Prophetic Expectations

[Red Sky at Morning]

@Serveto - it's a very interesting question (I like the way you think) and one I have considered - are there some prophecies that people will try to 'force' like ISIS tried to with Dabiq?

It makes me wonder though - however appealing it might be to Jewish groups - would they really look to engineer a scenario where many of their regional neighbours were in alliance against them just so they could have the warm glow of satisfaction that prophecy was being fulfilled ;-)

 

[Serveto]

@Serveto - it's a very interesting question (I like the way you think) ...

Thank you, bro, and likewise.

It makes me wonder though - however appealing it might be to Jewish groups - would they really look to engineer a scenario where many of their regional neighbours were in alliance against them just so they could have the warm glow of satisfaction that prophecy was being fulfilled ;-)

I understand. However, as I see it, that might not be their sole motive. An alternative scenario could be that a powerful group of Illuminoids (clearly not all Jews, if it need be said), including, to further your example, those who birthed and fund AQ/ISIS and its ideological derivatives, are in essence replicating or trying to imitate the prophecies and are effectively passing the result off as counterfeit currency in the "marketplace of ideas." Throughout scripture, we are warned: "Take heed, that no man deceive you." The levels of deception conceivably run deep and the warning, in this case, I take seriously.

With that said, have you given much thought to whom, or to what group, "Edom" refers in the above-referenced Psalm? I ask because, at one point, I checked the rabbinic commentaries in the (Orthodox Jewish) Artscroll series on the Ezekiel 38 war and, though it's been a long time ago now and I might not be remembering exactly, there it was said that Edom represents Rome, and thus "Christians." I cannot remember if they specify the Vatican, the seat of Roman Christianity, but Christians generally were implicated, and I think it was even said that they would secretly organize the thing.

Relatedly, the late Barry Chamish, an interesting, controversial Israeli conspiracy theorist, continuing some of the theories of Rabbi Marvin Antelman before him, argued that the RT/CFR, everybody's favorite conspiracy football, were and are a Vatican-controlled and instituted organization. If and only if that is so, there are implications concerning ultimate plans in the region.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

Maybe this video will back up your suspicions...

Enjoy the rabbit hole!

 

[AspiringSoul]

Isaiah 17 and surrounding chapters are relevant to the period Prophet Isaiah AS lived in ie they've all been fulfilled long ago.
In isaiah 17 it doesn't say Damascus would be permanently destroyed. There are many prophecies about jerusalem being destroyed, yet it's still here. Cities rise and fall.

Example
Isaiah 13...it reads almost as if it's talking about the end of the world.
9 Behold, the day of the Lord comes,
cruel, with wrath and fierce anger,
to make the land a desolation
and to destroy its sinners from it.
10 For the stars of the heavens and their constellations
will not give their light;
the sun will be dark at its rising,
and the moon will not shed its light.
11 I will punish the world for its evil,
and the wicked for their iniquity;
I will put an end to the pomp of the arrogant,


YET
Behold, I am stirring up the Medes against them,
who have no regard for silver
and do not delight in gold.
18 Their bows will slaughterd]">[d] the young men;
they will have no mercy on the fruit of the womb;
their eyes will not pity children.
19 And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms,
the splendor and pomp of the Chaldeans,
will be like Sodom and Gomorrah

this obv wasn't an end times prophecy but a prophecy that was eventually fulfilled whilst the jews were in captivity, so not long after Isaiah.


Isaiah 14
An Oracle Concerning Assyria
An Oracle Concerning Philistia
Isaiah 15
An Oracle Concerning Moab
Isaiah 17
An Oracle Concerning Damascus
Isaiah 18
An Oracle Concerning Cush
Isaiah 19
An Oracle Concerning Egypt
Isaiah 21
The oracle concerning the wilderness of the sea
The oracle concerning Dumah
The oracle concerning Arabia.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@AspiringSoul -

One thing that you do find from the structuring of a number of books is that they are not chronological - take Song of Songs and Revelation. The timeline does jump, sometimes even in mid verse as in the one Jesus said had been fulfilled in the hearing of the Jews..

Luke 4

18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. 20And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him. 21And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.

Isaiah 61:

1The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

2To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; [still future]

It would be presumptuous of me to even pretend to be a Bible teacher, so the best I can do is give you my 'Biblical opinion', respect your right to yours, then see what, if anything transpires on the world scene...

 

[Serveto]

Maybe this video will back up your suspicions...

Enjoy the rabbit hole!

I appreciate the narrator's sincerity and insight, but, for an even deeper rabbit hole, I am more impressed by your late ex-patriot countryman, Antony Sutton. Working from within the ostensibly "conservative" Hoover Institution connected to prestigious Stanford University, in the '70's, Sutton (I say facetiously) did that thing which few people, from the 9/ll Commission Report to the accountants auditing the missing trillion$ in the Pentagon, should do: followed the money and drew unofficial, independent conclusions. Not only that, he published his results, thus securing his place in relative obscurity.

As a final scene in the theater of the absurd, he ended not only an arguably somewhat "deranged" (secular) prophet without honor in his own country, England, but also here in the colonies (USA), being interviewed, on the fringe, by Elizabeth Clare Prophet. I think it is safe to say that anybody, especially of his stature, who exposes the Skull and Bones and related societies, will pay the price by losing his or her career, though not, in this case, necessarily his life.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

For when the rabbit hole goes deep...

From Lord of the Rings...

'I don't understand,' said Frodo.

'Neither do I,' answered the wizard. 'I have merely begun to wonder about the ring, especially since last night. No need to worry. But if you take my advice you will use it very seldom, or not at all. At least I beg you not to use it in any way that will cause talk or rouse suspicion. I say again: keep it safe, and keep it secret!'

'You are very mysterious! What are you afraid of?'

'I am not certain, so I will say no more. I may be able to tell you something when I come back. I am going off at once: so this is good-bye for the present.'

 

[Serveto]

Working from within the ostensibly "conservative" Hoover Institution connected to prestigious Stanford University, in the '70's, Sutton (I say facetiously) did that thing which few people, from the 9/ll Commission Report to the accountants ...

As an explanatory note, the embedded link in my above statement was gotten by doing a Google search on key words: "selling American Airlines stock short on 9/11." The sense that bloggers and other websites make of it, the short selling, I leave to them to publish and defend.

 

[AspiringSoul]

Isaiah 17
An oracle about Damascus.
Look! Damascus is finished as a city;
it will become a fallen ruin.
2 The villages of Aroer are abandoned forever.[a]
They will be pastures for flocks,
which will lie down undisturbed.
3 Ephraim’s security will cease,
as will Damascus’ rule.
What’s left of Aram will resemble the glory of the Israelites,
says the Lord of heavenly forces.


In the 8th century BCE, Rezin had been a tributary of Tiglath-Pileser III, the king of Assyria.[4] In c. 732 BCE, he allied himself with Pekah, the king of Israel, to attack Ahaz, the king of Judah. However, Ahaz appealed to Tiglath-Pileser III for help. This the Assyrian king obliged, after Judah paid tribute to the Assyrian king. (2 Kings 16:7-9) As a result, Tiglath-Pileser III sacked Damascus and annexed Aram.[4] According to 2 Kings 16:9, the population was deported and Rezin executed. Tiglath-Pileser also records this act in one of his inscriptions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aram-Damascus

Do you get this now?


it has nothing to do with our time.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

@AspiringSoul ... It may not do, but perhaps the fact that it was not "finished as a city" as it's continued existence indicates, puts it on the list for possible future fulfillment. Who knows?

I think it is one to be aware of just because it is frequently in the news at the moment. For the ordinary people of Damascus I hope that if anything happens there, that it is not for a good while!

 

[Karlysymon]

My eyes were opened to this warning not too long ago. Matthew 24:26-27
“Therefore if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the
desert !’ do not go out; or
‘Look, He is in the inner
rooms!’ do not believe it. For as the lightning comes from the east and
flashes to the west, so also
will the coming of the Son of
Man be."

Satan doesn't have the ability to appear in every place on earth simultaneously. Yet, Christ's advent will be a visual and audible event that everyone will simultaneously experience (every eye will see Him). We are warned 'not to go out'. If/when i get word that christ has appeared a mile away from where iam at, i need to fight the urge or curiosity to go out and see this other-worldly being and probably snap a few pics, given this warning. Lingering where the devil is, is always a bad idea. Eve lingered and parleyed and look what happened. She succumbed despite her unfallen state. What lies will he tell to convince me? That is a huge risk. Further, we are told that if he does appear where we are, say, my front yard, we shouldn't believe it. He'll probably appeal to millenia-old traditions or beliefs of the church, that are biblically un-sound, but sell them as truth basing on that fact, that they've been around or held for so long, how could they possibly be false (the state of the dead, the Moral law: abrogated or not, etc)? It will take incredible faith to believe/stand with the scriptures and only the scriptures given that this entity, warned about so many times, will contradict or twist Holy Writ.

@Red Sky at Morning
you know we don't see eye to eye when it comes to Isaiah 17, we've been there

https://www.vigilantcitizenforums.com/threads/the-rapture.149/page-5

so iam with @AspiringSoul on this one.

 

[Serveto]

Satan doesn't have the ability to appear in every place on earth simultaneously. Yet, Christ's advent will be a visual and audible event that everyone will simultaneously experience (every eye will see Him) ...

Some years ago, I read a fascinating book by and equally enigmatic man, Malachi Martin, a Vatican insider, who said, in his book, that there is yet one "supernatural" event for which his church awaits: the "woman, clothed with the sun" (think Fatima, Portugal, on a much larger scale?), whom all humankind will see. So it is well said, or suggested, that appeals might be made to ancient, especially Biblical traditions.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

Some years ago, I read a fascinating book by and equally enigmatic man, Malachi Martin, a Vatican insider, who said, in his book, that there is yet one "supernatural" event for which his church awaits: the "woman, clothed with the sun" (think Fatima, Portugal, on a much larger scale?), whom all humankind will see. So it is well said, or suggested, that appeals might be made to ancient, especially Biblical traditions.

Fascinating....

Revelation 12 crops up again.

1And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: 2And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. 4And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. 6And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

@floss and @Thunderian - this topic may be of interest to you guys...

The first and most important thing to say is that I have no idea if anything of significance will happen 21-23rd Sept 2017.

I found a good site that provides a balanced view imo of why people are judging these dates to have possible significance.

http://www.unsealed.org/2017/01/the-revelation-12-sign-compendium.html?m=1

@Serveto - Malachi Martin may have been on to something more than Fatima...

 

[Karlysymon]

Some years ago, I read a fascinating book by and equally enigmatic man, Malachi Martin, a Vatican insider, who said, in his book, that there is yet one "supernatural" event for which his church awaits: the "woman, clothed with the sun" (think Fatima, Portugal, on a much larger scale?), whom all humankind will see. So it is well said, or suggested, that appeals might be made to ancient, especially Biblical traditions.

The apparition said this to the 3 Portuguese children:
"God wishes to establish in the world devotion to my Immaculate Heart. If what I say to you is done, many souls will be saved and there will be peace. The [First World] war is going to end; if people do not cease offending God, a worse one will break out
during the pontificate of Pius XI. When you see a
night illumined by an unknown light, know that this is the great sign given you by God that He is about to punish the world for its crimes, by means of
war, famine, and persecutions of the Church and of the HolyFather. To prevent this, I shall come to ask for the consecration of Russia to my Immaculate Heart. If my requests are heeded,Russia will be converted, and there will be peace. If not, she will spread her errors
throughout the world,
causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred, the HolyFather will have much to suffer, various nations will be annihilated. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The HolyFather will consecrate Russia to me, and she will be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consecration_of_Russia

Enter our friends over at NASA, NRO, et al(or their previous incarnations)
Was Fatima an intelligence plot?
https://jaysanalysis.com/2015/02/08/fatima-bankster-fraud-and-the-great-game/

http://truthstreammedia.com/2015/09/23/were-the-prophesied-unknown-lights-in-the-sky-at-the-start-of-world-war-ii-artificial/

They are beaming the Mona Lisa into space. Why they are spending time and money on such, is anyone's guess.
https://www.theverge.com/2013/1/18/3890038/nasa-tests-laser-data-transmission-by-beaming-the-mono-lisa

Given all that, i have often wondered: how far back does this go? This is 1917! There is no way one could convince, even with evidence, Portuguese townsfolk that what they saw with their own eyes was some gov't project. Ofcourse it could have been a real apparition but how does one tell the difference between a gov't project and an other-worldly being?

Thanks, it actually has never occurred to me that there could be a Marian apparition, say, seen by an entire continent. Should that apparition appear as the woman of Revelation 12, that will be one sick and twisted lie. OMW, i can't believe this!

 

[Serveto]

Iam, literally screaming out NOOOOOOOOOOOO! You beat me to Fatima and i will not forgive you for it because i meant to write about but here i go!

We are birds of a feather and we are flocking together.

It occurs to me, and it would be just my bad luck, that, because I have heard about Project Blue Beam and such like, if and when Mary, the mother of Jesus, miraculously shows up, I might insult her by calling her a psyop and thus miss my ticket to the pearly gates ... I hope, in any case, that she is merciful and forgiving, especially if I have bad manners.

 

[DesertRose]

I went to a Catholic high school and was really good at quoting the encyclical I tried to understand a lecture by Malachi Martin but automatically considered the apparition as a jinn same with "Saul's road to Damascus" apparition....
Just my 2 cents please continue with your discussion, no offense.
Thanks for the concise explanations by everyone....

 

[DesertRose]

Project Blue Beam and such like, if and when Mary, the mother of Jesus, miraculously shows up, I might insult her by calling her a psyop and thus miss my ticket to the pearly gates ...

psyop....
how many gates of paradise in Christianity?

 

[grateful servant]

I went to a Catholic high school and was really good at quoting the encyclical I tried to understand a lecture by Malachi Martin but automatically considered the apparition as a jinn same with "Saul's road to Damascus" apparition....
Just my 2 cents please continue with your discussion, no offense.
Thanks for the concise explanations by everyone....

I'm with you on this one. Whether it be a psy-op or an apparition, the real goal is to get the people to devote themselves to (i.e.worship) the creation instead of the Creator.

Sahih International: And [beware the Day] when Allah will say, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Take me and my mother as deities besides Allah ?'" He will say, "Exalted are You! It was not for me to say that to which I have no right. If I had said it, You would have known it. You know what is within myself, and I do not know what is within Yourself. Indeed, it is You who is Knower of the unseen.

Pickthall: And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy Mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou, art the Knower of Things Hidden?

Yusuf Ali: And behold! Allah will say: "O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah'?" He will say: "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, Thou I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden.

Shakir: And when Allah will say: O Isa son of Marium! did you say to men, Take me and my mother for two gods besides Allah he will say: Glory be to Thee, it did not befit me that I should say what I had no right to (say); if I had said it, Thou wouldst indeed have known it; Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I do not know what is in Thy mind, surely Thou art the great Knower of the unseen things.

Muhammad Sarwar: When God asked Jesus, son of Mary "Did you tell men to consider you and your mother as their gods besides God?" he replied, "Glory be to you! How could I say what I have no right to say? Had I ever said it, You would have certainly known about it. You know what is in my soul, but I do not know what is in Yours. It is You who has absolute knowledge of the unseen.

Mohsin Khan: And (remember) when Allah will say (on the Day of Resurrection): "O 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)! Did you say unto men: 'Worship me and my mother as two gods besides Allah?' " He will say: "Glory be to You! It was not for me to say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, You would surely have known it. You know what is in my innerself though I do not know what is in Yours, truly, You, only You, are the AllKnower of all that is hidden and unseen.

Arberry: And when God said, 'O Jesus son of Mary, didst thou say unto men, "Take me and my mother as gods, apart from God"?' He said, 'To Thee be glory! It is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, Thou knowest it, knowing what is within my soul, and I know not what is within Thy soul; Thou knowest the things unseen

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

If we are in fact living in the run-up to the End Times, might we expect a significant number of deceptive events to take place? I would expect new 'Marian' apperitions, 'ancient alien' contact and more before the end...

In the middle of it, I keep coming back to some verses from John 10

1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.2But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. 3To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. 4And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.5And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. 6This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.

 

[DesertRose]