Differences between the Bible and Islam

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I disagree with you on this and it does not go hand in hand with biblical doctrine.

Jesus never broke any law in the Bible. Not once. Not His law which we are all supposed to obey with His power in us because we can't do it on our own. The Bible says about Jesus' sinlessness:

2 Corinthians 5:21, "For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."

Hebrews 4:15, "For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin."

1 John 3:5, "And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin."


If Jesus broke any laws they were man made laws and those don't count at all in our salvation. There are instances where it seemed like He was sinning but it was never against God, just against man. That is why He said, "Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. ... And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men” (Matthew 15:6, 9).

Biblically there is never a situation that calls for man to sin (which is breaking God's law), not even for good.
The pharisees accused Jesus of breaking the Sabbath numberous times, when he healed different people or ate from a field. The Sabbath was not a man made law. In the Old Testament a man was put to death for gathering sticks on the Sabbath.

Numbers 15

32And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. 33And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses

What Jesus did is clarify to them that the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. The pharisees had been misinterpreting the Law.
Mark 2
27And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 28Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath

The highest commandments are to love God and love our neighbor as ourselves. When Jesus healed (even on the Sabbath) he did so out of love.
 

90sWereBetter

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the Catholic/Orthodox approach and the Protestant approach I believe are both wrong. and wallahi I am a Muslim, my point isn't for anyone to worship Mary.

polytheism is wrong. don't pray to saints. don't pray to Mary. don't pray to Jesus. Worship Allah alone with no partners.

but you look at the Catholic approach. and I'm talking about the medieval Catholic, not the modern.... whatever that is going on in the Vatican.

medieval Catholic:
random person 1: this verse means this!
random person 2: actually, it means this
both: ok, let's settle this and ask the church what it means
the church: it means this!

now of course the church is corrupt. super mega corrupt. no denying that. but the Protestant approach to me is insane and yes I blame it for being the origin of liberalism and modern relativism. I think it's blatantly obvious.

Protestantism:
random Protestant 1: wow! it sure is nice to be away from that horrible oppressive anti-Christ Catholic church.
random Protestant 2: I agree. btw this verse means this!
random Protestant 1: no, actually the holy spirit just told me it means something else
random Protestant 2: you're wrong. the verse actually means THIS.
random Protestant 1: you misunderstand. because you don't have the deep connection with the holy spirit that I have. the holy spirit just told me the correct meaning.
random Protestant 2: actually, the Lord just put in my heart that the verse means something completely different
Random Protestant 3: *has a third completely different interpretation of the same verse*
random Protestant 4: *has a fourth interpretation, which he also attributes to direct inspiration from Jesus or the Holy Spirit*

this to me is insane. what you are going to end up with is in theory these people are all the same religion and in practice these people are each their own one-person sect. they are going to form their own individual interpretation of the Bible and of the entire religion. this is chaos.

this is the right approach:

Muslims:
Muslim 1: the verse means this!
Muslim 2: no, no- it's actually referring to something else
both of them: *refer back to classical commentary from a thousand years ago and go by the same interpretation that was passed down over a thousand years ago and that the classical commentator received in a chain that goes back to the sahaabah*

but the Christians really have no concept of this.
 
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some who believe in worshipping Mary alongside Jesus (you can continue to dissociate with Catholicism but they’re not exactly a branch of Hinduism are they?)
Theyre a branch of roman paganism.

If hinduism comes from the same roots as roman paganism - and there is evidence to suggest that they do, as do ALL other pagan religions (before the people were scattered after the tower of babel incident) - then it follows that yes, theyre related to hinduism.

Do ALL the believers know this? Of course not.

Yet when pressed they can't come up with answers as to WHY they are required to pray to Mary, or why Mary is "venerated"* on august 15th, the same day the romans celbrated the nemoralia, the "festival of torches" dedicated to diana.

* meaning it is a day all catholics are REQUIRED to attend church

They just have no answer other than the truth. The more honest of them admit that they based their own trachings on mythology. Ive posted about this before.

Pictures don't show up on quotes, so if anyone wants to view the pictures i took of the actual book that says this, click through to the original post

Sources that claim to "explain Catholicism" basically admit many of the things we've mentioned in this thread.

View attachment 82926

"The church has used the title mediator for Mary..."

What do the scriptures say?

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus

One mediator, Jesus Christ. Not his mother.

"The gods and goddesses of ancient Greece and Rome were powerful archetypes im the minds of the people up through the first and second centuries. From the beginning of Catholicism, their characteristics were assimilated into Mary's story."

View attachment 82927
"Catholics believe Mary rules over death as the queen of heaven. This role came out of the Hellenistic mythology of Artemis (later called Diana by the Romans)"

View attachment 82928
"Mary's legends continued to grow, especially around the city of Ephesus... where the mother goddess was particularly popular... It was also in Ephesus that Paul encountered the crowd's cheering 'great is Artemis of Ephesus' as he attempted to preach. "


This is not from some kind of "conspiracy book". The authors are catholics, have taught at catholic universities for many years.
 
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but you look at the Catholic approach. and I'm talking about the medieval Catholic, not the modern.... whatever that is going on in the Vatican.

medieval Catholic:
random person 1: this verse means this!
random person 2: actually, it means this
both: ok, let's settle this and ask the church what it means
the church: it means this!
It was more like:
Person 1: it means this
Person : i think it means that
Person 3: what will get us more followers, or convince the pagans to support us militaristically?
Person1: but thats not what the Bible says...
Person 3: banish him/burn him/excommunicate him/kill him (you get the idea)

The councils were held in stetegic places in order to advance agendas.
The councils were often presided by people who either were not Christians or were newly converted


Protestantism:
random Protestant 1: wow! it sure is nice to be away from that horrible oppressive anti-Christ Catholic church.
I understand that you are a Muslim, so were not going to agree about Christianity.

But it is not true that Christians leave catholicism because it is "oppressive". That is actually a common catholic lie, because they dont want to directly admit why people leave - because they are not biblical.

I posted about this before

A phenomenon i've noticed is that articles, such as the first one i quoted and linked, tend to push a narrative that people have left/are leaving because they're too strict - if only they just allowed female preachers, abortions, same sex marriages etc.

I've seen this repeated throughout other sources countless times. If i were to speculate, i would say it is clear that the reason many people leave (because they are unbiblical) is purposely covered up.

Even a catholic article acknowledged people leave because they start reading the Bible, then tried to backtrack that it's really for other reasons.

Www.ncronline.org/news/parish/hidden-exodus-catholics-becoming-protestants

They also cited the church’s teaching on the Bible (55 percent versus 16 percent) more frequently as a reason for leaving. Forty-six percent of these new evangelicals felt the Catholic church did not view the Bible literally enough. Thus, for those leaving to become evangelicals, spiritual sustenance, worship services and the Bible were key.

Thought this part was interesting
Thus, both as believers and as worshipers, Catholics who become Protestants are statistically better Christians than those who stay Catholic. We are losing the best, not the worst
I know many many catholics and they are the the worldliest, least devout, lukewarm people i know. They refer to fundamentalist Christians as "fanatics" and "extremists" that tells us all we need to know.
 

Flarepath

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...(catholics)....when pressed they can't come up with answers as to WHY they are required to pray to Mary..

One catholic told me "We regard Mary as an intermediary to pass on our prayers to God".
Huh, what codswallop..:)
The early Christians got it right-
"There is one mediator between God and men- the man Jesus Christ" (1 Timothy 2:5)
And when the disciples asked Jesus how to pray, he replied "Our Father which art in heaven..."
See, he never said we should have to go through his mam..:)
Catholicism has got satan's fingerprints all over it and i bet he's ROFLing because he's hoodwinked catholics into praying to Mary and to other human 'saints', thereby wasting their prayers which are like firing blank rounds..:)
 

Flarepath

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..the Catholic/Orthodox approach and the Protestant approach I believe are both wrong. and wallahi I am a Muslim...

Despite their flaws, Caths and Prots both acknowledge Jesus as being the Son of God, but muslims say "Nah, he wasn't", so that makes muslims prime candidates for-

naughty-step.jpg
 

phipps

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The pharisees accused Jesus of breaking the Sabbath numberous times, when he healed different people or ate from a field. The Sabbath was not a man made law. In the Old Testament a man was put to death for gathering sticks on the Sabbath.


Numbers 15

32And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. 33And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses
You're right. The Sabbath was not a man made law and is not now and for all eternity ever be. And yes in the Old covenant people were punished for breaking the Sabbath law. That's why its important to understand what we can and cannot do on the Sabbath and why according to God, not man.

When God gave man the Sabbath at creation for rest, it was so His people could spend time with Him. It is supposed to be the highlight of the week and a blessing to all who keep it. I means what could be better than spending a whole day set aside for us by our creator to commune with Him without much interruption.

However the Jews had thousands of Sabbath rules that were man-made and not given to them by God. These rules were much stricter. They interpreted "work" to include almost every physical activity. Even today, orthodox Jews consider turning on a light switch to be "work." It was impossible for anyone to observe all those rules. Basically the Jews had perverted the Sabbath and what it was meant for. They made it seem like God was the one who gave them those rules that were so stifling. God came across as a tyrant who would punish people for any slight.

The reason the Jews had so many Sabbath rules was because breaking the Sabbath was one of the reasons they were punished by God and taken captive by Babylon where they spent 70 years in captivity. So they put so many rules in place so they do not disobey the Sabbath and be punished so severely again by God.

The gathering of sticks on the Sabbath is not comparable to healing someone on the Sabbath. The biblical Sabbath restrictions are about work for economic or personal gain. Jesus healing and doing good on the Sabbath was not work or for personal gain. But of course by the Pharisee's man made rules, Jesus was breaking the Sabbath.

What Jesus did is clarify to them that the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. The pharisees had been misinterpreting the Law.
Mark 2
27And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 28Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath
Yes He did. Jesus is the creator of this world and He would know more about the Sabbath than the Pharisees. However that does not mean He broke the Sabbath commandment.

When the Pharisees accused Jesus of healing the man with the withered hand on the Sabbath for example, in the book of Mark (as you know the story is written of the gospels of Matthew and Luke too with some variation), Jesus said to them, "Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill?" (Mark 3:4). This means all "good" acts including those of healing do not breach the Sabbath law and are therefore appropriate. The sabbath is a time for spiritual matters, such as Bible study, praying, preaching the gospel, visiting and healing the sick, etc.

In the gospel of Matthew there is an additional comment showing that the Pharisees were willing to rescue animals on Sabbath, implying that they too understood that saving life was more important than the prohibition against most physical activity on the day. "What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days" (Matthew 12:11-12). They had no answer for him but instead were angry with Him and plotted His death.

As you know the Pharisees always wanted to show publicly how righteous and holy they were but it was all superficial. Their hearts were corrupt and Jesus had told them as much. They didn't like the fact that Jesus knew they were hypocrites as He had told them.

None of the gospels imply Jesus broke any law otherwise they would contradict the rest of the Bible that tells us Jesus was sinless as I showed in the scripture I posted in my previous post.

The highest commandments are to love God and love our neighbor as ourselves. When Jesus healed (even on the Sabbath) he did so out of love.
Absolutely and yes Jesus healed out of love. Everything Jesus did in this world was out of love including dying in our place for our sins even though He never sinned. But Jesus did not transgress God's law/His law. Not even out of love. And we are to do the same and follow His example.

"And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin" (1 John 3:5).
 
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Haich

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Despite their flaws, Caths and Prots both acknowledge Jesus as being the Son of God, but muslims say "Nah, he wasn't", so that makes muslims prime candidates for-

View attachment 96271
There are many times the phrase ‘son of God’ is used without Jesus. Here’s a few, but there’s many more.

And don’t redefine the use of capitalisation and say Son refers to Jesus and sons refer to everyone else mentioned. I’m still a Woman whether I type woman, WOMAN or Woman. The incorrect use of punctuation isn’t proof Jesus was the son of God.

Genesis 6:4 ESV
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown.
Romans 8:19 ESV
For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God
Matthew 5:9 ESV

“Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.
Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them.
 

Haich

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There’s also nowhere in the Bible where Jesus says himself he is God. Don’t you think that’s a vital piece of information he left out? Spoiler: Because he isn’t God, he was sent by The Father-that’s it.

And the absurdity of believing Jesus was somehow involved in God creating mankind? Absolutely nothing to suggest this is the case.
 

Haich

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I’ve also heard (haven’t read as I don’t know how to find the reference for this concept) that Christians believe God rested after He created everything? The Quran rejects this assertion. I guess it goes back to ‘humanising’ God when in reality, He is nothing like his creation.

Note: Kursi means throne.

IMG_6287.jpegIMG_6286.jpegIMG_6285.jpeg
 
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There’s also nowhere in the Bible where Jesus says himself he is God. Don’t you think that’s a vital piece of information he left out? Spoiler: Because he isn’t God, he was sent by The Father-that’s it.

And the absurdity of believing Jesus was somehow involved in God creating mankind? Absolutely nothing to suggest this is the case.
Jesus says "before Abraham was, I AM" and then the pharisees wanted to stone Him for blasphemy.

John 8
56Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by


They understood "I AM" to be referring to God.

Exodus 3

13And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them? 14And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel,
I AM hath sent me unto you


I’ve also heard (haven’t read as I don’t know how to find the reference for this concept) that Christians believe God rested after He created everything? The Quran rejects this assertion. I guess it goes back to ‘humanising’ God when in reality, He is nothing like his creation
It's not just that Christians believe God rested, it's that the Bible clearly states that God rested on the 7th day.

Genesis 2
1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made


There are many times the phrase ‘son of God’ is used without Jesus
Well, leaving aside the fact that Jesus is described as His only begotten son, the fact that the phrase "son of God" or "sons of God" is used simply shows us that the biblical God is not opposed to being seen as a Father.
 

Haich

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Jesus says "before Abraham was, I AM" and then the pharisees wanted to stone Him for blasphemy.

John 8
56Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by


They understood "I AM" to be referring to God.

Exodus 3

13And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them? 14And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you



It's not just that Christians believe God rested, it's that the Bible clearly states that God rested on the 7th day.

Genesis 2
1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made



Well, leaving aside the fact that Jesus is described as His only begotten son, the fact that the phrase "son of God" or "sons of God" is used simply shows us that the biblical God is not opposed to being seen as a Father.
Nothing you posted was clear. ‘I AM’ doesn’t make any sense, how did they make sense of that meaning he created mankind? Or is God? Was Enoch, Adam and Noah also before Abraham? Did Jesus create them? The problem is nothing is clear cut and you’re drawing to conclusions which you’re so certain of but there’s absolutely nothing concrete supporting your claims.

And how can Jesus be God but also the only begotten son?

You guys use the word father, was it in the original Greek manuscripts? Is there any way of knowing what the original Aramaic words were? It seems you’re working with such a far removed rendition of the original bible that things get lost in translation.
 

Haich

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Genesis 2
1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made
I think it was you who said Genesis is believed to have been written by Moses right? Just wanted to make sure. So this is Moses’ account of what God did?

This is hard for me to grasp. I’m trying to be objective here but I don’t see how an all supreme being and creator, who made something as expansive, complicated and vast as the universe, heavens, sky, planets etc needs to ‘rest’.
Would I be right in assuming according to Christianity, God is humanistic in his manner and appearance? What is God to you because I don’t see how a being can create immense things and then rest like He’s tired.

Who is God according to you? Is he a huge man in the sky? Is he a spirit? What is he and makes him distinct from us humans?
 

irrationalNinja

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Jesus is a speck in the grand scheme of life.
This is the basic difference between the Bible and Qur’an.

Where the Bible, from the beginning, portrays Jesus as the Messiah, the Qur’an portrays Jesus as just another prophet.

The rest of the Qur’an appears to be some sort of radical political ideology wrapped in religious phraseology.

It might be interesting to see if you can find any similarities between the Bible and the Qur’an. You will be hard-pressed to find any.

A thread cataloguing the differences makes sense. However, the “phobe” accusation will, inevitably, follow any critique of Islam. Good luck.
 
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