Trump wants to clean up

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I didn’t say they didn’t need help..but you aren’t helping someone who doesn’t want it and you surely aren’t helping them with being homeless by giving them food or some change. They are still homeless and that hasn’t changed their life.
So like I said Lisa... raise wages, implement a guaranteed job program, expand access to affordable housing, grant universal medical (so those addicts can get the help you keep citing).. I’m in favor of all that (I’m pretty sure you aren’t in favor of any of it)

In the interim however I will continue doing what’s in my power - be that change or food or clothes or whatever. I certainly won’t be calling cops when I see a homeless person in my neighborhood. And I will support the homeless shelters and soup kitchens and anything else that gives them atleast a decent meal or a warm place to sleep until our country/government starts prioritizing caring for our own living breathing feeling people, rather than wasting billions putting children in cages, sending aid to Israel, trillions on wars we shouldn’t be involved in, trillions in tax cuts for rich people and corporations etc.
 





Lisa

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I’m in favor of all that (I’m pretty sure you aren’t in favor of any of it)
You could ask if I am instead of assuming I’m not...

I certainly won’t be calling cops when I see a homeless person in my neighborhood.
Why would you do that? Unless they are disturbing the peace or something?

And I will support the homeless shelters and soup kitchens and anything else that gives them atleast a decent meal or a warm place to sleep until our country/government starts prioritizing caring for our own living breathing feeling people, rather than wasting billions putting children in cages, sending aid to Israel, trillions on wars we shouldn’t be involved in, trillions in tax cuts for rich people and corporations etc.
Lol
 





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You could ask if I am instead of assuming I’m not...


Why would you do that? Unless they are disturbing the peace or something?


Lol
You’ve told me your not in the past. Called them handouts.

Idk Lisa... why do you call cops on homeless people? They aren’t disturbing the peace for existing.
 





Lisa

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You’ve told me your not in the past. Called them handouts.

Idk Lisa... why do you call cops on homeless people? They aren’t disturbing the peace for existing.
They are handouts...those people who are capable of doing something for the meal, don’t. The man on the article is not able to care for himself and should get care since he is still alive.

I have never called the police on homeless people myself. My husband has because of the mess on the sidewalk in front of his building. Not only that it attracts more homeless to come over with their mess and then come the drug dealers...it is a very big problem for business owners. They actually do start to disturb the peace.
 





Lisa

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You’ve told me your not in the past. Called them handouts.
It took me a minute to see what you’ve done here...I did call feeding the homeless handouts but I’ve never talked about or referred to raise wages, implement a guaranteed job program, expand access to affordable housing, grant universal medical...as handouts...that’s you assuming I mean those things too.
 





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It took me a minute to see what you’ve done here...I did call feeding the homeless handouts but I’ve never talked about or referred to raise wages, implement a guaranteed job program, expand access to affordable housing, grant universal medical...as handouts...that’s you assuming I mean those things too.
That’s every conversation we have ever had on a political topic where you said no, socialism blah blah. There’s already an adequate safety net blah blah... clearly not since homeless people are living on your sidewalk.

That man is not alive. His body is being kept artificially nominally alive but his brain (the center of life) has long since left the building.
 





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I’m not but I think addicts are the majority.
You think. And when you combine drug and alcohol abuse, you're correct; 38% abuse alcohol and 26% abuse drugs. Even if you ignore overlap, that still leaves at least 36% who are clean. You're also realizing there are reasons why homeless people turn to addiction that won't be solved but snubbing them.

https://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/addiction.pdf

The catholic charities have showers where the homeless are. And I think with addicts it’s hard because they want the drugs or that drink.
Thank God for them. But when I mean "clean" I mean breaking their drug and/or alcohol addiction. Very few people can quit cold turkey.

Do you care that that is all your doing..you aren’t solving homelessness by doing that and homelessness creates more problems.
Homelessness won't be solved until we realize that our financial and economic systems aren't designed to help the poor and demand change. Until then, all we can do is try and offer some degree of succor. Ignoring them isn't going to help.

I didn’t say they didn’t have value...they are human and I hope they can come out of it too, I just don’t see feeding them as being the solution to homelessness. Do they deserve to eat if they won’t even help themselves? If they won’t do something for the food but show up?
Yes. Even if someone does absolutely nothing, they deserve to eat. No human being deserves to go hungry. Period. No exception.

Why? Wasn’t it a poor choice to start on drugs or drinking? Isn’t it selfishness to keep going although you were probably told by family and or friends that you weren’t a good person to be around while drinking or doing drugs? I worked with a girl who told me her parents were divorced because her mom wanted to drink more than she wanted to be a family...
To begin, addiction is an illness. It's a physical and psychological dependency. And people make mistakes. There isn't a human being on this planet who is perfect.




Being a Christian is the issue.
I'm pretty sure it isn't. No one seems to have an issue with my faith.

We believe something other than what the world believes about problems, we believe people are sinners and that makes people mad. Then they don’t understand that even though you are saved, you aren’t perfect and still have sins that God is working on.
No. People get upset, when you call out their sins, publically, while keeping yours in the dark. They get upset when rather than understanding most sin doesn't come from a plance of malice, that you refuse to try to understand and sit on a high horse. Like you are doing, looking down on homeless people.
They think then it’s hypocritical of you to even say anything to them even though you know that you still have God working on you but you’re still supposed to tell the unsaved the Good News.

To tell people about the Good News one must first let people know about sin so it would seem like they are being judgemental or self righteousness when they are actually just letting you know what constitutes sin, something they as a Christian also had to confess when they came to Christ.

Ya, being saved by grace through faith is easier than going to hell for your sins. Even Jesus said;
MATTHEW‬ ‭11:28-30‬ ‭

“Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and YOU WILL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”


Here's the thing. If someone is in a bad place, you telling them that Jesus makes it easier doesn't help them if they aren't a believer. If you're homeless, you need more than prayers. You did a hand up. You need someone to show some Christ-like love. And that's the problem with a lot of Christians these days. They don't want to be Christ-like; say they are saved but don't try to get their hands dirty in making the world the sort of place Christ would be pleased His followers tried when He returns.

If I murder someone would you say I deserve prison? Sometimes bad choices have negative consequences and I think they should so you would think twice about doing it.
You would. Since you took another person's life; you hurt another person. But depending on the circumstances, I might not think you deserve to be in prison for life and I certainly don't think you deserve to be executed; even if you were a serial killer. Your life would still have value.

If being an addict had a very negative connotation maybe then people would think twice about it. But there are people even on the forum ok with marijuana.
Most people who become addicts don't care all that much about the negative social stigma since many of them feel abandoned by society in the first place. I mean, the homeless veteran who's an alcoholic or the runaway who's got a heroin problem really didn't have people help them BEFORE they had a drug problem... And if everyone thought like you, no one would be there for them now.

People are wanting it to be legal for people to do magic mushrooms...where does that end? Will we don’t out more and more now that all the illegal drugs should be legal because they ‘help’ something? There is an opioid epidemic where people are getting those kinds of drugs somehow. We seem to make it easier and easier on people to become addicts.
Because addicts are sick. And we have an opioid epidemic because the war on drugs have hurt alterntive treatments for pain. And obviously, you've never had to watch someone suffer in chronic, unbarable pain you actually loved because if you did, you'd be more than willing to give them magic mushrooms if it owuld help ease their suffering. But that's another topic.

I never said that I feel bad about the system..again...I just don’t think it’s helping homelessness.
I mean it's fairly obvious you don't feel bad about the suffering of the homeless if you're willing to dismiss them all as addicts and think they can just rot away.

I didn’t say they deserve anything, except a free life to continue in their addictions and I think enabling people is sad and not helpful.
You might think its "sad to enable" someone... But again, unless addicts (which don't even makeup all the homeless) have their basic needs met, they aren't going to be able to get clean... And if you don't think they deserve to eat, well...

Ya, but He didn’t command to feed someone for life. Wasn’t it odd that the righteous had no idea that they had done all of that...
If someone is unable to get food themselves and you snub them and they starve, you murdered them. Period. Apathy is the whole reason they world is in the shape it is in the first place - and it's explictly the thing Christ spoke against.
 





Lisa

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That’s every conversation we have ever had on a political topic where you said no, socialism blah blah. There’s already an adequate safety net blah blah... clearly not since homeless people are living on your sidewalk.

That man is not alive. His body is being kept artificially nominally alive but his brain (the center of life) has long since left the building.
I don’t believe I’ve talked about the issues you are saying I did.

There isn’t a safety net for drug addicts/alcoholics who’s choices are to drink and do drugs..yes, you are right there.

Let’s keep the other comment to the euthanasia thread..
 





Lisa

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You're also realizing there are reasons why homeless people turn to addiction that won't be solved but snubbing them.
Did I say snub them? I do think that they aren’t helped by just feeding them though.

Thank God for them. But when I mean "clean" I mean breaking their drug and/or alcohol addiction. Very few people can quit cold turkey.
I see...I thought you meant a shower. Yes, that’s true, but eventually you’ll have to quit cold turkey.

Ignoring them isn't going to help.
But just feeding them does?

Yes. Even if someone does absolutely nothing, they deserve to eat.
That doesn’t make sense, I would rather give someone something if they do a little work for it then absolutely nothing, I think that helps a person to remember that they can help themselves by doing a little at first.

I'm pretty sure it isn't. No one seems to have an issue with my faith.
John‬ ‭15:19‬ ‭
“If you were of the world, the world would love its own.”
‭‭
No. People get upset, when you call out their sins, publically, while keeping yours in the dark. They get upset when rather than understanding most sin doesn't come from a plance of malice, that you refuse to try to understand and sit on a high horse. Like you are doing, looking down on homeless people.
Jeremiah‬ ‭17:9‬ ‭
The heart is more deceitful than all else And is desperately sick; Who can understand it?​
‭‭Most sin is bad and giving into it is bad as well..that’s why the punishment is so bad. I’m not looking down on homeless people by saying that they can participate in their recovery and help out by doing something rather than receiving a handout which doesn’t help them at all. I’m all for helping by giving food, or a place to stay or helping find a job provided they don’t use the help to just stay homeless which I think many just do that because it takes a lot to turn their lives around. Honestly, turning to Jesus is the biggest help they will ever get to turn their lives around. Everything else is just bandaids and doesn’t really help them.

Here's the thing. If someone is in a bad place, you telling them that Jesus makes it easier doesn't help them if they aren't a believer. If you're homeless, you need more than prayers. You did a hand up. You need someone to show some Christ-like love. And that's the problem with a lot of Christians these days. They don't want to be Christ-like; say they are saved but don't try to get their hands dirty in making the world the sort of place Christ would be pleased His followers tried when He returns.
If you understand the Bible, you know that you can’t make the world a better place, only God can because it was only God who really helped you in your life to make it better. Yes, God can help them and make their lives better..feeding the homeless is not the way to help them because it just continues their cycle of homelessness. It may make the people giving the handouts feel better they did something..but they didn’t actually help the situation.
God can and does help people..that’s why we are Christians. We know if we do good things, its because God is in us helping us to do them, not because we ourselves can do them. When people aren’t believers, you tell them about Jesus and pray that they will see God. Yes, you can offer to clothe them, feed them, but not for a lifetime, that’s enabling.

You would. Since you took another person's life; you hurt another person. But depending on the circumstances, I might not think you deserve to be in prison for life and I certainly don't think you deserve to be executed; even if you were a serial killer. Your life would still have value.
May whole point, was that bad decisions have negative consequences...who even thinks that it wouldn’t or shouldn’t? That’s to not encourage bad behavior.

Most people who become addicts don't care all that much about the negative social stigma since many of them feel abandoned by society in the first place. I mean, the homeless veteran who's an alcoholic or the runaway who's got a heroin problem really didn't have people help them BEFORE they had a drug problem... And if everyone thought like you, no one would be there for them now.
Why does someone always have to have something that has happened to them for them to be an addict, other than it was a choice? Its still a choice for that person to drink or do drugs, that’s how they think they can cope with their problems, but it just ends up giving more problems then it solves.

Because addicts are sick. And we have an opioid epidemic because the war on drugs have hurt alterntive treatments for pain. And obviously, you've never had to watch someone suffer in chronic, unbarable pain you actually loved because if you did, you'd be more than willing to give them magic mushrooms if it owuld help ease their suffering. But that's another topic.
That doesn’t make sense..I would think that more opioids are being prescribed than denied to have such a huge problem!
That is another topic.

I mean it's fairly obvious you don't feel bad about the suffering of the homeless if you're willing to dismiss them all as addicts and think they can just rot away.
Its so funny that you all act like I don’t care..I do, I just don’t think what’s being done now is helping...mostly because the homeless issue is getting worse and not better, surely a sign that its not being helped by just giving food to them?

If someone is unable to get food themselves and you snub them and they starve, you murdered them.
How did I murder them? Don’t they have any complicity in what they did to themselves? Who is responsible for a person’s sins, but the person doing them, right?