@Thunderian:
"It wasn't signed by either side. As I said, it was presented to the UN by Obama and ratified there, but never signed or ratified by the US or Iran"
Here is a picture of the front cover of the JCPOA document that shows the signatures of the lead negotiators from each participant country. For your relevance, note the scribble of the US Secretary of State (John Kerry) and that of his Iranian counterpart Javad Zarif:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Comprehensive_Plan_of_Action#/media/File:JCPOA_Signatures.png
I accept that the Iran nuclear deal is not a treaty or an executive agreement. It is, nevertheless, an important political agreement to which Washington committed itself to in 2015.
@Thunderian:
"You can't be serious. What is so sacred about this deal that you would use such a strange analogy? Did you hear that Iran is threatening to release the names of American and European officials who took bribes so the Iran deal would pass? So this deal was lied about, never ratified or signed, people had to be bribed to ensure it's acceptance, and Iran was not even in compliance with it anyway, but you're still saying it's such an important agreement that American withdrawal means we're all doomed."
I admit the analogy is outlandish, but, doesn't it fit the situation!?
Are there no
[real life] consequences for the United States decision to depart from an agreement that has the support of her nearest allies and partners?
German Foreign Minister Heiko Maas has stated that Berlin is going to change its stance towards Washington for reneging on the Iran nuclear deal. His deputy in the German Foreign Ministry stated that there would be
"grave long-term consequences for our relations". This is German understatement at its finest and the US State Department had better pay attention.
The French Finance Minister Bruno Le Maire talked about defending "economic sovereignty" and stated that the EU was not a "vassal" of the United States !?
Britain's Prime Minister was less strident, but, made it clear that London fully supports the Iran nuclear deal. I don't share your optimism that the EU will roll over and follow Washington out of this deal. Not when China, Russia and the UN continue to endorse it. With regards to the latter, the JCPOA had the best possible 'ratification' process of any agreement in recent history, namely, that it was incorporated into international law when every member of the Security Council voted to recognise its provisions on 20th July 2015.
The only authority that has the responsibility, credibility and direct information (from inspectors on the ground) about the compliance of Iran with the provisions of JCPOA is the IAEA, (International Atomic Energy Agency). Its Director General Yukiya Amano stated in March that Iran was in compliance with its obligations under the agreement. If Israel has intelligence indicating matters are otherwise, Tel Aviv should forward that information to the IAEA for investigation, (instead of providing PM Netanyahu an opportunity to undertake one of his
demented theatrical performances about the supposed menace of Tehran) !?
@Thunderian:
"I'm not American, and I have no imperial hubris myself. America is declining, but even in this state, it's still mightier than any other nation on earth. If it chooses to use it's economic might in this situation, it will be hard to resist it"
History indicates that its a terrible sign when an imperial champion has to rely on physical coercion to achieve its political objectives. 'Soft Power' (economic, cultural, diplomatic and educational) influences are indicative of real underlying strengths. Washington has, effectively, blown most - if not all - of these.
One could make the case that the US economy is an amalgam of misrepresented and misconstrued data that bears little resemblance to the reality of its economic performance. Therefore, the only credible strength underpinning the American economy is its military (and nuclear) arsenal!?
Take the military out of the equation and you have a bankrupt American Republic that doesn't even enjoy the benefit of producing its own bananas!?
@Thunderian:
"Fine, I have it all wrong. Everyone loves Iran and I don't know what I'm talking about"
Don't be like that.
I am always charmed and delighted to read your comments and the threads you post. In turn, i try to comment and participate in all of them. The fact that we don't agree on some issues should be a source of encouragement to rethink our own views, articulate better arguments and - where we get things wrong - to concede our error and move on.
@Thundrian:
"I still have to wonder what is so precious about this deal that withdrawing from it will apparently unleash hell. Can you explain what you're all so afraid of?"
To hell with the deal. I'm more concerned about the most powerful nation on earth spunking whatever remains of her international credibility down the sewage outflow pipe and leaving a massive vacuum in the Middle East. Nature and providence abhor vacuums. You may think that Christ will fill that vacuum, i take my cue from history and believe that what will unfold will be all too 'earthly'!? I'm prepared to wager (and i'm no betting man) that you won't like what will appear in this region in a few years!
@Thunderian:
"Trump promised when he was campaigning that he would withdraw from the deal, and now he's done it. He hasn't promised to withdraw from any other deals, other than NAFTA, so I don't think anyone needs to be concerned that this will start an avalanche"
You might have read my comments about Trump in other threads on these forums. I greeted his rise as a much needed antidote to the failed and corrupt liberal political classes, (across both sides of the Atlantic). As a Republican candidate and occupant of the Oval Office, Trump was (and still is) head and shoulders above any senior political figure on Capitol Hill, with the possible exception of Bernie Sanders. I even welcomed his decision to move the US Embassy to Jerusalem.
If anything, he hasn't been the sort of 'game changer' that many of his own supporters had wanted. He remains firmly in the pockets of the financial kleptocracy of Wall Street, (note the Goldman Sachs acolytes sat around his cabinet table)!?
The [real] American economy remains debt laden and moribund, in fact, the debt overhang will be even greater under Trump than Obama. The plight of working Americans will be a dangerous social and political crisis in 2020.
His military entanglements have been even more ridiculous (see Syria) than any of his recent predecessors. Even with the positive development in North Korea, the Middle East is more dangerous and unstable since the 1950's and 60's.