Differences between the Bible and Islam

[Haich]

A few things
- turning the other cheek is the ideal. Do we meet the ideal? Mostly no.
Some of us may have glimpsed for a moment "the kingdom of heaven" when, having been in a situation which would have resulted in retaliation, the choice to turn the other cheek was taken. It is an indescribable, but fleeting, feeling.
However, this is a choice, not something under duress. Not giving over our coat out of fear for our life, but out of pure love. No coercion whatsoever.

But like i said in my previous reply, even amongst other Christians this is a difficult subject. So, given the limitations of online writer language, i don't expect what i said to make sense...

- people in the Bible belt, or anywhere for that matter, are not an example of what the Bible says. Some of these states are also the most uncharitable towards their neighbors, for example. There is a stong calvinistic undercurrent, that those who are less fortunate are somehow hated by God and their poverty is somehow proof of this, it's messed up . The issue is complex, but ultimately judging the Bible by what people (who are often not going by the Bible, but by what their pastors say) do is unfair.

- as for why teach something if no one follows it, the Bible is full of teachings that people ignore. People steal, murder, commit adultery and other forms of immorality, etc. Just because people are wiked does not mean the Bible is wrong for calling out sin and teaching a different way.


In Christianity, a martyr is a person who has been killed for professing their faith in Jesus Christ, or for refusing to renounce Him. The word "martyr" does not refer to every murdered Christian, but Christians which are killed specifically because of their faith.

Christians have been martyred since during biblical times. This has continued thoughout the history of Christianity

The Bible tells us that during the endtimes many will be martyred

Revelation 6
9And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled



Ch 13 of the book of Revelation, the chapter that discusses the mark of the beast, has this to say.

7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9If any man have an ear, let him hear. 10He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints

If you as a Christian don’t turn the other cheek, are you committing a sin?
I’m sorry what are you talking about when you say seeing a ‘glimpse of the kingdom’? Are you saying you have a vision before thinking of sinning to deter you from the sin?

I didn’t say Christians on the Bible Belt are examples of what the Bible says. I’m pointing to the fact that you have stated turning the other cheek is the ideal, yet so many American Christians have guns and defend themselves. Doesn’t it occur to you that the standard the Bible wants you to live by (in terms of turning the other cheek) is such an unrealistic and unattainable standard that hardly anybody practises it?

It’s like when you’re given a worldly issue or problem, you have no problem reacting to it in a natural manner, for example if your home or property or family (God Forbid) were under attack, you know full well you would defend yourself instinctively. But the Bible preaches otherwise and you’re defending it without actually pondering on whether it’s possible to turn a blind eye to everyday threats?

 

[Haich]

Yes, ive read some of the chapters while researching for this thread, so that's why my question came up in the first place...

As an american i had genuinely never heard of this "royal we" thing. I find it quite bizarre to say the least, but yeah, apparently it's a thing.

As for he Bible verses in which God says "us", Christians say that is a proof of the existence of Jesus back when God was creating mankind

I guess American English is pretty different to British English. I mean anyone who has studied Shakespeare at a basic level will be familiar with the us of the majestic ‘we’. Maybe it’s more of a British thing? We learn it in secondary school so it’s not weird here.

Well the Bible was revealed in a Semitic language so I don’t think seeing majestic plurals in your copy today is odd. I’d argue they’re also majestic plurals which don’t refer to the common use of plural nouns. Hence, your reading of Jesus being present when God was making man kind isn’t a strong reading of that verse you’re referring to.

If he was supposedly present when god was creating mankind, what was his role? How did he look like as he certainly wasn’t human was he?

 

[Daze]

I guess American English is pretty different to British English. I mean anyone who has studied Shakespeare at a basic level will be familiar with the us of the majestic ‘we’. Maybe it’s more of a British thing? We learn it in secondary school so it’s not weird here.

Well the Bible was revealed in a Semitic language so I don’t think seeing majestic plurals in your copy today is odd. I’d argue they’re also majestic plurals which don’t refer to the common use of plural nouns. Hence, your reading of Jesus being present when God was making man kind isn’t a strong reading of that verse you’re referring to.

If he was supposedly present when god was creating mankind, what was his role? How did he look like as he certainly wasn’t human was he?

The "royal we" is not foreign here. I can't say it's commonly used in DC. But we've all heard such things from the Queen of England.

Perhaps Toxic was unaware of it, but it's just another thing to attack, it seems.

 

[phipps]

 

[Haich]

Yes what an insightful Christian man you take your knowledge off.

 

[Orwell's mentor]

Oh no! Not the guy who's been diagnosed with antisocial behaviour, David Wood. Apologies for budding in, but I don't even know him and know he's not a good person.

Please continue...

 

[Haich]

Honestly, as soon as you post people like David Woods who has made a career out of slandering Islam, you’ve lost any credible attempt to engage in dialogue.

 

[phipps]

 

[Haich]

(Sighs) Phipps, I’ve read somewhere on these boards that you live in Africa so maybe you’re unaware of the multiple times (some debates date 4 years ago) that western Muslims have engaged and debunked David Woods. Here are 3 that I’ve watched in the past, I’m sure there’s more if you search it on YouTube.

Disclaimer: I do not consider any of these men scholars, they’re knowledgable men who have a good command of Arabic and are either academically or theologically educated in the realms of both bible and Quran.

 

[phipps]

 

[90sWereBetter]

I just can’t forgive the fact you guys call biscuits bread. Biscuits and gravy? If you said that here people would look at you crazy.

yes this is another problem with the British speakers. yes, of course biscuit dunkers are barbarians. what kind of madman would dunk their beautiful bread biscuit in milk??????

to be fair I have never been to Europe in my life so I can't really grasp what it's like to live there. I respect other cultures in general but... Europe I don't look well upon. to my knowledge they are a bunch of atheists. I can be tolerant of Christians, Buddhists... but atheists is too far for me.

 

[90sWereBetter]

u people just believe whatever stuff from ex-Muslims... "the Mooslems are doing taqiyyah!" "they worship a moon God!"

"look! the guy who made this anti-Islam video is Arab! therefore it's definitely true!" it's all a load of what in British is called "rubbish"

 

[Haich]

Not the ‘apostate prophet’ guy! Haha! Phipps you really have shown your colours this evening. I shall not be engaging further with your bait tactics.

 

[Haich]

yes this is another problem with the British speakers. yes, of course biscuit dunkers are barbarians. what kind of madman would dunk their beautiful bread biscuit in milk??????

to be fair I have never been to Europe in my life so I can't really grasp what it's like to live there. I respect other cultures in general but... Europe I don't look well upon. to my knowledge they are a bunch of atheists. I can be tolerant of Christians, Buddhists... but atheists is too far for me.

Haha yeah biscuits are cookies and sweet baked goods here so there’s definitely a lot of dunking.

Yes atheism is big here, I think for Brits they’re generally tolerant in comparison to let’s say the French. The biggest thing you’re missing out in Europe is the food. I’ve had American products before and I just don’t understand why everything is so processed! American chocolate is horrendous, I think that’s one taste I can never forget. Putrid would be a good wood to describe it.

 

[Haich]

Like we have mosques everywhere, we can practise freely so the atheism aspect isn’t too bad. I guess the issue would be those raising kids here as schools are pretty secular. You’d have to do a lot of groundwork ensuring your kids are clued up on Islam so they won’t be so easily duped or swayed by the endless philosophical questions they explore in schools.

 

[Daze]

Honestly, as soon as you post people like David Woods who has made a career out of slandering Islam, you’ve lost any credible attempt to engage in dialogue.

Bingo.

Then he goes on to source Apostate prophet.

If that isn't a concede to defeat, then idk what is.

 

[phipps]

u people just believe whatever stuff from ex-Muslims... "the Mooslems are doing taqiyyah!" "they worship a moon God!"

"look! the guy who made this anti-Islam video is Arab! therefore it's definitely true!" it's all a load of what in British is called "rubbish"

I don't just believe whatever ex Muslims say. It has to go hand in hand with biblical teaching plus they are showing actual passages from the Quran and Hadiths. If you don't agree with what is being stated in the videos, please feel free to prove them wrong.

 

[Daze]

I don't just believe whatever ex Muslims say. It has to go hand in hand with biblical teaching plus they are showing actual passages from the Quran and Hadiths. If you don't agree with what is being stated in the videos, please feel free to prove them wrong.

There's a lot of fake hadith out there. Also its easy to twist the Quran to push an agenda.

When you source the "kkk" to explain Islam you remove your own credibility.

Wood, HammerTime, tired to kill his own dad with a hammer.

While Apus champions incest.

You're really scraping the barrel with those sources.

 

[Flarepath]

Who are the British to tell people to speak English properly? You ask them for fish and chips and they bring you french fries or something.

I take it you're a Yank mate, you should be glad we Brits went over there..

GREAT MOMENTS IN HISTORY: THE PILGRIMS LAND IN THE NEW WORLD !
"Thank God that voyage is over, I was puking my guts up right across the friggin Atlantic: okay everybody break out the guns and let's go bust Hiawatha's ass, we'll be running the place inside a week if he's the best they've got around here"

 

[Flarepath]

Are you suggesting that Africans are dogs and swine? You have said derogatory things about Africans before as Tidal too. Do you think its okay to speak about anyone like that African or not especially as a Christian?
And you've misquoted scripture to mean something that it doesn't.

Mate, I think it's about time you told us what cult you belong to, (JW, Mormon, Catholic, Amish, wimpy lukewarm Snowflake or what?)
Me, I'm non-denom because I don't need any oddball cult to do my thinking for me.
As for Africans, the christian ones are fine, but sadly most are just heathens like all non-christians, you'd better argue it out with God and Jesus if you don't believe them..
"dogs, pigs. " (Matt 7:6)
"weeds" (Matt 13:38 )
"brute beasts," (2 Peter 2:12)
"heathens" (Jeremiah10:2)
"fools" (Psalm 94:8 )
"liars" (1 John 2:22/23)
"defiled, impure'" (Titus 1:15)
"filthy" (Revelation 22:11)