The reliability of Christian and Muslim texts compared

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I scrolled through the Quran - looks like there are even more loopholes for men.

https://quran.com/78?translations=20

78:31
Indeed, for the righteous is attainment -
78:32
Gardens and grapevines
78:33
And full-breasted [companions] of equal age

Where is the small print that says WIFE? The Heaven of Islam permits sex slaves now?
Where is there any hint of consent from the women?
Its an abrahamic faith it IS wife LOL

Stop grabbing at straws, what point of "youll get whatever you want" is hard to understand?

Ok Muslims - I just discovered the book Amazon banned that claims to have put the Quran in the correct order to show how Muhammad went from a founder of a new faith into a warlord.

UK Muslims - remember Tommy Robinson? He is one of the writers. https://epdf.pub/queue/mohammeds-koran-why-muslims-kill-for-islam.html

It will be very interesting to the rest of us who scratch our head at the Quran verses put in no logical sequence UNLIKE the bible. It apparently got 5 star ratings from readers. http://www.mohammeds-koran.com/articles/the-banning-of-this-book
"correct order" LMFAO

So over 1400 years the book wasn't in correct order and Tommy from down the block puts it in correct order? Are you going to provide me with reason HOW and WHY is this book the "Correct order"?
 





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And Just like that When Jo realizes that she "better non material paradise" thing did not work, she completely ignores it and brings up a new topic. Evasion is rarely attractive.

Answer the questions please.
 





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There is the world of difference between being argumentative and providing reasoned argument. People reading our various exchanges will determine for themselves where logic ends and force of polemical argument begins. I respect the former and don’t have time to waste on the latter.
And you're two counts striked with that:

1. Failed to validate the Bible as scripture, it's canonization and lack of any direct revelation (spare us your wishy-washy apologetic verbal diarrhea)
2. Failed to validate the supposed deity of Jesus, in light of the entire Old Testament from your own Bible.
3. Failed to validate a reason why God wouldn't send direct revelation, inspite of accounts in your Bible telling abbreviated biographical accounts of this supposedly happening.
4. Failed to prove the authenticity of a random collection of texts without any chain of transmission and often very far removed association with any of the history it claims throughout.
5. Failed to invalidate the truth about God not being an arbitrarily assembled battle-force superman slotmachine.
6. Failed to invalidate the Jewish position on this, which predates the Revelation of Islam.
7. Failed to disprove the third commandment.
8. Failed to disprove the reoccurring pagan motifs in your Bible, for our atheist audience.​
 





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And you're two counts striked with that:

1. Failed to validate the Bible as scripture, it's canonization and lack of any direct revelation (spare us your wishy-washy apologetic verbal diarrhea)​

2. Failed to validate the supposed deity of Jesus, in light of the entire Old Testament from your own Bible.​

3. Failed to validate a reason why God wouldn't send direct revelation, inspite of accounts in your Bible telling abbreviated biographical accounts of this supposedly happening.​

4. Failed to prove the authenticity of a random collection of texts without any chain of transmission and often very far removed association with any of the history it claims throughout.​

5. Failed to invalidate the truth about God not being an arbitrarily assembled battle-force superman.​

6. Failed to invalidate the Jewish position on this, which predates the Revelation of Islam.​

7. Failed to disprove the third commandment.​

8. Failed to disprove the reoccurring pagan motifs, for our atheist audience.​
No @Infinityloop - with respect I have a busier life than you might realise and I am aware that those who wish to examine your bold claims are well able to investigate them for themselves without help from you and I ;-)
 





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Right, so busy that you made this thread. You've failed to give a good reason to ignore my list, at that, too.
I was discussing politics with my son this morning and I failed to convince him of a more nuanced political understanding than he currently held. It wasn’t that I was making no sense, but he was not ready to hear it. In the same way @Infinityloop you are not (yet) ready to hear from me. If I detect a different tone than the one I often encounter from a frequent gnostic ecclesiastical contributor to this forum, I will be more inclined to trade my time for discussion with you.

James 3

Heavenly Versus Demonic Wisdom

13Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show by good conduct that his works are done in the meekness of wisdom. 14But if you have bitter envy and self-seeking in your hearts, do not boast and lie against the truth. 15This wisdom does not descend from above, but is earthly, sensual, demonic. 16For where envy and self-seeking exist, confusion and every evil thing are there. 17But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy. 18Now the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.
 





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Now clearly, if Islam is false, you'd be able to honestly answer those very easily without any deflections and logical errors. But clearly you can't.

It brings to mind the very nature of this thread, which is once again one of arrogant Christian egotistical fallacious self-superiority. To look down on the Muslim as just stupid and unable to think, and to see the world as a blazing fire which is engulfing everyone except those that accept their superman idol as "lord and savior". Who will willingly go on their way to shit on Muslims, yet give lazy, incoherent arguments against Islam without even attempting to lift a finger to defend the very arbitrary collection of Books (the Bible) that they (Christians) consider to be so great, authoritative and totally above the idea of Direct Revelation, in the case of the Qur'an.
The constant obnoxious behavior, dodging everything that you don't like, not giving straight answers to anything and then having the audacity to pretend that we are the ones doing what you're doing. It's rich but wholly childish.
At the end of it, it brings into question the entire Abrahamic tradition. Depends which way you swing.
Maybe religions outside the Abrahamic tradition are the real truth and we are so caught up with idolizing things that have no actual reality, or maybe we collectively as Jews, Christians and Muslims just don't understand our texts.
Truth remains that in order to accept the Bible as any form of authority (leaving aside mutual respect of parts within it), requires one to also put everything else on the table, as the Bible alone has no authority and is rather just a cultural prop leftover.
The nature of this thread is very clear from the offset and it's a shame you Christians have such low standards on your Bible, such low standards that you may as well be pot-smoking atheists. Heck, you may even learn something from trying out that lifestyle, who knows?
To be completely unable to defend your Bible in any way, yet having such strong disdain, disrespect and prejudice against the Qur'an, just amuses me. At the end of it all, the Abrahamic tradition likely just shows us that life itself is a big joke.



“God is not a man, that He should lie,
Nor a son of man, that He should repent.
Has He said, and will He not do?
Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?"

- Numbers 23:19
 





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Its an abrahamic faith it IS wife LOL

Stop grabbing at straws, what point of "youll get whatever you want" is hard to understand?


"correct order" LMFAO

So over 1400 years the book wasn't in correct order and Tommy from down the block puts it in correct order? Are you going to provide me with reason HOW and WHY is this book the "Correct order"?
1. I did better and gave professional information sources.
If that is not enough for you and Infinityloop, then nothing will satisfy you. That is your problem, not mine.

2. How about you read the book for yourself and all by yourself and then give your careful analysis feedback?
 





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If that is not enough for you and Infinityloop, then nothing will satisfy you. That is your problem, not mine.
You clearly don't take the same position the other way around. Your posts unveil that there is something in Christianity that doesn't satisfy you, so your attacks on Islam are the way you preoccupied that side of yourself that is in fear, with closet doubt. Attacking Islam is more satisfying for you than defending your own Bible, which is in dire need of attention.
You don't feel the brick wall you smash into every time you claim Jesus "is Lord" or that the Bible is "scripture". These errors will only continue to bring you further down through your self-repression and inability to cultivate intelligence within yourself. You project your fear onto others and let that suffice, but it only serves your self or ego in the present moment. You gradually dig yourself a bigger hole and forget the oil in your lamp that you are supposed to have for your bride.
 





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Now clearly, if Islam is false, you'd be able to honestly answer those very easily without any deflections and logical errors. But clearly you can't.

It brings to mind the very nature of this thread, which is once again one of arrogant Christian egotistical fallacious self-superiority. To look down on the Muslim as just stupid and unable to think, and to see the world as a blazing fire which is engulfing everyone except those that accept their superman idol as "lord and savior". Who will willingly go on their way to shit on Muslims, yet give lazy, incoherent arguments against Islam without even attempting to lift a finger to defend the very arbitrary collection of Books (the Bible) that they (Christians) consider to be so great, authoritative and totally above the idea of Direct Revelation, in the case of the Qur'an.
The constant obnoxious behavior, dodging everything that you don't like, not giving straight answers to anything and then having the audacity to pretend that we are the ones doing what you're doing. It's rich but wholly childish.
At the end of it, it brings into question the entire Abrahamic tradition. Depends which way you swing.
Maybe religions outside the Abrahamic tradition are the real truth and we are so caught up with idolizing things that have no actual reality, or maybe we collectively as Jews, Christians and Muslims just don't understand our texts.
Truth remains that in order to accept the Bible as any form of authority (leaving aside mutual respect of parts within it), requires one to also put everything else on the table, as the Bible alone has no authority and is rather just a cultural prop leftover.
The nature of this thread is very clear from the offset and it's a shame you Christians have such low standards on your Bible, such low standards that you may as well be pot-smoking atheists. Heck, you may even learn something from trying out that lifestyle, who knows?
To be completely unable to defend your Bible in any way, yet having such strong disdain, disrespect and prejudice against the Qur'an, just amuses me. At the end of it all, the Abrahamic tradition likely just shows us that life itself is a big joke.



“God is not a man, that He should lie,

Nor a son of man, that He should repent.

Has He said, and will He not do?

Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?"

- Numbers 23:19
Many words, nothing said. Ad hominem attacks, pseudo-intellectual terminology, fake moralising, strawman arguments.

I will translate in one sentence "I refuse to believe in the bible and therefore Christianity."

One thing that makes me curious - if you are a muslim then why do you have that image for your avatar?

https://www.navhindu.com/dashavatara-lord-vishnu/

What would Muhammad say about this idolatrous image from another god?
 





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Many words vs no words, that is what this argument is. You are unable to refute or defend anything, again, as you continue to make more and more evident to those reading the thread.

One thing that makes me curious - if you are a muslim then why do you have that image for your avatar?

https://www.navhindu.com/dashavatara-lord-vishnu/
It is the Buddha actually, and he was a truly enlightened thinker. You could do with releasing your brainwashing and realizing the root condition of your existence.

It's a massive sign of weakness when you have to resort to attacking me by my avatar. I haven't done this to you, although I could make a few jokes about it.

Failed again, not a God.
 





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You can only paraphrase the Nicene Creed so many times before I roll my eyes, just remember that.

Now remember Jo, that you still haven't answered these questions from the previous page (alongside other ignored posts):

The Bible is a compilation of texts/books, YES or NO?
The Bible is largely written by anonymous authors, YES or NO?
The majority of Bible is made up of biographical texts which lack any form of transmission chain to verify it's authenticity, YES or NO?
The Bible was supposed to have been written over several thousand years, YES or NO?
The Bible contains no DIRECT revelation from the 'mouth of God', YES or NO?
The Bible canon officially decided upon by a council of men as a reaction against the other texts floating around at the same time, YES or NO?
The Prophets of the Old Testament taught the trinitarian doctrine, YES or NO?
Thou Shalt Not Make God any Graven Image, YES or NO?
The majority of the New Testament contains polemics against Jews because they didn't accept Jesus, YES or NO?
The Bible routinely rips off Pagan motifs, YES or NO?
 





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1. I did better and gave professional information sources.
If that is not enough for you and Infinityloop, then nothing will satisfy you. That is your problem, not mine.
Which professional sources? And regarding what?
You can't even explain what your paradise is.

2. How about you read the book for yourself and all by yourself and then give your careful analysis feedback?
Have you read the book? You brought it up, you should be the one giving the critical analysis.

Or Did you post about the book without reading it? Aw its not good to use things are "proof" or "sources" which you know nothing about.
 





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I will translate in one sentence "I refuse to believe in the bible and therefore Christianity."
And no, I don't follow the lack-of-logic that you do in your 'arguments'. My post was entirely about the behavior of you Christians on this forum and your inability to defend your Bible, when you are supposed to be able to do that, especially given how you so readily attack the Qur'an for fallacious reasons.
 





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You clearly don't take the same position the other way around. Your posts unveil that there is something in Christianity that doesn't satisfy you, so your attacks on Islam are the way you preoccupied that side of yourself that is in fear, with closet doubt. Attacking Islam is more satisfying for you than defending your own Bible, which is in dire need of attention.
You don't feel the brick wall you smash into every time you claim Jesus "is Lord" or that the Bible is "scripture". These errors will only continue to bring you further down through your self-repression and inability to cultivate intelligence within yourself. You project your fear onto others and let that suffice, but it only serves your self or ego in the present moment. You gradually dig yourself a bigger hole and forget the oil in your lamp that you are supposed to have for your bride.
Quit your wanna be religious mumbo jumbo amateur psychoanalysing.
All your words are false. You are believing the lies of Satan being planted in your head. He is the accuser of Christians and you are being used like a pawn on a chessboard.

I have been a serious Christian for many years now. You have absolutely no idea of what you are typing about.
I am shaking my head at how stupidly you jump to conclusions about myself, Christians or even the bible in general.
Now quit wasting time and everyone else's - you make claims, you refuse to defend them.
Don't expect people to make massive entries when they see how you refuse to consider people's answers seriously.
Your replies so far have been a Muslim friendly verbose version of Monty Python's argument clinic.


 





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All your words are false. You are believing the lies of Satan being planted in your head. He is the accuser of Christians and you are being used like a pawn on a chessboard.
See, now your evil side is showing, you're self-superiority, your pseudo-moral pageantry act has fallen and the thread can see, as I've mentioned, how fundamentally flawed your worldview is - with it's whole 'reason to exist' being founded on a principle distortion with the Jewish view of One-God. Your antagonism and fearful attempt to make me your enemy is likewise, doing you nothing but hard. You resist to actualize the teachings of Jesus and remain blinded by your own prison of a worldview.

Aside from this, you still choose to proceed to not defend your Bible, which has no direct revelation from God.
If an assorted collection of writings of random men, a majority of which do not reach back to the time period of the Prophets, not even of Moses. Then how can I take your criticisms against the Qur'an with any seriousness?
I ask you questions and you lash out at me like a wolf.
This does not lead you to knowledge, it leads you to ignorance - of which you are willingly participating in.
You still have not given a defense for the fundamental centerpiece of your beliefs, being the Bible supposedly. To antagonize me as such without first having established the logic of which to be able to antagonize me, you sever of your only opportunity to be able to validate your position which rests on a two faulty polemics.
One of those polemics failing under the pressure of your own Old Testament and the other failing under the fact that you have no direct revelations, so your criticism of Muhammad is meaningless and self-defeating.
You're only digging yourself a deeper hole which is inescapable. The first thing to learning is being able to admit you can be wrong about things.
 





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The worst thing you can do while talking about your faith is accuse others of being the "pawn of Satan" because they don't believe in your scripture lol
No Karen, we don't believe in your scripture because a Holy book should know the shape of the earth and how plants grow.
 





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Don't expect people to make massive entries when they see how you refuse to consider people's answers seriously.
Your replies so far have been a Muslim friendly verbose version of Monty Python's argument clinic.
Yes, Monty Python would see the humor in how narrow the worldview you are displaying is. Not only that, they would see the humor in how hypocritical you are towards us, and uncritical you are with your Bible, which you expect everybody to just accept as fact without even providing any logical reasons to accept anything written within it's pages.