BTS discussion thread

Kimiko2

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Exactly. It's pretty difficult to take NJ seriously in anything, but especially leadership. It's hilarious how the label and his bandmates keep shouting from the rooftops that he's a great leader when everyone else can see otherwise. NJ doesn't respect them, so they don't listen to him.
NJ even said that when jh had covid and wasn't there the members wouldn't listen to him when they were rehersing for the grammys
 

theartbook35

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weird animation :


Suga and his alter ego animation:
I suppose these animations are fine, I just don't understand the point, if any. Is this meant to be humorous or cute or both? I'm not sure how the artist expects me to receive it. It's bordering on making content for the sake of making content with no real purpose (similar to those compilation videos of the BTS members sleeping, eating, looking at stuff, doing nothing).

I went through absolute hell to get BT5 articles off of that "third screen" thing that comes with G00gle phones. I kept saying I had no interest until they finally stopped recommending them to me. Reason why was because so many sites were writing pointless articles about a singular thing a BT5 member said, or what clothes they wore, or a food they ate. I kid you not, it was ridiculous. BT5 literally do next to nothing, but everyone is talking about them right now, they're a trend so these media sites are posting any crap they can think of to keep generating traffic. Now, I as a writer would not feel good about myself if I was writing total junk like that. I would not rest the fate of my news site on a trend that will die out soon now that they're "taking a break/on hiatus/disbanded and don't wanna confirm it". Remember how the label's stocks took a huge hit? That's just the beginning.
 

theartbook35

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yes probably, but i really think that the maknae would beat his ass for sure, since 2 of them are into martial arts
I doubt it. JM worships NJ. Taek00k pretty much do as well, to a certain extent anyway. Even though now they are VERY close, I did hear a rumor from a fan about YG and NJ having a fight over a room when they were trainees. Like, fighting over who got to have the room. Apparently NJ threw stuff at YG, and YG hit NJ. I can see this actually happening. NJ is not a fighter, at all, it's really obvious he's not so it's easy for me to visualize him being a wuss and throwing something at someone else. YG is a whole other person when the cameras are off (and he boxed in high school, he was way beefier back then than he is today) so it's also easy for me to picture him hitting NJ. This could be why they get along now, and why NJ never challenges YG or gets an attitude with him about anything. (I also wonder if NJ has ever had a fight with Jin, or even if not a fight, knows it's a BAD IDEA to get into it with Jin. NJ has said multiple times that Jin is the strongest physically out of all the guys, like stronger than JK. Fans go nuts over JK all the time but they forget about Jin).
 

minnie82

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I suppose these animations are fine, I just don't understand the point, if any. Is this meant to be humorous or cute or both? I'm not sure how the artist expects me to receive it. It's bordering on making content for the sake of making content with no real purpose (similar to those compilation videos of the BTS members sleeping, eating, looking at stuff, doing nothing).

I went through absolute hell to get BT5 articles off of that "third screen" thing that comes with G00gle phones. I kept saying I had no interest until they finally stopped recommending them to me. Reason why was because so many sites were writing pointless articles about a singular thing a BT5 member said, or what clothes they wore, or a food they ate. I kid you not, it was ridiculous. BT5 literally do next to nothing, but everyone is talking about them right now, they're a trend so these media sites are posting any crap they can think of to keep generating traffic. Now, I as a writer would not feel good about myself if I was writing total junk like that. I would not rest the fate of my news site on a trend that will die out soon now that they're "taking a break/on hiatus/disbanded and don't wanna confirm it". Remember how the label's stocks took a huge hit? That's just the beginning.
the points of the animation may be cute for the artist point and for the fans, but i find it weird because it seems that portrait them and their alter ego
 

theartbook35

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the points of the animation may be cute for the artist point and for the fans, but i find it weird because it seems that portrait them and their alter ego
Yeah, I think it's weird too. Like, okay, they have alter-egos/stage personas like every other idol. Congratulations artist, you can tell the difference between their stage personas. That's the point of having an alter-ego, so people can see the difference. If the comparison went deeper in some way, like defining various details then we'd have something worth watching. But otherwise it's mindless content.
 
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Oh 100% his real personality came out. HS's lyricism with this album has been praised significantly, FOR A REASON. He's a way better writer than any of the guys in the band.

His music isn't my taste, as well, but I watched Lolla. I adored his moments with Becky, it was fricking precious. Those two have such a genuine friendship. People who know him, respect him.

HS's verses in every song sound amazing. It's his voice. That tone is very specific and you notice it immediately. (The same can be said about YG, especially when he starts growling or gets hyped up and starts squealing, lol). HS's delivery is just out of this world. And he wasn't a rapper before he joined Hive.

I think Hive were also using his album as the digital album experiment. You're right that they lose nothing with him. In fact, if HS left BT5 I don't think Hive would even care. (The same could probably be said about Jin, cause Hive and the RM never let Jin do anything).

I'm looking forward to your thoughts about the article!
When Jn leaves, his acting and music career will take off. His songs are what Koreans prefer, and his visuals are too. He's been pretending to like his members for almost a decade. Someone give him an Oscar.

He wrote his own songs? I'm surprised by that. I liked the lyrics to Arson a lot. The video's imagery was too dark for me. Hive pushes the narrative that only Rm and Sg are talented and write songs. He was going to be a singer but he became a rapper, and Tae a singer.

I believe that article. There's a rumor about Rm in bed, that's he's demanding and bossy. Also worse rumors but I won't post them in public. Tae was excluded a lot during interviews and ignored. The language gap made it worse because Rm can just ignore him, and Tae can't speak fluent English. Run episodes exposed the rifts in the group, and put holes in the Rm as loving father story. Same with Jn as the group's mom. He's not close to anyone anymore. He hates being called mom by fans.

Rm is responsible for everything. Any trouble and he's reamed for other's mistakes. His music is pushed on albums. He gets writing credits on other group's comebacks. That had to cause a rift similar to the one in t×t with Yj and the rest of the group. The group and B@ng pulled a prank on Rm, and he was so afraid. He thought he was in trouble with B@ng, and the other members went along with the prank. When they're around B@ng, Rm is afraid and reverent. Only Jn and Jh are comfortable around him. B@ng has his favorites for services and the ones he favors for business. It's obvious who those are.
 

minnie82

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When Jn leaves, his acting and music career will take off. His songs are what Koreans prefer, and his visuals are too. He's been pretending to like his members for almost a decade. Someone give him an Oscar.

He wrote his own songs? I'm surprised by that. I liked the lyrics to Arson a lot. The video's imagery was too dark for me. Hive pushes the narrative that only Rm and Sg are talented and write songs. He was going to be a singer but he became a rapper, and Tae a singer.

I believe that article. There's a rumor about Rm in bed, that's he's demanding and bossy. Also worse rumors but I won't post them in public. Tae was excluded a lot during interviews and ignored. The language gap made it worse because Rm can just ignore him, and Tae can't speak fluent English. Run episodes exposed the rifts in the group, and put holes in the Rm as loving father story. Same with Jn as the group's mom. He's not close to anyone anymore. He hates being called mom by fans.

Rm is responsible for everything. Any trouble and he's reamed for other's mistakes. His music is pushed on albums. He gets writing credits on other group's comebacks. That had to cause a rift similar to the one in t×t with Yj and the rest of the group. The group and B@ng pulled a prank on Rm, and he was so afraid. He thought he was in trouble with B@ng, and the other members went along with the prank. When they're around B@ng, Rm is afraid and reverent. Only Jn and Jh are comfortable around him. B@ng has his favorites for services and the ones he favors for business. It's obvious who those are.
yes i heard that he have to learn rapping ..it seems that his album show his true personality or something
 

theartbook35

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When Jn leaves, his acting and music career will take off. His songs are what Koreans prefer, and his visuals are too. He's been pretending to like his members for almost a decade. Someone give him an Oscar.

He wrote his own songs? I'm surprised by that. I liked the lyrics to Arson a lot. The video's imagery was too dark for me. Hive pushes the narrative that only Rm and Sg are talented and write songs. He was going to be a singer but he became a rapper, and Tae a singer.

I believe that article. There's a rumor about Rm in bed, that's he's demanding and bossy. Also worse rumors but I won't post them in public. Tae was excluded a lot during interviews and ignored. The language gap made it worse because Rm can just ignore him, and Tae can't speak fluent English. Run episodes exposed the rifts in the group, and put holes in the Rm as loving father story. Same with Jn as the group's mom. He's not close to anyone anymore. He hates being called mom by fans.

Rm is responsible for everything. Any trouble and he's reamed for other's mistakes. His music is pushed on albums. He gets writing credits on other group's comebacks. That had to cause a rift similar to the one in t×t with Yj and the rest of the group. The group and B@ng pulled a prank on Rm, and he was so afraid. He thought he was in trouble with B@ng, and the other members went along with the prank. When they're around B@ng, Rm is afraid and reverent. Only Jn and Jh are comfortable around him. B@ng has his favorites for services and the ones he favors for business. It's obvious who those are.
Agreed, Jin is gonna be hella successful. I think he likes his bandmates in certain context. He jokes around with JK, and he'll be friendly on stage with the maknae line. Jin and YG do spend time together outside of BT5 activities. YG is probably the only member Jin has a friendship with. Otherwise, Jin tolerates everyone else.

Yeah, HS wrote his own stuff. The music video for Arson creeps me out. But I also found it pretentious, especially the ending with him laying inside the word arson. It was too much.

NJ has apparently hooked up with fans. There's a girl who said several years ago that she slept with him and he was verbally abusive. Every time she moaned or made any noise he'd tell her to shut up. Given that he's a misogynist, that's unsurprising.

I wanna know what B@ng did to make these guys fear him.
 

theartbook35

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yes i heard that he have to learn rapping ..it seems that his album show his true personality or something
That happens a lot in the industry. The company decides on a persona for each member. Take 2NE1 for example, CL was the fashion queen, Bom the visual, Dara was the "innocent one", Minzy the tomboy. CL has rolled with that persona her whole career, and like, you go honey. Took it and made it her own. Dara was far from innocent and Bom seems to have been fine with her stage persona. Minzy as a tomboy was stupid cause she's actually ultra feminine. Anyway my point is that HS was never a rapper to start with, and he became a pop-rapper to suit the band. HS is cool, but again, he's not a traditional hip hop artist. This is why his music isn't my taste, because I don't listen to pop music.
 

theartbook35

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Who taught him to rap? His flow is similar to his dance. I think we came closer to the real Jh in his album and concert than the last decade in btees.
It was YG, mostly. HS was super shy pre-debut, and nervous around the other trainees so him and YG hung out a lot. YG helped HS fit in by coaching him in rapping, and HS helped YG by coaching him in dancing. And that was the birth of Sope, lol (there's something to be said for these two coming up with that ship name themselves).

BTW, it was NJ who coached JK in rapping... thank god JK stopped doing it. In the early days JK sounded like NJ in his flow and style. One NJ is bad enough but two is just NO. JK was recruited by multiple companies for his VOICE, not rapping, so making him a rapper was dumb.

Real HS is a really nice thing to witness. None of this sunshine crap.
 
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Agreed, Jin is gonna be hella successful. I think he likes his bandmates in certain context. He jokes around with JK, and he'll be friendly on stage with the maknae line. Jin and YG do spend time together outside of BT5 activities. YG is probably the only member Jin has a friendship with. Otherwise, Jin tolerates everyone else.

Yeah, HS wrote his own stuff. The music video for Arson creeps me out. But I also found it pretentious, especially the ending with him laying inside the word arson. It was too much.

NJ has apparently hooked up with fans. There's a girl who said several years ago that she slept with him and he was verbally abusive. Every time she moaned or made any noise he'd tell her to shut up. Given that he's a misogynist, that's unsurprising.

I wanna know what B@ng did to make these guys fear him.
I heard that too. He was only interested in sex, not the person. I feel bad for the fan because she saw his true face. Wonder if she stayed a fan.

They're very afraid of him. Their juniors act nonchalant but they're pretending. I've seen the fearful look in their eyes too. In t×t, there's his favorite for business and his favorite for looks. I'm sure it's the same in the other groups.

His video shocked me because I'm used to the happy Jh, but the atmosphere in the video was bleak and hopeless. He's showing us what's inside, his pain and everything he's stuffed inside deep. The members are adults and made their choices, but I feel bad for the kids they were. I doubt this is what they wanted.
 
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It was YG, mostly. HS was super shy pre-debut, and nervous around the other trainees so him and YG hung out a lot. YG helped HS fit in by coaching him in rapping, and HS helped YG by coaching him in dancing. And that was the birth of Sope, lol (there's something to be said for these two coming up with that ship name themselves).

BTW, it was NJ who coached JK in rapping... thank god JK stopped doing it. In the early days JK sounded like NJ in his flow and style. One NJ is bad enough but two is just NO. JK was recruited by multiple companies for his VOICE, not rapping, so making him a rapper was dumb.

Real HS is a really nice thing to witness. None of this sunshine crap.
I prefer the real Jh too. The sunny image was an act. It bothered him what the members and fans said about his looks. He's talented on his own, but stands in the other's shadows. No one appreciates being a side character in someone else's story. It's telling that he's the most supportive member of the group, except for Jm. The maknaes crowd around him like baby ducks. I think he's the real leader.

Why does every hive leader have a loyal follower? Jk was Rm's and Tae is Yj's. Yj is the unofficial leader of t×t. Are Sg and Jh friends or did the company tear them apart too? The maknaes were friends until they had to do lots of fanservice and shipping, and competed with each other for popularity. Jn and Rm were another popular shop, are they still friends? None of them seem close to Rm anymore.
 

theartbook35

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I heard that too. He was only interested in sex, not the person. I feel bad for the fan because she saw his true face. Wonder if she stayed a fan.

They're very afraid of him. Their juniors act nonchalant but they're pretending. I've seen the fearful look in their eyes too. In t×t, there's his favorite for business and his favorite for looks. I'm sure it's the same in the other groups.

His video shocked me because I'm used to the happy Jh, but the atmosphere in the video was bleak and hopeless. He's showing us what's inside, his pain and everything he's stuffed inside deep. The members are adults and made their choices, but I feel bad for the kids they were. I doubt this is what they wanted.
NJ is mean, plain and simple. I feel bad for her too. You get to do that thing with an idol you like and it turns out to be really awful. Granted, any time we choose to have sex with someone there's a chance it won't be good, especially a ONS, but we don't deserve to have an abusive experience.

HS not being "happy" didn't really shock me, necessarily, but it wasn't what I expected. And that's good, really good. It does show what he's keeping inside and if anything, letting it out was healthy for him. Aside from maybe NJ, I don't think the other members wanted what they got with joining BH. They're often careful about what they say or allude to, because they've been coached to be careful, or worse warned and punished for saying the wrong things. Despite that, Jin pretty much says whatever he wants, he even called out his own bandmates in an interview about the BE album because all his input for the album was rejected. He didn't specifically identify which band member it was, but I think we all know who it was.

YG has a also been super vocal over the years and hinted at a lot of internal problems. In general he's verbally unhinged. He's diplomatic in public most of the time, and wise, but this is the same guy who bitched at an American interviewer in Korean over a dating question (which NJ translated as "He says he's single", lol). He's also been open about their almost disbandment in 2015, and has even called out @rmy for their nonsense belief that BT5 were barely having any success and didn't get many opportunities early on. YG was like, "We were doing well but we weren't seeing the success we had hoped for". He is also the only member who's been open about his sexuality, and I seriously think the label told him to say that it was a mistranslation just to make discussions about it fizzle out. I get it, SK is stupid about homosexuality and coming out is dangerous but it sucks to be in a position where you are forced to lie about who you are, especially after being so honest. It makes him look bad without it being his fault.

Speaking of coming out, what are your thoughts on the bi colors during HS's performance of Equal Sign? I was surprised but also really happy to see it. I had always thought he was gay instead of bi. I've never gotten vibes from him that he's attracted to women, but during that performance he was definitely flirting with the female dancers.
 

theartbook35

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I prefer the real Jh too. The sunny image was an act. It bothered him what the members and fans said about his looks. He's talented on his own, but stands in the other's shadows. No one appreciates being a side character in someone else's story. It's telling that he's the most supportive member of the group, except for Jm. The maknaes crowd around him like baby ducks. I think he's the real leader.

Why does every hive leader have a loyal follower? Jk was Rm's and Tae is Yj's. Yj is the unofficial leader of t×t. Are Sg and Jh friends or did the company tear them apart too? The maknaes were friends until they had to do lots of fanservice and shipping, and competed with each other for popularity. Jn and Rm were another popular shop, are they still friends? None of them seem close to Rm anymore.
HS definitely runs the show. He chose the group's name even. It's hilarious to me the way @rmy don't realize he's the one in charge.

BT5 friendships are weird. This basically is how it looks right now based on what I've been told by other people (I have no hard evidence and this is all alleged):

Friendships -
  • Jin & YG. They are actually the closest. Only ones who spend time together out of ALL the group members.
Close as bandmates -
  • HS & YG. As bandmates, they are all over each other. Outside of BT5 activities they have nothing to do with each other though :(
  • HS & JM. They are around each other a lot, and it's more genuine than the fanservice.
  • JM & NJ. JM worships NJ. NJ can do no wrong and NJ lets JM do anything.
  • JK & YG. Yoonk00k have a nice work-friendship between them. They do contact each other occasionally outside of work.
  • Tae has zero friendships with anyone in the group. JM hates this, NJ tries to steer Tae away from having his own friends. The other guys don't care.
  • JM and NJ are also bullies. NJ is the worst but JM can be pretty nasty too. (To clarify, they team up on other members a lot).
  • YG & NJ. It's weird that these two have a close working relationship, but they do. Highly unexpected since they are total opposites in personality. They're just very compatible artistically which is why they collaborate. I have heard though that YG keeps NJ close so that he doesn't have issues with the company.
And here is what Jin apparently thinks of his bandmates. This is to be taken with a grain of salt, although the multiple sources I've talked to all say about the same thing with minor variations in wording. That could be a bunch of people all getting info from one person, or it's could be true, who knows. Jin also gets easily annoyed so there's that to consider.
  • He likes being around YG cause he's easy to get along with.
  • He thinks NJ is stupid and annoying.
  • He tolerates Tae but can't be around him for too long without getting annoyed.
  • He worries about JM a lot. He keeps a distance from him emotionally cause JM is too high maintenance.
  • He likes HS but they do argue on rare occasions and have to take breaks from each other.
  • He spends time with JK for livestreams because their senses of humor are compatible.
  • He used to hang out with the whole maknae line a lot but he doesn't have the energy for them anymore.
 
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NJ is mean, plain and simple. I feel bad for her too. You get to do that thing with an idol you like and it turns out to be really awful. Granted, any time we choose to have sex with someone there's a chance it won't be good, especially a ONS, but we don't deserve to have an abusive experience.

HS not being "happy" didn't really shock me, necessarily, but it wasn't what I expected. And that's good, really good. It does show what he's keeping inside and if anything, letting it out was healthy for him. Aside from maybe NJ, I don't think the other members wanted what they got with joining BH. They're often careful about what they say or allude to, because they've been coached to be careful, or worse warned and punished for saying the wrong things. Despite that, Jin pretty much says whatever he wants, he even called out his own bandmates in an interview about the BE album because all his input for the album was rejected. He didn't specifically identify which band member it was, but I think we all know who it was.

YG has a also been super vocal over the years and hinted at a lot of internal problems. In general he's verbally unhinged. He's diplomatic in public most of the time, and wise, but this is the same guy who bitched at an American interviewer in Korean over a dating question (which NJ translated as "He says he's single", lol). He's also been open about their almost disbandment in 2015, and has even called out @rmy for their nonsense belief that BT5 were barely having any success and didn't get many opportunities early on. YG was like, "We were doing well but we weren't seeing the success we had hoped for". He is also the only member who's been open about his sexuality, and I seriously think the label told him to say that it was a mistranslation just to make discussions about it fizzle out. I get it, SK is stupid about homosexuality and coming out is dangerous but it sucks to be in a position where you are forced to lie about who you are, especially after being so honest. It makes him look bad without it being his fault.

Speaking of coming out, what are your thoughts on the bi colors during HS's performance of Equal Sign? I was surprised but also really happy to see it. I had always thought he was gay instead of bi. I've never gotten vibes from him that he's attracted to women, but during that performance he was definitely flirting with the female dancers.
JH always seemed straight to me or bisexual. He flirted with an army and gave her a letter at a fanmeet. If he's coming out, that's very brave because Korea is brutal to LGBT people. Idols are trained to queerbait, so I'm curious about what he says next. Only someone as famous as btees could come out and have a career.

She didn't deserve that, no one does. Most fans won't get a chance to meet their idols and she was living the dream, but it was a nightmare. After a scandal over lyrics, he said that a woman helps him write his lyrics. She's a professor and a feminist. I think being the leader got to him, and any abuse he experienced is now directed outward to unsuspecting women.

Who did Sg say that to? I remember Ellen asking btees and Superm if they're dating or talk to fans in the case of btees. A lot of male idols talk to fans and even sasaengs. They're relying on them for votes, high res pictures, gifts, free publicity, and sex. A group had a controversy because a member said that sasaengs are good for oral sex. There's a lot of rumors about idols sleeping with their sasaengs or fans. Pretty women will catch their eye and have a chance to meet or sleep with the idol. Especially if they're international and the guy knows that it won't get back home. Many Korean guys are obsessed with White and sometimes Black women. It's new, and the language barrier means she can't speak to the media in their country.

He's definitely done with btees. I'm not sure what to think about him because of the Jim Jones scandal. A lot of idols are racist or sexist, but he's quiet.
 
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HS definitely runs the show. He chose the group's name even. It's hilarious to me the way @rmy don't realize he's the one in charge.

BT5 friendships are weird. This basically is how it looks right now based on what I've been told by other people (I have no hard evidence and this is all alleged):

Friendships -
  • Jin & YG. They are actually the closest. Only ones who spend time together out of ALL the group members.
Close as bandmates -
  • HS & YG. As bandmates, they are all over each other. Outside of BT5 activities they have nothing to do with each other though :(
  • HS & JM. They are around each other a lot, and it's more genuine than the fanservice.
  • JM & NJ. JM worships NJ. NJ can do no wrong and NJ lets JM do anything.
  • JK & YG. Yoonk00k have a nice work-friendship between them. They do contact each other occasionally outside of work.
  • Tae has zero friendships with anyone in the group. JM hates this, NJ tries to steer Tae away from having his own friends. The other guys don't care.
  • JM and NJ are also bullies. NJ is the worst but JM can be pretty nasty too. (To clarify, they team up on other members a lot).
  • YG & NJ. It's weird that these two have a close working relationship, but they do. Highly unexpected since they are total opposites in personality. They're just very compatible artistically which is why they collaborate. I have heard though that YG keeps NJ close so that he doesn't have issues with the company.
And here is what Jin apparently thinks of his bandmates. This is to be taken with a grain of salt, although the multiple sources I've talked to all say about the same thing with minor variations in wording. That could be a bunch of people all getting info from one person, or it's could be true, who knows. Jin also gets easily annoyed so there's that to consider.
  • He likes being around YG cause he's easy to get along with.
  • He thinks NJ is stupid and annoying.
  • He tolerates Tae but can't be around him for too long without getting annoyed.
  • He worries about JM a lot. He keeps a distance from him emotionally cause JM is too high maintenance.
  • He likes HS but they do argue on rare occasions and have to take breaks from each other.
  • He spends time with JK for livestreams because their senses of humor are compatible.
  • He used to hang out with the whole maknae line a lot but he doesn't have the energy for them anymore.
Being the oldest, Jn is in a different place in life now. He's at the age people settle down or have settled in with someone special and start a family. The maknaes are in their 20s and that's when most people play the field or have casual relationships. There's people looking to settle down too, but not as much nowadays. He didn't have much in common with the people at Jh's party and sat by himself.

This sounds the most believable out of the information I've heard. I wonder why Rm is so close to Jm and lets him get away with things. He's also Supreme Boy's favorite too.

Tae looked outside the group for validation because they talk to him like he's not intelligent. He's on of the smartest people in the group. Because he doesn't speak like he's a college graduate, they mock and laugh at him. I saw a TV host make fun of his accent and it probably hurt his feelings. Now he's proven to them many times that he has a lot of connections outside the group. He doesn't have to do anything but exist and everyone loses their minds. Why do Jm or Rm care who he hangs around with?
 

Pepsi

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In general I'm fine with him going solo and his performance at Lolla was great. I do kind of but not really wonder why, out of all the band members, HS was the one selected to go to Lolla. At first I thought it was because someone in charge had to be a HS stan, because despite him being the richest member and his first mixtape being the most lucrative, he's not the most popular.
He's the one who's had the most solo work released out of all the members + he's like the only charismatic performer in the group. Dgaf about him as an artist but he did command the stage very well all alone at Lolla. He looks ambitious as well, so maybe he made a lot of connections behind the scenes taking advantage of his low key persona. He seems like he might go far internationally outside bts along with jjk. Not bts level fame though
 
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