WhatsApp

[Just following orders]

hi everyone

about 5 years ago I paid around 90 English pence for WhatsApp. Since then I’ve used it constantly to the point of barely send a text message anymore (only to 1 or 2 people that don’t have WA). To my knowledge I’ve not had to pay anything since the initial payment 5 years ago.

I’m not an idiot, I’m sure that my information is being stored (not for my benefit) and I’m sure that since this pandemic and considering some of the info that I talk to various friends, questioning the narrative, I can’t make a telephone call without a clicking sound halfway through the call, or the person I’m talking to saying at the beginning of the conversation that they can’t hear me very well, then there will be an audible click and they’ll be able to hear me absolutely fine.....Could be being paranoid ‘I guess’.

In addition to this, whenever I have a look at VIG Cit website - not all of the time, but a large percentage of the time - I open WhatsApp up again, I get the FACEBOOK logo coming up briefly (I don’t have a FB account, but know that WA are owned by FB). I can guarantee this is only when I am on VG or Bitchute.

does anyone know anything that we should all be aware of? I’m guessing that as a result of any comments (if there are any) then it will be a resounding gtf off WhatsApp ASAP. But is text any safer?

Any advice would be valued greatly.

 

[Cintra]

Years ago, in the Uk, the clicking on the phones was said to be Project Echelon.
I don't know if that is still the case or if they have moved on to something new.
The audible click was meant to be a recording system triggered by specific words.
You would think that by now they would have something less obvious. Yet the clicking continues.

The clicking tends to be very specific, it clicks when I mention certain things.
Many years ago, when I first heard it, I was talking to someone and they mentioned a bomb scare in their locality. It had been on the news.
Everytime they said bomb, it clicked.
I started to test it, by asking more questions about the incident, and mentioning the word bomb, and making sure that the click wasn't just a coincidence.
That was 20 years ago.

I still hear it. Yesterday I mentioned RT to someone, even giving them the web address, RT.com.
The clicks loved that, they went crazy.
They love it when I talk about covid too, and how it is an excuse to give us a vaccination and a mark of the beast tattoo.

This is a landline.
I don't do social media or whats app, so I don't know about that. But the clicks on the phone are real.
We are being surveilled, and we have been for a long time.

ECHELON - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[polymoog]

facebook owns whatsapp, so expect anything you say or share on there will be recorded.

with that said, do NOT self- censor yourself and the truth!
the NWO is here, right now. it is time to make a stand.

keep in mind that we exist in vast numbers. they could not possibly lock us all up. look at the numbers who protested the lockdowns.

 

[recure]

does anyone know anything that we should all be aware of? I’m guessing that as a result of any comments (if there are any) then it will be a resounding gtf off WhatsApp ASAP. But is text any safer?

There is a lot you should be aware of in terms of online privacy but as it pertains to your situation, I would agree and suggest ditching WhatsApp and maybe reassess your threat model. In particular, the involvement of Facebook and Google with international governments in "intelligence gathering" shouldn't be taken lightly, as "user data" will play a big part in the unfolding technological dictatorship.

However, there are alternatives to WhatsApp which also cannot be trusted because really, any app which runs on Google ad revenue feeds into the collection and monetisation of your private data. If you want to know which apps you should use, refer to PrivacyTools and perhaps do some reading with regards to the apps which interest you and, I would urge, with regard to online privacy in general. As a rule of thumb, use only free and open-source applications with the caveat that they don't come from companies here mentioned or which contain ads.

 

[Just following orders]

There is a lot you should be aware of in terms of online privacy but as it pertains to your situation, I would agree and suggest ditching WhatsApp and maybe reassess your threat model. In particular, the involvement of Facebook and Google with international governments in "intelligence gathering" shouldn't be taken lightly, as "user data" will play a big part in the unfolding technological dictatorship.

However, there are alternatives to WhatsApp which also cannot be trusted because really, any app which runs on Google ad revenue feeds into the collection and monetisation of your private data. If you want to know which apps you should use, refer to PrivacyTools and perhaps do some reading with regards to the apps which interest you and, I would urge, with regard to online privacy in general. As a rule of thumb, use only free and open-source applications with the caveat that they don't come from companies here mentioned or which contain ads.

Would you say I’m being paranoid about the ‘audible click’ that I can hear whenever I make a call? Or that my paranoia is justified?

how do these things work? Do they monitor key words, or do they monitor online activity? Is WhatsApp a mousetrap?

also, can you define how someone can understand what their threat model is..Would it be as simple as how big your sphere of influence is? And if possible can you suggest safer alternatives..in regards to Duck Duck Go - does it make any difference using this for searches?

thank you for your help.

 

[Mr.Anderson]

I don't know about the US, but there have been lots of controversy about whatsapp in brazil... really. There were lots of legal battlers regarding data of druglords and in cases involving minors, this went as far as blocking whatsapp via judge decision for 24h. As far as I know, the government couldn't gather this data and there was a really serious case involving Glenn Greenwald and then justice minister Sergio Moro regarding possbile cloning, leaking and or data adulteration....

Now due to the outcome of these cases I can say that at least the brazilian government cant directly access this data. I don't know however about private companies since my cell phone directly eavesdrop my convos, even when I don't search it on engines so this isn't cookie related.

I've never or noticed any click. But I guess this is more related to audio compression / decompression than wiretap

 

[Just following orders]

I don't know about the US, but there have been lots of controversy about whatsapp in brazil... really. There were lots of legal battlers regarding data of druglords and in cases involving minors, this went as far as blocking whatsapp via judge decision for 24h. As far as I know, the government couldn't gather this data and there was a really serious case involving Glenn Greenwald and then justice minister Sergio Moro regarding possbile cloning, leaking and or data adulteration....

Now due to the outcome of these cases I can say that at least the brazilian government cant directly access this data. I don't know however about private companies since my cell phone directly eavesdrop my convos, even when I don't search it on engines so this isn't cookie related.

I've never or noticed any click. But I guess this is more related to audio compression / decompression than wiretap

Thanks for this.

interesting to know that the facility is there if required. Guessing the Brazilian government cleared it with WhatsApp?

 

[Mr.Anderson]

Guessing the Brazilian government cleared it with WhatsApp?

Well, they denied giving up info to the police. Some judges meddled a bit but whatsapp didn't gave up. The app was blocked for some hours but in the end nothing happened.

WhatsApp bloqueado: Relembre todos os casos de suspensão do app

Determinação da Justiça do Rio é a quarta tentativa de bloquear WhatsApp. Operadoras de telefonia já foram notificadas para suspender acesso ao app.

g1.globo.com

 

[recure]

Would you say I’m being paranoid about the ‘audible click’ that I can hear whenever I make a call? Or that my paranoia is justified?

I think it's reasonable to be paranoid about something that's out of the ordinary. The problem is when people think there is nothing to be paranoid about whilst using what is essentially military technology (so you can guess what it was designed for).

how do these things work? Do they monitor key words, or do they monitor online activity? Is WhatsApp a mousetrap?

Yes, they monitor all online activity and store it at the Utah Data Center, and, as much as possible, try to personally identify each individual responsible for it. The aim is to become the "god of this world" that is omnipresent and omniscient; the proverbial eye in the sky.

WhatsApp is indeed a mousetrap as it has end-to-end encryption but it is closed source and contains a backdoor/trojan to allow snooping. Windows 10 has an in-built keylogger, but key words and even writing style can be used to identify you across the web by indexing your e-mails on Outlook and Gmail.

also, can you define how someone can understand what their threat model is..Would it be as simple as how big your sphere of influence is? And if possible can you suggest safer alternatives..in regards to Duck Duck Go - does it make any difference using this for searches?

Your threat model is proportional to your level of paranoia and the extent to which you want to be exposed to online tracking and data collection, and from whom. This would range from "no privacy, thanks" to "total anonymity", the latter being the golden standard though very hard to achieve.

For instance, if you don't want your real identity to be searchable online, you might delete (or never create) any social media accounts. But that won't stop those same websites from tracking you through third-party scripts and cookies (in the form of social media buttons and Google Analytics), and, of course, advertisements. In that case you would have to take measures to harden your browser and make other adjustments accordingly. After all, Facebook makes "shadow profiles" of people who have never registered with their service.

On the other hand, someone who is directly under government surveillance and perhaps seen as a "threat to national security", i.e. a whistle-blower or "terrorist", would have an entirely different threat model which would include more extreme measures.

In your case, the "threat" has been identified as WhatsApp potentially eavesdropping on your conversations so you would replace it, but if that's the extent of your threat model then nothing else is required. My recommendation is still to consult PrivacyTools about which apps to try and find what works for you. I thought it better to give a link to a reputable source and let others decide for themselves than to plug a specific program, but for what it's worth, I personally use Signal messenger and can provide a list of other program suggestions if that is what you're after.

The inevitable trade-off when protecting yourself from rapacious data gathering is that you sacrifice some things you took for granted, but often the price you pay for using these "free" services is with your personal data and its monetisation. Most people will use an app that is popular over one that is secure, so it may be tedious to convert one's social circle and it suddenly becomes an inconvenience to make such sacrifices. It all goes back to what your threat model is.

DuckDuckGo is much better than Google in terms of privacy but Google is still the best search engine when it comes to the volume of indexed pages and thus quality of search results; DDG is just a proxy for Bing and Yahoo search results. With that said, it's not impossible, and certainly not that hard (once you acquire the knowledge), to replace Google, Facebook, and anything else that has a spotty privacy policy, and still have a comfortable experience.

thank you for your help.

It's my pleasure.

 

[Cintra]

@recure
Thank you for your very informative posts.
Can I ask the following question, please?

Is there any way to secure an android device?
Or are they automatically compromised because they are hard wired to google?

 

[recure]

The best way to secure a device is to begin with the easy things such as getting informed about online privacy and making better decisions about the services we use, then the more difficult steps will follow naturally. You will also be better aware of what you're doing and the reasons for doing them and it's something that's going to take time and patience. But the most effective way to secure the device would have to be one of the more difficult and tedious tasks, such as installing a custom operating system on the phone without Google Services, and for one's own sake to delete the Google account for good. Further, the effective way is not feasible for many people and they will have to settle for less which, to put it bluntly, is a huge compromise if you care at all about privacy and the harvesting of your personal data.

To start off, one should consider changing their browsing habits, using free and open-source software (FOSS) alternatives to Google apps and other popular programs wherever possible, and become comfortable with the change before attempting to fully remove Google (and by extension Facebook, Microsoft etc.) from the phone. However, Google Services is required by some applications in order to work, so removing it (the only way is to fully wipe the phone with a new OS) might cause some programs to malfunction, though I think this rarely happens. At first it's better to use the phone settings to review the permissions of each application and disable all the unnecessary ones wherever possible. I'm quite strict and disable most permissions because when you run the application it will still ask you to give permissions to essential components.

In order to find privacy-respecting applications, you should install F-Droid, but if you still want to access the Google Play Store, use Aurora Store which allows you to anonymously install apps from the Play Store and tells you whether they contain trackers and ads. If you are after recommendations, again, refer to PrivacyTools. But I will suggest installing certain browser add-ons which I consider to be essential (for Firefox, though I'm sure most are on Chrome if you want to be a rebel): NoScript, uBlock Origin, Privacy Badger, Decentraleyes, Cookie AutoDelete, HTTPS Anywhere, Multi-Account Containers. Of these, NoScript is the the one that requires the most user attention because it blocks third-party scripts from running and might break a website until you review the permissions. Also, become familiar with how to use Multi-Account Containers because it isolates open pages from each other to prevent cross-site tracking.

On mobile, you can also install Blokada to block web-based ads from running in most applications. But this creates a VPN tunnel so you can't use a VPN that alters your IP address at the same time. In any case, I would recommend running an ad-blocker on mobile phone over a VPN anonymizer. Many VPN companies are just fronts used to funnel all your data without having to go through your ISP. With that said, it's possible to secure your device to an extent if you follow the steps I mentioned but it's best to get an understanding of what all these companies and their services are about. Check out The Hated One's channel on YouTube* as he makes very informative videos about these topics. Also feel free to message me if you have any question as it pertains to your particular threat model.

 

[AspiringSoul]

just get on telegram, it's more or less the same as whatsapp, but with more features inc loads of channels
some pretty cool channels on there.

 

[recure]

just get on telegram, it's more or less the same as whatsapp, but with more features inc loads of channels
some pretty cool channels on there.

Telegram is not recommended as a viable alternative by PrivacyTools or PRISM-Break for various reasons, not in the least because it's not a truly secure messenger. As the Wikipedia article states:

Telegram provides end-to-end encrypted calls and optional end-to-end encrypted "secret" chats between two online users on smartphone clients. However, the desktop clients (excluding macOS client) do not feature end-to-end encryption, nor is end-to-end encryption available for groups, supergroups, or channels. Telegram has defended the lack of ubiquitous end-to-end encryption by claiming the online-backups that do not use client-side encryption are "the most secure solution currently possible".

So E2E encryption is not on by default on Telegram, nor are group chats E2E encrypted so it's amusing that "drug dealer" types create public channels on there. Furthermore, Telegram originated in Russia, whatever that might entail, and its protocol has not been audited. There have been controversies regarding giving chat records to the authorities. You can read a more in-depth review of Telegram recently published by Recover Privacy.

Realistically the best and most secure messenger you can use is a decentralized one that isn't tied to your phone number such as Element and Jami, but Signal messenger is held in the highest regard by privacy enthusiasts.

 

[AspiringSoul]

Telegram is not recommended as a viable alternative by PrivacyTools or PRISM-Break for various reasons, not in the least because it's not a truly secure messenger. As the Wikipedia article states:

So E2E encryption is not on by default on Telegram, nor are group chats E2E encrypted so it's amusing that "drug dealer" types create public channels on there. Furthermore, Telegram originated in Russia, whatever that might entail, and its protocol has not been audited. There have been controversies regarding giving chat records to the authorities. You can read a more in-depth review of Telegram recently published by Recover Privacy.

Realistically the best and most secure messenger you can use is a decentralized one that isn't tied to your phone number such as Element and Jami, but Signal messenger is held in the highest regard by privacy enthusiasts.

However, the desktop clients (excluding macOS client) do not feature end-to-end encryption, nor is end-to-end encryption available for groups, supergroups, or channels

yeh no shit, it's not safe on your desktop because you're going through a web browser.
it's not owned by facebook. group public channels obv arent secure because you don't know who's on them. i wouldnt expect you to have private convos on a public channel.

 

[recure]

yeh no shit, it's not safe on your desktop because you're going through a web browser.
it's not owned by facebook. group public channels obv arent secure because you don't know who's on them. i wouldnt expect you to have private convos on a public channel.

The Telegram desktop client is a standalone application and does not go through a web browser, though from a privacy standpoint this is trivial. Also you misunderstood the quote (its syntax is confusing): it's saying that the desktop client does not have E2E encryption at all, while the mobile client does have E2E encryption but not for groups. This includes your private groups and public channels, the contents of which are stored unencrypted on Telegram's servers. In other words, the only encryption Telegram offers is the optional "secret" chats between two users.

Edit: typo.

 

[Cintra]

The best way to secure a device is to begin with the easy things such as getting informed about online privacy and making better decisions about the services we use, then the more difficult steps will follow naturally. You will also be better aware of what you're doing and the reasons for doing them and it's something that's going to take time and patience. But the most effective way to secure the device would have to be one of the more difficult and tedious tasks, such as installing a custom operating system on the phone without Google Services, and for one's own sake to delete the Google account for good. Further, the effective way is not feasible for many people and they will have to settle for less which, to put it bluntly, is a huge compromise if you care at all about privacy and the harvesting of your personal data.

To start off, one should consider changing their browsing habits, using free and open-source software (FOSS) alternatives to Google apps and other popular programs wherever possible, and become comfortable with the change before attempting to fully remove Google (and by extension Facebook, Microsoft etc.) from the phone. However, Google Services is required by some applications in order to work, so removing it (the only way is to fully wipe the phone with a new OS) might cause some programs to malfunction, though I think this rarely happens. At first it's better to use the phone settings to review the permissions of each application and disable all the unnecessary ones wherever possible. I'm quite strict and disable most permissions because when you run the application it will still ask you to give permissions to essential components.

In order to find privacy-respecting applications, you should install F-Droid, but if you still want to access the Google Play Store, use Aurora Store which allows you to anonymously install apps from the Play Store and tells you whether they contain trackers and ads. If you are after recommendations, again, refer to PrivacyTools. But I will suggest installing certain browser add-ons which I consider to be essential (for Firefox, though I'm sure most are on Chrome if you want to be a rebel): NoScript, uBlock Origin, Privacy Badger, Decentraleyes, Cookie AutoDelete, HTTPS Anywhere, Multi-Account Containers. Of these, NoScript is the the one that requires the most user attention because it blocks third-party scripts from running and might break a website until you review the permissions. Also, become familiar with how to use Multi-Account Containers because it isolates open pages from each other to prevent cross-site tracking.

On mobile, you can also install Blokada to block web-based ads from running in most applications. But this creates a VPN tunnel so you can't use a VPN that alters your IP address at the same time. In any case, I would recommend running an ad-blocker on mobile phone over a VPN anonymizer. Many VPN companies are just fronts used to funnel all your data without having to go through your ISP. With that said, it's possible to secure your device to an extent if you follow the steps I mentioned but it's best to get an understanding of what all these companies and their services are about. Check out The Hated One's channel on YouTube* as he makes very informative videos about these topics. Also feel free to message me if you have any question as it pertains to your particular threat model.

Thank you.

I use Brave browser, which is supposed to have built in security features.
Its fast, unlike firefox, but i don't know if it really more secure than other browers.

 

[recure]

Thank you.

I use Brave browser, which is supposed to have built in security features.
Its fast, unlike firefox, but i don't know if it really more secure than other browers.

Brave is basically a privacy-oriented version of Google Chrome, both are based on the Chromium browser but Brave doesn't have the Google tracking services that come with Chrome so it's better in that regard. However, my criticism would be that unlike Chromium, both Google Chrome and Brave browser are closed-source applications which has led people to claim that Chromium is the best option, though the Chromium Project itself is a Google initiative in cooperation with Microsoft and Yandex. Also Brave is made by an ad company; they have an opt-in service where you can earn their cryptocurrency by agreeing to display ads, and they have been known to whitelist trackers from Google and Facebook without notifying their users. For these reasons I would personally avoid it, but I still rate Brave browser ahead of Chrome and Microsoft Edge in terms of privacy but behind Firefox and Tor Browser.

 

[Cintra]

Brave is basically a privacy-oriented version of Google Chrome, both are based on the Chromium browser but Brave doesn't have the Google tracking services that come with Chrome so it's better in that regard. However, my criticism would be that unlike Chromium, both Google Chrome and Brave browser are closed-source applications which has led people to claim that Chromium is the best option, though the Chromium Project itself is a Google initiative in cooperation with Microsoft and Yandex. Also Brave is made by an ad company; they have an opt-in service where you can earn their cryptocurrency by agreeing to display ads, and they have been known to whitelist trackers from Google and Facebook without notifying their users. For these reasons I would personally avoid it, but I still rate Brave browser ahead of Chrome and Microsoft Edge in terms of privacy but behind Firefox and Tor Browser.

Thank you very much.

I shall see if i can get Firefox working properly on this device.

I am currently not 'enabled' for the ad rewards.
But they try and trick me into it.

 

[Mr.Anderson]

I believe that everything done online is being eavesdropped by someone, or at least is vulnerable to eavesdropping unless you take some crazy countermeasures that are a bit difficult to employ on our daily lives. If I reckon, Russia used some typewriters instead of computers to send messages. In the end, the only "safe" way is to do things the old way, offline.