Barriers between you and God?

[Douglas Summers]

Besides being an evangelizing talking-point, there is no scriptural basis for what you are saying. There is no point in any of the Torah where either God demands animal sacrifices and certainly nowhere does the Torah say that such sacrifices are required for salvation, lmfao. These are things that since the beginning of time people have been motivated to do themselves.
These were also practices common all around the world, of which are pagan in origin. The difference in the Torah is that God says to do these rituals in a very puritanical way, in order for God to accept it. Comparing the strict procedures in the book of Leviticus to other culture's animal sacrifices to their deities makes it obvious what it's role really is in the Torah, which is a kind of civilizing of the Israelites.



I repeat the same sentiment back to you.



That is blasphemy.

"God is not human, that he should lie,
not a human being, that he should change his mind.
Does he speak and then not act?
Does he promise and not fulfill?"
Numbers 23:19

You must be a follower of Judaism. Jesus had much to say about you.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

And in your last days, you will fear death....

What's there to fear exactly? when you're dead you're dead.

The born again believer does not. Even your Father Satan fears the last days.

Satan is your father too, he's everyone's father. I have a book to prove it.

 

[Karlysymon]

Think about this too, God is so caring in the old testament that he will accept the Israelites to continue the Pagan practice of animal sacrifice which they learned from Egypt, with the stipulation of them doing it for God and using strict procedure so that God would accept their chosen sacrifice as legitimate.

These were also practices common all around the world, of which are pagan in origin. The difference in the Torah is that God says to do these rituals in a very puritanical way, in order for God to accept it. Comparing the strict procedures in the book of Leviticus to other culture's animal sacrifices to their deities makes it obvious what it's role really is in the Torah, which is a kind of civilizing of the Israelites.

Hey, please pardon the delayed response. You are going to have to provide me with the verses in the Torah that corroborate these claims……..“of civilizing the Israelites” and that it was a pagan practice that God decided to…well….edit. Furthermore, when Noah (Gen 9) and Abel (Gen 4) offered up burnt offerings, were they taking after pagan Egyptians? [Noah had just come off the Ark, earth population =8)

Also, 1 Samuel 15:22-25
But Samuel replied:
“Does YHWH delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices
as much as in obeying YHWH?
To obey is better than sacrifice,
and to heed is better than the fat of rams.
For rebellion is like the sin of divination,
and arrogance like the evil of idolatry.
Because you have rejected the word of YHWH,
he has rejected you as king.”
Then Saul said to Samuel, “I have sinned. I violated YHWH’s command and your instructions. I was afraid of the men and so I gave in to them. Now I beg you, forgive my sin and come back with me, so that I may worship YHWH.”

Also, Hosea 6:4-6
“What can I do with you, Ephraim?
What can I do with you, Judah?
Your love is like the morning mist,
like the early dew that disappears.
Therefore I cut you in pieces with my prophets,
I killed you with the words of my mouth—
then my judgments go forth like the sun.
For I desire mercy, not sacrifice,
and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings.

The system was always open to abuse. [Malachi 1:6-8 and 1 Samuel 2:12-17]

There was always a danger of persisting in rebellion because one would argue that they’d just sacrifice an animal and be pardoned, which is why the statement is made that to obey is better than sacrifice. The same accusation has been lobed at Christians. That we literally sin our way to heaven, afterall the blood of Christ covers our iniquity. Which isn’t true

 

[Karlysymon]

Here's the thing, Korban was never demanded of by God (aka, there is no "sacrifice to me or else!" in the Torah), nor does God ever say that he requires animal sacrifice to forgive sins. I think Christians tend to either ignorantly overlook this, or simply lie (and misrepresent) about it to make God seem tyrannical (which happens to be where Christians and Atheists share a middle-ground ironically enough).

The fact that the Israelites came out of Egypt should tell you enough - this was common place for them, they sacrificed animals even before they followed Moses. This is something they already willfully did.
What we see here in Exodus (only mentioned two or three times) and extensively in Leviticus is how to do it in a pure way which will please God. And there things like ritual purity become extremely important to Leviticus laws, because God only accepts sacrifice in those texts if they are done a specific way (which in Torah's logic differentiates it from pagan sacrifices).
God here is accommodating the prior-practices of the Israelites, pure and simple!

And I will try to strongly emphasize this to you: Nowhere in the Torah does it say that God requires animal sacrifice for repentance and forgiveness of sins, nowhere in the Torah does God say that he will not forgive someone if they don't sacrifice an animal; such a thing is absurd.

I had to bold all the above because its serious....

Leviticus 5:14-17
The Lord said to Moses: 15 ‘When anyone is unfaithful to the Lord by sinning unintentionally in regard to any of the Lord’s holy things, they are to bring to the Lord as a penalty a ram from the flock, one without defect and of the proper value in silver, according to the sanctuary shekel.[d] It is a guilt offering. 16 They must make restitution for what they have failed to do in regard to the holy things, pay an additional penalty of a fifth of its value and give it all to the priest. The priest will make atonement for them with the ram as a guilt offering, and they will be forgiven.

17 ‘If anyone sins and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, even though they do not know it, they are guilty and will be held responsible. 18 They are to bring to the priest as a guilt offering a ram from the flock, one without defect and of the proper value. In this way the priest will make atonement for them for the wrong they have committed unintentionally, and they will be forgiven. 19 It is a guilt offering; they have been guilty of[e] wrongdoing against the Lord.’

Leviticus 4:13-21
“If the whole Israelite community sins unintentionally and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, even though the community is unaware of the matter, when they realise their guilt 14 and the sin they committed becomes known, the assembly must bring a young bull as a sin offering and present it before the tent of meeting. 15 The elders of the community are to lay their hands on the bull’s head before the Lord, and the bull shall be slaughtered before the Lord. 16 Then the anointed priest is to take some of the bull’s blood into the tent of meeting. 17 He shall dip his finger into the blood and sprinkle it before the Lord seven times in front of the curtain. 18 He is to put some of the blood on the horns of the altar that is before the Lord in the tent of meeting. The rest of the blood he shall pour out at the base of the altar of burnt offering at the entrance to the tent of meeting. 19 He shall remove all the fat from it and burn it on the altar, 20 and do with this bull just as he did with the bull for the sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for the community, and they will be forgiven. 21 Then he shall take the bull outside the camp and burn it as he burned the first bull. This is the sin offering for the community. ​

The verses are many but feel free to read Leviticus chapters 1-7. The first set of verses above concern a guilt offering. Now, care to speculate as to whom Isaiah 53 is talking about here:

Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all. ........
Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied;[e]
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors. ​

Interestingly enough, the first case of offerings and sacrifices in the entire Tanakh - Cain's offering (Genesis 4). Was rejected by God, God wasn't interested. Don't you find this, fascinating?
God accepted Abel's offering of fruit and soil. Yet Cain brought something presumably akin to what the Israelites did more meticulously and professionally thousands of years later.
I find this thing very intriguing.
Then we have the first case of murder following (Cain killing Abel, spoiler alert )

Huh???? Please re-read Gen 4.

"Now Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground. 3 And in the process of time it came to pass that Cain brought an offering of the fruit of the ground to the Lord. 4 Abel also brought of the firstborn of his flock and of their fat. And the Lord respected Abel and his offering, 5 but He did not respect Cain and his offering. And Cain was very angry, and his countenance fell. "​

Also it will always remain an unanswered question, how someone can atone for someone else?

Have you ever paid for, willingly that is, someone else's crime?

 

[Infinityloop]

Hey, please pardon the delayed response. You are going to have to provide me with the verses in the Torah that corroborate these claims……..“of civilizing the Israelites” and that it was a pagan practice that God decided to…well….edit. Furthermore, when Noah (Gen 9) and Abel (Gen 4) offered up burnt offerings, were they taking after pagan Egyptians? [Noah had just come off the Ark, earth population =8)

In case you didn't read me right, I did specify that the strict procedures were what I was speaking of and not sacrifice in general.

As I did say in the second post you quoted there:

The difference in the Torah is that God says to do these rituals in a very puritanical way, in order for God to accept it. Comparing the strict procedures in the book of Leviticus to other culture's animal sacrifices to their deities makes it obvious what it's role really is in the Torah, which is a kind of civilizing of the Israelites.

Leviticus 11-16 is very heavy on purity and it's role in validating sacrifice, this is something perhaps that I will return to later.

As far as Egyptians are concerned, as with anything to do with the ancient east there are several angles, many are very open in the text - such as the Israelites relationship with both Canaanites and Babylonians, both who similar practiced their own animal sacrifices happily. Afterall most of what we know as the Old Testament, Tanakh or "Jewish Bible" came out of the Babylonian exile.
Anthropology at least, will tell us that the Israelites acquired these practices from their neighbors (Babylonians, Sumerians etc) as this was common place all around the polytheistic middle east.
Nonetheless from the Bible's own perspective, the first time we see sacrificial offerings as anything systematic (or formal) and not isolated is obviously when the Israelites come out of Egypt (who sacrificed animals themselves to their deities).

It's only wiki but here is a good place to start to notice how prevalent of a practice it was in the ancient world, there is nothing special about the practice in the Torah. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_sacrifice
Some cultures still do this today as well, and it has nothing to do with atonement to them.

In Genesis, whenever an offering is mentioned it's always casually mentioned "so and so made an offering for YHWH", there is never any doctrine attached directly to it. However it is mentioned various times that sentiment is attacked in an almost magical way.

To explain as straight-forward as possible: If I were an ancient Israelite, I would pray to God sincerely for repentance. Then I would give an offering to God. The offering I give has no value in-and-of-itself, it is a burning carcass of an animal. Where my soul is, is what is accepted by God. The physical offering itself is an ornament, a gift, a display of my worship. Offerings in the ancient world are an act of worship afterall.

And again I will heavily emphasize ritual purity. This, in the eyes of the Torah, is one thing that separates "God's chosen people" from the outside pagan world.

There was always a danger of persisting in rebellion because one would argue that they’d just sacrifice an animal and be pardoned, which is why the statement is made that to obey is better than sacrifice. The same accusation has been lobed at Christians. That we literally sin our way to heaven, afterall the blood of Christ covers our iniquity. Which isn’t true

To not be rude but blunt, but I'll make it simpler: The Christian view of sacrifice is nonsensical and meaningless. The idea of Jesus as a sacrifice is an insult to the intelligence. I appreciate it's emotional weight but that is all it has.

I had to bold all the above because its serious....

Leviticus 5:14-17
The Lord said to Moses: 15 ‘When anyone is unfaithful to the Lord by sinning unintentionally in regard to any of the Lord’s holy things, they are to bring to the Lord as a penalty a ram from the flock, one without defect and of the proper value in silver, according to the sanctuary shekel.[d] It is a guilt offering. 16 They must make restitution for what they have failed to do in regard to the holy things, pay an additional penalty of a fifth of its value and give it all to the priest. The priest will make atonement for them with the ram as a guilt offering, and they will be forgiven.

17 ‘If anyone sins and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, even though they do not know it, they are guilty and will be held responsible. 18 They are to bring to the priest as a guilt offering a ram from the flock, one without defect and of the proper value. In this way the priest will make atonement for them for the wrong they have committed unintentionally, and they will be forgiven. 19 It is a guilt offering; they have been guilty of[e] wrongdoing against the Lord.’

Leviticus 4:13-21
“If the whole Israelite community sins unintentionally and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, even though the community is unaware of the matter, when they realise their guilt 14 and the sin they committed becomes known, the assembly must bring a young bull as a sin offering and present it before the tent of meeting. 15 The elders of the community are to lay their hands on the bull’s head before the Lord, and the bull shall be slaughtered before the Lord. 16 Then the anointed priest is to take some of the bull’s blood into the tent of meeting. 17 He shall dip his finger into the blood and sprinkle it before the Lord seven times in front of the curtain. 18 He is to put some of the blood on the horns of the altar that is before the Lord in the tent of meeting. The rest of the blood he shall pour out at the base of the altar of burnt offering at the entrance to the tent of meeting. 19 He shall remove all the fat from it and burn it on the altar, 20 and do with this bull just as he did with the bull for the sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for the community, and they will be forgiven. 21 Then he shall take the bull outside the camp and burn it as he burned the first bull. This is the sin offering for the community. ​

All I am seeing in the passages you've quoted that are relevant to the discussion, is that there are many precautions put in place.

If you still think that the offerings themselves had anything to do with the actual atonement itself, then you may be shocked to learn:

"And now, Israel, what does YHWH your God ask of you but to fear YHWH your God, to walk in obedience to him, to love him, to serve YHWH your God with all your heart and with all your soul, and to observe YHWH’s commands and decrees that I am giving you today for your own good?
To YHWH your God belong the heavens, even the highest heavens, the earth and everything in it. Yet YHWH set his affection on your ancestors and loved them, and he chose you, their descendants, above all the nations—as it is today. Circumcise your hearts, therefore, and do not be stiff-necked any longer.
For YHWH your God is God of gods and Lord of lords, the great God, mighty and awesome, who shows no partiality and accepts no bribes. He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the foreigner residing among you, giving them food and clothing. And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt." (Deuteronomy 10:14-19)

The way that you seem to be framing offerings, is that they were bribes to God. That by killing an animal, God would simply forgive a person of their sins (keeping in mind that the concept of "sin" is a wider concept than the Christian concept). Personally I still don't see the logic in this depiction of God you are presenting.
YHWH is depicted incredibly compassionate in this passage, also emphasizing certain doctrinally important things which help to elucidate elements of salvation in the worldview presented by the Torah.

The verses are many but feel free to read Leviticus chapters 1-7. The first set of verses above concern a guilt offering. Now, care to speculate as to whom Isaiah 53 is talking about here:

Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all. ........
Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied;[e]
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors. ​

But this passage is speaking about the Israelites and the Israelites only.

He said to me, “You are my servant,
Israel, in whom I will display my splendor.”
But I said, “I have labored in vain;
I have spent my strength for nothing at all.
Yet what is due me is in the Lord’s hand,
and my reward is with my God.”
(Isaiah 49:3-4)

Who among you fears the Lord
and obeys the word of his servant?
Let the one who walks in the dark,
who has no light,
trust in the name of the Lord
and rely on their God.
(Isaiah 50)

by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
(Isaiah 53:11)

It would make no sense whatsoever to assert that Isaiah 53 is suddenly speaking of something different when the last few chapters literally have given the context of what it is saying. The Babylonian Exile was around the period this text originated afterall and serves as the pinnacle point of Jewish identity. These passages also outline the strong sense of identity the Israelites had for themselves at the time it was written, enduring through oppression and the rest of the story you should know already.

Have you ever paid for, willingly that is, someone else's crime?

No.

 

[Karlysymon]

The difference in the Torah is that God says to do these rituals in a very puritanical way, in order for God to accept it. Comparing the strict procedures in the book of Leviticus to other culture's animal sacrifices to their deities makes it obvious what it's role really is in the Torah, which is a kind of civilizing of the Israelites.

I'd asked you for verses to corroborate this but i know you won't post them because they don't exist. It was pretty much rhetorical. The real question to ask here is: did God tell the Israelites to carry on with animal sacrifice like the pagans did but in a puritanical way......so it being an after thought or was the puritanical system already present in heaven in some form? Note the details given to Moses regarding the priestly garments in Leviticus.

Exodus 25:8-9
And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.

According to all that I shew thee, after the pattern of the tabernacle, and the pattern of all the instruments thereof, even so shall ye make it.
​

The vision given to Daniel showing this system does exist in heaven (Daniel 8. Note the deliberate use of sanctuary animals ram and goat)

And it grew up to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground, and trampled them. 11 He even exalted himself as high as the Prince of the host; and by him the daily sacrifices were taken away, and the place of His sanctuary was cast down. 12 Because of transgression, an army was given over to the horn to oppose the daily sacrifices; and he cast truth down to the ground. He did all this and prospered.

13 Then I heard a holy one speaking; and another holy one said to that certain one who was speaking, “How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices and the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary and the host to be trampled underfoot?”

14 And he said to me, “For two thousand three hundred days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed."​

Another obvious question here; The sanctuary ritual system here on earth ended. Was the one in heaven abolished too? Afterall, as you said, God only mandated this to the Israelites by taking pagan rituals and purifying them. So basically, it was like an afterthought.

 

[Jackfists]

While it is an interesting thought experiment, I think you underestimate the tendencies towards secularism and irreligion in the world in general. At this point in history it is just not very likely at all that people will buy into anything on the scope you speak of.
Yes, I know that Protestantism (of which it took from medieval Catholicism) believes in the antichrist and concepts as such (of which do capture the creative imagination), I don't think religion can provide the structures needed for what you state.
Religion and Culture worldwide is just too dissimilar and what you state is clearly paired with the concept of a 'one-world-government' which seems closer to worshiping the governments themselves (heavy Stockholm syndrome) rather than collectively following a single religion.

What I think is possible is that leaders of major faiths may come to say that all religions worship the same God, we are all the same, and ultimately believe in the same thing. This will be a very welcome message to all, with these religions focusing on being kind to each other, following golden rules, etc. I agree with you that forcing anyone to follow any ONE religion over another won't work. It never has.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

What I think is possible is that leaders of major faiths may come to say that all religions worship the same God, we are all the same, and ultimately believe in the same thing. This will be a very welcome message to all, with these religions focusing on being kind to each other, following golden rules, etc. I agree with you that forcing anyone to follow any ONE religion over another won't work. It never has.

Intriguingly, the Bible says this is precisely how things will play out. In the end nobody can be forced to believe anything. We have free will, and the present in which to exercise it.

 

[Jackfists]

I had a Personal Real Life Changing Encounter with the Jesus Christ of the Bible. In one day I went from a man that was literally saying almost verbatim the types of things, the same arguments I see you and IL spewing day in and day out, to a man that literally was preaching the Gospel.

That's cool. Do you think maybe talking about your experience and what it did for you, how you changed, might be a more powerful testimony than debating others that don't want to see it? I mean, you said it yourself, most of the people you debate don't really change, do they? Share your experience man.

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

The question never answered in Christian theology, is "why blood"?

I know this is an old thread but i read through it all and i didnt see the following mentioned regarding why blood.

Before the Law in the Torah, and all the mention of atonement sacrifices (which im not going to list verses, but theyve been mentioned throughout the thread), there was the original shedding of blood.

In Genesis 3:21 "unto Adam also and unto his wife did the Lord God make coats of skins, and clothed them"

Adam and Eve had tried to cover their sin/nakedness with fig leaves (Genesis 3:7), but that wasn't good enough. God had to clothe them with animal skins, which required killing the animals. When the serpent had told Eve "Ye shall not surely die" (Gen 3:4), he was lying. But the sacrifice of the animals delayed their deaths, which inevitably occured, although 100s of years later.

Regarding the story of Cain and Abel, its interesting to note that Cain offered first, it was not because he felt obligated to because his brother did it first, as Ive seen some children's bible books teach it.

Cain's offering was not accepted because he offered up "fruit of the ground" (Genesis 4:3), while Abel offered "the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof" (Genesis 4:4) Cain offered up his WORKS while Abel offered up a LAMB. (Genesis 4:2 "Abel was a keeper of sheep, BUT Cain was a tiller of the ground". Also note, the ground had been cursed in Genesis 3:17 "cursed is the ground for thy sake".

It is implied that Cain should have known what kind of offering God wanted "If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted?" (Genesis 4:7)

Im not expecting everyone to agree or anything, just saying something i have not seen mentioned. When I was little I was told that God preferred Abel "just cause" and the perceived unfairness of the situation sent me on the wrong anti-God path for a long time.

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

Accidental duplicate post

 

[A Freeman]

I'd asked you for verses to corroborate this but i know you won't post them because they don't exist. It was pretty much rhetorical. The real question to ask here is: did God tell the Israelites to carry on with animal sacrifice like the pagans did but in a puritanical way......so it being an after thought or was the puritanical system already present in heaven in some form? Note the details given to Moses regarding the priestly garments in Leviticus.

Exodus 25:8-9
And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.

According to all that I shew thee, after the pattern of the tabernacle, and the pattern of all the instruments thereof, even so shall ye make it.
​

The vision given to Daniel showing this system does exist in heaven (Daniel 8. Note the deliberate use of sanctuary animals ram and goat)

And it grew up to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground, and trampled them. 11 He even exalted himself as high as the Prince of the host; and by him the daily sacrifices were taken away, and the place of His sanctuary was cast down. 12 Because of transgression, an army was given over to the horn to oppose the daily sacrifices; and he cast truth down to the ground. He did all this and prospered.

13 Then I heard a holy one speaking; and another holy one said to that certain one who was speaking, “How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices and the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary and the host to be trampled underfoot?”

14 And he said to me, “For two thousand three hundred days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed."​

Another obvious question here; The sanctuary ritual system here on earth ended. Was the one in heaven abolished too? Afterall, as you said, God only mandated this to the Israelites by taking pagan rituals and purifying them. So basically, it was like an afterthought.

The reason that so-called Muslims attack animal sacrifice -- which is clearly written into the ordinances of God's Law and thus is NOT pagan -- is because that's what they're taught by their spiritually blind imams/leaders, etc. in their evil organized religion.

The Koran plainly and repeatedly states that it was sent to CONFIRM what was sent before it in The Law (Torah) and the Gospel. That's why the Koran COMMANDS its readers to read The Law and the Gospel, and even stipulates that the reader should NOT be in doubt of the The True Law (or the True Gospel, which confirms The Law) reaching them, because they -- like all Scripture -- have been guarded against corruption (Sura 15:9-10, Sura 32:23).

So what do "Muslims" do? They choose to believe their false imams (Matt. 23:8-10) rather than God, and falsely claim the true Bible (The Law/Torah and the Gospel) no longer exist, and that blood sacrifice isn't necessary, because they are all supposedly so pious and righteous that they can make it to heaven on their own (Ps. 53:1-3, Rom. 3:10-12), as if they aren't responsible for any of their past sins, and can allegedly continue in their own, numerous pagan and idolatrous practices with impunity.

Do people even consider WHY God included animal sacrifice in the ordinances of The Law?

In an agrarian based society, a man's wealth is in his livestock. The better quality and larger one's herd was, the wealthier that individual was.

Requiring one to sacrifice their very best breeding stock to atone for their sins levied a very expensive penalty for sin, as it not only deprived the owner of that individual animal, but also of all the future stock it would have otherwise bred. This, of course, offered everyone a huge incentive NOT TO SIN/BREAK THE LAW.

Animal sacrifice necessarily is a blood sacrifice, because the life of the flesh is in the blood.

Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the FLESH [is] in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the Altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it [is] the blood [that] maketh an atonement for the soul.

Animal sacrifice foreshadowed self-sacrifice. Self-sacrifice is the discipline/punishment of the human to make atonement for the soul (e.g. through fasting, whether it be food abstinence or something else that is feeding the ego/"self"/flesh). And the ultimate example of self-sacrifice was the crucifixion of Jesus, to pay for our PAST SINS (Rom. 3:25). The sacrifice that we cannot live without.

How would any of us pay for our past sins, even if we lived a perfect (sinless/crime-free) life from this point forward? Shouldn't all of us be striving to be perfect, as our Father in heaven IS perfect (Matt. 5:48)? And how could any of us hope to strive to be perfect, other than by following THE EXAMPLE of discipline and self-sacrifice that we have in Christ (John 14:6, Sura 3:55, Sura 43:57-61)?

Self-sacrifice is a core message throughout Scripture (e.g. see Deut. 30:15-20, Matt. 10:38, Mark 8:34, Luke 9:23, Luke 14:26-27, Gal. 2:20, Sura 6:162, Sura 92:18-21). If the entire world was actually doing this, there would be no more crime/sin, no more division, no more organized religion, no more conflict, no more hatred, no more war, and no more disease ending in death.

Self-sacrifice (self-crucifixion) is the crucifying of the satanically-controlled ego/"self" daily, which serves the flesh and its desires rather than serving God by doing His Will. Self-sacrifice should therefore, just as animal sacrifice did before it, serve as a huge incentive for everyone to stop sinning (committing crimes) and learn to live in harmony with our Creator, and with His Anointed One (Christ) and with each other and with our natural surroundings.

 

[A Freeman]

Yet another reason why organized religion is a barrier between God and man...

Further on the subject of the sacrifice Christ made on our behalf, in the crucifixion of Jesus, there is a mistaken belief in "Islam" based on their mistaken interpretation of the following passage in Ezekiel taught by their mistaken and spiritually blind imams, that no man can atone for the sins of another:

Ezekiel 18:20-22
18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall DIE. The son shall not bear the inequity of the father, neither shall the father bear the inequity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
18:21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all My Statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
18:22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.

Of course, this passage is offered without reference to the rest of the same chapter in Ezekiel, and without bothering to correctly read what these passages actually say. Please see the first reference to this subject at the beginning of chapter 18.

Ezekiel 18:1-19
18:1 The Word of the "I AM" came unto me again, saying,
18:2 What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge?
18:3 [As] I live, saith the Lord "I AM", ye shall not have [occasion] any more to use this proverb in Israel.
18:4 Behold, ALL SOULS ARE MINE; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is Mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall DIE.
18:5 But if a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right,
18:6 [And] hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the "House of Israel", neither hath defiled his neighbour's wife, neither hath come near to a menstruous woman,
18:7 And hath not oppressed any, [but] hath restored to the debtor his pledge, hath spoiled none by violence, hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment;
18:8 He [that] hath not given forth upon usury, neither hath taken any increase, [that] hath withdrawn his hand from inequity, hath executed True Judgment between man and man,
18:9 Hath walked in My Statutes, and hath kept My Judgments, to deal truly; he [is] just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord "I AM".
18:10 If he beget a son [that is] a robber, a shedder of blood, and [that] doeth the like to [any] one of these [things],
18:11 And that doeth not any of those [duties], but even hath eaten upon the mountains, and defiled his neighbour's wife,
18:12 Hath oppressed the poor and needy, hath spoiled by violence, hath not restored the pledge, and hath lifted up his eyes to the idols, hath committed abomination,
18:13 Hath given forth upon usury, and hath taken increase: shall he then live? he shall not live: he hath done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood shall be upon him.
18:14 Now, lo, [if] he beget a son, that seeth all his father's sins which he hath done, and considereth, and doeth not such like,
18:15 [That] hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the "House of Israel", hath not defiled his neighbour's wife,
18:16 Neither hath oppressed any, hath not withholden the pledge, neither hath spoiled by violence, [but] hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment,
18:17 [That] hath taken off his hand from the poor, [that] hath not received usury nor increase, hath executed My Judgments, hath walked in My Statutes; he shall not die for the inequity of his father, he shall surely live.
18:18 [As for] his father, because he cruelly oppressed, spoiled his brother by violence, and did [that] which [is] not good among his people, lo, even he shall die in his inequity.
18:19 Yet say ye, Why? doth not the son bear the inequity of the father? When the son hath done that which is lawful and right, [and] hath kept all My Statutes, and hath done them, he shall surely Live.

The Soul is the Spirit-Being within the human father or the human son. It is absolutely true that no human dad will be held accountable for the sins of any of his human sons on Judgment Day, just as it is absolutely true that no human son will be held accountable for any of the sins of his human dad on Judgment Day. Each individual will be judged according to their works (Matt. 16:27, Rev. 20:12-15); whether they be good or evil (Matt. 7:16-20).

CHRIST -- the IMMORTAL Spirit-Being/Soul incarnated inside of Jesus (John 1:14), that the world could not see (with human eyes -- John 1:10) -- IS NOT THE FATHER OF ANY OF YOUR MEN; NOR IS CHRIST THE SON OF ANY HUMAN.

Christ is, however, the Son of God and God's Messenger to mankind (1 Tim. 2:5), delivering The Word/Truth of God (John 1:1). And it was Jesus, whom Christ incarnated, that was offered as the sacrificial Lamb of God to atone for our PAST SINS, which had earned us all the death penalty under The Law (see Deut. 28:15-68).

So only humans, who cannot distinguish between an immortal soul (spiritual-Being) and a mortal human/flesh, would mistakenly believe the LIE that we can somehow live without the sacrifice that was made on the cross, or without the resurrection that followed it, to prove that there is spiritual life after the death of the human body.

This is why the most important words in all of Scripture are found in John 3:3-7, for without being reborn again as one's true spiritual self, it's impossible to even "see" the Kingdom of heaven, much less enter it.

John 3:3-7
3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born from above, he cannot SEE The Kingdom of God.
3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water (human) and then is born (later) from above as his spirit-"Being" (his REAL self which is NOT human), he can NOT enter into The Kingdom of God (Who is a Spirit-"Being").
3:6 That which is born of the flesh is human; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit (a spirit-"Being") - (a human+Being).
3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.