Virginia Democrats pass gun ban

justjess

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Assault style weapons. Not all guns. I have yet to meet a person who can explain to me a valid reason for having an assault weapon.
 






The Zone

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It’s a radical bill and one that’s arguably unconstitutional and undoubtedly ineffective. They want to turn Virginians into criminals for owning AR-15's or the magazines overnight. It is a draconian measure. The Democratic proposal would undoubtedly limit the rights of otherwise law-abiding gun owners and even subject them to criminal penalties, yet it wouldn’t actually stop mass shootings or do much to make Virginia safer.

In 1994 to 2004 the Dems had a bill which banned the weapons but a then RAND study showed that mass shooting still happened and they were not all on TV back then. The Virginia Dems also on the same week voted to ease abortion restrictions, created a bill for more protection of LGBTQabcdefg residents and undocumented immigrants but also raise the minimum working wage.

What we are seeing are extreme liberals impose their will on a very divided state. The reason they are in power is their heavily populated northern Virginia cities near D.C. but the rest of the state is quite red and this s the first time in two decades they won power and they are pretty much assuring themselves of losing it in the next election with moves. Are there some here who do not think the Charlottesville debacle was orchestrated to a degree? They have made Virginia a hotbed, so keep your eyes peeled.

But now the Dems want to run another impeachment kicking up a fuss again, again and again, while most people are actually doing okay. So good luck at the ballot box for them in that they will need it against republicans and libertarians.
 






justjess

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Can you provide a reason that a private citizen would need an AR-15 or similar type of gun?

I’m not anti gun. I think the right to own guns is important (I exercise that right myself) however, I can not think of any reason for an AR-15 or similar. I just can’t. To fight a corrupt government? It won’t do anything against the type of weapons the government has.

Also the MAJORITY of people is the MAJORITY. No matter what geographic region of the state they live in. I never understood that argument either.
 






weskrongden

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Can you provide a reason that a private citizen would need an AR-15 or similar type of gun?

I’m not anti gun. I think the right to own guns is important (I exercise that right myself) however, I can not think of any reason for an AR-15 or similar. I just can’t. To fight a corrupt government? It won’t do anything against the type of weapons the government has.

Also the MAJORITY of people is the MAJORITY. No matter what geographic region of the state they live in. I never understood that argument either.
A majority of immigrants tipping the balance just like elites want. And yes these weapons give you a chance against the government. You overrate the government's effectiveness, see Afghanistan, and don't consider some of the military would defect.

Love bringing over immigrants who vote to take our rights away.
 






justjess

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A majority of immigrants tipping the balance just like elites want. And yes these weapons give you a chance against the government. You overrate the government's effectiveness, see Afghanistan, and don't consider some of the military would defect.

Love bringing over immigrants who vote to take our rights away.
Illegal immigrants can’t vote.

The rest of us are all descendents of legal immigrants, so...

You honestly believe an ar-15 is going to hold its own against a tank? If the government truly goes to war with us no amount of guns or types of guns are going to help. And I truly can see no other justification for them short of defending a homestead in the event of a zombie apocalypse with the probability of that happening being close to nonexistent
 






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weskrongden

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Illegal immigrants can’t vote.

The rest of us are all descendents of legal immigrants, so...

You honestly believe an ar-15 is going to hold its own against a tank? If the government truly goes to war with us no amount of guns or types of guns are going to help. And I truly can see no other justification for them short of defending a homestead in the event of a zombie apocalypse with the probability of that happening being close to nonexistent
LOL you think I'm one of those idiotic virtue signaling Rs who like legal immigrants? The 1965 Immigration was the worst thing to happen to the country. Big difference between immigrants pre and post 1965. People who don't assimilate voting to restrict my rights.

It's called gueralla warfare. The government still can't win in Afghanistan, you drastically overrate them.
 






justjess

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LOL you think I'm one of those idiotic virtue signaling Rs who like legal immigrants? The 1965 Immigration was the worst thing to happen to the country. Big difference between immigrants pre and post 1965. People who don't assimilate voting to restrict my rights.

It's called gueralla warfare. The government still can't win in Afghanistan, you drastically overrate them.
I don’t think your anything. I don’t know you. I made a statement, asked a question. You can - and did - respond how you see fit.

I’m okay with isolationism but that includes pulling all our own people back (military) and ending international trade exceptin cases where we literally can not produce the necessary item ourselves. But that won’t happen. That’s not what anyone’s pushing for.

Trump wants to close the borders except for the foreign workers he ships in because apparantly there’s a shortage of native waitresses and construction workers in New Jersey and Florida (there’s not). He wants to end global trade, except for the fashion items he gets manufactured in Chinese sweat shops.

So go ahead close the borders. I’m good with that. If it’s 100%. If it’s not then it is nothing more than yet another way the rich deceive us by creating scapegoats while continuing to benefit from this ridiculous system they themselves manufactured.

I’ve been saying this for upwards of a decade, and I mean it. I’m not saying it because of trump but it has become ever more blatantly obvious since him.

My grandparents came over here legally. I know plenty of legal immigrants and their children who are fine and I don’t see the issue. I get the anger at illegals but I think there needs to be some sort of recognition that our foreign policy creates this issue and the people who tell you they don’t want it are exactly the people who benefit off it.


As for guerilla warfare.. there’s a difference between American citizens and afghani citizens engaging in it. 99% of our population wouldn’t have a goddamn idea what their doing. The government is a lot more effective against a population that’s never had to fight before for a thing in their lives.
 






Thunderian

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As someone who enjoys firing AR-15’s, as well as other guns, I can attest that the reason a private citizen in the US needs an assault rifle is, if for nothing else, to exercise their constitutional right to have a gun and shoot things with it.
 






justjess

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As someone who enjoys firing AR-15’s, as well as other guns, I can attest that the reason a private citizen in the US needs an assault rifle is, if for nothing else, to exercise their constitutional right to have a gun and shoot things with it.
I have a gun. I shoot things with it. Not being able to have an ar-15 has not infringed on that right

I will say this... I get the importance of the right to bear arms. I have my own hurdles to exercising this right due to no fault of my own, so I get it. I didn’t realize how important it was until I had to figure out ways to preserve mine. But in the absence of a single valid justification for ownership of weapons of war by private citizens I have to err on the side of prevention because the risk/cost ratio is too high there to justify it just for “fun” or highly unlikely hypothetical situations.
 






weskrongden

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I have a gun. I shoot things with it. Not being able to have an ar-15 has not infringed on that right

I will say this... I get the importance of the right to bear arms. I have my own hurdles to exercising this right due to no fault of my own, so I get it. I didn’t realize how important it was until I had to figure out ways to preserve mine. But in the absence of a single valid justification for ownership of weapons of war by private citizens I have to err on the side of prevention because the risk/cost ratio is too high there to justify it just for “fun” or highly unlikely hypothetical situations.
Disarming the populace is a key objective for a one world government. It's not highly unlikely at all. Not sure why you'd be on VC if you think armed conflict with the government is extremely unlikely.
 






elsbet

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I don’t think your anything. I don’t know you. I made a statement, asked a question. You can - and did - respond how you see fit.

I’m okay with isolationism but that includes pulling all our own people back (military) and ending international trade exceptin cases where we literally can not produce the necessary item ourselves. But that won’t happen. That’s not what anyone’s pushing for.

Trump wants to close the borders except for the foreign workers he ships in because apparantly there’s a shortage of native waitresses and construction workers in New Jersey and Florida (there’s not). He wants to end global trade, except for the fashion items he gets manufactured in Chinese sweat shops.

So go ahead close the borders. I’m good with that. If it’s 100%. If it’s not then it is nothing more than yet another way the rich deceive us by creating scapegoats while continuing to benefit from this ridiculous system they themselves manufactured.

I’ve been saying this for upwards of a decade, and I mean it. I’m not saying it because of trump but it has become ever more blatantly obvious since him.

My grandparents came over here legally. I know plenty of legal immigrants and their children who are fine and I don’t see the issue. I get the anger at illegals but I think there needs to be some sort of recognition that our foreign policy creates this issue and the people who tell you they don’t want it are exactly the people who benefit off it.


As for guerilla warfare.. there’s a difference between American citizens and afghani citizens engaging in it. 99% of our population wouldn’t have a goddamn idea what their doing. The government is a lot more effective against a population that’s never had to fight before for a thing in their lives.
This is where it's at-- not much else to be said:

... yet another way the rich deceive us by creating scapegoats while continuing to benefit from this ridiculous system they themselves manufactured.​
It works both ways, by design-- whether we agree or disagree is irrelevant. That is, they win, either way.

+1
 






SquaredCircle

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Jan 30, 2020
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224
It’s a radical bill and one that’s arguably unconstitutional and undoubtedly ineffective. They want to turn Virginians into criminals for owning AR-15's or the magazines overnight. It is a draconian measure. The Democratic proposal would undoubtedly limit the rights of otherwise law-abiding gun owners and even subject them to criminal penalties, yet it wouldn’t actually stop mass shootings or do much to make Virginia safer.

In 1994 to 2004 the Dems had a bill which banned the weapons but a then RAND study showed that mass shooting still happened and they were not all on TV back then. The Virginia Dems also on the same week voted to ease abortion restrictions, created a bill for more protection of LGBTQabcdefg residents and undocumented immigrants but also raise the minimum working wage.

What we are seeing are extreme liberals impose their will on a very divided state. The reason they are in power is their heavily populated northern Virginia cities near D.C. but the rest of the state is quite red and this s the first time in two decades they won power and they are pretty much assuring themselves of losing it in the next election with moves. Are there some here who do not think the Charlottesville debacle was orchestrated to a degree? They have made Virginia a hotbed, so keep your eyes peeled.

But now the Dems want to run another impeachment kicking up a fuss again, again and again, while most people are actually doing okay. So good luck at the ballot box for them in that they will need it against republicans and libertarians.
I agree with you , but far right politicians impose their ideas on all kinds of people who dont want it !
This is how politics work . Virginia voted in people to do these things ! Either leave or get your vote out and change the laws to your favour !
We dont need AR 15s , because the military has them ! The old pose comitatus argument flew the coop when muskets and cannons became obsolete.

If the military turned on the citizens and we all grabbed our AR 15s and barricaded ourselves or ran for the hills ,who would supply the ammo , food , shelters , transportation, communications , triage , equipments , and intel ?
Man is so far from being self reliant . Are women and children bugging out as well ?
No matter how much fantasy wine you drink there will never be a civil war ! The military has force multiplier’s that would end a civil uprising by tea time .
I own guns as well Im a CMP member and Palma instructor at Perry . The AR 15 is just a grown mans identity lego set !
AR 15s are horrible home defence weapons, they are long , heavy , require 2 hands , way to high of velocity( collateral damage ) , way to many moving pieces and not to mention all the tacti- fool attachments.
870 bump with BB , 45 acp 1911 or a .38 revolver are your best guns for home defence .
Better yet a large guard dog is the greatest proven deterrent to crooks .
It is sad to see AR 15s get banned , but when you have right wing nuts with guns walking around and rambling about final show downs and killing politicians that are different from them , what do you expect .
The lunatic fringe on both sides draws each other out and thus become the same ! Identity politics is the worst and the AR 15 has become a far right identity symbol !
20 yrs ago no one wanted a AR-15 or M16 ! Then came all the first person shooter games and slowly , but surely the tacti-cool crowd was born !
25 yrs ago I had 2 Colt M4 pre bans and no one wanted one of them ! I was not allowed to fire them at most outdoor rifle ranges , because the members complained about the semi auto rapid fire noise ! In 2008 (Obama fear)those pre ban Colts fetched me $2300.00 a piece and by 2011 the same guns new were $ 875.00 -950.00 !!!!! Lol

When I was kid we all wanted to be like Simo Hāyhā or Carlos Hathcock . The only semi auto guns were M14-M1A1 matches at Camp Perry ! The Armalite rifle has been the main battle rifle of the US since 1967 . Yet you could not sell an AR/M16 , as no one wanted one until the 2000s , because of the Brady 1993/AWB 1994 laws ! Thats right folks no one wanted hi cap Glocks or AR 15 s until there was a ban !!! The bans affected less than 2% of gun buyers , yet the day after the bills went in to effect people wanted what they could not have . Then came the XBOX and PS2 in 2000 and by 2004 Assault type weapons were accounting for 15% of all gun sales and by 2008 the AR 15 was the gun to own ! None of the reasons people own AR 15s are for defense , government standoffs , hunting etc... They became popular , because they were being regulated or a threat of being banned in 1994 ( older crowd ) and every-other video game had assault weapons ( younger crowd ) . The game Metal Gear sold more usp pistols for HK than any add campaign ever and that is from their mouths . Solid Snake had a USP SOCOM .45 acp with a can on it in the game .

When I was a kid in the 70/80s there was one guy at the rifle range ( 250 members ) who had an M16 . Every man was into bolt action accuracy and 1911 or revolver handguns . Then as I said video games , bans and movies made every one want a tacti-cool AR 15, but up until then you could not give a M16/AR-15 away !!!!!!!! Facts !!!!

Own a vanilla Colt 1911 with trijicon night sights , Wilson mags and learn how to be deadly with it . Keep 230 grain speer flying ashtrays in it and rest easy !
AR’s are fun , but serve no other function than a hobby ! They are not worth losing the 2A over .
Now if they come for my Winchester bolt action 7mm then Ill get concerned, but that wont happen unless these right wing goofs start acting more insane over and with their tact-fool AR 15s
 






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Johnny5

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What is an assault style weapon anyway? I have yet to have anyone accurately define that for me. Are they the scarier looking ones? Are they the ones that can shoot more than one round before being thrown away? Are they the ones named with abbreviations and numbers?
 






Johnny5

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207
It’s a radical bill and one that’s arguably unconstitutional and undoubtedly ineffective. They want to turn Virginians into criminals for owning AR-15's or the magazines overnight. It is a draconian measure. The Democratic proposal would undoubtedly limit the rights of otherwise law-abiding gun owners and even subject them to criminal penalties, yet it wouldn’t actually stop mass shootings or do much to make Virginia safer.

In 1994 to 2004 the Dems had a bill which banned the weapons but a then RAND study showed that mass shooting still happened and they were not all on TV back then. The Virginia Dems also on the same week voted to ease abortion restrictions, created a bill for more protection of LGBTQabcdefg residents and undocumented immigrants but also raise the minimum working wage.

What we are seeing are extreme liberals impose their will on a very divided state. The reason they are in power is their heavily populated northern Virginia cities near D.C. but the rest of the state is quite red and this s the first time in two decades they won power and they are pretty much assuring themselves of losing it in the next election with moves. Are there some here who do not think the Charlottesville debacle was orchestrated to a degree? They have made Virginia a hotbed, so keep your eyes peeled.

But now the Dems want to run another impeachment kicking up a fuss again, again and again, while most people are actually doing okay. So good luck at the ballot box for them in that they will need it against republicans and libertarians.
I think they are trying ram in as much as they can while they can. I think Virginia is similar to Illinois in that Charlottesville and Chicago decide the outcome for the whole states. It is a microcosm for why the Electoral College is important at the federal level.
 






weskrongden

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Nov 30, 2017
Messages
323
I agree with you , but far right politicians impose their ideas on all kinds of people who dont want it !
This is how politics work . Virginia voted in people to do these things ! Either leave or get your vote out and change the laws to your favour !
We dont need AR 15s , because the military has them ! The old pose comitatus argument flew the coop when muskets and cannons became obsolete.

If the military turned on the citizens and we all grabbed our AR 15s and barricaded ourselves or ran for the hills ,who would supply the ammo , food , shelters , transportation, communications , triage , equipments , and intel ?
Man is so far from being self reliant . Are women and children bugging out as well ?
No matter how much fantasy wine you drink there will never be a civil war ! The military has force multiplier’s that would end a civil uprising by tea time .
I own guns as well Im a CMP member and Palma instructor at Perry . The AR 15 is just a grown mans identity lego set !
AR 15s are horrible home defence weapons, they are long , heavy , require 2 hands , way to high of velocity( collateral damage ) , way to many moving pieces and not to mention all the tacti- fool attachments.
870 bump with BB , 45 acp 1911 or a .38 revolver are your best guns for home defence .
Better yet a large guard dog is the greatest proven deterrent to crooks .
It is sad to see AR 15s get banned , but when you have right wing nuts with guns walking around and rambling about final show downs and killing politicians that are different from them , what do you expect .
The lunatic fringe on both sides draws each other out and thus become the same ! Identity politics is the worst and the AR 15 has become a far right identity symbol !
20 yrs ago no one wanted a AR-15 or M16 ! Then came all the first person shooter games and slowly , but surely the tacti-cool crowd was born !
25 yrs ago I had 4 Colt M4 pre bans and no one wanted one of them ! I was not allowed to fire them at most outdoor rifle ranges , because the members complained about the semi auto rapid fire noise ! In 2008 (Obama fear)those pre ban Colts fetched me $2300.00 a piece and by 2011 the same guns new were $ 875.00 -950.00 !!!!! Lol

When I was kid we all wanted to be like Simo Hāyhā or Carlos Hathcock . The only semi auto guns were M14-M1A1 matches at Camp Perry ! The Armalite rifle has been the main battle rifle of the US since 1967 . Yet you could not sell an AR/M16 , as no one wanted one until the 2000s , because of the Brady 1993/AWB 1994 laws ! Thats right folks no one wanted hi cap Glocks or AR 15 s until there was a ban !!! The bans affected less than 2% of gun buyers , yet the day after the bills went in to effect people wanted what they could not have . Then came the XBOX and PS2 in 2000 and by 2004 Assault type weapons were accounting for 15% of all gun sales and by 2008 the AR 15 was the gun to own ! None of the reasons people own AR 15s are for defense , government standoffs , hunting etc... They became popular , because they were being regulated or a threat of being banned in 1994 ( older crowd ) and every-other video game had assault weapons ( younger crowd ) . The game Solid Gear sold more usp pistols for HK than any add campaign ever and that is from their mouths . Solid Snake had a USP SOCOM .45 acp with a can on it in the game .

When I was a kid in the 70/80s there was one guy at the rifle range ( 250 members ) who had an M16 . Every man was into bolt action accuracy and 1911 or revolver handguns . Then as I said video games , bans and movies made every one want a tacti-cool AR 15, but up until then you could not give a M16/AR-15 away !!!!!!!! Facts !!!!

Own a vanilla Colt 1911 with trijicon night sights , Wilson mags and learn how to be deadly with it . Keep 230 grain speer flying ashtrays in it and rest easy !
AR’s are fun , but serve no other function than a hobby ! They are not worth losing the 2A over .
Now if they come for my Winchester pre 64 7mm then Ill get concerned, but that wont happen unless these right wing goofs start acting more insane over and with their tact-fool AR 15s
What are you talking about? Right wing goofs? Coming from someone who thinks a 1911 has more practical purpose in a gunfight than an AR15, lol. You don't know anything about firearms. I could find you source after source completely proving your wrong. You don't even need to know much about firearms to understand that an AR15 is more effective than any pistol. It is easier to aim, it is steadier, it has more stopping power, it can fire more rounds, ect... ARs are extremely functional, please stop polluting the discussion with ridiculous non sense like this. At least base your opinions on modicum of facts and logic.

There is no way to win the vote when you bring in constant massive flows of immigrants who don't assimilate or respect the Constitution. If you think people won't go to a Civil War to protect their 2nd Amendment rights you are mistaken. A civil war is an extremely likely scenario with the left beginning to impose it's will on restricting the rights for the rest of us.
 






Lurker

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Can you provide a reason that a private citizen would need an AR-15 or similar type of gun?
For me it's more about want than need.
I’m not anti gun. I think the right to own guns is important (I exercise that right myself) however, I can not think of any reason for an AR-15 or similar
I can't think of any reason to ban any specific gun. The gun itself doesn't do anything.
To fight a corrupt government? It won’t do anything against the type of weapons the government has
Fully agree with you. We would need directed energy weapons at least.
Also the MAJORITY of people is the MAJORITY. No matter what geographic region of the state they live in. I never understood that argument either.
In this case, I think it's about the politicians/ lobbyists etc. moving into the state and not really representing Virginians. For me, it's students that skew local elections. Nationally, I don't want a handful of heavily populated states dictating. A lot of nuance for this issue.
 






weskrongden

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For me it's more about want than need.

I can't think of any reason to ban any specific gun. The gun itself doesn't do anything.

Fully agree with you. We would need directed energy weapons at least.

In this case, I think it's about the politicians/ lobbyists etc. moving into the state and not really representing Virginians. For me, it's students that skew local elections. Nationally, I don't want a handful of heavily populated states dictating. A lot of nuance for this issue.
Dude, it's immigrants. The stats and polls are clear, only white people majority support gun rights.
 






justjess

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Disarming the populace is a key objective for a one world government. It's not highly unlikely at all. Not sure why you'd be on VC if you think armed conflict with the government is extremely unlikely.
Re-read what I said. An AR-15 is not going to do jack shit if the government comes for us. They have way “bigger guns”

If your truly concerned move the fuck away from civilization to the middle of nowhere up in the mountains. Make your self self-reliant. Buy weapons that are good for home defense. And batten down.

For me: move to the middle of nowhere - check. Move to the mountains - check. Home defense- check. Working on the self reliance piece. Still don’t see a need for an ar-15, not when assholes are running around using them to slaughter people.
 






weskrongden

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Re-read what I said. An AR-15 is not going to do jack shit if the government comes for us. They have way “bigger guns”

If your truly concerned move the fuck away from civilization to the middle of nowhere up in the mountains. Make your self self-reliant. Buy weapons that are good for home defense. And batten down.

For me: move to the middle of nowhere - check. Move to the mountains - check. Home defense- check. Working on the self reliance piece. Still don’t see a need for an ar-15, not when assholes are running around using them to slaughter people.
They aren't though. The overwhelming majority of shootings are handguns. So if you want to stop shootings, you want to ban handguns.
 






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