Dr. William Campbell destroyed by Dr. Zakir Naik on scientific errors in the Bible MUST WATCH!!

[elsbet]

Actually. Jesus existed before anyone.

Claire ♡

Nicely done.

 

[Haich]

Actually. Jesus existed before anyone.

So why wasn't his divinity acknowledge by these prophets prior? Why didn't they preach the trinity and his divinity?

 

[elsbet]

So why wasn't his divinity acknowledge by these prophets prior? Why didn't they preach the trinity and his divinity?

They did.

 

[phipps]

So why wasn't his divinity acknowledge by these prophets prior? Why didn't they preach the trinity and his divinity?

They did preach it. They acknowledged it. Whatever God revelaed to the Prophets, they told the people.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

They did preach it. They acknowledged it. Whatever God revelaed to the Prophets, they told the people.

I think the Prophets said and did different things in the Qur'an compared to the Bible. For that reason it's like someone in the UK and the states talking, but the words meaning different things!

 

[phipps]

At the moment lets hear about mathew
.

.

the first debater escaped.

The whole Bible is in unison and those of us who study/studied are telling you that it is. Therefore the book of Matthew like all other books in the Bible were inspired of the Holy Spirit and its the truth, nothing but the truth. We told you there are certain things you're not going to understand without the spirit. 1 Corinthians 2:14, But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
You approach the Bible with unbelief in your heart, so you're not going to feel the amazing power of the Word. The Bible says Jesus is the Word. The words of scripture testify of Jesus and the includes the book of Matthew. John 6:63, It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. Nothing is in the Bible that wasn't meant to be there and it was God's doing. Without believing in God and praying to understand His Word, you won't.

 

[phipps]

I think the Prophets said and did different things in the Qur'an compared to the Bible. For that reason it's like someone in the UK and the states talking, but the words meaning different things!

I understand that, but as you know some Muslims here are making statements about the Bible as though they were the truth yet its clear they don't know what they are talking about. I suppose we are going to have to agree to disagree on both sides.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

I understand that, but as you know some Muslims here are making statements about the Bible as though they were the truth yet its clear they don't know what they are talking about. I suppose we are going to have to agree to disagree on both sides.

I was just stating the obvious so that the issue was flagged up. The words that Muhammad puts in the mouths of the Prophets differ from those in the Bible. Islam charges the Bible with corrupting that original message (though I believe this claim represents Muslim opinion rather than Muhammad's writings) hence the need for the "new revelation". I disagree entirely with this claim but you will as soon prise a bone from a Great Dane as have a Muslim even contemplate that Muhammad was incorrect ;-)

 

[Karlysymon]

Had God revealed the entire Quran at once it would have been impossible for people to follow. it is the final message for entire mankind not just for the children of israel so it is very voluminous comparing the earlier heavenly scriptures.
every prophet began his teaching with call to believing in One True God with reason/logic and miracles by the leave of God. then when the creed took root in the hearts they would call people toward acts of worship and then toward good dealings and so on..... Step by Step.
for example in the beginning God revealed that there is both benefit and in alcohol but the harm is more than benefit, after a while God revealed that when the time of prayer nears the believers should not drink alcohol, then when believers got used to not drink at least for half a day God relvealed the prohibition of alcohol forever.

I see. Still, Gabriel still could have written the text and at each rendez-vous, whether its a month later or a year later, he would simply hand over the specific chapter/book to Muhammad. Like, this month it would be Genesis, 3months later the Psalms, etc.

Iam actually suprised you didn't counter the question with the idea that the primary reason God never writes sacred texts is because men are inspired to write in a 'language' their fellow men will understand.

If non-prophets are inspired by
God to write heavenly scriptures then what was the point sending prophets ?

The primary job of a prophet is to invoke revival and reformation among the people. Not foretelling. David is considered a prophet. He wrote the Psalms and yet during his reign, he always consulted other prophets for divine counsel.

 

[elsbet]

At the moment lets hear about mathew
.

.

the first debater escaped.

Clever. And reminiscent of the one in the Garden, using logic and reason... but the lie of omission is still a lie.

GENESIS 3:4
The serpent said to the woman, "You won't surely die, for God knows that in the day you eat it, your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

 

[Haich]

They did preach it. They acknowledged it. Whatever God revelaed to the Prophets, they told the people.

Abraham, Moses and the other prophets preached Jesus divinity?
That is a brave claim, evidence please.

 

[grateful servant]

Iam just curious. Muhammad had some physical encounters with Gabriel. So why didn't Gabriel just write it and press it into his hands rather than go through the long process of dictation and inspiration?

10For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:
11For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
12To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.
13But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

 

[phipps]

@phipps

1- If non-prophets are inspired by God to write heavenly scriptures then what was the point sending prophets ?

What is prophecy according to the Bible? Prophecy is a message inspired by God, a divine revelation. The Bible says that prophets “spoke from God as they were moved by holy spirit.” 2 Peter 1:20, 21, Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. So a prophet is one who receives God’s message and transmits it to others. Their main purpose was to be used by God as messengers to offer good advice — and often times judgment — to guide His people. the Bible tells in Amos 3: 7. “Surely the Lord God does nothing unless He reveals His secret to His servants, the prophets.”


2- i am not talking about the disciples rather the authors of the bible who have used the name John, Mathew etx...
the problem is that John is not the author of gospel of John and likewise mathew, only God knows who was or were the author.
i meant that the authors of the bible are not the ones who they claim to be.

Matthew and John were the authors of the books they wrote. There is no lie in the BIble, its all truth. Like I told you, you won't believe because you heart is unbelieving. The whole Bible is in unity including the books Matthew and John wrote. Take it from someone who reads and studies the Bible. Do you think we are lying to you? Just because you don't believe and understand doesn't make it a lie.


3- I know Jesus pbuh. He was a true, pious prophet of God who called people toward worshipping the God of Abraham who has no co-equal whatsoever.

Then you don't know Jesus. The Bible tells us unequivocally who Jesus is. He is God. We Christians have told you too who Jesus Christ is as we've felt His power in our lives.

Jesus is self-existent (John 1:1–4; 14:6); only God is self-existent (Psalm 90:2).

Jesus defines Himself as eternal. “I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty” (Revelation 1:8).

He is, and has, eternal life (1 John 5:11, 12, 20).

He is all-powerful (Revelation 1:8).

He created all things (John 1:3). “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth” (Genesis 1:1). “For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him” (Colossians 1:16 NKJV).

The Father even calls Jesus God. “But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom” (Hebrews 1:8).

Jesus is able to forgive sin (Luke 5:20, 21); The Bible says only God can forgive sin (Isaiah 43:25).

Jesus accepted worship that according to the Ten Commandments is reserved only for the Almighty (Matthew 14:33). “And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, ‘All hail.’ And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him” (Matthew 28:9). Upon seeing the risen Saviour, the converted sceptic, Thomas, confessed, “My Lord and my God!” (John 20:26–29).

Even the angels worship Jesus. “And again, when he bringeth in the first begotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him” (Hebrews 1:6).

The Scriptures also teach that only God knows the thoughts of a man’s heart (1 Kings 8:39). Yet Jesus consistently knew what people were thinking, “for he knew what was in man” (John 2:25). “Nathanael said to Him, ‘How do You know me?’ Jesus answered and said to him, ‘Before Philip called you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you’” (John 1:48 NKJV).

Through the Spirit, Jesus is omnipresent. “Lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age” (Matthew 28:20 NKJV). “For I am with you, and no one will attack you to hurt you; for I have many people in this city” (Acts 18:10 NKJV).

He has power to give life, and even resurrected Himself. “No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again” (John 10:18). “I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live” (John 11:25).

Therefore, by considering the primary definitions of God, and seeing that Jesus fits every one of those definitions, obviously, Jesus must be eternal God.


4- God is not mortal.

You're right, God is not mortal. God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are immortal and they work in unity.


5- most of people on earth don't understand the trinity not even the Christians understand it. so how come God hold us responsible for something we cannot understand on the day of Judgment?

True Christians understand the trinity. God will judge us according to what we know. The whole world will have heard the gospel in some form or another but also God created us to instinctively know right from wrong. Roman 1:18-20, For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse. Also God will judge us from the age of accountability. That is to say when we matured in our understanding of right and wrong. It happens at different times for all of us. However we are all going to be judged. No one can escape. We have all been summoned. We have all been subpoenaed. Hebrews 9:27, And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:. 2 Corinthians 5:10, For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. You may not think it but you're hearing the gospel through the Christians on this forum.


6- God is not male or female to have son/daughter. Male/Female was created by God for continuation of mankind.

True, God is not male or female. When Jesus came to this earth He came as a male. He can do that because He is God. Stop limiting God to what He can and cannot do in your human estimation. Matthew 19:26, But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible. Isaiah 55:8-9, For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.


7- Salvation is through the true messengers of God. in the time of Abraham salvation was ONLY through Abraham because he only knew the true religion and so was Moses and Aron at their time. In Jesus's time when the Torah was corrupted by men, salvation was through Jesus pbuh only because God had sent him to mankind.

No honey, Salvation is through Jesus Christ alone. John 3:16, For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 2 Corinthians 5:21, For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. The Bible says of Jesus in John 1:3, “All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made.” I've also shown you above a few more places that identify Jesus as God. No human being can make such claims. Only God can and Jesus is God. No human or created being can save anyone. Abraham, Moses, Aaron etc could not save anyone's souls any more than you or I can. They were faithful men of God who allowed God to use them to spread the word of God to His people so they can be saved. They needed a saviour just like we all do. They were people like we are so we too can be like them if we let Jesus into our hearts and have faith in Him.

 

[phipps]

inspired by God even if it is not written by mathew ?

INSPIRED by God even if says contradicting things ?

It was written by Matthew and it was inspired by God and we know that because the Gospel of Matthew is in unity with the whole Bible. There are NO Contradictions except for those who don't understand like you. Now you may disagree but those of us who study the Bible are telling you that there are no contradictions in the Bible but it needs study along with prayer. Do you study the Bible like that? Do you think we (Christians on this forum) are all conspiring to lie to you?

 

[phipps]

Abraham, Moses and the other prophets preached Jesus divinity?
That is a brave claim, evidence please.

I've shown you evidence honey, others have shown you evidence here too. It will never be enough for you because you don't believe. I know the prophets believed and preached the divinity of Christ because they told the people about their prophecies that talked about Christ. No prophecy was kept a secret from the people. You don't believe, only God can make you believe. So we are going to have to agree to disagree and leave it at that, okay? I pray that God helps you understand and accept His truth of the Bible and live according to it, and I pray the same prayer for all of us on this forum too. This really is the last Goodbye. God bless.

 

[Haich]

I've shown you evidence honey, others have shown you evidence but you don't believe and there is nothing I can do about that. So we are going to have to agree to disagree, okay?!

You didn't show me evidence of Abraham and other prophets preaching and confirming Jesus' divinity.

 

[phipps]

You didn't show me evidence of Abraham and other prophets preaching and confirming Jesus' divinity.

Read my edited post above and other posts I've posted to others too. Good bye.

 

[Haich]

Read my edited post above. Good bye.

I did! All you did was reiterate that Jesus is supposedly God. You didn't say what will happen to prophets of the old nor did you show evidence of prophets of the old, confirming and preaching the divinity of Jesus. Is there a verse which shows at least one of the prophets saying Jesus is God?

I'm tired of your responses, you just go round in circles so consider this my last response to you. To you your way and to me mine.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

I did! All you did was reiterate that Jesus is supposedly God. You didn't say what will happen to prophets of the old nor did you show evidence of prophets of the old, confirming and preaching the divinity of Jesus. Is there a verse which shows at least one of the prophets saying Jesus is God?

I'm tired of your responses, you just go round in circles so consider this my last response to you. To you your way and to me mine.

I'm not sure if you consider King David to have said anything prophetic, but just for the sake of providing an example, this one is referred to by Jesus:

Key question: Which Lord is addressing David's Lord?

Psalm 110.

1{A Psalm of David.} The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.

2The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.

3Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.

4The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.

5The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.

6He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.

7He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

The sense of the passage is unpacked here:

https://www.gotquestions.org/Lord-said-to-my-Lord.html

God bless.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@friend

"If non-prophets are inspired by God to write heavenly scriptures then what was the point sending prophets ?"

It begs the question "what do you understand by a prophet?" Is it the same meaning as in the Bible where God gives someone insight into future events which can then be reviewed in the light of things that might find both partial and ultimate fulfillments?