The "celebrity mind control" aspect on this site doesn't add up completely

Aero

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It's unfortunate, but you do have to ignore a lot of the sensationalism regarding MKUltra. It's always made out to be way more sinister than it actually is. I mean come on, nobody believes pop stars are subjecting themselves to constant electro-shock treatment. Like wouldn't they forget half of their song lyrics?

I think it's also important to note. Pop stars make the most money when they sell out on tour. So a fresh American Idol every 3 years isn't going to sell out stadiums. Than you have to consider all the endorsement deals and every other industry that is supported by music. All I'm saying is, it takes time to create a pop star juggernaut. And once you do, you got them on the hook forever.
 

Mr.Grieves

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Don't agree on 9/11. I think 9/11 conspiracy theories were a huge waste of time (especially now, where it reached levels like "holographic planes").

Here's why: I fully believe in the possibility that it wasn't Al-Quaeda. BUT, why coming up with ultra-complicated schemes instead of brainwashing some "terrorists" and let them indeed fly the planes into the buildings? Now that's what I would use MKULTRA for! (Sirhan Sirhan anyone?)

Far simpler than planting bombs in the buildings and all that jazz.
I agree the 'Holographic planes' and all that shit is total nonsense.
I don't try to speculate about how the attacks were carried out. I'm well aware that I and the vast majority of people spinning theories about it, as well as the vast majority of people claiming those theories are logistically impossible, lack the necessary expertise by and far to make such claims.
I powerfully believe the 9/11 attacks were in part orchestrated by a criminal conspiracy of corporate and government officials in America utterly addicted to the Military Industrial Complex warned about by previous administrations who facilitated the attacks.

I believe this because there was compelling evidence and extremely essential lines of inquiry/investigation that were not only ignored in the same-day conclusion that terrorists abroad and only terrorists abroad were responsible, but rapidly became highest taboo to even MENTION in the media by almost the following day of the attacks. Watching the event very closely as an outsider in Canada, it was extremely eerie to behold the transformation of the American media over those few terrible days, as they went from desperately trying to make sense of the attacks to vehemently pounding down any doubt about the 'a few guys with box-cutters' narrative.

I wont get into it in any great detail, as this is neither the thread nor necessarily the forum for it, but things like the uncanny collapse of WTC 7, the fact that core-column steel beams in the rubble at the base of the towers were photographed as being diagonally cut, the fact that the vast majority of the steel columns that investigators of the most significant building collapses in history would want to see were rapidly sold to China at an incredible discount before they could be inspected, the plethora of witnesses who saw, heard, or were struck by the blasts of what they believed to be bombs detonating at lower levels, the firefighters who say they were confronted by rivers of molten metal, the photographic evidence of melted steel, the lingering extreme hot-spots deep beneath the rubble which lasted for weeks in spite of most of the fires being on high-level floors which had to endure the multiple crushing impacts and oxygen-choked environment of supposedly pancaking floors, and most damning of all the suggestion that a terrorist pulled this very specific maneuver with this very unwieldy plane to strike this very specific section of the Pentagon, and yet no one even investigated the possibility that killing those specific people was perhaps part of the motive.
For one, that specific section of the Pentagon was recently thoroughly reinforced against bombings and had a new sprinkler system installed, a fact which both contained the impact and minimized casualties, as most of the recently renovated section was still unoccupied. Additionally, the people who were stationed there were largely investigative accountants for the Office of Naval Intelligence, who were likely hard at work investigating the 2 trillion missing dollars Donald Rumsfeld had just announced the day before 9/11
A topic which would have been incredibly big news and the subject of considerable investigation, had 9/11 not then occured the next day, killing and destroying the work of those people in the Pentagon most likely to be investigating its waste, and seeing all the other agencies that would have been investigating this issue reassigned to counter-terrorism.

To bring home just how blatantly, glaringly inadequate the 9/11 investigation was, Monicagate, the inquiry into the Bill Clinton blow-job scandal, cost $80 million.

This grotesque movie, starring Nicholas cage, had an estimated budget of $63 million dollars.


The 9/11 Commission, whose mandate it was to provide a a full and complete account of the circumstances surrounding the 9/11 attack, was given a strict budget of $15 million, which they requested to expand, and were refused. They faced constant obstruction from the administration and beyond, to the point that the two chairs of the commission believed it was designed to fail, specifically so that no blame could be assigned to any American.

I don't know bombs, I don't know planes, I don't know holograms, I don't know black ops... but I know a big fucking turd when I see one, and the 9/11 investigation was a big fucking turd, for which there's no reasonable excuse but cover-up.
 
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LaserSharks

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It's unfortunate, but you do have to ignore a lot of the sensationalism regarding MKUltra. It's always made out to be way more sinister than it actually is.
How do you know?

That in itself would be interesting discussion. What does an actual MKULTRA procedure look like nowadays?
 

Mr.Grieves

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And use that on your multimillion dollar popstar, in some basement?
I'm just pointing out that the technology is readily available to anyone with money, and there aren't really many limits on what you can do with your own property when you're wealthy.
 

Mr.Grieves

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What does an actual MKULTRA procedure look like nowadays?
MKULTRA is a discontinued government program, which included but was by no means limited to trauma-based mind-control. An effort to engage in trauma-based mind-control would look a lot like torture, because it's essentially torture.
 

LaserSharks

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An effort to engage in trauma-based mind-control would look a lot like torture, because it's essentially torture.
Are they using trauma based mind control though? That's basically an axiom on this site, but maybe (if they are doing it) it's actually an entirely different technique.

Maybe it's a variation of Scientological auditing for instance.

https://jeta.home.xs4all.nl/scn/Scn-dem-200401/scn/deaths/reports/initiatory-tech.html

On Scientology's secret initiations, the individual is told (while under the suggestibility of hypnotic trance and stress) that he or she is really not one individual but a composite of hundreds, possibly thousands, or even tens of thousands of alien beings (called "body thetans" or "BTs.") These beings are trapped in his or her body as the result of a galactic war that occurred 76 million years ago (OT 3, and OT 5.) Individuals subjected to these initiation techniques are told (while vulnerable) that these alien beings are fighting for control of the individual's body and identity, that these alien beings can make them act insane or become terminally ill, and that only Scientology has the technology to safely "remove" these alien beings from their bodies.

Members spend years of their lives of exposure to these secret levels, talking to their various body parts, trying to get these alien beings out of their bodies. They are repeatedly told that they could go insane and die if they do anything procedurally wrong while trying to remove these other beings.

In these secret initiation levels, to more effectively attack the person's core concepts of self, Hubbard's methods trick the person in trance into believing he is not who he always thought he was. To fragment the individual's personality and integrity on order to facilitate better initiate control, Hubbard induces a hypnotic state of multiple personality similar to an artificial schizophrenia. Many observers report Scientologists switching "personalities" dramatically and abruptly.
 

rainerann

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Weren't they accusing each other of plagiarism?
Well, not exactly. Taylor says she took them in, paid for their food, and then Mark Phillips tells her that she is basically a disinfo agent and leaves. So Brice talks about the feeling of being betrayed by them. Cathy suggests plagiarism if I remember correctly, but it is hard to say because people suggest that Mark is her handler and from Brice's account, he does appear like a handler.

Their stories converge primarily in their account of their daughters. Both claim that their daughters were raped by George Bush Sr. However, besides this, they are not all that similar. Brice appears to be older than Cathy and her life is set about 10 years before Cathy's in almost every way. She also is from California and Cathy is from Michigan and their experiences with childhood are extremely different.

Brice's account is longer in many ways and much, much more detailed in regard to childhood abuse. So I have concluded that even if they are plagiarizing each other, this is likely a coping mechanism and the comments they make about each other result from the isolation that is part of the abuse they experienced. I think that it is possible that both testimonies were premature, but releasing their story when they did could also be another method of coping with the anger and isolation. So it is hard to say and I believe it deserves research because of this.

In regard to the electrocution that you mention. A lot of the older accounts mention private surroundings. "A Nation Betrayed" would be a good resource for this because she describes her experience beginning in the early 1950's. When she describes being onsite, these are not locations that were open to the public so that the accounts of when this type of abuse was experimented with in a scientific way does not seem to be something that the public would have had access to.

However, for the average person, some basic understanding of electrical currents can turn any basement into a torture chamber. Fifty years ago, which is approximately the average time frame from when these testimonies would have taken place, there were more manufacturing jobs in the US. It is possible to consider that it would have been common for a perpetrator to have some understanding of electrical currents to use this as a way to reinforce fear in the victim. This wouldn't have the same controls as an onsite location, but it would be possible.

In our present time, I don't believe that you would need an onsite location or a basement set up to deliver an electrical current without killing a person. You would just need a taser. The electricity serves the function of making someone afraid and debilitating their ability to function, but it is not a requirement to retain "programming." The electric shock isn't just going to wear off at a certain point so that they need another jolt the way you would need to take medication for high blood pressure.

It will debilitate someone so they won't have the energy to pursue something like therapy if the person seemed like they were going to try to get something like this; but otherwise, you wouldn't even need to give someone another jolt if they appeared like they were too afraid to question anything. It seems more like a deterrent that creates motivation for the adult to follow a certain path that they been given by someone trying to control their life.
 

LaserSharks

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It will debilitate someone so they won't have the energy to pursue something like therapy if the person seemed like they were going to try to get something like this; but otherwise, you wouldn't even need to give someone another jolt if they appeared like they were too afraid to question anything. It seems more like a deterrent that creates motivation for the adult to follow a certain path that they been given by someone trying to control their life.
So it kinda works like Cesar Milan's "tsst"-grip?
 

Vixy

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1. They are used for more than entertainers, they have a multi functioning purpose. Everything frome lite soldiers (DELTA) to prostitutes who film and blackmail polititians.

2. They need to be MK'd to fit in their role as an entertainer, being able to swtitch personas in seconds, since you need to be able to dissociate fast to shift personas like this.

3. During the many MANY interviews I've seen with celebrities, it shows a high range of dissociation throughout these videos. No doubt about that. You can even see them "dissapear" ever so often.
 

LaserSharks

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1. They are used for more than entertainers, they have a multi functioning purpose. Everything frome lite soldiers (DELTA) to prostitutes who film and blackmail polititians.
Yes, I have seen the tape where Bill Clinton acts like a zombie for example.



I am trying to make sense of it - again, the logistics of it. I can see how someone like Britney might have a "handler". But to put the president for example into a basement for a torture session, away from all his entourage...

Is it voluntary to some extend? Like an extreme form of self-improvement therapy to keep a high performance at the job?
 
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Mr.Grieves

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Yes, I have seen the tape where Bill Clinton acts like a zombie for example.



I am trying to make sense of it - again, the logistics of it. I can see how someone like Britney might have a "handler". But to put the president for example into a basement for a torture session, away from all his entourage...

Is it voluntary to some extend? Like an extreme form of self-improvement therapy to keep a high performance at the job?
There's a woman out there, can't remember her name (might actually be the one Fritz references), who accused the Clintons of using her as a sex slave when she was a child, and suggested that Hillary was the real predator, whereas Bill always just seemed to follow her around like a dog. Can't remember her name though, and trying to google the story gives me all pizzagate stuff, and this lady's story predates that. She wasn't a particularly credible witness of course, had a plethora of mental health issues, but if someone HAD gone through this process, one would expect such of them.
 

Helioform

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LaserSharks

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I didn't mean that. I meant the MK of Bill Clinton himself. Any idea how that procedure might work? Keeping him from his secret service agents for a period of time and so on?
 
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Karlysymon

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There's something going on, certainly. But is it related to MKULTRA and are they all MKed? That's an entirely different matter. I just don't see why you need to "control" these pop stars. What's the point
This is how I understand the issue. Hollywood is first and foremost an extension or the another arm of the Espionage complex. Yeah, we get entertained and all that but its the quickest way to transform any society. One will argue that Hollywood predates the CIA or the OSS and that's true but then you have people like Houdini who were assets. Its been said that journalists and entertainers make the best spies! And if you want an efficient spy/asset, you'll need some MK.

I would argue that most artists wouldn't do or push the things that they push but they are trapped. If the ultimate goal is to degenerate any society, you need people to sell the idea. Since most people won't freely do it, one has to find a way to control them and "get things done". Ke$ha is a good example. She said she didn't want to sing the song 'Die Young' but had to because of contractual obligation but atleast she tried to break free. I also think its the same story with Taylor Swift.

The other thing is, apparently, dissociation is hereditary. If one's parent (female esp.) was mk'd, their offspring dissociate more easily, so the perps don't have to try as hard.

Anyone heard of Svali? According to her writings, the occult hierarchy themselves are always under dissociation (they are all mind controlled themselves). What's your take on this? Especially the infrastructure to keep that going?
If you are familiar with the Dutroux affair (Marc Dutroux, the monster of Belgium running pedo rings for Europe's elite, stretching to the US aswell), a huge scandal that almost brought down the Belgian govt of that time. Well, keeping in mind he was well aware of protection afforded him from the highest reaches of govt because of his "services", he had this to say:

"People want to believe that iam at the center of everything. They are mistaken. I did things of which I wasn't the driving force. I was used as an instrument by others, who were themselves used as instruments by others."
 

Masked crusader7

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This is how I understand the issue. Hollywood is first and foremost an extension or the another arm of the Espionage complex. Yeah, we get entertained and all that but its the quickest way to transform any society. One will argue that Hollywood predates the CIA or the OSS and that's true but then you have people like Houdini who were assets. Its been said that journalists and entertainers make the best spies! And if you want an efficient spy/asset, you'll need some MK.

I would argue that most artists wouldn't do or push the things that they push but they are trapped. If the ultimate goal is to degenerate any society, you need people to sell the idea. Since most people won't freely do it, one has to find a way to control them and "get things done". Ke$ha is a good example. She said she didn't want to sing the song 'Die Young' but had to because of contractual obligation but atleast she tried to break free. I also think its the same story with Taylor Swift.

The other thing is, apparently, dissociation is hereditary. If one's parent (female esp.) was mk'd, their offspring dissociate more easily, so the perps don't have to try as hard.


If you are familiar with the Dutroux affair (Marc Dutroux, the monster of Belgium running pedo rings for Europe's elite, stretching to the US aswell), a huge scandal that almost brought down the Belgian govt of that time. Well, keeping in mind he was well aware of protection afforded him from the highest reaches of govt because of his "services", he had this to say:

"People want to believe that iam at the center of everything. They are mistaken. I did things of which I wasn't the driving force. I was used as an instrument by others, who were themselves used as instruments by others."[/QUO i belive it!
 

Vixy

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This is how I understand the issue. Hollywood is first and foremost an extension or the another arm of the Espionage complex. Yeah, we get entertained and all that but its the quickest way to transform any society. One will argue that Hollywood predates the CIA or the OSS and that's true but then you have people like Houdini who were assets. Its been said that journalists and entertainers make the best spies! And if you want an efficient spy/asset, you'll need some MK.

I would argue that most artists wouldn't do or push the things that they push but they are trapped. If the ultimate goal is to degenerate any society, you need people to sell the idea. Since most people won't freely do it, one has to find a way to control them and "get things done". Ke$ha is a good example. She said she didn't want to sing the song 'Die Young' but had to because of contractual obligation but atleast she tried to break free. I also think its the same story with Taylor Swift.

The other thing is, apparently, dissociation is hereditary. If one's parent (female esp.) was mk'd, their offspring dissociate more easily, so the perps don't have to try as hard.


If you are familiar with the Dutroux affair (Marc Dutroux, the monster of Belgium running pedo rings for Europe's elite, stretching to the US aswell), a huge scandal that almost brought down the Belgian govt of that time. Well, keeping in mind he was well aware of protection afforded him from the highest reaches of govt because of his "services", he had this to say:

"People want to believe that iam at the center of everything. They are mistaken. I did things of which I wasn't the driving force. I was used as an instrument by others, who were themselves used as instruments by others."
Don't forget all of those who seeked the fame volunteeringly, like:


(CLEAR on that its not an expression, itäs REAL and litterally.

And look how he's feeling.. Doesnt seem like a good bargain to sell out to evil, does it?
 
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