Witch Population doubled in 2018 rise of Satanists

[Colonel Valerio]

From the Bible, anyone practicing sin - which includes magic [black, white], wicca, occultism, divination, necromancy, paganism, dark arts, etc - is following the Biblical satan. I understand they may not be considered satanists by the world's definition, but he is their leader whether they realize it or not. It's a deception. (1 John 3:8, Ps 106:36-39, Deut 18:10-12, Isa 47:12-14, 1 Cor 10:20-22, Gal 5:19)



Definition of a Christian:
John 12:26 “Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”
Acts 5:29 “We must obey God rather than men.”

Any church, group, organization, pastor, teacher, person not doing the above is not Christian, end of. That rules out your 'visible forms of Christianity' false assumption list. Personal responsibility: If a person is following a false religion or false movement, they have only themselves to blame. It's not Jesus' fault, and it's definitely not Trump's fault.



Let's break it down:
1. You have not personally met 'millions of Americans' - identified as evangelical or otherwise.
2. If you had met these millions, you would have to know and question each one according to the Bible to determine their beliefs and determine they are 'politically corrupt and dangerous' [your words].
3. You didn't do 1. or 2., therefore BS conclusion.

Here's what you can't seem to wrap your head around: Millions of individuals made a decision vote for Trump and vote against Hillary. No one forced them to do this.



Exactly right.

85% of Evangelicals supported him, and their politics have been corrupt and dangerous since the Reagan Eighties, nothing new.

If pastor or the husband says vote for him, they will and they did.

Sure “millions” voted for him (still lost the popular vote) but Evangelicals are a huge part of his base without who he would not be in power.

 

[TempestOfTempo]

Millenials were raised on the occult [tv, movies, music, books, magazines], so to blame Trump is utterly ridiculous. Society is simply reaping what it's sown FOR YEARS. Seriously, it's time to get a new line other than 'because Trump'. Personal responsibility for actions and behavior is a real thing.

Trump plays his part to the hilt in regards to the deepening of the vulgarity and elitist shadow clutch on the throat of decent society.

 

[Aazaad]

Several years ago: "They weren't witches, they were women wrongfully accused of witchcraft, by religious people, just because they were bold, or different"
Now: "All those poor witches that were burned just because they were witches!"

 

[Colonel Valerio]

1. Define corrupt and dangerous.

2. Are you saying Christians don't have a mind of their own and don't research issues? Are you saying they only do what their pastor or husband [seriously can't believe I just read that] tells them to do? If yes, provide evidence that all/most Christians behave this way.

3. Which churches endorse a candidate and tell their members who to vote for. Be specific.

4. Your statement about women voting as their husbands 'tell them to' displays serious ignorance and misogyny. If you really believe women are too stupid to do their own research and vote how they want, you are a misogynist. Congrats.

1. Right Wing

2. Yes, just google Christian Right Voting Statitisics, they have supported in high numbers all Republicans since Reagan.

3. Not necessarily a specific church but Christian Right media 700 Club, Focus on the Family, and whole host of “family values” think tanks and organizations.

4. I don’t think women are stupid at all, but women in fundamentalist marriages do as their husbands tell them to.

 

[Dalit]

3. Which churches endorse a candidate and tell their members who to vote for. Be specific.

A charismatic home church did (this is the crazy NAR/New Apostolic Reformation one I went to). I had a dissenting opinion and was almost shamed for it by some. So I quit going there. No church should tell you how to vote, but some do. Not in so many words like "vote for T/C, whoever" but by stating that one specific party is more closely aligned with Christian beliefs. Umm, how about no party is really aligned with Christian beliefs because the two-party system is bipolar? Someone called it bipolar in another thread and it fits.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

1. Ok, so you got zero. If you're going to launch accusations against a group of people, at least have the guts to back it up with an explanation.

2. Without explaining how evangelicals are 'corrupt and dangerous', it makes the rest of your statements null and void. Goes right back to this:

1. You have not personally met 'millions of Americans' - identified as evangelical or otherwise.
2. If you had met these millions, you would have to know and question each one according to the Bible to determine their beliefs and determine they are 'politically corrupt and dangerous' [your words].
3. You didn't do 1. or 2., therefore BS conclusion.

2. Ah, so you have no clue.

4. Too late. You've already given your true self away. Again, you have no clue what women as individuals do - how dare you try to speak for us or any other particular group. Refer to #2 above.

Yeah it’s right wing politics, which they support. Their voting trends since the 80s prove this. I know what Evangelicalism is and what they support and believe in. I was raised it in and my mother and sister are a part of it still.

If you are denying that the Evangelical movement is a right-wing political movement you are denying reality. I don’t have to personally know millions of them to know how they think. I also pay attention to Evangelical publications. I live 60 miles from the fundie capital of Colorado Springs.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

Yes, I know about the NAR - bad group and a cult. I'm so glad you walked away. The majority of churches - and I mean legit churches - do not and will not tell their members who to vote for, and for several reasons. Here's what a church cannot do by law, otherwise they lose their tax exempt status:

• Endorse or campaign for candidates for elected office in the name of the church
• Contribute money or make “in kind” contributions, (such as resources or services), to a candidate, political party or political action committee
• Distribute materials that endorse a particular candidate or political party
• Allow candidates to solicit funds from the congregation (from the pulpit)
• Create a church political committee that would do any of the above

Point is, no one can say all/most churches pushed their members to vote for Trump, because they didn't. Some people just cannot wrap their heads around the fact that people from all walks, all beliefs, all colors, all genders voted for Trump and against Hillary.

Last paragraph isn’t really true though, Evangelical support for Trump in 2016 was high 80s and it still stands that way. The churches may not outright endorse but other Evangelical outlets do, and it’s implied support at the least.

And his support was hardly from “all walks of life” it was almost universally uneducated whites. He won on a fluke of 100k votes or so spread across 3 states against a terrible candidate in her own right, and lost the popular vote my millions. He’s only president because the constitution gives far to much power to rural shit kick America.


Didn’t Trump get rid of that amendment that blocked Pastors from outright endorsing people anyway?

The point is you are out of your mind if you don’t think the Evangelical movement encourages a certain politics.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

Before the Reagan administration, while fundamentalist Christianity was a thing it was it's own thing but with the abortion issue becoming a bigger thing, conservatives in America managed to seduce Catholicism to its cause. While Catholics weren't the only radical Christians, in America, they were the backbone and with Catholic activism shifting to general anti-abortion activism the movement collapsed. Old organizations became shadows of their former selves and new ones never managed to pick up steam.

The impact was so serve that at least in Catholicism, even the mainstream was warped. Nothing Francis said is different from previous popes but increased reactionary belief just made things worse.

We need more Dorothy Day and less Opus Dei

 

[Colonel Valerio]

Seriously, you can't answer a simple question on the specifics of why 'right wing politics' are corrupt and dangerous? Got it.

Definition of evangelical
1 : of, relating to, or being in agreement with the Christian gospel especially as it is presented in the four Gospels
2 : protestant
3 : emphasizing salvation by faith in the atoning death of Jesus Christ through personal conversion, the authority of Scripture, and the importance of preaching as contrasted with ritual

Wow... so evil! You are smearing people without even knowing the definition of evangelical. To compare small pockets of cults with Biblical evangelical Christianity is complete ignorance on your part. Maybe it's time to grow up and get to know real, actual Christians instead of hating them from afar.

You should also rethink your 'progressive' stance on women, because what you displayed here against a group of women you don't even know is MISOGYNY, plain and simple.

Their voting trends over the year overwhelmingly support right wing politics, and for example the Iraq War, anti-lgbt measures, cronyist corporate policies are just a few things that make it a dangerous political movement. It is what is and Evangelicals are the religious right. It’s a real thing with real power, you can pretend otherwise but it’s not reality.

I was raised in an Evangelical Church, my mom and sister and her husband and his family are Evangelicals, I know evangelicals. I don’t hate anybody but the Christian Right is a dangerous political movement and I won’t ever stop calling them out.

I must of hit a nerve because that is how Evangelical Women act, or are expected to act. Also, I don’t care what you think

 

[Dalit]

Yes, I know about the NAR - bad group and a cult. I'm so glad you walked away. The majority of churches - and I mean legit churches - do not and will not tell their members who to vote for, and for several reasons. Here's what a church cannot do by law, otherwise they lose their tax exempt status:

• Endorse or campaign for candidates for elected office in the name of the church
• Contribute money or make “in kind” contributions, (such as resources or services), to a candidate, political party or political action committee
• Distribute materials that endorse a particular candidate or political party
• Allow candidates to solicit funds from the congregation (from the pulpit)
• Create a church political committee that would do any of the above

Point is, no one can say all/most churches pushed their members to vote for Trump, because they didn't. Some people just cannot wrap their heads around the fact that people from all walks, all beliefs, all colors, all genders voted for Trump and against Hillary.

You're right because of 501(c)(3) yet I've noticed from living near the deep South that some can get away with steering certain groups to the left or to the right.

So glad I got out of NAR, too! The voting thing was one of the things that awakened me to the need to leave. The other things and the really major things were the fact this "church" didn't hardly use the Bible at all, didn't really worship, and wanted to touch everyone and heal them, wanted to experiment with looking for angels, but that's neither here nor there for this thread.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

Your family has absolutely nothing to do with the rest of the world, you do know that, right? Sounds like your universe revolves around them and you haven't moved past it. Your argument boils down to 'Because I said so'. And we're supposed to take your word for it... why?

If you want to continue to claim you know how evangelical women act, feel free, just don't whine when it comes back to haunt you.

Stop just stop. It goes beyond my personal experience. I’ve researched the movement, I read their publications and watch their propaganda, I mean outlets. Opinion polling and voter statistics prove what they support, they have powerful politicians working daily to enact a right wing agenda. For the last time you can pretend that the religious right doesn’t exist, but it does.

 

[Dalit]

Yeah, the NAR are Dominionist, and the Bible has nothing to do with it. The focus on crazy experiences, false prophecies and false teachings , just like you said. Scripture is considered 'not complete', hence they go beyond to their destruction. I've spent a lot of time studying various cults, and it's just ridiculous how they twist and manipulate people. It shows their true heart. At least you are OUT! Hopefully you can convince others to come out, as well.

I got one out of there, but it took some convincing. Wish I could've gotten more. But I digress.

 

[Dalit]

Sorry that this got off track. I have seen churches, despite 501(c)(3) status, steer people left or right depending on the audience. Don't like that, really don't like that, but know it's true.

 

[elsbet]

The three most visible forms of Christianity to Americans (and probably world wide) are The Catholic Church and the sex abuse scandal, Evangelical fundamentalists ( Think Pat Robertson or James Dobson and the entire city of Colorado Springs), and more frequently far-right neo-fascist movements.

You can't blame people looking elsewhere when that is the face of a faith. It's a shame Gary North is a popular theologian, and scary how much influence he has, while no one really knows about this man ( and associated people)

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/americas-street-priest/

Maybe that's the way it should be for true believers, they do the right thing solely to do it without thought to reputation or reward.
.

These groups--

​

The Catholic Church and the sex abuse scandal, Evangelical fundamentalists ( Think Pat Robertson or James Dobson...), and more frequently far-right neo-fascist movements.​

-- are entrenched in Politics... always have been. The Catholics... rumour has it they control it all, anyway. But none of these groups actually represents authentic Christianity.

Even your Berrigan... while I agree that Trinity ought to drop the charges, Berrigan is still just another political personality-- hes talking about faith but his pet agenda is apparently the embodiment of his faith. And Trinity is not the sole owner of that property, according to other sources-- :/

Its media-manufactured bullshit, for the most part... and its working beautifully on those who believe the headlines.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

These groups--

​

The Catholic Church and the sex abuse scandal, Evangelical fundamentalists ( Think Pat Robertson or James Dobson...), and more frequently far-right neo-fascist movements.​

-- are entrenched in Politics... always have been. The Catholics... rumour has it they control it all, anyway. But none of these groups actually represents authentic Christianity.

Even your Berrigan... while I agree that Trinity ought to drop the charges, Berrigan is still just another political personality-- hes talking about faith but his pet agenda is apparently the embodiment of his faith. And Trinity is not the sole owner of that property, according to other sources-- :/

Its media-manufactured bullshit, for the most part... and its working beautifully on those who believe the headlines.

Yeah they don’t represent authentic Christianity but they are it’s face.

Ironically two examples in recent memory for me, that represent authentic Christianity are two Catholics, Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin.

Yeah Berrigan was a radical but he lived his life dedicated to others. He gave all he had of himself and tried with all he had to live the Gospel truth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catonsville_Nine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Berrigan

 

[elsbet]

Yeah they don’t represent authentic Christianity but they are it’s face.

Ironically two examples in recent memory for me, that represent authentic Christianity are two Catholics, Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin.

Yeah Berrigan was a radical but he lived his life dedicated to others. He gave all he had of himself and tried with all he had to live the Gospel truth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catonsville_Nine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Berrigan

Interesting.

Father Daniel Berrigan, a Jesuit priest

And...

On October 17, 1967, Fr. Philip Berrigan [Josephite priest] and Tom Lewis raided the Baltimore City Custom House and poured blood on draft records.

Thanks for the added information.

 

[awakened32]

Interesting.

Father Daniel Berrigan, a Jesuit priest

And...

On October 17, 1967, Fr. Philip Berrigan [Josephite priest] and Tom Lewis raided the Baltimore City Custom House and poured blood on draft records.

Thanks for the added information.

JESUIT? Thanks for routing out the snakes, geez.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

Interesting.

Father Daniel Berrigan, a Jesuit priest

And...

On October 17, 1967, Fr. Philip Berrigan [Josephite priest] and Tom Lewis raided the Baltimore City Custom House and poured blood on draft records.

Thanks for the added information.

Yeah , good symbolism. Those draft records were the blood of human beings, who were being conscripted into an illegal war of aggression against a foreign populace. You are damn right that those draft records are paid for in blood. Maybe they saved some poor bastard from being a draftee into that fucked up war. I don't care if his education came from the Jesuits, I'll look at his his actions. Father Berrigan devoted his life to the marginalized, very few will remember him while Billy Graham got a state funeral. That speaks for itself, he wasn't in it for recognition or a desire of influence or converts, but because it was right.

 

[elsbet]

Yeah , good symbolism. Those draft records were the blood of human beings, who were being conscripted into an illegal war of aggression against a foreign populace. You are damn right that those draft records are paid for in blood. Maybe they saved some poor bastard from being a draftee into that fucked up war. I don't care if his education came from the Jesuits, I'll judge him on his actions. Father Berrigan devoted his life to the marginalized, very few will remember him while Billy Graham got a state funeral. That speaks for itself, he wasn't in it for recognition or a desire of influence or converts, but because it was right.

It wasn't just a Jesuit education-- he went on to be a Jesuit priest. Lots of people have a Jesuit education. I think the fire was probably more constructively destructive than the bloody symbolism of the other Berrigan. Looking back at all the publicity both acts must have garnered, though, it makes you wonder how far the Hegelian dialectic was actually employed. I mean they breached security in a government building-- twice. Even in the 60s, that's quite a feat. Idk.. it's just odd.

 

[Colonel Valerio]

It wasn't just a Jesuit education-- he went on to be a Jesuit priest. Lots of people have a Jesuit education. I think the fire was probably more constructively destructive than the bloody symbolism of the other Berrigan. Looking back at all the publicity both acts must have garnered, though, it makes you wonder how far the Hegelian dialectic was actually employed. I mean they breached security in a government building-- twice. Even in the 60s, that's quite a feat. Idk.. it's just odd.

So what? If that was his calling so be it. There is nothing more Christian than to oppose war. I would go so far as to say voluntary military service especially in war time is incompatible with being an actual Christian. I will still view the Berrigan brothers based on how they lived, and to me they did their best to live their lives in the service of others and to those without a voice. Security measures were way different back then, and the draft board offices aren't exactly the CIA headquarters. They were dedicated and they carried out a powerful act of civil disobedience (several times) they did not hurt anyone nor did they have the intention to.

Again if they are part of some big bad conspiracy why do they have less influence than Billy Graham or even whackos like Jack Chick or JR Rushdoony? All three of them have more of an impact on modern Christianity than the Berrigans.

And therein lies the truth.