointed - Heb. 1:9; i.e. Christ - Prince Michael the Archangel - Rev. 12:7,10).

Michael - The firstborn of every creature (the first created by God - Colossians 1:15):

Colossians
1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
1:16 For by Him (God) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him (God), and for him (Christ):
1:17 And He (God) is before all things, and by Him (God) all things consist.
1:18 And he (Christ) is the head of the body, the community: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all [things] he (Christ) might have the preeminence.
1:19 For it pleased [the Father] (God) that in him (Christ) should all fulness dwell;
1:20 And, making peace through the blood of his (Christ's) cross, by him to reconcile all things unto Himself (God); by him (Christ), [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.

1 Corinthians
15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.
15:27 For He (God) hath put all things under his (Christ's) feet. But when He (God) saith all things are put under [him (Christ), it is] manifest that He (God) is excepted, which did put all things under him (Christ).
15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him (Christ), then shall the Son (Christ) also himself be subject unto Him (God) that put all things under him (Christ), that God may be all in all.
 
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phipps

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The Angel of the Lord

The phrase "angel of the Lord" is found 68 times in Scripture. Sometimes it applies to Gabriel who appeared to Daniel, Zacharias, and Mary. But Gabriel is called "an" angel of the Lord (Luke 1:11). He is not referred to as "the" angel of the Lord. Neither is he ever called the archangel. (And while we’re on the subject, the popular angel Raphael does not appear anywhere in Scripture.) Gabriel is probably one of the two covering cherubs who flank the throne of God. Remember that he said to Zacharias, "I am Gabriel, who stands in the presence of God," (Luke 1:19). Lucifer once held the other position before his fall (Ezekiel 28:14). If the highest rank held by an angel is that of the covering cherubs by the throne of God then who and what is the archangel? And who is this mighty individual identified as "the angel of the Lord" who performs such prominent roles in the redemption of man?

God the Father created all things through Jesus (Hebrews 1:2; Ephesians 3:9). It is not implausible to assume that if Christ came to earth and became a man in His battle against Satan to save human beings, He might also have in some way identified with the angels to protect them from Satan's evil influence in heaven. In fact, there are several references in Scripture to a mysterious being identified as "the angel of the Lord" before Christ's earthly incarnation. Yet each time He is mentioned, there are clues to His identity.
 
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The catholic doctrine is insidious.

It calls both Jesus and God liars (John 14:28) yet the church upholds it as supposedly being the truth. But Jesus told us who the father of lies is (John 8:44) and about the lie being Satan's signature.

The New Testament teaches that God is NOT the Author of confusion (1 Corr. 14:33) and that the result of believing lies is delusion (2 Thess. 2:11).

Organized religions should be avoided, like the plague (Rev. 18:4)!
 

TokiEl

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The only difference is that in the Book of Joshua, no specific name was mentioned for the commander of the army of the Lord except for a description of a "Man...with His drawn sword in His hands". In the Book of Revelations on the other hand, explicitly mentioned "Michael and his angels".
When in Revelation it is said Michael and his angels...then it means that Michael is the commander of the angels. And that commander told Joshua what God told Moses... Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground.

In other words the commander of the angels is God... and his name is Michael.


Before Jesus Christ was born on earth... He was always Michael the Archangel.

God the commander of the angels.
 
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phipps

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Scriptural instances when the Angel of the Lord speaks as if He were God:

Genesis 16:9-12,
"The Angel of the Lord said to her, “Return to your mistress, and submit yourself under her hand.” Then the Angel of the Lord said to her, “I will multiply your descendants exceedingly, so that they shall not be counted for multitude.” And the Angel of the Lord said to her: “Behold, you are with child, And you shall bear a son. You shall call his name Ishmael, Because the Lord has heard your affliction. He shall be a wild man; His hand shall be against every man, And every man’s hand against him. And he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren"

Exodus 3:2-4, "And the Angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed. Then Moses said, “I will now turn aside and see this great sight, why the bush does not burn.” So when the Lord saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!”

Judges 2:1-2, "Then the Angel of the Lord came up from Gilgal to Bochim, and said: “I led you up from Egypt and brought you to the land of which I swore to your fathers; and I said, ‘I will never break My covenant with you. And you shall make no covenant with the inhabitants of this land; you shall tear down their altars.’ But you have not obeyed My voice. Why have you done this?"
(There are more, but I'll stop here.)


The Angel of the Lord explained who He was.

Exodus 3:2, 6, 7, "And the Angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed. Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God. And the Lord said: “I have surely seen the oppression of My people who are in Egypt, and have heard their cry because of their taskmasters, for I know their sorrows."

Verse 14, "And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”

There are many more passages in the Bible that demonstrate that the Angel of the Lord is, in fact, God Himself.


The Angel of the Lord Identified With God.

Judges 13:21-22,
"When the Angel of the Lord appeared no more to Manoah and his wife, then Manoah knew that He was the Angel of the Lord. And Manoah said to his wife, “We shall surely die, because we have seen God!”


The Angel of the Lord also accepts worship:

Worship belongs to God and Him alone. Yet the angel of the LORD was worshipped by Moses and Joshua (Joshua 5:13-15).


The Angel of the Lord has the authority to forgive sin.

Genesis 48:16,
"The Angel who has redeemed me from all evil, Bless the lads; Let my name be named upon them, And the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; And let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.”

Exodus 23:20-23, “Behold, I send an Angel before you to keep you in the way and to bring you into the place which I have prepared. Beware of Him and obey His voice; do not provoke Him, for He will not pardon your transgressions; for My name is in Him. But if you indeed obey His voice and do all that I speak, then I will be an enemy to your enemies and an adversary to your adversaries. For My Angel will go before you and bring you in to the Amorites and the Hittites and the Perizzites and the Canaanites and the Hivites and the Jebusites; and I will cut them off."

Zechariah 3:3-4, "Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and was standing before the Angel. Then He answered and spoke to those who stood before Him, saying, “Take away the filthy garments from him.” And to him He said, “See, I have removed your iniquity from you, and I will clothe you with rich robes.”

The Bible says that only God can forgive sin.


The Angel of the Lord as protector of Israel

Exodus 14:19–20, "And the Angel of God, who went before the camp of Israel, moved and went behind them; and the pillar of cloud went from before them and stood behind them. So it came between the camp of the Egyptians and the camp of Israel. Thus it was a cloud and darkness to the one, and it gave light by night to the other, so that the one did not come near the other all that night.

The Israelites might have escaped Egypt, but they were still incredibly vulnerable. In Exodus 13:21–22, we’re told: "And the Lord went before them by day in a pillar of cloud to lead the way, and by night in a pillar of fire to give them light, so as to go by day and night. He did not take away the pillar of cloud by day or the pillar of fire by night from before the people.

The pillars of cloud and fire that had been leading the Israelites were linked to the Lord, but then it’s identified with the angel of the Lord. This is another clear example where the two identities are used interchangeably.


The Angel of the Lord Is Jesus.

First, we know the Godhead is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, but in John 6:46, Jesus says, “ Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father.” Since no one has seen the Father, and since people did see the Angel of the Lord, we can, therefore, know that the angel of the Lord cannot be the Father.

Second, the Holy Spirit never takes human form, and rarely does the Spirit take any form. He took the form of a dove when Jesus was baptized (Matthew 3:16), and as tongues of fire at Pentecost (Acts 2:3-4), but He is never shown in scripture to assume the form of man. Therefore, we have no reason to assume these OT appearances of the Angel of the Lord are the Holy Spirit.

Finally, Paul says that Jesus has always been the "image of the invisible God" in Colossians:

Colossians 1:15-20, "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. For it pleased the Father that in Him all the fullness should dwell, and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross."

Consequently, the Angel of the Lord is the image of the invisible God in the days before Jesus took on flesh (pre-incarnate Christ). Furthermore, the Angel of the Lord never appears in the New Testament, once Jesus took on flesh, nor after His resurrection. The only mention of such a person in the New Testament is described as “an” angel of the Lord, but never “the” Angel of the Lord. Once God the Son appeared as flesh (incarnate Christ), there was no longer a need for Him to appear in any other form as “the Angel of the Lord”.

Finally, it's interesting to consider that the word “angel” means messenger. A messenger is one who is sent from someone else to deliver a message, and of course, Jesus fits this perfectly. He says in John 8:18, I am One who bears witness of Myself, and the Father who sent Me bears witness of Me.” Just as the Father sent Jesus, so also did He send the Angel of the Lord. Based on all the above, we conclude that Jesus was the Angel of the Lord.








 
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TokiEl

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Exodus 23:20-23, “Behold, I send an Angel before you to keep you in the way and to bring you into the place which I have prepared. Beware of Him and obey His voice; do not provoke Him, for He will not pardon your transgressions; for My name is in Him.
For My name is in Him.


Moses would write God's name in what is called the Proto-Sinaitic script... and God's name would look like this...




So what God means by saying... For My name is in Him... is that the Angel of the Lord is the other Person in God's name.
 
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