who is this man?

InfoHarb

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Everyone can plainly see for themselves that a certain group of "Muslims" here engage in behavior such as:
- Armchair diagnosing other posters who seem to be going through emotional or spiritual issues. Their "diagnosis" essentially includes first probing and inquiring the persons background and whats bothering them, then mocking and insulting the person, wishing the worst on them and asking to interact with the "demons" they have ascribed to the posters in turmoil. Quite the helping hand there eh?
- Constantly complaining about/attacking Christians and other groups/individuals while wholly refusing to address issues within their own Muslim communities.
- Claiming that in Islamic theology, Allah is the/a "father"... shirk much?
- Refusing to address why they support faulty fatwa's and hadeeth interpretations which allow for the EPIDEMIC of grown men engaging in forced marriages with children under the age of ten and the subsequent rapes of those children during the "marriage"...
just admit you're an anti-Muslim poster.
 






TempestOfTempo

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@TempestOfTempo can you just make an age of Aisha thread and stop making random threads about the age of Aisha?
We have those threads already. I am one of the posters who has made them in the past... the results are always the same. Yall just duck and dodge the heart of the matter, utilizing it as an opportunity to howl about non-Muslims instead of presenting whatever proof you claim to have.
 






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InfoHarb

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We have those threads already. I am one of the posters who has made them in the past... the results are always the same. Yall just duck and dodge the heart of the matter, utilizing it as an opportunity to howl about non-Muslims instead of presenting whatever proof you claim to have.
DR already made a very long post about it, I made a post about it, if you had your way, I think we'd be endlessly discussing it until we all die or until the Day of Judgement.
 






akay

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Jesus in the Quran holds one of the highest statures amongst the Prophets. Unlike other Prophets who performed miracles, Jesus himself was a miracle, as he was born of a virgin mother, and God describes him and his mother Mary as such:
“…and We made her (Mary) and her son (Jesus) a sign for the worlds.” (Quran 21:91)
Nonetheless, in the Quran, Jesus is described as having many miracles not bestowed upon other prophets. God says:
“And We gave unto Jesus, son of Mary, clear miracles” (Quran 2:87)
The following is a brief description of the miracles performed by Jesus mentioned in the Quran.

1. A Table Laden with Food
In the fifth chapter of the Quran, “The Table Laden with Food” – named after this miracle of Jesus, God narrates how the disciples of Jesus requested him to ask God to send down a table laden with food, and for it to be a special day of commemoration for them in the future.
“When the disciples said: O Jesus, son of Mary! Is your Lord able to send down for us a table spread with food from heaven? He said: Observe your duty to God, if ye are true believers. They said: We desire to eat of it and our hearts be at rest, and that We may know that you have spoken truth to us, and that We may be witnesses thereof. Jesus, son of Mary, said: 'O God, our Lord, send down for us a Table laden with food out of heaven, that shall be for us a recurring festival, the first and last of us, and a miracle from You. And provide us our sustenance, for You are the best of providers!” (Quran 5:112-114)
Since the occasion was to be “for us a recurring festival,” it is likely the Last Supper,[1] also called the Lord's Supper, Breaking of Bread, Eucharist, or Communion. The Eucharist has always been at the center of Christian worship. Encyclopedia Britannica says:
“Eucharist is a Christian sacrament commemorating the action of Jesus at his Last Supper with his disciples … The letters of Paul and the Acts of the Apostles make it clear that early Christianity believed that this institution included a mandate to continue the celebration… The Eucharist has formed a central rite of Christian worship.”


2. While Still in the Cradle
One of the miracles mentioned in the Quran, although not mentioned in the Bible, is that fact that Jesus, while still in the cradle, spoke out to protect his mother Mary from any accusations people may have placed on her due to having a child without a father. When she was approached about this strange incident after her childbirth, Mary merely pointed to Jesus, and he miraculously spoke, just as God had promised her upon annunciation.
“He shall speak to people while still in the cradle, and in manhood, and he shall be from the righteous.” (Quran 3:46)
Jesus said to the people:
“I am indeed a slave of God. He has given me the Book and made me a Prophet, and He has made me blessed wherever I may be. And He has enjoined upon me prayers, and to pay the alms, as long as I live and (He has made me) kind to my mother, and He has not made me insolent, unblessed. And may Peace be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and on the Day I shall be raised to life.” (Quran 19:30-33)



3. And It Becomes a Bird
God mentions a miracle given to none other in the Quran but Jesus, one which is quite parallel to how God himself created Adam. This miracle was one which none can argue its greatness. God mentions in the Quran that Jesus says:
“I create for you out of clay the likeness of a bird, then I breathe into it and it becomes a bird with God’s permission.” (Quran 3:49)
This miracle is not found in the New Testament, but it is found in the non-canonical ‘Infancy Gospel of Thomas,’ “When this boy, Jesus, was five years old, he was playing at the ford of a rushing stream… he then made soft clay and shaped it into twelve sparrows… but Jesus simply clapped his hands and shouted to the sparrows: “Be off, fly away, and remember me, you who are now alive!” And the sparrows took off and flew away noisily.” (Infancy Gospel of Thomas:2)


4. Healing the Blind and the Leper
Similar to the New Testament[3], The Quran also mentions Jesus to a have healed the blind and lepers.
“I also heal the blind and the leper.” (Quran 3:49)
The Jews during the time of Jesus were quite advanced in the science of medicine and were quite proud of their achievements. For this reason, miracles of this nature were given by God to Jesus, ones which the Jews could well understand that no force in nature could perform its like.


5. The Resurrection of the Dead
“…and I bring to life the dead, by the permission of God.” (Quran 3:49)
This, like the creation of a bird, was a miracle of incomparable nature, one which should have caused the Jews to believe in the prophethood of Jesus without doubt. In the New Testament, we read three cases where Jesus brought the dead back to life by God’s permission - the daughter of Jairus (Matt 9:18, 23; Mark 5:22, 35; Luke 8:40, 49), the widow's son at Nain (Luke 7:11), and Lazarus (John 11:43).


6. The Provisions of Today and Tomorrow
Jesus was given the miracle of knowing what people had just eaten, as well as what they had in store for the coming days. God says.
“I inform you too of what things you eat, and what you store up in your houses. Surely in that is a sign for you, if you are believers.” (Quran 3:49)
A Demonstration of Truth
Similar to other prophets, Jesus performed miracles to convince skeptics of his truthfulness, not to demonstrate his divinity. The Quran says:
“Surely in that is a sign for you, if you are believers.” (Quran 3:49)
These miracles were performed only by the Will of God, had he not willed them to occur, they could never come to be. God explicitly states this in the Quran, saying that they were:
“…by the permission of God” (Quran 3:49; 5:10)


Although Muslims can not confirm it, the Bible, through certain narrations, states that Jesus at times failed to perform miracles. Once when Jesus tried to heal a blind man, he was not healed after the first attempt, and Jesus had to try a second time (Mark 8: 22-26). In another instance, “He could not do any miracles there, except lay his hands on a few sick people and heal them.”(Mark 6:5)
The fact remains that indeed it was not through his own will that Jesus or any other prophet performed miracles. Rather, they were performed only by Will of God Almighty - a fact also explicitly stated in the Bible:
“A man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through him in your midst.” (Acts 2:22


The Miracles of Jesus - Siraj Wahhaj

جميلة جولى حاولت تنصير صديقتها المسلمة وبعد إلحاح وافقت صديقتها ولكن بشرط واحد

إمارة إسلامية في أمريكا - خالد ياسين (مترجم) Islamic State in America - Khalid Yasin
 






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TempestOfTempo

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DR already made a very long post about it, I made a post about it, if you had your way, I think we'd be endlessly discussing it until we all die or until the Day of Judgement.
You and shibshib got what you wanted... a thread devoted entirely to the topic. See you there?
 






akay

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القرآن الكريم والعلم الحديث كاملة The Quran and Modern Science full Zakir naik youtube



 






akay

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Is his name Jesus Christ or isa? Misrepresentation .... even in the name of the Holy Prophet!

the writings of the Fathers and historians in the early centuries , and we read them :
Epiphanius in the writings of the second century AD :
Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis:
"They who believe on Christ were called iessaei before they were called Christians. These derived their constitution from the significance of the name Iesus, which in Hebrew signifies the same as Therapeutae, that is, saviour or physician."
www.wisdomworld.org/setting/thegnostics....

Epiphanius says that the early followers of Christ had their name (issaei)
Many say that these are also the (essenes)
He says that this name is purported to be the name of iesus ( as pronounced in Greek ) , which means a doctor or a savior in Hebrew ( and Hebrew at the time of Christ was the Aramaic ! Shows this flaw in the definition of many books for parents , especially when describing the Gospel of Matthew Aramaic , which he called the other ( Hebrew) ) ! !
..
This means that the name of Christ iesus means the doctor or the Savior ! !
It is known that the language of Jesus was Aramaic ! !
When I moved the names of the Aramaic into Greek changed ( do not know about the Greek ) , such as:
Barnabas ( Laramie ) became Barnabas ( Baleonana )

And we go back Hecmaflo iesus name from the Greek to Aramaic ( the language of Christ ) again to those who are supposed to be iessa ( Isa ) ... and this also shows the keyword iessaei
Someone may come and say : You are an impostor ! !
How assume a name without a guide ? ! !
I tell him : Esberabivanius says that the meaning of iesus is a doctor or a savior , says it was similar to a word Therapeutae
Does that mean iessa doctor Aramaic ? ? ? To see! !
Most simplicity , you can use this dictionary type and the physician ( doctor) and will give you the meaning and pronunciation of the word in Aramaic letters etymology
www.peshitta.org/lexicon/
Let's try and look ! !
Word: 0ys0
Lexeme: 0ys0
Root: 0s0
Word Number: 1628
Meaning: physician
Pronunciation: (Eastern) AaSYaA
(Western) AoSYoA
Part of Speech: Noun
Gender: Masculine
Person:
Number: Singular
State: Emphatic
So again AaSYaA dialect pronunciation Eastern ?
It may be the name of Jesus Christ, peace be upon him is derived from the word doctor Asia ... it is not surprising it was the miracles of Jesus are all in the field of medicine !

...

What cut removes all doubt is what will come , God willing, one of the scientists say manuscripts Aalghemranih
5 - and read in the encyclopedia and Kibdia the following:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essenes
According to a controversial view put forward by Dead Sea Scrolls Scholar Géza Vermes, both Josephus and Philo pronounced the essenes name as "Esaoin", which means in Arabic followers of "Esa", which Vermes says is the name of Jesus according to the most ancient mosaic portrait found in Turkey dated 70 AD which says underneath "Esa our Lord".
According to the word ( brief symbolizes ) World of the Dead Sea manuscripts says :
That according to the reported Josephus and Philo that the name is Alasnnin esaion and says he means to follow Jesus in Arabic ( Issaon )
He says that what it asserts is the oldest trace Mousavi ( the oldest ever ) and finder in Turkey dates back to the year 70 AD ( the oldest manuscripts of the New Testament !)
It is a plates written on it ( our Lord Jesus )
....
It was Salva before the discovery of these paintings he has claimed many of the imams delusion that the name iessaei or esaion mentioned in the books of Philo and Josephus and Epiphanius but it is the name ascribed to a place called essa and of course did not specify where this place and how they knew this Almkananma is indisputable Balbatlualve detect falseness is the emergence of these paintings discovered and written under the name Alchristola I can only put the strongest evidence and believe Dleilbasm of God the Merciful ( Al Imran )
[And mention] when the angels said, "O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah




جندي امريكي يريد إعتناق الإسلام لكنه يخشى عائلته | عثمان بن فاروق مترجم
 






Bubbajay

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Messages
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Is his name Jesus Christ or isa? Misrepresentation .... even in the name of the Holy Prophet!

the writings of the Fathers and historians in the early centuries , and we read them :
Epiphanius in the writings of the second century AD :
Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis:
"They who believe on Christ were called iessaei before they were called Christians. These derived their constitution from the significance of the name Iesus, which in Hebrew signifies the same as Therapeutae, that is, saviour or physician."
www.wisdomworld.org/setting/thegnostics....

Epiphanius says that the early followers of Christ had their name (issaei)
Many say that these are also the (essenes)
He says that this name is purported to be the name of iesus ( as pronounced in Greek ) , which means a doctor or a savior in Hebrew ( and Hebrew at the time of Christ was the Aramaic ! Shows this flaw in the definition of many books for parents , especially when describing the Gospel of Matthew Aramaic , which he called the other ( Hebrew) ) ! !
..
This means that the name of Christ iesus means the doctor or the Savior ! !
It is known that the language of Jesus was Aramaic ! !
When I moved the names of the Aramaic into Greek changed ( do not know about the Greek ) , such as:
Barnabas ( Laramie ) became Barnabas ( Baleonana )

And we go back Hecmaflo iesus name from the Greek to Aramaic ( the language of Christ ) again to those who are supposed to be iessa ( Isa ) ... and this also shows the keyword iessaei
Someone may come and say : You are an impostor ! !
How assume a name without a guide ? ! !
I tell him : Esberabivanius says that the meaning of iesus is a doctor or a savior , says it was similar to a word Therapeutae
Does that mean iessa doctor Aramaic ? ? ? To see! !
Most simplicity , you can use this dictionary type and the physician ( doctor) and will give you the meaning and pronunciation of the word in Aramaic letters etymology
www.peshitta.org/lexicon/
Let's try and look ! !
Word: 0ys0
Lexeme: 0ys0
Root: 0s0
Word Number: 1628
Meaning: physician
Pronunciation: (Eastern) AaSYaA
(Western) AoSYoA
Part of Speech: Noun
Gender: Masculine
Person:
Number: Singular
State: Emphatic
So again AaSYaA dialect pronunciation Eastern ?
It may be the name of Jesus Christ, peace be upon him is derived from the word doctor Asia ... it is not surprising it was the miracles of Jesus are all in the field of medicine !

...

What cut removes all doubt is what will come , God willing, one of the scientists say manuscripts Aalghemranih
5 - and read in the encyclopedia and Kibdia the following:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essenes
According to a controversial view put forward by Dead Sea Scrolls Scholar Géza Vermes, both Josephus and Philo pronounced the essenes name as "Esaoin", which means in Arabic followers of "Esa", which Vermes says is the name of Jesus according to the most ancient mosaic portrait found in Turkey dated 70 AD which says underneath "Esa our Lord".
According to the word ( brief symbolizes ) World of the Dead Sea manuscripts says :
That according to the reported Josephus and Philo that the name is Alasnnin esaion and says he means to follow Jesus in Arabic ( Issaon )
He says that what it asserts is the oldest trace Mousavi ( the oldest ever ) and finder in Turkey dates back to the year 70 AD ( the oldest manuscripts of the New Testament !)
It is a plates written on it ( our Lord Jesus )
....
It was Salva before the discovery of these paintings he has claimed many of the imams delusion that the name iessaei or esaion mentioned in the books of Philo and Josephus and Epiphanius but it is the name ascribed to a place called essa and of course did not specify where this place and how they knew this Almkananma is indisputable Balbatlualve detect falseness is the emergence of these paintings discovered and written under the name Alchristola I can only put the strongest evidence and believe Dleilbasm of God the Merciful ( Al Imran )
[And mention] when the angels said, "O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah




جندي امريكي يريد إعتناق الإسلام لكنه يخشى عائلته | عثمان بن فاروق مترجم
Those are Gnostic beliefs. Jesus did much more than heal the sick, he raised a man from the dead whos body already started to " stinketh", and fed 5,000 people with 5 loaves of bread, and 2 fish, then had enough left overs to fill several baskets.
 






akay

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One of the main lessons from this miracle event is that space and time are not subject to the laws of nature for humans.

All religious traditions share the concept of miracles, that is, something that defies logic, nature or established constitution and the course of events.


Allah's legitimate miracles, which are by definition the only true miracles. When the forces of unbelief are strong, the prophetic miracles opposed to them are usually stronger.

The prophet Moses had several miracles, Moses' wand turned into a serpent
By order of God

By command of God Likewise, the Prophet Jesus even had the power Revive the Dead in order to establish his legitimacy before the Jews who would ultimately condemn him to death. Nevertheless, his miracles were undeniable by their nature, and it was only the stubbornness and arrogance of the people to whom he was sent .

the miracles of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him!

Miracles that he performed were all done with God's power. Moses did similar things, as did some of the apostles.
 






Bubbajay

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Messages
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One of the main lessons from this miracle event is that space and time are not subject to the laws of nature for humans.

All religious traditions share the concept of miracles, that is, something that defies logic, nature or established constitution and the course of events.


Allah's legitimate miracles, which are by definition the only true miracles. When the forces of unbelief are strong, the prophetic miracles opposed to them are usually stronger.

The prophet Moses had several miracles, Moses' wand turned into a serpent
By order of God

By command of God Likewise, the Prophet Jesus even had the power Revive the Dead in order to establish his legitimacy before the Jews who would ultimately condemn him to death. Nevertheless, his miracles were undeniable by their nature, and it was only the stubbornness and arrogance of the people to whom he was sent .

the miracles of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him!

Miracles that he performed were all done with God's power. Moses did similar things, as did some of the apostles.
Muhammad didn't do any miracles, he probably never existed.
 






akay

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This is the fashion or lie of the new church and the mercenaries who follow it every period of time!

كيف عرف النبي ذلك؟! - حدث تاريخي مفصل يذكره القرآن بدقة ويفشل الكتاب المقدس في ذكره

How did the Prophet know that?!


The American film about the Prophet (peace be upon him)


Muhammad in the Bible محمد في الكتاب المقدس





أحمد ديدات - ماذا يقول الكتاب المقدس عن محمد

 






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Bubbajay

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I think its hilarious how Muslims claim to be monotheistic but worship Muhammad as though he's a god. Every time they mention his name its "peace be upon him", and they even bow down to the rock where he supposedly ascended into heaven. They pray to Muhammad several times a day with " peace etc etc", and if you don't live in mecca you're suppose to pray in that direction. They don't have a triune (three in one) god so they are openly polytheistic in their worship, but claim they're not. They even accuse other religions of the same thing they're guilty of.
 






akay

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Muslims do not worship Muhammad in any way. They believe that he was the last messenger sent by Allah and like all His other prophets and messengers, he was a human being. However, some people mistakenly assume that Muslims worship Muhammad

Muhammad, like Jesus, never claimed divine status. He called people to worship Almighty Allah alone, and he continually emphasized his humanity. In order to prevent his deification, Prophet Muhammad always said to refer to him as "Allah's slave and messenger". He said – “Do not adulate me as the Christians adulated Jesus son of Mary. I am Allah's slave and messenger.”

Muhammad was chosen to be Allah's final messenger and to communicate His message to us, not only in words, but also as a living example of its practical application. Muslims love and respect him because of his impeccable and upright moral character and because he conveyed the truth from Allah - which is the pure monotheism of Islam.

Muslims strive to follow the great example of Prophet Muhammad but do not worship him in any way. Islam teaches Muslims to respect all of Allah's prophets and messengers. However, respecting and loving them does not mean worshipping them. Muslims know that all worship and prayer must be directed to Allah alone.
Do Muslims Worship Muhammad? | Dr. Shabir Ally
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\





'Peace be upon him' is a phrase used by Muslims after mentioning the name of a prophet to show respect and to honour them. The Arabic term used after mentioning Muhammad (pbuh) is "sallā llahu ‘alayhi wa salaam" which translates to "may blessing of Allah and peace be upon him".

A similar term is also used for all the other prophets of God; "Alayhi Salam" which means peace be upon him. So for example a Muslim might say 'Jesus Alayhi Salam' or 'Jesus peace be upon him'.

These phrases are used because Muslims believe that the prophets were the best people to walk on the face of the Earth. So we ask God to bless them and have peace on them every time we hear or say their names.

Indeed Allah and His angels bless the Prophet; O you who have faith! Invoke blessings on him and invoke Peace upon him in a worthy manner. [33.56]



The Messenger of God is a precious unique pearl of creation, that Allah and His angels have blessed him. He deserves the Greetings and blessings of all the creatures, and in particular that of Mankind, that he was indeed God's Mercy to all the worlds.

Why Do Muslims Say 'Peace be Upon Him'? | Dr. Shabir Ally
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



The Kaaba is the Qibla, i.e. the direction that Muslims face when they pray. It is important to point out that although Muslims turn towards the Kaaba to pray, they do not worship the Kaaba as such. Muslims worship only Allah and do not bow down to anyone other than Him.

Islam promotes unity
If Muslims were left free to choose the direction in which they want to pray, some would choose the north, others would choose the south, etc. In order to unite all Muslims in their worship of the One God, wherever they are, Islam asks them to all look in the same direction,

but we find
Catholics who prostrate themselves at statues and offer them incense, candles, and flowers, and pray to thwart God's commandments,

If Islam Against Idol Worship Why Muslims Bow To The Kaaba Dr Zakir Naik #HUDATV

 






Bubbajay

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Messages
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Muslims worship prophet Muhammad!
Muslims do not worship Muhammad in any way. They believe that he was the last messenger sent by Allah and like all His other prophets and messengers, he was a human being. However, some people mistakenly assume that Muslims worship Muhammad

Muhammad, like Jesus, never claimed divine status. He called people to worship Almighty Allah alone, and he continually emphasized his humanity. In order to prevent his deification, Prophet Muhammad always said to refer to him as "Allah's slave and messenger". He said – “Do not adulate me as the Christians adulated Jesus son of Mary. I am Allah's slave and messenger.”

Muhammad was chosen to be Allah's final messenger and to communicate His message to us, not only in words, but also as a living example of its practical application. Muslims love and respect him because of his impeccable and upright moral character and because he conveyed the truth from Allah - which is the pure monotheism of Islam.

Muslims strive to follow the great example of Prophet Muhammad but do not worship him in any way. Islam teaches Muslims to respect all of Allah's prophets and messengers. However, respecting and loving them does not mean worshipping them. Muslims know that all worship and prayer must be directed to Allah alone.
Do Muslims Worship Muhammad? | Dr. Shabir Ally
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\





'Peace be upon him' is a phrase used by Muslims after mentioning the name of a prophet to show respect and to honour them. The Arabic term used after mentioning Muhammad (pbuh) is "sallā llahu ‘alayhi wa salaam" which translates to "may blessing of Allah and peace be upon him".

A similar term is also used for all the other prophets of God; "Alayhi Salam" which means peace be upon him. So for example a Muslim might say 'Jesus Alayhi Salam' or 'Jesus peace be upon him'.

These phrases are used because Muslims believe that the prophets were the best people to walk on the face of the Earth. So we ask God to bless them and have peace on them every time we hear or say their names.

Indeed Allah and His angels bless the Prophet; O you who have faith! Invoke blessings on him and invoke Peace upon him in a worthy manner. [33.56]



The Messenger of God is a precious unique pearl of creation, that Allah and His angels have blessed him. He deserves the Greetings and blessings of all the creatures, and in particular that of Mankind, that he was indeed God's Mercy to all the worlds.

Why Do Muslims Say 'Peace be Upon Him'? | Dr. Shabir Ally
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



The Kaaba is the Qibla, i.e. the direction that Muslims face when they pray. It is important to point out that although Muslims turn towards the Kaaba to pray, they do not worship the Kaaba as such. Muslims worship only Allah and do not bow down to anyone other than Him.

Islam promotes unity
If Muslims were left free to choose the direction in which they want to pray, some would choose the north, others would choose the south, etc. In order to unite all Muslims in their worship of the One God, wherever they are, Islam asks them to all look in the same direction,

but we find
Catholics who prostrate themselves at statues and offer them incense, candles, and flowers, and pray to thwart God's commandments,

If Islam Against Idol Worship Why Muslims Bow To The Kaaba Dr Zakir Naik #HUDATV

What they supposedly believe and what they do are two different things. Bowing down to the place where he supposedly went to heaven is worship. Bowing down and prostrating yourself to any person or object is worship.
 






TrollingTroubles

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Muhammad didn't do any miracles, he probably never existed.
Historically that statement applies more to Jesus than Mohammed.
Mohammed was even documented by his enemies of his time.

Jesus didn’t even get a footnote in any other document except the bible.

you do realise that right?
 






elsbet

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Historically that statement applies more to Jesus than Mohammed.
Mohammed was even documented by his enemies of his time.

Jesus didn’t even get a footnote in any other document except the bible.

you do realise that right?
Are you sure about that? :)

The Bible is the best-selling book of all time (and space, perhaps). That is sufficient.

Maybe it is another "Jesus" mentioned in the quran-- I have suggested that, myself-- and in the gnostic "gospels." Maybe not, though, since both are rewriting the story.

Interesting topic, either way.
 






recure

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Muhammad didn't do any miracles, he probably never existed.
I take it that you cited the Hadiths for rhetorical purposes and not because you think that Muhammad actually said and did those things? There’s certainly a trend in revisionist scholarship to, not necessarily deny the existence of Muhammad, but to question the reliability of the traditional accounts. There’s the theory that “Muhammad” was at one time a title for Jesus, as it means “praiseworthy”, from the root حمد (hamad, “to praise”) + the prefix م (mu-) added to verbs to create nouns and adjectives. Evidence for this can be discerned when looking particularly at the early Islamic period, i.e. under the Umayyads; the Qur’an, numismatics and archaeology, such as the inscriptions on the Dome of the Rock.

For example, Sura 7:157 says: “Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel… it is those who will be successful.” This verse is believed by Muslims to be referring to Muhammad, a 7th-c. Arab prophet who was allegedly illiterate, hence he is shoehorned into various verses of the Bible. However, this Surah could be referring to a passage in the Gospel of John which says: “But when it was now the midst of the feast, Jesus went up into the temple and taught. The Jews therefore marveled, saying, “How does this man know letters, having never been educated?” (7.14-15) The “unlettered prophet” one finds in the Torah and the Gospel is none other than Jesus himself.

Also from the context of the inscription on the Dome of the Rock it can be deduced that the phrase “Muhammad (praiseworthy) is the messenger of God” in the Shahadah is a reference to Jesus, as most of it reads like a polemic against the deity of Christ. The inscription is as follows:
In the name of God, the Merciful the Compassionate. There is no god but God. He is One. He has no associate. Unto Him belongeth sovereignity and unto Him belongeth praise. He quickeneth and He giveth death; and He has Power over all things.

Muḥammad is the servant of God and His Messenger. Lo! God and His angels shower blessings on the Prophet. O ye who believe! Ask blessings on him and salute him with a worthy salutation. The blessing of God be on him and peace be on him, and may God have mercy.

O People of the Book! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning God save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a Messenger of God, and His Word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in God and His messengers, and say not ‘Three’ – Cease! (it is) better for you! - God is only One God. Far be it removed from His transcendent majesty that He should have a son. His is all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And God is sufficient as Defender. The Messiah will never scorn to be a servant unto God, nor will the favoured angels. Whoso scorneth His service and is proud, all such will He assemble unto Him.

Oh God, bless Your Messenger and Your servant Jesus on of Mary. Peace be on him the day he was born, and the day he dies, and the day he shall be raised alive! Such was Jesus, son of Mary, (this is) a statement of the truth concerning which they doubt. It befitteth not (the Majesty of) God that He should take unto Himself a son. Glory be to Him! When He decreeth a thing, He saith unto it only: Be! And it is. Lo! God is my Lord and your Lord. So serve Him. That is the right path. God (Himself) is witness that there is no God save Him. And the angels and the men of learning (too are witness). Maintaining His creation in justice, there is no God save Him, the Almighty, the Wise.

Lo! Religion with God (is) Islam. Those who (formerly) received the Book differed only after knowledge came unto them, through transgression among themselves. Whoso disbelieveth the revelations of God (will find that) Lo! God is swift at reckoning!
We can see that the inscription starts by saying “there is no god but Allah” and then says “Muhammad is the servant of Allah and his messenger”, the fundamental portions that constitute the Islamic creed. However, what follows is entirely about Jesus Christ, saying to the “People of the Book” that he “was only a messenger” and should not be associated with God. Moreover, it calls him Allah’s messenger and servant, which is what it says Muhammad is. So if we read it as “Praisworthy is the servant and messenger of Allah”, then the inscription becomes consistent and is entirely about Jesus and the negation of his divinity.

The Muhammad of the Sira tradition is probably not an entirely fictional character, but moreso a composite of Jesus and an early Muslim king like Abdul Malik, the one responsible for the Dome of the Rock. Even in the earliest biographies of Muhammad such as that of Ibn Ishaq, one can immediately notice the parallels to the life of Jesus. In his book “Mohammed and Mohammedanism”, Sigismund Koelle cites many other obscure Arabic texts that attribute qualities of Christ to Muhammad, including his pre-existence. Even in the Hadiths, you find such narrations as this: “They said: 'O Messenger of Allah! When was the Prophethood established for you?' He said: 'While Adam was between (being) soul and body.'” (Tirmidhi 49.5)
 






Bubbajay

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Historically that statement applies more to Jesus than Mohammed.
Mohammed was even documented by his enemies of his time.

Jesus didn’t even get a footnote in any other document except the bible.

you do realise that right?
There's no mention of Muhammad in any historical record until around 700AD. There are many more records from the time of Muhammad than the time of Jesus to have survived. The enemies of Jesus in the Talmud even attest to his life, miracles, and execution. What does Muhammad have?
 






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