Was Albert Pike truly a "luciferian"?

[Helioform]

So apparently the quote attributed to him in Morals And Dogma is this:

“Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable, blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls? Doubt it not!”

But that quote was totally taken out of context, and this is the rest of it:

“The Apocalypse is, to those who receive the nineteenth Degree, the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed. Plato and Philo, also, were inspired. The Apocalypse, indeed, is a book as obscure as the Sohar. It is written hieroglyphically with numbers and
images; and the Apostle often appeals to the intelligence of the Initiated. “Let him who hath knowledge, understand! let him who understands, calculate !” he often says, after an allegory or the mention of a number. Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.”

So in fact he is saying the exact opposite, which is that Lucifer is evil and should not be followed.

Knowing this, I'm guessing the letter attributed to him talking about initiating the world to "Luciferianism" is bogus.

There are some who openly praised Lucifer in their books such as Helena Blavatsky and Alice Bailey...but Pike was not one of them and he even took a more "Christian" point of view.

AFAIK, Blavatsky has been given an honorary degree in freemasonry but was not a member since she was a woman.

 

[elsbet]

Eh.. it says he blinds feeble, selfish souls. I doubt anyone things of himself as feeble or selfish-- what can he do for the strong and the generous? He also says this, which enforces their idea of secret or sacred knowledge:

Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the [unnamed] Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.”

But we are told plainly in Luke that ".. nothing is secret, that shall not become manifest, nor hid, that shall not be known, and become manifest."

So I'm a little leery.

 

[Helioform]

it says he blinds feeble, selfish souls. I doubt anyone things of himself as feeble or selfish-- what can he do for the strong and the generous?

I don't understand what you mean there...he is saying that kind of people will be more prone to fall for Lucifer's tactics.

He also says this, which enforces their idea of secret or sacred knowledge:

Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the [unnamed] Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.”

You have to admit though that nobody really knows for sure what most of the stuff John talks about in Revelation really represent. I have studied it for years and still don't really understand it.

 

[elsbet]

I don't understand what you mean there...he is saying that kind of people will be more prone to fall for Lucifer's tactics.




You have to admit though that nobody really knows for sure what most of the stuff John talks about in Revelation really represent. I have studied it for years and still don't really understand it.

And so when it is made to be manifest, you will likely recognize it, where others will not.

As for the other.. the definition:

apóthesis (from 659 /apotíthēmi, "put away, let go") – properly, a putting off (letting go) to remove (set something aside); a resignation from a previous obligation; (figuratively) removal, by the supernatural hand of God.

[The prefix (apo) shows 595 (apóthesis) involves a look back (away from what is let go) – to what comes next (L-S).]

So.. letting go

".. of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer."

See?

 

[KoncreteMind]

Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not!

This says to not doubt that Lucifer holds the light.

The Apocalypse, indeed, is a book as obscure as the Sohar. It is written hieroglyphically with numbers and
images; and the Apostle often appeals to the intelligence of the Initiated. “Let him who hath knowledge, understand! let him who understands, calculate !” he often says, after an allegory or the mention of a number. Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.”

Clearly he suggests (well imo of course) that the book of Revelation wasn't supposed to be understood by the masses but reallynto the "intelligence" of the "iniated" Which on the surface kinda sounds like the "initiating" that is allegedly done in the music industry. Or maybe the music industry isn't luciferian like this website says.. He was also a mason, but I guess there's a chance that they're not luciferian either....

 

[Helioform]

This says to not doubt that Lucifer holds the light.

Yeah but just before that he says that we need to hate his works...with him bearing light or not. Not really sure if he associates light with goodness here.

Clearly he suggests (well imo of course) that the book of Revelation wasn't supposed to be understood by the masses but reallynto the "intelligence" of the "iniated" Which on the surface kinda sounds like the "initiating" that is allegedly done in the music industry.

I think he means anyone who researches this thoroughly and is intelligent enough but not specifically a mason only.

 

[elsbet]

Scroll down for more excerpts from Pike-- he clarifies his thinking beyond a doubt, on his theology (if we can call it that).

http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception-Freemason_Lucifer_Albert_Pike

 

[KoncreteMind]

Yeah but just before that he says that we need to hate his works...with him bearing light or not. Not really sure if he associates light with goodness here.

But elsbet showed that Pike was saying that the 19th degree of masonry comes with the letting go (apothesis) of the faith that calls for them to do that. Its clear what he meant so why are you defending him?

I think he means anyone who researches this thoroughly and is intelligent enough but not specifically a mason only.

Maybe you think that because you didn't know or remember that Pike was a mason writing about freemasonry in his book morals and dogma.. Or maybe you think that because you don't believe what this website says when it alleges that upper level masons run a music industry where to succeed you allegedly have to be initiated into luciferianism.

You would have been better off saying the quote doesn't support him being luciferian because if that doesn't, his belief system does. Just thought I'd respond because I did bring up this quote in another thread.

 

[Helioform]

But elsbet showed that Pike was saying that the 19th degree of masonry comes with the letting go (apothesis) of the faith that calls for them to do that. Its clear what he meant so why are you defending him?

OK! I totally skipped the definition of Apothesis that elsbet posted. Somehow I confused Apothesis with Apotheosis at first. My apologies I understand now. So I wonder why a lot of people on Quora or Reddit used this to defend him...

Maybe you think that because you didn't know or remember that Pike was a mason writing about freemasonry in his book morals and dogma.. Or maybe you think that because you don't believe what this website says when it alleges that upper level masons run a music industry where to succeed you allegedly have to be initiated into luciferianism

I don't deny it, I know he was a mason. But a lot of those books like Morals and Dogma are available for the public and anyone can study this on their own.

 

[Helioform]

Scroll down for more excerpts from Pike-- he clarifies his thinking beyond a doubt, on his theology (if we can call it that).

http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception-Freemason_Lucifer_Albert_Pike

Thanks I read that a long time ago, but somehow forgot it...so it fits with what Blavatsky and Bailey believed in. But the quote from de La Rive with instructions to the 30th 31st and 32nd degrees has been disputed. Also I don't really agree that all forms of Gnosticism make Lucifer, or the Devil "God". Masonic beliefs are often being used by Christians as an example to demonize it in general.

 

[Claire Rousseau]

So apparently the quote attributed to him in Morals And Dogma is this:

“Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable, blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls? Doubt it not!”

But that quote was totally taken out of context, and this is the rest of it:

“The Apocalypse is, to those who receive the nineteenth Degree, the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed. Plato and Philo, also, were inspired. The Apocalypse, indeed, is a book as obscure as the Sohar. It is written hieroglyphically with numbers and
images; and the Apostle often appeals to the intelligence of the Initiated. “Let him who hath knowledge, understand! let him who understands, calculate !” he often says, after an allegory or the mention of a number. Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.”

So in fact he is saying the exact opposite, which is that Lucifer is evil and should not be followed.

Knowing this, I'm guessing the letter attributed to him talking about initiating the world to "Luciferianism" is bogus.

There are some who openly praised Lucifer in their books such as Helena Blavatsky and Alice Bailey...but Pike was not one of them and he even took a more "Christian" point of view.

AFAIK, Blavatsky has been given an honorary degree in freemasonry but was not a member since she was a woman.

Without a doubt, Albert Pike was a Freemason, and having reached the highest degrees, KNEW that it was covert satanism.

I own the book, Morals & Dogma by Pike & it is clear, throughout the entire book that he is a satanist.

Same with Manly P. Hall.

 

[Claire Rousseau]

And so when it is made to be manifest, you will likely recognize it, where others will not.

As for the other.. the definition:

apóthesis (from 659 /apotíthēmi, "put away, let go") – properly, a putting off (letting go) to remove (set something aside); a resignation from a previous obligation; (figuratively) removal, by the supernatural hand of God.

[The prefix (apo) shows 595 (apóthesis) involves a look back (away from what is let go) – to what comes next (L-S).]

So.. letting go

".. of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer."

See?

Well said, Elsbet

 

[Helioform]

Without a doubt, Albert Pike was a Freemason, and having reached the highest degrees, KNEW that it was covert satanism.

I own the book, Morals & Dogma by Pike & it is clear, throughout the entire book that he is a satanist.

Same with Manly P. Hall.

Luciferianism isn't exactly Satanism. Luciferians believe that they should balance their good deeds with evil deeds, because they view nature as dualistic like the Yin and Yang. This is why they can give to charity and be philanthropists like the Rockefeller family.

Satanists are usually just puppets of Luciferians, because they cause chaos in society with their animalistic behaviour, which has to be converted into order by the Luciferians. High level freemasons know this with their "order out of chaos" motto.

 

[elsbet]

Thanks I read that a long time ago, but somehow forgot it...so it fits with what Blavatsky and Bailey believed in. But the quote from de La Rive with instructions to the 30th 31st and 32nd degrees has been disputed. Also I don't really agree that all forms of Gnosticism make Lucifer, or the Devil "God". Masonic beliefs are often being used by Christians as an example to demonize it in general.

Luciferianism isn't exactly Satanism. Luciferians believe that they should balance their good deeds with evil deeds, because they view nature as dualistic like the Yin and Yang. This is why they can give to charity and be philanthropists like the Rockefeller family.

Satanists are usually just puppets of Luciferians, because they cause chaos in society with their animalistic behaviour, which has to be converted into order by the Luciferians. High level freemasons know this with their "order out of chaos" motto.

That's not really what they mean by Ordo ab Chao, but what's with the rationalization?

Thinking of joining, yourself? Just curious.

 

[Helioform]

That's not really what they mean by Ordo ab Chao,

What is it then in your opinion?

but what's with the rationalization?

Thinking of joining, yourself? Just curious.

Not really rationalizing, I'm just trying not to jump to conclusions too fast on this. And no, no way I wouldn't want to be part of that with their silly rituals and sycophant attitude.

 

[elsbet]

What is it then in your opinion?

A good example imo is what happened after 911-- homeland security, the NSA, etc. They create such chaos that people will accept ridiculous, invasive laws to feel safe-- they will even be grateful to have them in place. Kind of like that.

 

[Claire Rousseau]

Luciferianism isn't exactly Satanism. Luciferians believe that they should balance their good deeds with evil deeds, because they view nature as dualistic like the Yin and Yang. This is why they can give to charity and be philanthropists like the Rockefeller family.

Satanists are usually just puppets of Luciferians, because they cause chaos in society with their animalistic behaviour, which has to be converted into order by the Luciferians. High level freemasons know this with their "order out of chaos" motto.

Luciferian is no different than satanism.
They worship the same Baphomet.
Freemasonry claims Luciferianism but it’s all the same. They both follow the same “craft”.
It’s witchcraft.

Satan goes by many names & faces but, in the end,He is the same wicked beast that knows his time is short.

 

[Helioform]

A good example imo is what happened after 911-- homeland security, the NSA, etc. They create such chaos that people will accept ridiculous, invasive laws to feel safe-- they will even be grateful to have them in place. Kind of like that.

Yes of course...but that is not the entire story. I was just giving an example of how Satanists end up being used in their plans because they are agents of chaos themselves.

 

[Helioform]

Luciferian is no different than satanism.
They worship the same Baphomet.
Freemasonry claims Luciferianism but it’s all the same. They both follow the same “craft”.
It’s witchcraft.

Satan goes by many names & faces but, in the end,He is the same wicked beast that knows his time is short.

Baphomet is not really the "devil", it's a symbol for alchemy. It's not a real creature.

 

[Claire Rousseau]

Baphomet is not really the "devil", it's a symbol for alchemy. It's not a real creature.

Baphomet is the androgynous goat “god”.

It’s definitely a depiction of Satan/pan//Saturn/molech/remphan/Baal/bel/beelzebub. Etc....different names, same devil.

The infamous baphomet picture is a drawing by a well-known Freemason/occultist Eliphas Levi.