What Is Political Correctness And What Are Its Roots

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#21
To be fair, there's self-expression and and then there's being an asshole. It's a line some people cross...

If I made made a joke about r*pe, someone got offended, and I suggested they didn't find it funny because they got raped... I'd be an asshole. I'd have a right to be an asshole... But other people would have a right to call me asshole too. And if I made my living based on telling jokes, if I offended enough people, that could hurt me.

If I could no longer get shows in comedy clubs, should I blame political correctness? Or myself for taking a joke too far? As I said, I believe in complete freedom of speech. At the same time, there's consequences to the things you say and do.

I mean there's a lot of ways to be subversive to society without being a dick and there's ways to combat political correctness without crossing the line into being an asshole.
 





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#22
100% agree.

To me political correctness is just a cage for your minds defined by people who wanna reach a goal with it.
As long as I don't offend no one, I say whatever the fuck I think.
I make jokes about jews, turkish, russians, muslims, christs, buddhists, chinese, childs, pedophiles, elders, man, woman, aliens, whatever. If it's funny and worth a laugh, just laugh! If it's offending someone next to you, you should be respectful and take a break.

If you don't fear the consequences of your behaviour OR if you wanna be rude to someone for good reasons without being political correct, go ahead.

To me it's like with religions: I don't wanna stick to rules defined by someone else, I've got my own. And as long as I can look in the mirror and have a good sleep, I'm fine.
 





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#23
100% agree.

I make jokes about jews, turkish, russians, muslims, christs, buddhists, chinese, childs, pedophiles, elders, man, woman, aliens, whatever. If it's funny and worth a laugh, just laugh! If it's offending someone next to you, you should be respectful and take a break.
If you don't fear the consequences of your behaviour OR if you wanna be rude to someone for good reasons without being political correct, go ahead..
why should someone fear the consequences of their right to free speech? nothing someone says should be responded with by violence. end of story. words are words.

the entire problem with PC is that EVERYONE can be offended about ANYTHING.

truthsucker-- being respectful and taking a break is the right thing to do,i agree, but if one continues on there is never a reason for resorting to violence.
"he was asking for it" could be the excuse given about hitting someone.
"she was asking for it" is the same excuse justifying r*pe if a woman was dressed provocatively.
 





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#26
"consequences of your behavior" is interpreted (at least by me) as violence.
the ultra left resorts to violence all the time.
That is right.
3 Recent examples of disgusting conduct related to Australian gay marriage plebiscite -
1.assault on our ex-Prime Minister Tony Abbott who is on the NO side.
The guy claimed he is a lone anarchist and was merely taking advantage of the opportunity. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-22/astro-labe-charged-over-alleged-assault-of-tony-abbott/8975454
Just by chance he was wearing a vote YES badge. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-21/tony-abbott-headbutted-by-ssm-supporter-in-hobart/8970658

2. Such charming behaviour by some YES Uni students against NO students - NOT. http://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/a...s/news-story/74efaf3374cc1445c795bcc521d30a34

3. At a vote NO rally 2 lesbians invade the stage. http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw...t/news-story/6de2aea40cd923f468af85e8f6ec065a
Imagine the outcry if a Christian, Muslim or any other pro-traditional marriage supporter dared to do the same at a pro-gay marriage rally.
 





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#27
Even Facebook is in on the act.
My husband tried to post a VOTE NO image as a message on Facebook and it was blocked. He could not enter it. In contrast all my siblings have multiple VOTE YES images and photos shown there.
 





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#29
Are you saying that the right doesn't resort to violence as well? Some people do on both sides, but most people don't.
no one could ever say that one side is ALWAYS non-violent. but this thread is about political correctness. i have not seen the right get violent during a PC debate (ben shapiro and that TG defensive tackle looking wo(?)man immediately come to mind-- she/he/it grabbed him by his little neck and threatened to send him home in an ambulance if he didnt quit it).
i have seen the left do it very, very often. why? perhaps theyre ultra sensitive about others feelings, and the right doesnt care and/or thinks its ridiculous. recipe for the disaster.
 





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#30
Are you saying that the right doesn't resort to violence as well? Some people do on both sides, but most people don't.
Fringe groups are the violent ones. They both ways. The far left is groups like antifa/BLM groups. The far right is Neo nazi's/kkk.

Most normal Americans do not associate with those groups. In order to see progress both sides have to come together and strive for each other to better our social outlook, communities, policies etc.

Right now because of political correctness and everyone wanting to be right, easily offended etc. It's hard to spread a simple message.

Humans as a whole are such a fragile species right now.
 





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#31
"consequences of your behavior" is interpreted (at least by me) as violence.
the ultra left resorts to violence all the time.
I wasn't referring to violence at all. I'm an anarchist, but I'm also a pacifist. The only legitimate use of violence is to protect people from immediate physical harm.

I was speaking of social consequences. If someone came to these forums and started preaching white nationalism, I'd tell them to fuck off and they aren't welcome because VC has always had diverse people and that sort of bullshit isn't welcome here. And there would be a lot of other people that do the same... Because it isn't. And there's nothing wrong with that, either.

Likewise, there's nothing wrong with people writing articles because a comedian or some television show said or did something that offended them. Freedom of speech goes both ways... And if enough people are offended, there's nothing wrong with promoters or networks wanting nothing to do with that comedian or show because we live in a capitalist country and money talks...

But let's put it this way. I decided to go to an pro-Trump rally and yell "fuck that orange cunt". I'd put a lot of money on the line that someone there would decide that I should be knocked the fuck out... And let's pretend I was. Would you feel bad for me? Would you defend my freedom of speech? "I don't agree with him because he's leftist, but he had a right to say it!" Or would you think I deserved it, or at the very least, should have expected it?
 





Etagloc

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#32
no one could ever say that one side is ALWAYS non-violent. but this thread is about political correctness. i have not seen the right get violent during a PC debate (ben shapiro and that TG defensive tackle looking wo(?)man immediately come to mind-- she/he/it grabbed him by his little neck and threatened to send him home in an ambulance if he didnt quit it).
i have seen the left do it very, very often. why? perhaps theyre ultra sensitive about others feelings, and the right doesnt care and/or thinks its ridiculous. recipe for the disaster.
I think I've actually discussed this before on here. And I do think there is an asymettry as.... I forget what his name...... he's a black conservative.... someone someone...... let me google it... oh Thomas Sowell lol. Thomas Sowell said there is an assymetry betreen how the left perceives the right and how the left perceives the right.

I am someone who fundamentally believes the left and the right as concepts are social constructions so I don't really identify with a particular side but some people see me as one. I don't think I really fit in either category.

In any case, even though I'm not such a Thomas Sowell fan and I really don't agree with him (isn't his ideology related to the ideology of Pinochet-era Chile?... and I suppose he is for neoliberalism).... I do agree with him in how he described an assymetry between left and right.

I have mentioned it before and I said I have seen it in my own experience hanging around both camps.

Basically, according to Sowell, conservatives see liberals as well-meaning but misguided fools. And leftists see conservatives as evil.

I think that's an oversimplification of what he said and I think it's an oversimplification of what he was getting at but I think he has a point. I think liberals look at conservatives in a very different way than the conservatives look at the liberals side and I think the liberals are disproportionately more tolerant as far as ideology goes..... I think liberals will care about you being conservative way more than conservatives will care about you being liberal.... and I say this based on what I have actually seen while seeing different places.... the fact that it was brought up again by someone else just makes me think it was correct.

Again, I'm not saying that all liberals or all conservatives are the same but I mean all this in general terms... and I don't care if it's believed that "you can't generalize" because if that was the case it wouldn't be possible to think in larger, sociological terms. You have to be able to think in small-scale and large-scale terms.
 





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#33
I think I've actually discussed this before on here. And I do think there is an asymettry as.... I forget what his name...... he's a black conservative.... someone someone...... let me google it... oh Thomas Sowell lol. Thomas Sowell said there is an assymetry betreen how the left perceives the right and how the left perceives the right.

I am someone who fundamentally believes the left and the right as concepts are social constructions so I don't really identify with a particular side but some people see me as one. I don't think I really fit in either category.

In any case, even though I'm not such a Thomas Sowell fan and I really don't agree with him (isn't his ideology related to the ideology of Pinochet-era Chile?... and I suppose he is for neoliberalism).... I do agree with him in how he described an assymetry between left and right.

I have mentioned it before and I said I have seen it in my own experience hanging around both camps.

Basically, according to Sowell, conservatives see liberals as well-meaning but misguided fools. And leftists see conservatives as evil.

I think that's an oversimplification of what he said and I think it's an oversimplification of what he was getting at but I think he has a point. I think liberals look at conservatives in a very different way than the conservatives look at the liberals side and I think the liberals are disproportionately more tolerant as far as ideology goes..... I think liberals will care about you being conservative way more than conservatives will care about you being liberal.... and I say this based on what I have actually seen while seeing different places.... the fact that it was brought up again by someone else just makes me think it was correct.

Again, I'm not saying that all liberals or all conservatives are the same but I mean all this in general terms... and I don't care if it's believed that "you can't generalize" because if that was the case it wouldn't be possible to think in larger, sociological terms. You have to be able to think in small-scale and large-scale terms.
I find it frustrating that the social liberals (Australian Labor Party) have become so narrow-minded and bigoted in their support of minority groups that the only alternative is the conservatives group (Australian Liberal Party) whom I hate for their blatant neoliberalism/ pro-corporation policies.

Right now I dislike each group equally.
 





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#34
I think I've actually discussed this before on here. And I do think there is an asymettry as.... I forget what his name...... he's a black conservative.... someone someone...... let me google it... oh Thomas Sowell lol. Thomas Sowell said there is an assymetry betreen how the left perceives the right and how the left perceives the right.

I am someone who fundamentally believes the left and the right as concepts are social constructions so I don't really identify with a particular side but some people see me as one. I don't think I really fit in either category.

In any case, even though I'm not such a Thomas Sowell fan and I really don't agree with him (isn't his ideology related to the ideology of Pinochet-era Chile?... and I suppose he is for neoliberalism).... I do agree with him in how he described an assymetry between left and right.

I have mentioned it before and I said I have seen it in my own experience hanging around both camps.

Basically, according to Sowell, conservatives see liberals as well-meaning but misguided fools. And leftists see conservatives as evil.

I think that's an oversimplification of what he said and I think it's an oversimplification of what he was getting at but I think he has a point. I think liberals look at conservatives in a very different way than the conservatives look at the liberals side and I think the liberals are disproportionately more tolerant as far as ideology goes..... I think liberals will care about you being conservative way more than conservatives will care about you being liberal.... and I say this based on what I have actually seen while seeing different places.... the fact that it was brought up again by someone else just makes me think it was correct.

Again, I'm not saying that all liberals or all conservatives are the same but I mean all this in general terms... and I don't care if it's believed that "you can't generalize" because if that was the case it wouldn't be possible to think in larger, sociological terms. You have to be able to think in small-scale and large-scale terms.
It depends, in both camps, where people fall on the libertarian/authoritarian spectrum. More authoritarian conservatives, who usually favor big armies with massive budgets and believe in trying the legislate morality are very likely to see leftists as evil... And on the other hand, libertarian-leftists don't seem very inclined to view conservatives as evil, in and of themselves. They might see some of their views are immoral, but genuinely feel that they are as much victims to of the system as anyone else.

The issue is always in authoritarianism. When you start believing that your ideology is the worth making other people bleed, things go down hill. It's a problem, in my opinion, with both the mainstream "left" and the right these days.

...but then again, I'm an anarchist. Since that means I don't support the state, that usually means that folks on both sides don't like me. The right get upset that I don't want much to do with their rotten system and the left get upset that while I agree with a lot of what they have to say, I really don't think their jackboot belongs on anyone's back any more than the right's.
 





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#35
"consequences of your behavior" is interpreted (at least by me) as violence.
the ultra left resorts to violence all the time.
Consequences could be anything from words to violence. Action and reaction. What reaction you should expect is about your understanding in people and the mind of your opponent and of course in your action.

Psychological warfare is very powerful and like I said in another thread before, you only have to push the right buttons with some people to get a violent answer. But I personally would describe this persons as simple minded.
Violence to me is only a sign of crossing someones border where words aren't enough anymore OR a missing idea of an answer.

But we should go back to topic cause this isn't about violence. This could be another topic worth to discuss.
 





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#36
I wasn't referring to violence at all. I'm an anarchist, but I'm also a pacifist. The only legitimate use of violence is to protect people from immediate physical harm.

agreed here.

I was speaking of social consequences. If someone came to these forums and started preaching white nationalism, I'd tell them to fuck off and they aren't welcome because VC has always had diverse people and that sort of bullshit isn't welcome here. And there would be a lot of other people that do the same... Because it isn't. And there's nothing wrong with that, either.

this is VCs website. being his website, we are under his rules, so free speech does not apply. same with twitter, facebook, and at your job. outside of those realms, one has free speech.


I decided to go to an pro-Trump rally and yell "fuck that orange cunt". I'd put a lot of money on the line that someone there would decide that I should be knocked the fuck out... And let's pretend I was. Would you feel bad for me? Would you defend my freedom of speech? "I don't agree with him because he's leftist, but he had a right to say it!" Or would you think I deserved it, or at the very least, should have expected it?

id put a lot of money on the fact that you would not be knocked out. [yes, i would defend you, as would most of the others- the right IS free speech.] just look at the raw footage of these protests and rallies. show me the right attacking people. ill be happy to show you the weapons that antifa carries to the rallies. why do you think they cover their faces?

would the ultra-left do this?

 





makeorbreak

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#37
Perhaps, it should be called "socially correct" and it should be separated from politics. For one thing, politicians only say what they say to please everyone else and to get voted or stay in office. Society is the place where the rest of us have to consider the effect our words or actions have on others.
 





Antipapirus

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#39
Here's what you can do about political correctness: Just get over it. Who cares? It's just criticism, not actual censorship, so if you can't take it then go cry about it more because in reality is that's all you can do.
It's far more than criticism, its a weapon - watch this video and see the power of this weapon
This guy explains its so good its a pleasure to hear him out