University Pulls Article on Gender Dysphoria Study Due to Accusations of Transphobia

[Violette]

Interesting
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6115103/Brown-University-pulls-gender-dysphoria-study-teens-identifying-transgender-amid-transphobic.html#article-6115103
“Brown University pulled an article touting its own study on transgender youth which suggested that social media and peers can influence a teen to consider changing their gender identity, amid complaints. The school said it recieved complaints from the community that the research could invalidate perspectives of members in the transgender community. The research, that also showed teens suddenly identifying as transgender could be influenced by their peer group, was also called 'transphobic'.”
Here’s the study https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0202330

 

[Aero]

Snowball sampling is not very good. It indicates a bias and skewed method of analyzing the population. They put their surveys on websites where people were already reporting rapid-onset gender dysphoria.

If they are simply trying to prove that this is a thing, that's fine. But the data is mostly meaningless. And I'm pretty sure people already know it's a thing.

 

[Violette]

Snowball sampling is not very good. It indicates a bias and skewed method of analyzing the population. They put their surveys on websites where people were already reporting rapid-onset gender dysphoria.

If they are simply trying to prove that this is a thing, that's fine. But the data is mostly meaningless. And I'm pretty sure people already know it's a thing.

Snowball sampling can actually be very useful especially in a situation like this where the population is hard to reach. I get how it can be used for bias but I don’t think that’s the case here.

Lots of people don’t know it’s a thing. I see it argued all the time that people are born trans or feel that way at a very young age but now lots of parents are observing this cultural phenomenon of their teenagers and YA becoming trans when there was no indication they were as young children. I’ve seen people here say being aware of transgender ideology has no influence on others and I don’t buy that at all. Social and peer contagion definitely play a role in ROGD.

 

[Aero]

Snowball sampling can actually be very useful especially in a situation like this where the population is hard to reach. I get how it can be used for bias but I don’t think that’s the case here.

Lots of people don’t know it’s a thing. I see it argued all the time that people are born trans or feel that way at a very young age but now lots of parents are observing this cultural phenomenon of their teenagers and YA becoming trans when there was no indication they were as young children. I’ve seen people here say being aware of transgender ideology has no influence on others and I don’t buy that at all. Social and peer contagion definitely play a role in ROGD.

It's not that it can be used for bias. It's that it probably was in this case. If they were trying to be objective they would of cold called. Instead, they went directly to the people they were trying to categorize. This may give them some insights into certain characteristics of this specific group of people. But that group of people has to remain anonymous due to privacy concerns. So either way for all we know it could be totally rigged.

One group of people can have this specific disorder. And another group can have the genetic dispositions. Epigenetics tells us that genes change over time for many different reasons. So genes could change from some type of social pressure. But there could also be genes that were dormant since birth and just waiting for that specific age. Conclusively speaking you don't really know and this study doesn't get us closer to answering that.

I can't really tell if you are a constructionist or not. Either way, this type of stuff is not just a social phenomenon. Science can predict a lot of things about us with pretty good accuracy. And my personal opinion is Carl Jung solved the whole thing a long time ago. He knew it was a combination of hormones and the human unconscious.

What I mean is heterosexual egos identify more with the typical heterosexual symbols. In transgender and homosexuals the priority, or order of symbols if you will has been unbalanced. In the Jungian view, this would be a process that started at birth, or in the womb.

 

[Thunderian]

If it doesn't fit the agenda, it goes down the memory hole. Progressivism is cancer to any kind of freedom.

 

[mecca]

The study was flawed in many ways. They said they wanted to study transgender people yet they decided to ask their parents questions about what they think their children are doing, instead of actually asking the transgender people themselves. The parents have no idea what thought processes their child was going through before finally reaching the conclusion that they are transgender, they don't know how long their child was keeping their identity a secret... to the parent it could seem unexpected and sudden but to the actual trans person, it is how they felt all along.

Also, they took their sample only from specifically anti-transgender blogs, that is an obvious bias. It doesn't make sense to try to reach an objective conclusion about gender dysphoria and transgender people by asking some anti-trans parents.

 

[Aero]

If it doesn't fit the agenda, it goes down the memory hole. Progressivism is cancer to any kind of freedom.

So you prefer traditionalist brutality? Aka we should attack anyone who symbolizes change.

Last year America had the highest murder rate of transgenders. Oh well right?

 

[elsbet]

So you prefer traditionalist brutality? Aka we should attack anyone who symbolizes change.

Last year America had the highest murder rate of transgenders. Oh well right?

Except that isn't true.

Since 2008 the number of transgender people who have been murdered worldwide has been recorded annually by the Trans Murder Monitoring project (link to all the data is here.)

Some important trends can be seen in the data. The vast majority of all transgender murder victims come from countries in Central and South America; Brazil and Mexico having the highest numbers.*

LINK

* 1/3 of the victims were sex workers-- a "notoriously dangerous line of work."

 

[Aero]

Except that isn't true.

Since 2008 the number of transgender people who have been murdered worldwide has been recorded annually by the Trans Murder Monitoring project (link to all the data is here.)

Some important trends can be seen in the data. The vast majority of all transgender murder victims come from countries in Central and South America; Brazil and Mexico having the highest numbers.*

LINK

* 1/3 of the victims were sex workers-- a "notoriously dangerous line of work."

Last year the number of transgender murders was higher than any other year in America. Fixed it.

But don't see your point anyway. In a survey of transgender people, 65 percent of Florida's respondents say police have mistreated them. And if the cops are treating them poorly, it's safe to assume this is a vulnerable population. They have to deal with constant discrimination and a serious lack of safe work environments.

Kind of blows the whole agenda theory out of the water though. The world is shit for transgender people, and no amount of conspiracy theories will change that

 

[Thunderian]

So you prefer traditionalist brutality?

How is it that you think those are the only two choices?

As far as I'm concerned, we have progressed -- at least when it comes to Western civilization -- to the end of a right and proper quest for a just and fair society based on the same rights for every person while protecting the freedom of personal expression. That kind of society is the dream, and we are living it.

There are no more civil rights left to grant, and what we have now -- this eternal refining by the left of what constitutes harmful discrimination -- is what I would call cancerous progressivism. Progressivism can't spread without replacing some healthy freedom.

We have a good society now. People need to stop messing with it.

Aka we should attack anyone who symbolizes change.

Good grief. Resisting cancerous change isn't attacking ALL change.

 

[Bacsi]

Interesting
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6115103/Brown-University-pulls-gender-dysphoria-study-teens-identifying-transgender-amid-transphobic.html#article-6115103
“Brown University pulled an article touting its own study on transgender youth which suggested that social media and peers can influence a teen to consider changing their gender identity, amid complaints. The school said it recieved complaints from the community that the research could invalidate perspectives of members in the transgender community. The research, that also showed teens suddenly identifying as transgender could be influenced by their peer group, was also called 'transphobic'.”
Here’s the study https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0202330

Censorship! It's not an isolated case. This has been going on for decades on many subjects.

 

[Corvus Metus]

Ignoring that the study stoke to parents, rather than the actual transgendered indivdual... Colleges and universities are for profit in America, especially a "prestigious" Ivy Leauge school like Brown. If enough of its costumers students complain about something, they'll change it. Because you know, it's bad for business to piss off the people giving you a lot of money to teach you shit that you could learn in community college for a fraction of the cost.

 

[elsbet]

Ignoring that the study stoke to parents, rather than the actual transgendered indivdual... Colleges and universities are for profit in America, especially a "prestigious" Ivy Leauge school like Brown. If enough of its costumers students complain about something, they'll change it. Because you know, it's bad for business to piss off the people giving you a lot of money to teach you shit that you could learn in community college for a fraction of the cost.

Arent the ignorant parents footing the bill, though?

 

[Corvus Metus]

Arent the ignorant parents footing the bill, though?

Probably not the parents they interviewed. Point is, every time people complain about colleges and universities doing this but colleges and universities aren't really bastions of learning and education anymore. They are glorified clubs that every day, only the rich can actually attend. From the stand-up comedians the hire to entertain to even the studies they fund... Everything is a product.

Not to mention, this study is poorly thought out and should be criticised. "Let's see if social media can influence someone to be transgendered. Let's see... Should we interview the transgendered individuals? No, the parents!" There is nothing even remotely scientific about that.

 

[elsbet]

Probably not the parents they interviewed. Point is, every time people complain about colleges and universities doing this but colleges and universities aren't really bastions of learning and education anymore. They are glorified clubs that every day, only the rich can actually attend. From the stand-up comedians the hire to entertain to even the studies they fund... Everything is a product.

Not to mention, this study is poorly thought out and should be criticised. "Let's see if social media can influence someone to be transgendered. Let's see... Should we interview the transgendered individuals? No, the parents!" There is nothing even remotely scientific about that.

Little error on my part-- this is a university study, but it's about minors.

Did you read the article?

 

[Bacsi]

One can criticise and not accept the methodology of the study, from the scientific point of view, but forcing to withdraw it is pure sensorship and is totally unacceptable. Especially on the grounds quoted. It's dictate of a small group of mentally ill people to suppress anything they don't like which doesn't fit their delusional fantasy.

About the subject of the study, gender dysphoria is a mental illness. If I suddenly decide I'm a head of cabbage, I think no-one will say it's a rapid-onset lifeform dysphoria.

 

[mecca]

One can criticise and not accept the methodology of the study, from the scientific point of view, but forcing to withdraw it is pure sensorship and is totally unacceptable.

The study is freely visible on their website. It isn't censored. People are rightfully questioning the flawed and unscientific methods the study used and it is being reevaluated.

 

[Aero]

That's a strong accusation. The problem is that so many people are looking to be offended and going out of their way to create a situation where there is none. With that in mind -
1. How were the respondents defining mistreatment?
2. What are the actual examples of the mistreatment? Was there physical harm, illegal activity, emotional harm, threats, etc? Was it maybe just a misunderstanding, and therefore no intent to mistreat?

Without further information and proof of actual mistreatment, the survey cannot be taken as fact.

Pretty sure they defined it like I said. Discrimination and fearing for their personal safety.

It must be your thing to quote half of a paragraph and pretend the rest doesn't exist. It still does exist though. And I don't care if you believe it or not. I'm not going to go dig up any more sources.

 

[elsbet]

Last year the number of transgender murders was higher than any other year in America. Fixed it.

But don't see your point anyway. In a survey of transgender people, 65 percent of Florida's respondents say police have mistreated them. And if the cops are treating them poorly, it's safe to assume this is a vulnerable population. They have to deal with constant discrimination and a serious lack of safe work environments.

Kind of blows the whole agenda theory out of the water though. The world is shit for transgender people, and no amount of conspiracy theories will change that

I really thought I responded to this.

My point was simply that the US didn't have the highest murder rate. Brazil and Mexico have the highest rate, and prostitutes are typically the victims. That's true for hetero prostitutes, too, though. It's a dangerous job by nature.

I don't think I said anything else.

 

[Aero]

I really thought I responded to this.

My point was simply that the US didn't have the highest murder rate. Brazil and Mexico have the highest rate, and prostitutes are typically the victims. That's true for hetero prostitutes, too, though. It's a dangerous job by nature.

I don't think I said anything else.

A lot of people don't have prime options for work. That's why I brought up discrimination.

But let's go with your ideas. They are all prostitutes. So if more of them are dying, than more of them are prostituting. Or maybe prostitution is getting more dangerous. Tough call I guess.