What's The Difference Between Prayer And Worship?

Haich

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I think maybe some of the difference here may be due to different understandings of Who and What God is. The Bible teaches that God is a 'trinity' of three equal parts - God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. So Christians talk about being spoken to by the Holy Spirit, as a separate person distinct from the Father, but still part of the trinity of God. Sometimes that is a literal voice. As I understand it, the Quran teaches that Allah did not beget anyone, and although it mentions spirit, this is not referring to what Christians are. Is that correct?
I'm not sure what you mean by spirit in Islam, could you expand ? And yes Islam teaches God didn't have a son. Although it's integral to Christianity there isn't conclusive proof Jesus was the son of God
 

Haich

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think maybe some of the difference here may be due to different understandings of Who and What God is.
True, Islam tells us God revealed the commandment of prayer during the prophet's descent to the heavens, during the night journey explained here:


{Glory be to Him Who made His servant to go on a night from the Sacred Mosque to the remote mosque of which We have blessed the precincts, so that We may show to him some of Our signs; surely He is the Hearing, the Seeing.} (Al-Israa’ 17:1)

There is no doubt that Al-Isra (the night journey) followed by Al-Miraj (the heavenly ascension) was one of the miracles in the life of our Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). According to the most accepted view, it happened on the 27th of Rajab, the seventh month of the Hijri calendar, in the tenth year of Muhammad’s prophethood.

It is reported in Hadith literature, that the Messenger of Allah was carried from the Sacred Mosque in Makkah to the “Farthest Mosque” (Al-Masjid al-Aqsa) in Jerusalem on a creature called Al-Buraq in the company of the archangel Gabriel (peace be upon him). There he led a congregational prayer of the prophets of God.

Then Gabriel took him to the heavens where he met the prophets Adam, John, Jesus, Idris, Aaron, and Moses (peace be on them all). In the seventh heaven, he met Abraham (peace be on him).

He was then brought to the Divine Presence. The details of this encounter are beautifully detailed in the beginning of surat An-Najm (52).

Prayer: God-given Gift

During this time, Allah ordered for his nation fifty daily prayers. But on the Prophet’s return, he was told by Prophet Moses (peace be on him) that his followers could not perform fifty prayers. Thus, he went back and eventually it was reduced to five daily Prayers. After this, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) returned to Makkah on the same night itself.

Therefore, Muslims should be thankful to Allah for this gift. They should take care of it and never neglect it. It is the thing that allows the Muslim to communicate with the creator five times as day.

Time and Space Are Not Bound for Allah

One major lesson of that miraculous event, was that space and time which are bound by laws of nature for humans, are not so bound for Allah. On that night prophet Muhammadbridged time and space and this world, traveling to the heavens by Allah’s will.

I believe that for those who study philosophy the abstract as well as the symbolic implications of the event might be very stimulating indeed. The gap between the reality of this life and that of the life to come simply diminished.

This is illustrated by the Prophet’s encounter with other prophets who were long since dead as far as we normally think of it but who, in reality, live as beings in a different form somewhere else.

The implications of the night journey cannot be overstated. The miraculous nature of the Prophet’s journey established his divine-stated legitimacy as the seal of all prophets. Allah brought him to Him to show us his true worth in the sight of Allah.

All religious traditions share the concept of miracles, that is, something that defies logic, nature, or the established constitution and course of things.

Prophet Moses was given several miracles, which included his staff that turned into a massive snake and culminated in his parting of the Red Sea, as a divine response to the extreme infidelity of Pharaoh.

Similarly, Prophet Jesus was given even the power to raise the dead, in order to establish his legitimacy before the Jews who would ultimately condemn him to death for blasphemy. Nevertheless, his miracles were undeniable by their nature, and it was only the obstinacy and arrogance of the people to whom he was sent that enabled them to deny him.

Muhammad’s night journey was obviously not easy for the pagan Makkans to believe. Nevertheless, the Prophet proved it logically by describing the approaching caravans that he overtook on his miraculous return.

Thus, this particular prophetic miracle not only established the Prophet’s eminence for Muslims as discussed above, but it also helped to prove his prophethood to the non-believers of his time.
 

llleopard

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Correction, the Church teaches that God is a "trinity". At best the Bible, with debatable intrepretation methods, implies that God could be a "trinity". No where in the Bible is there explicit teaching that God is three seperate distinct "persons".
I see a huge amount of explicit teaching in the Bible that God is three separate 'persons'. Beginning in the old testament, LORD is clearly different to Lord, and the Spirit is mentioned as well. There is a hierarchy among the three, and they all have different roles and different voices. Even the plural Elohim is used. If you do not see that the Bible is describing three separate but one, how do you interpret all the evidence? I'm curious - because I grew up in a 'fundamental' kind of church, and I am always interested to see if what I believe is based on actual truth or is just what people spouted!
 

llleopard

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I'm not sure what you mean by spirit in Islam, could you expand ? And yes Islam teaches God didn't have a son. Although it's integral to Christianity there isn't conclusive proof Jesus was the son of God
I was thinking of parts like this:

And We did certainly give Moses the Torah and followed up after him with messengers. And We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear proofs and supported him with the Pure Spirit. Surah 2 v 87, or
Say, [O Muhammad], "The Pure Spirit has brought it down from your Lord in truth to make firm those who believe and as guidance and good tidings to the Muslims." Surah 16 v 102
I have only recently started reading the Quran, so I am probably way off in thought and interpretation! Would you believe that the Pure Spirit is part of God, or a different 'entity', or something else?
 

Todd

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I see a huge amount of explicit teaching in the Bible that God is three separate 'persons'. Beginning in the old testament, LORD is clearly different to Lord, and the Spirit is mentioned as well. There is a hierarchy among the three, and they all have different roles and different voices. Even the plural Elohim is used. If you do not see that the Bible is describing three separate but one, how do you interpret all the evidence? I'm curious - because I grew up in a 'fundamental' kind of church, and I am always interested to see if what I believe is based on actual truth or is just what people spouted!
The explicit teaching is this: Duet 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one"
Jesus confirmed this in the NT in Math 12:29 "And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:"

What you are saying is not explicit teaching, it's interpretation. Whenever interpretation contradicts an explicit statement in the Bible then you should question the interpretation.

I can interpret what you are saying as just different descriptions of the functions/capabilities or titles of a single God. For example someone could write a book about me and in one chapter call me an engineer and say the engineer did this. Then in another chapter call me a Daddy and say the Daddy did this (the role and even the tone or voice I use as a Daddy is different than the tone or voice I use as an Engineer). Then another chapter it calls me a husband and says the husband did this. But it would not make sense for someone to call me a trinity and claim I am three different persons, because they see an Engineer, a daddy and a husband in the book.
 

llleopard

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Oh, okay.... but doesn't that kind of make it ridiculous when Jesus speaks to the Father for instance? It would be like me saying that the Mother in me is talking to the Teacher in me....when I am really just talking
to myself and slightly nuts?
 
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Todd

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Oh, okay.... but doesn't that kind of make it ridiculous when Jesus speaks to the Father for instance? It would be like me saying that the Mother in me is talking to the Teacher in me....when I am really just talking to myself and slightly nuts?
I'm not following you. Jesus speaking to Father is only ridiculous if you think Jesus is God. The Bible never says Jesus is God...it says he is the son of God and Peter says that God made Jesus both Lord and Christ. When Jesus asked Peter who he was, Peter did not say he was God. He said he was the son of God.

A physical son has the DNA of his father. A son shares the nature of his father, but a son does not exist with the Father before he was born. The idea that Jesus was pre-existant with the Father is an interpretation and not an explicit teaching of the Bible.
If God, according to Peter, had to "make" Jesus Lord and Christ, doesn't that imply that Jesus was at some point, not Lord and Christ?
 

Lisa

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Oh, okay.... but doesn't that kind of make it ridiculous when Jesus speaks to the Father for instance? It would be like me saying that the Mother in me is talking to the Teacher in me....when I am really just talking
to myself and slightly nuts?
What I originally wrote wasn't that great...see post below #37.
 
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mecca

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Do you think if eggs could talk, lol, they would say to each other hi yolk/me. Or would they be able to function distinctly separate but still be called an egg..that's kind of what's going on with God. Sorry, its a silly way to explain it...but hopefully you get the point.
Um... what?
 

mecca

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I know, it was a bit silly, but the point is one egg, 3 different roles. Same with God, one God, three different roles, they are saying it's Me, You
I don't know what you're saying.
 

Haich

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I was thinking of parts like this:

And We did certainly give Moses the Torah and followed up after him with messengers. And We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear proofs and supported him with the Pure Spirit. Surah 2 v 87, or
Say, [O Muhammad], "The Pure Spirit has brought it down from your Lord in truth to make firm those who believe and as guidance and good tidings to the Muslims." Surah 16 v 102
I have only recently started reading the Quran, so I am probably way off in thought and interpretation! Would you believe that the Pure Spirit is part of God, or a different 'entity', or something else?
Ohh the pure spirit is angel Gabriel. Gabriel used to reveal chapters to Muhammed but he was also inspired in other ways which are ambiguously mentioned in the Quran
 

Lisa

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Ok...so that was gibberish that I posted earlier...but I only had a very limited time and had a thought that didn't really translate well...

My point with the egg thing is this.
We all know an egg. It's called an egg, but it actually has three different parts to its, but we still call it an egg. It's one, but three, shell, yolk and whites. It's the same kind of thing with God. One God, three parts, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. I really should have explained that first before attempting the egg thing without it.

That's the point I was attempting to make but you had to know the egg analogy first..or maybe not...that really didn't translate well...anyway hopefully this makes more sense.
 

Karlysymon

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True, Islam tells us God revealed the commandment of prayer during the prophet's descent to the heavens, during the night journey explained here:


{Glory be to Him Who made His servant to go on a night from the Sacred Mosque to the remote mosque of which We have blessed the precincts, so that We may show to him some of Our signs; surely He is the Hearing, the Seeing.} (Al-Israa’ 17:1)

There is no doubt that Al-Isra (the night journey) followed by Al-Miraj (the heavenly ascension) was one of the miracles in the life of our Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). According to the most accepted view, it happened on the 27th of Rajab, the seventh month of the Hijri calendar, in the tenth year of Muhammad’s prophethood.

It is reported in Hadith literature, that the Messenger of Allah was carried from the Sacred Mosque in Makkah to the “Farthest Mosque” (Al-Masjid al-Aqsa) in Jerusalem on a creature called Al-Buraq in the company of the archangel Gabriel (peace be upon him). There he led a congregational prayer of the prophets of God.

Then Gabriel took him to the heavens where he met the prophets Adam, John, Jesus, Idris, Aaron, and Moses (peace be on them all). In the seventh heaven, he met Abraham (peace be on him).

He was then brought to the Divine Presence. The details of this encounter are beautifully detailed in the beginning of surat An-Najm (52).

Prayer: God-given Gift

During this time, Allah ordered for his nation fifty daily prayers. But on the Prophet’s return, he was told by Prophet Moses (peace be on him) that his followers could not perform fifty prayers. Thus, he went back and eventually it was reduced to five daily Prayers. After this, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) returned to Makkah on the same night itself.

Therefore, Muslims should be thankful to Allah for this gift. They should take care of it and never neglect it. It is the thing that allows the Muslim to communicate with the creator five times as day.

Time and Space Are Not Bound for Allah

One major lesson of that miraculous event, was that space and time which are bound by laws of nature for humans, are not so bound for Allah. On that night prophet Muhammadbridged time and space and this world, traveling to the heavens by Allah’s will.

I believe that for those who study philosophy the abstract as well as the symbolic implications of the event might be very stimulating indeed. The gap between the reality of this life and that of the life to come simply diminished.

This is illustrated by the Prophet’s encounter with other prophets who were long since dead as far as we normally think of it but who, in reality, live as beings in a different form somewhere else.

The implications of the night journey cannot be overstated. The miraculous nature of the Prophet’s journey established his divine-stated legitimacy as the seal of all prophets. Allah brought him to Him to show us his true worth in the sight of Allah.

All religious traditions share the concept of miracles, that is, something that defies logic, nature, or the established constitution and course of things.

Prophet Moses was given several miracles, which included his staff that turned into a massive snake and culminated in his parting of the Red Sea, as a divine response to the extreme infidelity of Pharaoh.

Similarly, Prophet Jesus was given even the power to raise the dead, in order to establish his legitimacy before the Jews who would ultimately condemn him to death for blasphemy. Nevertheless, his miracles were undeniable by their nature, and it was only the obstinacy and arrogance of the people to whom he was sent that enabled them to deny him.

Muhammad’s night journey was obviously not easy for the pagan Makkans to believe. Nevertheless, the Prophet proved it logically by describing the approaching caravans that he overtook on his miraculous return.

Thus, this particular prophetic miracle not only established the Prophet’s eminence for Muslims as discussed above, but it also helped to prove his prophethood to the non-believers of his time.
@Haich

that was a nice read. Afew quick questions, given Muhammad's status (seal of prophets), is he ascended to heaven, now in the company of the aforementioned 'greats'? What does the Quran say about the state of the dead? Do you expect a mass resurrection at the end of the age? Like, will God descend to call to the dead to life?
 

Haich

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@Haich

that was a nice read. Afew quick questions, given Muhammad's status (seal of prophets), is he ascended to heaven, now in the company of the aforementioned 'greats'?

Well we believe he's dead in the grave like everyone else but when we all rise from the graves on judgement day, and any last people are wiped out on earth, God will judge everyone and expose those who sinned and lied against him. Each prophet will gather its people, so Abraham's people will follow him, Lot's people will follow Lot, Jesus's people will follow Jesus and Mohammed's people will be the most diverse and greater in number as he was the final messenger. So in relation to your question, he will be admitted to heaven on J day with his people, those that followed him but for now he's dead.

Some would wonder why the prophets including Mohammed aren't already in heaven like Jesus. It's because their souls are awaiting J day in the grave. We don't accept Jesus died, God saved him from the crucifixion so he's in the heavens until it's his time to descend on earth. Jesus is the only prophet to have this status and along with Abraham, Moses and Mohammed they're the pioneers of God's words and hold a lot of importance


Moses spoke to God I mean come on that's special! No other prophet had that chance

What does the Quran say about the state of the dead?

The dead are in their graves. Upon death they are asked 3 questions.

The questioning will begin when the funeral and burial is over. 2 angels prop the deceased soul upright in the grave and ask three questions:

"Who is your Lord? What is your religion? Who is your prophet/messenger ?".

Each nation or group of people throughout history was sent a prophet. Some will answer with Jesus, David, Moses etc. But we believe Mohammed was sent to mankind as he was the seal of the prophets so we answer Mohammed


After the questioning the person is given a glimpse of their destination and the soul remains in this state until J Day. Time is a concept only known to us, time and it's laws doesn't really apply in the afterlife. The person will be resurrected on J Day and think he was in the grave for a day (slight exaggeration lol but it'll seem quick)

Do you expect a mass resurrection at the end of the age? Like, will God descend to call to the dead to life?

Yes we believe that the earth will be destroyed and God will form a plain where Everyone will be brought forward for judgment

?
 
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