The Giants/Nephilim in the Bible.

[elsbet]

Btw angels can take the form of humans do you not remember the story of LOT?

Yes...!

And Abraham & Sarah

 

[elsbet]

“Repeat a lie often enough and it becomes the truth” - Joseph Goebbels (Nazi propagandist)

Excellent point.

: )

 

[elsbet]

Btw angels can take the form of humans do you not remember the story of LOT?

And Daniel.


"... stand upright, for I have now been sent to you.” DANIEL 10:11

 

[phipps]

The Bible is the story of redemption of man. It is primarily about the relationship between mankind and mankind’s Creator and Redeemer. Bible history is the history of the godly line – Adam, Seth, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, the Hebrew nation, Jesus Christ, the apostles, and true Christians. So it is logical that a reference to “the sons of God” is a reference to the antediluvian godly line, those few people who were faithful to God and this is supported by the entire Bible on the subject. "But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name" (John 1:12).

Those who don't study the Bible much or are taught by people who teach false doctrine, are prone to believe strange ideas that have no foundation in God's Word such as angels breeding with humans etc. The Bible never suggests such a crazy idea.

As Christians we should study the Bible prayerfully to find out what God is saying to us not to establish what we believe.

 

[phipps]

In the Bible being a giant isn’t always about size. We find many giants recorded in the Bible, but they were giants because of their characters, not their height.

Gideon, David, and Jeroboam are all described as mighty men of valour (Numbers 13:1–33; Judges 6–7; 1 Samuel 16; 1 Kings 11).

Caleb and Joshua, Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Jacob, and Moses were all giants of faith, believing and trusting in God (Numbers 13; Hebrews 11).

Daniel stood tall in the courts of Nebuchadnezzar, Darius, and Cyrus, and Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego stood tall on the plain of Dura.

These giants for God weren’t always perfect, but we will see every one of them in His kingdom. It isn’t the physical size of a man that makes him a giant; it is his spiritual connection to God.

“Let us take hold of the arm of infinite power. Let us walk humbly before God, but let us be giants in meeting discouragement and difficulty. We must have increased faith. Let us praise God. He is our strength, our shield, and our defense, our front guard and our rearward.” Pamphlet 067, 17

 

[phipps]

Sons of God in the Old Testament.

In the Old Testament the phrase “son(s)/children of God” designates three types of persons:

The heavenly beings who met with the Lord in the divine council:

Job 1:6, "Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them."

Job 2:1, "Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the Lord."

At the moment of creation we are told that “the morning stars sang together, And all the sons of God shouted for joy?” (Job 38:7).

The people of God are called “the children of the Lord your God.”

Deuteronomy 14:1, “You are the children of the Lord your God; you shall not cut yourselves nor shave the front of your head for the dead."

Hosea 2:1, "Say to your brethren, ‘My people,’ And to your sisters, ‘Mercy is shown.’ "

Isaiah 45:11, "Thus says the Lord, The Holy One of Israel, and his Maker: “Ask Me of things to come concerning My sons; And concerning the work of My hands, you command Me."

They became God’s children through creation and redemption, "Then you shall say to Pharaoh, ‘Thus says the Lord: “Israel is My son, My firstborn. So I say to you, let My son go that he may serve Me. But if you refuse to let him go, indeed I will kill your son, your firstborn” (Exodus 4:22-23).

Finally, the Israelite king was called the “Son of God.”

2 Samuel 7:14, "I will be his Father, and he shall be My son. If he commits iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men and with the blows of the sons of men."

God appointed the king as “my firstborn”

Psalm 89:27, "Also I will make him My firstborn, The highest of the kings of the earth."

Psalm 2:7, "I will declare the decree: The Lord has said to Me, ‘You are My Son, Today I have begotten You."

In these cases the word “son” is used figuratively. Heavenly beings are sons of God through creation; the people of God are God’s children through creation and redemption; and the king becomes a son of God through his appointment as king. In the Bible God does not have children through natural conception and birth.

 

[phipps]

Can angels become human and do everything that humans can?

The simple answer is no!

We read about angels in the Bible appearing in human form but that does not make them human. They just appear in human form. God has given angels the ability to appear at times, in human form to humans for different reasons, as we are not able to see angels who exist in a spiritual dimension. Angels are spirits, they are not flesh. They are supernatural beings created higher than men and are more powerful than us.

Jesus tells us plainly in Mark 12:25 that angels do not marry and are therefore not sexual beings and as a result they cannot procreate. And yes, I know people can procreate outside of marriage but God only intended for procreation within the confines of marriage. The institution of marriage is uniquely only human. No other creatures of God marry.

Plus humans cannot procreate with another creature of any other kind as I posted here in this very thread. I posted:

When God created all living creatures He created them after their own kind, and only after their own kind. “Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind”; and it was so.” Genesis 1:24, and this obviously includes mankind.

1 Corinthians 15:39-40, “…but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds. There are also celestial bodies and terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.”

So no human being can reproduce with another creature of any other kind:

Celestial: That is of heaven/spiritual world.

Terrestrial: That is of earth.

The bodies of the celestial and the terrestrial are different, and cannot reproduce, as Jesus confirms in Mark 12:25, Matthew 22:30 and Luke 20:35.

Angels cannot procreate because that ability was not created in them. As God's creatures we cannot do anything outside of what God created us to do.

I liken this subject to the trans issue that has been going on and intensifying for years now. We have men who claim they are women and women who claim they are men. And some of them have gone as far as having gender re-assignment surgery.

Now most people in the world know that we cannot change our genders whether we change the way we dress or have gender re-assignment surgery. Men who think they are women for example, cannot give birth because they do not and never will have that ability to do so because God did not create it in them. Well its the same for angels. They cannot do that which God did not create them to do.

So it is impossible that the evil angels married (Genesis says the the sons of God married the daughters of men yet Jesus said angels cannot marry) the daughters of men and sired any children/nephilim with them. This is not a biblical teaching at all.

The sons of God were human beings who married the daughters of men who were also human beings and had giant children. Giants existed before the sons of God married the daughters of men (Genesis 6:4) and existed after the flood too.

 

[phipps]

In the Bible God's people led by the Holy Spirit are called sons of God, "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God" (Romans 8:14). The sons of God (Genesis 6:1-2) were the descendants of Seth who kept the knowledge of God. They saw the daughters of men who were descendants of Cain. The mixed marriages of righteous and unrighteous resulted in corruption and not long after the world was destroyed by a flood because mankind had become very sinful.

 

[M G]

The entire story of the nephalim is here in this book: Enoch.

http://www.bookofenoch.org/ENOCH-McCracken2020.pdf

 

[phipps]

The entire story of the nephalim is here in this book: Enoch.

http://www.bookofenoch.org/ENOCH-McCracken2020.pdf

The book of Enoch is not biblical. It is not inspired by God and does not harmonise with the Bible. I explain why here, here and here in this very thread.

I will repost what I posted in the top post on this page:

"Those who don't study the Bible much or are taught by people who teach false doctrine, are prone to believe strange ideas that have no foundation in God's Word such as angels breeding with humans etc. The Bible never suggests such a crazy idea."

Plus everything else I've said in this thread.

 

[phipps]

John 1:12, "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name."

Romans 8:14, "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God."

Philippians 2:15, "That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world."

Are fallen angels 'led by the Spirit of God'? Have fallen angels 'received Jesus Christ'? Are fallen angels 'blameless and harmless'? No, they are NONE of these. So the sons of God in Genesis 6 cannot be fallen angels.

Fallen angels are not led by the Spirit of God, they are led by the spirit of Satan. And once you understand this clear truth, you will see that the sons of God in Genesis 6 CANNOT be fallen angels.

Genesis 6 refers to the children of Seth/sons of God who were led by the Spirit of God, who had received Christ and who were harmless and blameless, BUT they strayed from the truth and fornicated with the children of Cain/daughters of men.

Biblically the sons of God/children of God are holy beings, either unfallen or repentant, not wicked ones.

 

[phipps]

The book of Enoch is useful for one thing--understanding other religions' fables and errors.

The book of Enoch is dangerous, because it will lead our understanding away from the pure word of God, and corrupt it with "vain conversation received by tradition from the fathers" (1 Peter 1:18).

Christ payed a high price to redeem us from these vain traditions.

 

[elsbet's cat ^. .^]

The sons of God (Genesis 6:1-2) were the descendants of Seth who kept the knowledge of God. They saw the daughters of men who were descendants of Cain. The mixed marriages of righteous and unrighteous resulted in corruption and not long after the world was destroyed by a flood because mankind had become very sinful.

The sons of God were human beings who married the daughters of men who were also human beings and had giant children. Giants existed before the sons of God married the daughters of men (Genesis 6:4) and existed after the flood too.

Source?

I crossed out what you added to Gen. 6:1-2, 4.
* better read in context-- v. 4 is misunderstood grammatical tense.

Daughters of Cain, Sons of Seth
False Doctrine
The Roman church introduced this false doctrine before the Middle Ages. Seth isn't even mentioned in Genesis Six-- the term Daughters of Cain doesn't exist.
Nephilim RCC; Africanus, Eusebius RCC

False Doctrine|Sethite Theory

Despite the lack of biblical evidence, this fictional belief is still taught in seminaries. The biblical reality of certain Supernatural events is considered 'woo-woo' territory (professional su*cide?).

Spoiler: False Doctrine

Julius Africanus resorted to the Sethite interpretation as a more comfortable ground ... Augustine also embraced the Sethite theory and thus it prevailed into the Middle Ages. It is still widely taught today among many churches who find the literal "angel" view a bit disturbing. False Doctrine

Jesus tells us plainly in Mark 12:25 that angels do not marry and are therefore not sexual beings and as a result they cannot procreate.

Source?

I crossed out what you added to Mark 12:25, too. :/

Jesus said dead people do not marry when they rise from the grave-- instead, they will be like the angels in heaven. Mark 12:25, Luke 20:34-36

Marriage is a Legal Contract.
It's binding only on earth, and it carries a lot more weight than recreational sex (which isn't mentioned, either). -.-

Spoiler

MARK 12
The Saducees asked whether a widow belonged to her first husband in heaven, or the man she married after he died. Obviously, neither can lay claim to her. Women are released from a marriage contract upon the husband's death, according to the law.

Knowledge of the Marriage contract's terms is necessary for a proper understanding of biblical Salvation -> big picture... but I don't want to derail.

It all goes back to Genesis.
God said to the Serpent:

'And I will put enmity between you​

and the woman, and between your​

seed and her seed.​

He will crush your head, and you will​

strike his heel.' GENESIS 3:15​

____________

I see no reason to belabor the point since you're reading from the 'Great Controversy,' rather than the Bible. Unless you would like to compare Ellen White's messages to the Bible...? Or refer to the biblical text exclusively? Either would work.

. . .

 

[phipps]

John 17:17, "Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth."

 

[Maldarker]

The book of Enoch is useful for one thing--understanding other religions' fables and errors.

The book of Enoch is dangerous, because it will lead our understanding away from the pure word of God, and corrupt it with "vain conversation received by tradition from the fathers" (1 Peter 1:18).

Christ payed a high price to redeem us from these vain traditions.

Wrong verse doesn't even mention book of Enoch - BTW the Jude quotes from it directly so he's in error?
BTW the verse you quoted from Peter has to do with temple sacrifice and the traditions of such. Say that CHRIST is the redemption a perfect lamb without blemish

 

[phipps]

Wrong verse doesn't even mention book of Enoch - BTW the Jude quotes from it directly so he's in error?
BTW the verse you quoted from Peter has to do with temple sacrifice and the traditions of such. Say that CHRIST is the redemption a perfect lamb without blemish

I'll edit the post and post the right verse. But you understood the gist of what I posted.

With the information I have posted here about angels and how its impossible they sired offspring with human beings, with the information I've given about the giants, the falsity of the book of Enoch etc., do you actually think one verse in the book of Jude is going to be incompatible with the entire word of God? You know that is not true. Remember the whole Bible harmonises and that's one of the reasons we know the book of Enoch is false.

I did post about Jude 6 in this very thread here. And it harmonises with Bible doctrine.

Edit: Actually its the right verse but KJV wording. I linked the the NKJV version. I'll change it to the KJV.

 

[Maldarker]

It does other verses also point to it:

1. Jesus referred to The Book of Enoch; “Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.” (Mat 5:5) pulled from “The elect shall possess light, joy and peace, and they shall inherit the earth. (Enoch 5:7 {6:9})”
2. "Woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. (Luke 6:24) Woe to you who are rich, for in your riches have you trusted; but from your riches you shall be removed. (Enoch 94:8 {93:7}).
3. “Ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Mat. 19:28) I will place each of them on a throne of glory (Enoch 108:12 {105:26})
4. “Between us and you there is a great gulf fixed. (Luke 16:26) by a chasm ... [are] their souls are separated (Enoch 22: 9,11{22:10,12})
5. “That ye may be called the children of light (John 12:36) the good from the generation of light (Enoch 108:11 {105: 25})
6. One direct quote in the New Testament is by Jude, a brother of Jesus Christ: Jude 1:14-15, quoting Enoch 1:9 …

"And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints to execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches, which ungodly sinners have spoken against him."

 

[phipps]

It does other verses also point to it:

1. Jesus referred to The Book of Enoch; “Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.” (Mat 5:5) pulled from “The elect shall possess light, joy and peace, and they shall inherit the earth. (Enoch 5:7 {6:9})”
2. "Woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. (Luke 6:24) Woe to you who are rich, for in your riches have you trusted; but from your riches you shall be removed. (Enoch 94:8 {93:7}).
3. “Ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Mat. 19:28) I will place each of them on a throne of glory (Enoch 108:12 {105:26})
4. “Between us and you there is a great gulf fixed. (Luke 16:26) by a chasm ... [are] their souls are separated (Enoch 22: 9,11{22:10,12})
5. “That ye may be called the children of light (John 12:36) the good from the generation of light (Enoch 108:11 {105: 25})
6. One direct quote in the New Testament is by Jude, a brother of Jesus Christ: Jude 1:14-15, quoting Enoch 1:9 …

"And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints to execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches, which ungodly sinners have spoken against him."

Wrong and not biblical at all I'm afraid.

I refer you to my posts here and here about the false doctrine in the book of the Enoch. If it had only one lie in it that would be one lie too many and still be wrong and not in harmony with the Bible, but the book of Enoch is choke full of falsities that its surprises me any Christian can say its God's Word and truth. Its a false book and its no coincidence its not in the Bible. That's the truth of God.

 

[phipps]

 

[elsbet's cat ^. .^]

Wrong and not biblical at all I'm afraid.

I refer you to my posts here and here about the false doctrine in the book of the Enoch. If it had only one lie in it that would be one lie too many and still be wrong and not in harmony with the Bible, but the book of Enoch is choke full of falsities that its surprises me any Christian can say its God's Word and truth. Its a false book and its no coincidence its not in the Bible. That's the truth of God.

Again.
You can't claim the moral high ground here.

The false doctrine of the Great Controversy isn't biblical, either. You post its doctrine daily + cite Bible verses instead of Ellen White (who wrote as dictated by her attending Angels).

I'm not saying your beliefs are wrong (though I vehemently disagree with White’s doctrine); but your evangelization efforts are intentionally deceptive.

The GC is the primary, authoritative source in 7th Day Adventism, as well as its biggest secret.
. . .