Differences between the Bible and Islam

[Zakat]

In the Bible God's people including Jesus (God Himself)

He cannot be God Himself when he was but a speck in the womb of Mary.

 

[Zakat]

not what people have made Him out to be.

Qur'an Surah 3, The family of Imrān, Verse 154

After sorrow, He caused calm to descend upon you, a sleep that overtook some of you.

Another group, caring only for themselves, entertained false thoughts about God, thoughts more appropriate to pagan ignorance, and said, ‘Do we get a say in any of this?’

[Prophet], tell them, ‘Everything to do with this affair is in God’s hands.’ They conceal in their hearts things they will not reveal to you.

They say, ‘If we had had our say in this, none of us would have been killed here.’

Tell them, ‘Even if you had resolved to stay at home, those who were destined to be killed would still have gone out to meet their deaths.’

God did this in order to test everything within you and in order to prove what is in your hearts.

God knows your innermost thoughts very well.

 

[Zakat]

Differences between the Bible and Islam

Why not compare Scripture against Scripture instead?

How would it be if I were to, say,

Differences between the Qur'an and Christianity?

 

[phipps]

He cannot be God Himself when he was but a speck in the womb of Mary.

I disagree. Jesus is God.

 

[Zakat]

I disagree. Jesus is God.

How can he be when he was conceived?

 

[phipps]

Qur'an Surah 3, The family of Imrān, Verse 154

After sorrow, He caused calm to descend upon you, a sleep that overtook some of you.

Another group, caring only for themselves, entertained false thoughts about God, thoughts more appropriate to pagan ignorance, and said, ‘Do we get a say in any of this?’

[Prophet], tell them, ‘Everything to do with this affair is in God’s hands.’ They conceal in their hearts things they will not reveal to you.

They say, ‘If we had had our say in this, none of us would have been killed here.’

Tell them, ‘Even if you had resolved to stay at home, those who were destined to be killed would still have gone out to meet their deaths.’

God did this in order to test everything within you and in order to prove what is in your hearts.

God knows your innermost thoughts very well.

I don't understand these verses.

 

[Zakat]

I disagree. Jesus is God.

How can he be when he was conceived?

 

[phipps]

Differences between the Bible and Islam

Why not compare Scripture against Scripture instead?

How would it be if I were to, say,

Differences between the Qur'an and Christianity?

Christians compare scripture with scripture. Remember the Bible is a huge book and it doesn't talk about one subject in one place. Christians should not build a whole theology upon one single statement of the Bible.

1 Corinthians 2:13, "These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual."

 

[Zakat]

I don't understand these verses.

It is okay. God Willing, understanding will come in due time with good intentions and sincerity. I advise,

“Take on only as much as you can do of good deeds, for the best of deeds is that which is done consistently, even if it is little.”

– Sunan Ibn Majah 4240

 

[phipps]

How can he be when he was conceived?

Because God can do anything including be conceived, live as a man (denying His godly abilities) and then return to heaven and be God without limiting Himself again. There is nothing God cannot do especially when its about saving His people.

We as mere humans should not limit God's abilities by our human thoughts and ways. The Bible tells us, "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts" (Isaiah 55:8-9).

 

[phipps]

It is okay. God Willing, understanding will come in due time with good intentions and sincerity. I advise,

“Take on only as much as you can do of good deeds, for the best of deeds is that which is done consistently, even if it is little.”

– Sunan Ibn Majah 4240

Why not explain what the verses mean and how they are connected to defending God and our faith?

 

[Haich]

Phipps made a point about how God can do anything including be conceived. Do you not hear yourself? You’re saying God allowed himself/his son to be conceived?

This chapter is something we learn as kids to help us understand the nature of God and what is befitting for him to do. The question isn’t of capability, you aren’t limiting God in our eyes by saying he wasn’t born/conceived. He says himself that he is nothing like his creation. So it’s impossible for him to do or emulate human characteristics.

I just don’t see how you can believe God was conceived but also a son of himself?? It really requires a lot of blind faith because it’s just not something you can explain.

 

[Haich]

It seems that Christians have humanised God by accepting Jesus is the son but also God at the same time. This is not a concept that was originally proposed prior to Jesus. You guys break the tradition of monotheism by doing this. Moses, Noah, David etc none of these prophets believed in what you claim to be truth. Muslims accept the one true God in his entirety and like the chapter above states, God is above and beyond what we can perceive. He is not human and was never born.

 

[Haich]

That's interesting, i wonder if the issue is one of semantics? As in, humans (including prophets) make errors or misjudgments (sometimes catastrophically so) because our our human nature, which in Christianity would be our sinful nature.

For example, in the biblical story of Jonah, it is true that he was disobedient, but as i pointed out, some good came out of it: he converted the men on the ship from paganism to the one true God.
Then he realized his error and went where God had told him, where he had great success in getting them to repent. It makes me wonder if he had been succesful had he gone there directly...perhaps his firsthand experience had made him even more faithful?

Regardless, the notion of disobeying God and repenting comes up in the New Testament, in one of Jesus' parables

Matt 21
28But what think ye? A certain man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to day in my vineyard. 29He answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented, and went. 30And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not. 31Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They say unto him, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you. 32For John came unto you in the way of righteousness, and ye believed him not: but the publicans and the harlots believed him: and ye, when ye had seen it, repented not afterward, that ye might believe him

For me it’s not semantics it’s just that God chose them for a purpose so they were clearly fit for that job. So it doesn’t make sense for them to do crazy sins like those depicted in the Bible. It’s not the prophets I’m defending, it’s God’s choice of making those men prophets. There are multiple prophets you’ve mentioned in the Bible that do wicked things so are you telling God kept allowing them to do that and he didn’t think to choose better people? Just paints him to be quite dim and limited in terms of thinking.

So with Jonah I think the only difference between the two stories is I don’t accept he was intentionally disobedient. I think he gave up when his people wouldn’t listen and he sought people who would listen. Of course God had other plans for him but I reckon it’s a learning experience for us. The same way his people were on the verge of believing in God and accepting his message, when we represent our faith, there could be people on the verge of also accepting. So personally I try and be patient with others.

 

[Haich]

Another way of understanding the Islamic approach to God and what is befitting for him to do is this:

We are adults. We are capable of pretty much anything children can do. We can crawl, scribble on the walls, break things and jump off the sofa or bed. Do we do these things? No. Because as adults it’s not befitting for us to do things which we have come to learn with age aren’t appropriate. God can do anything He sees fit but he tells us due to his choice and his nature which is befitting for him, he is above his creation and doesn’t reduce himself to humane standards and characteristics.

If I started jumping on the bed and crawling everywhere like a kid, it would nullify my position as a functioning, sane adult. Same way, God has a grandeur and a set of attributes which make him God. Being like his creation would nullify that. That’s how we see it anyway.

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

Differences between the Bible and Islam

Why not compare Scripture against Scripture instead?

How would it be if I were to, say,

Differences between the Qur'an and Christianity?

Because if i were to have said "Christianity" it would have turned into "comparing catholicism to Islam" and im not gonna defend catholicism, as much of it is unbiblical.

Bible-believing Christianity is the only kind of Chrisitanity i am defending. Not the results of church councils which were often political in nature.

If anyone wants to compare the Bible to the Quran alone they are free to do so.

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

He says himself that he is nothing like his creation. So it’s impossible for him to do or emulate human characteristics.

It seems that Christians have humanised God by accepting Jesus is the son but also God at the same time. This is not a concept that was originally proposed prior to Jesus. You guys break the tradition of monotheism by doing this. Moses, Noah, David etc none of these prophets believed in what you claim to be truth.

In the Old Testament, God appears (in human form) to Abraham accompanied by 2 angels. Abraham has dinner with them.

Genesis 18
And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; 2And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground, 3And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant: 4Let a little water, I pray you, be fetched, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree: 5And I will fetch a morsel of bread, and comfort ye your hearts; after that ye shall pass on: for therefore are ye come to your servant. And they said, So do, as thou hast said.

6And Abraham hastened into the tent unto Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly three measures of fine meal, knead it, and make cakes upon the hearth. 7And Abraham ran unto the herd, and fetcht a calf tender and good, and gave it unto a young man; and he hasted to dress it. 8And he took butter, and milk, and the calf which he had dressed, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree, and they did eat


Im aware that Muslims will claim that this must have been edited into the Bible or something. But it is in the Hebrew scriptures.


Throughout the Old Testament there is mention of "the angel of the Lord".

Who is the angel of the Lord? | GotQuestions.org

Who is the angel of the Lord? Was the angel of the Lord a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ?

www.gotquestions.org

The precise identity of the “angel of the Lord” is not given in the Bible. However, there are many important “clues” to his identity. There are Old and New Testament references to “angels of the Lord,” “an angel of the Lord,” and “the angel of the Lord.” It seems when the definite article “the” is used, it is specifying a unique being, separate from the other angels.
Therefore, it is clear that in at least some instances, the angel of the Lord is a theophany, an appearance of God in physical form.
...

It is possible that appearances of the angel of the Lord were manifestations of Jesus before His incarnation. Jesus declared Himself to be existent “before Abraham” (John 8:58), so it is logical that He would be active and manifest in the world. Whatever the case, whether the angel of the Lord was a pre-incarnate appearance of Christ (Christophany) or an appearance of God the Father (theophany), it is highly likely that the phrase “the angel of the Lord” usually identifies a physical appearance of God

I don't remember where i read it, but i remember reading that in the Old Testament it was accepted that God would also take on human form but when the Israelites denied Jesus being the son of God it involved renouncing their previous beliefs. If i happen across this again i will post it.

 

[Haich]

In the Old Testament, God appears (in human form) to Abraham accompanied by 2 angels. Abraham has dinner with them.

Genesis 18
And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; 2And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground, 3And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant: 4Let a little water, I pray you, be fetched, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree: 5And I will fetch a morsel of bread, and comfort ye your hearts; after that ye shall pass on: for therefore are ye come to your servant. And they said, So do, as thou hast said.

6And Abraham hastened into the tent unto Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly three measures of fine meal, knead it, and make cakes upon the hearth. 7And Abraham ran unto the herd, and fetcht a calf tender and good, and gave it unto a young man; and he hasted to dress it. 8And he took butter, and milk, and the calf which he had dressed, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree, and they did eat


Im aware that Muslims will claim that this must have been edited into the Bible or something. But it is in the Hebrew scriptures.


Throughout the Old Testament there is mention of "the angel of the Lord".

Who is the angel of the Lord? | GotQuestions.org

Who is the angel of the Lord? Was the angel of the Lord a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ?

www.gotquestions.org

I don't remember where i read it, but i remember reading that in the Old Testament it was accepted that God would also take on human form but when the Israelites denied Jesus being the son of God it involved renouncing their previous beliefs. If i happen across this again i will post it.

The link you posted states the identity of the angel of the lord is unknown and it’s not mentioned in the New Testament.

From the verse you posted, I don’t see anything that indicates God took a human form.

 

[Haich]

Im aware that Muslims will claim that this must have been edited into the Bible or something. But it is in the Hebrew scriptures.

I mean you’ve said yourself that The Bible is a series of accounts of men. That right there is the problem, they could’ve said and written anything.

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

The link you posted states the identity of the angel of the lord is unknown and it’s not mentioned in the New Testament.

From the verse you posted, I don’t see anything that indicates God took a human form.

I'll post the entire article. It mentions how the "angel of the Lord" stopped appearing once Jesus Christ was born.

Who is the angel of the Lord? | GotQuestions.org

Who is the angel of the Lord? Was the angel of the Lord a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ?

www.gotquestions.org

The precise identity of the “angel of the Lord” is not given in the Bible. However, there are many important “clues” to his identity. There are Old and New Testament references to “angels of the Lord,” “an angel of the Lord,” and “the angel of the Lord.” It seems when the definite article “the” is used, it is specifying a unique being, separate from the other angels. The angel of the Lord speaks as God, identifies Himself with God, and exercises the responsibilities of God (Genesis 16:7-12; 21:17-18; 22:11-18; Exodus 3:2; Judges 2:1-4; 5:23; 6:11-24; 13:3-22; 2 Samuel 24:16; Zechariah 1:12; 3:1; 12:8). In several of these appearances, those who saw the angel of the Lord feared for their lives because they had “seen the Lord.” Therefore, it is clear that in at least some instances, the angel of the Lord is a theophany, an appearance of God in physical form.

The appearances of the angel of the Lord cease after the incarnation of Christ. Angels are mentioned numerous times in the New Testament, but “the angel of the Lord” is never mentioned in the New Testament after the birth of Christ. One possible difficulty is that the angel who appears to Joseph in a dream in Matthew 1:24 is called "the" angel of the Lord. However, this angel is clearly the same one appearing in verse 20, which calls him "an angel." Matthew is simply referencing the same angel he had just mentioned. There is also some confusion regarding Matthew 28:2, where the KJV says “the angel of the Lord” descended from heaven and rolled the stone away from Jesus’ tomb. It is important to note that the original Greek has no article in front of angel; it could be “the angel” or “an angel,” but the article must be supplied by the translators. Other translations besides the KJV say it was “an angel,” which is the better wording.

It is possible that appearances of the angel of the Lord were manifestations of Jesus before His incarnation. Jesus declared Himself to be existent “before Abraham” (John 8:58), so it is logical that He would be active and manifest in the world. Whatever the case, whether the angel of the Lord was a pre-incarnate appearance of Christ (Christophany) or an appearance of God the Father (theophany), it is highly likely that the phrase “the angel of the Lord” usually identifies a physical appearance of God.

In the verses i posted (Genesis 18:1-8) it talks about how the Lord appeared to him.

The Hebrew in vs 18:1 for "Lord" is "Yahweh", so it is unmistakably referring to God, not an angel or anything else.