Coronavirus

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Jan 27, 2018
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Perhaps what would be most logical, is to allow those who want to go back to work to return to work. And allow those who want to stay in quarantine stay in quarantine.
We're already doing a portion of this when we differentiate between "essential" and "non-essential" workers.
Why not give people the option?
 

rainerann

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Mar 18, 2017
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If we protested by NOT going back when they tell us to unless they provide certain things.. we’d have leverage. But only if people were united on it - which clearly isn’t the case
That is an incredibly good point, and it is truly unfortunate that such an opportunity will probably end up going to waste. There are a lot of opportunities presenting themselves right now that will probably go to waste because people have a very hard time moving forward and frequently seem to want to hang onto an idealized view of the past.
 

justjess

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Mar 16, 2017
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Perhaps what would be most logical, is to allow those who want to go back to work to return to work. And allow those who want to stay in quarantine stay in quarantine.
We're already doing a portion of this when we differentiate between "essential" and "non-essential" workers.
Why not give people the option?
Because the people in charge don’t want to go back to work THEMSELVES. They want their underlines to go back - no matter what they want - to make THEM money while they sit it out safely somewhere.
 

justjess

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That is an incredibly good point, and it is truly unfortunate that such an opportunity will probably end up going to waste. There are a lot of opportunities presenting themselves right now that will probably go to waste because people have a very hard time moving forward and frequently seem to want to hang onto an idealized view of the past.
its an unfortunate situation when people 1) don’t realize their own power and 2) choose to use that power for worthless bs
 

Haich

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Mar 15, 2017
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Anyone in the UK waiting to apply for the 80% wages scheme, contact your employer now. You cannot do it yourself, your employer has to do it from their side.


I've told the college to do my application in the hope that I get some part of my usual income. Even 50% would do me fine...
 

Thunderian

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Mar 13, 2017
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I have just been harangued to give a mobile phone number to access a service I used to access in person.
For social distancing...

They didn't like the refusal that was given. And in fact I will be obliged to give a number, or do without a necessary service.

They got us to buy the instruments of our own repression.
That was the thin end of the wedge, and now they are hammering it home.
The problem is that we can’t have it both ways. We can’t have a government that solves all our problems and also have a total privacy from that government. We told the government to take care of our healthcare, and they told us that this is what that care looks like.

I’m not sure what we think we’re hiding anyway. The government knows all my details already — where I live, what I do, how much I make, and my bank account number. They know everything important about me, and how to get in touch. If they really wanted to find or eavesdrop on me, they don’t need me to give them my cell number. It’s far beyond that point, and the idea — for most of us — of being able to keep anything from the government is a quaint one.

If we want the government to take care of us in the style in which we’ve convinced ourselves is best, this is what we get. Government control of something means as much control of that thing as the government deems necessary. If the government control of the problem we told them to fix involves us giving up freedom we took for granted until now, how can we complain, ya know?

Like the saying goes: "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is a government big enough to take away everything that you have."
 

Thunderian

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They are like antifa...standing in the way...are we sure they aren’t antifa? How can they send out hospital workers to the streets when we have a pandemic? ;)
I’m old enough to remember when Antifa were heroes for blocking emergency vehicles and health workers.
 

The Zone

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Mar 13, 2017
Messages
3,163
The problem is that we can’t have it both ways. We can’t have a government that solves all our problems and also have a total privacy from that government. We told the government to take care of our healthcare, and they told us that this is what that care looks like.

I’m not sure what we think we’re hiding anyway. The government knows all my details already — where I live, what I do, how much I make, and my bank account number. They know everything important about me, and how to get in touch. If they really wanted to find or eavesdrop on me, they don’t need me to give them my cell number. It’s far beyond that point, and the idea — for most of us — of being able to keep anything from the government is a quaint one.

If we want the government to take care of us in the style in which we’ve convinced ourselves is best, this is what we get. Government control of something means as much control of that thing as the government deems necessary. If the government control of the problem we told them to fix involves us giving up freedom we took for granted until now, how can we complain, ya know?

Like the saying goes: "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is a government big enough to take away everything that you have."
This video pretty much covers it all in a clear manner with the concern to your internet privacy and it is worth a watch for the info.

Okay, back to another day of petty arguments from the same few people...
 
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Lisa

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Mar 13, 2017
Messages
20,288
What on earth are you talking about? The people were going to the state capital to protest the shelter in place, and the healthcare workers were in a counter-protest by standing in the street. They were standing there without weapons or threats of violence. Therefore, it is a peaceful protest.

However, I think the main problem is that many people have a very misguided understanding of protest. You don't just decide to make a sign and get a group of people together to take a stand and think that is going to independently make a difference. That isn't how it ever worked. When workers throughout history protested their working conditions, their employers actually needed them, so they were forced to respond to this complaint. There hasn't really been a protest in my lifetime that was comparable to this. These people going to the capital to protest shelter in place orders who are otherwise sitting at home because they were already deemed unessential by the state, what leverage do they really have to protest with?

Nothing, the capital doesn't need to respond to their protest at all because they need absolutely nothing from them at the moment, just like no one needed to respond to antifa's demonstration four years ago. They had no leverage with the institution they were protesting. It was completely empty way of putting themselves in the line of fire for every major media company to do what they wanted and get practically nothing in return outside of the world know that you don't like Trump and in this case, that you don't like the shelter in place. It is a complete waste of time to protest if you don't have some kind of leverage.

The only protest that might be useful is the one that might take place over personal protective equipment shortages because the healthcare workers are necessary, so if they protest, they might end up getting what they want in return. These people protesting the shelter in place, they have no leverage outside threats of violence or the potential to start some kind of civil war because they have absolutely nothing else that the capital wants in exchange for them disbanding their protest. This sort of ignorance towards the function of protest is what would lead to martial law before shelter in place orders ever would, which is another reason I am not a fan of modern empty protests like this.

Which is not bias. It is just a better understanding of the history of the function of protest. I'm not going to go out and waste my time protesting on either side of this issue. But, healthcare workers can actually demonstrate a real witness to the situation in contrast with the people running to the capital that just know what they have learned from watching Fox news and I appreciate this.
Its not a peaceful counter protest if you are standing in the middle of the street, blocking traffic...its called passive/aggressive.

I’m sure they were hoping that the numbers of people protesting would speak for themselves.

Obviously, they didn’t think it was a waste of time. How are government officials going to know that people are tired of the lockdown if no one protests it? Especially now that Colorado is continuing to go left.

It’s bias, everyone has a bias, even those who think they don’t.
 

Awoken2

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Jan 22, 2018
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Zero social distancing


And it appears to look like zero patients

 

Lisa

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Mar 13, 2017
Messages
20,288
Zero social distancing


And it appears to look like zero patients

Could we actually be on the same side on this issue? :eek:
 

illuminatimess

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Sep 3, 2017
Messages
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Its not a peaceful counter protest if you are standing in the middle of the street, blocking traffic...its called passive/aggressive.

I’m sure they were hoping that the numbers of people protesting would speak for themselves.

Obviously, they didn’t think it was a waste of time. How are government officials going to know that people are tired of the lockdown if no one protests it? Especially now that Colorado is continuing to go left.

It’s bias, everyone has a bias, even those who think they don’t.
It’s not. When people don’t have other options to be heard, they have to conduct in that way.
 
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