The essence of the facts

TempestOfTempo

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Go ahead and be angry. Bring them to justice. In my youth, I championed many worthwhile causes. Now I let karma do the work.

"All these sufferings are man-made and it is within man's power to put an end to them. God helps by facing man with the results of his actions and demanding that the balance should be restored. Karma is the law that works for righteousness; it is the healing hand of God." -- Nisargadatta
What makes you think people standing up to child predators AINT part of karma? Or what comes around goes around or etc... however the individual chooses to frame it. And yes, I am angry about this... these are real children we are discussing... it hurts to know they suffer because of this, but that pain is nothing compared to theirs.
 

Red Sky at Morning

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Is It Salvation or Destruction? :: By Dennis Huebshman

“To be, or not to be; that is the question.” This is the famous line from Shakespeare’s play “Hamlet.” Basically, the character was trying to decide if he should live or commit suicide. (all emphasis mine – all verses ESV)

To believe or not to believe does not affect only one person but every living human that is on this earth today. This is covered by one of the most recognizable Bible verses, which is John 3:16; “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.” All, everyone on the face of this earth today, can have this Salvation if they will but choose it.

There is a condition to this which is found in John 3:18; “Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.”
Later, in 1 John 5:10-12, the apostle expands on this; “Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning His Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.”

A couple of points here: for this to be of value, one must believe that the Bible is the true and inerrantword of the Father, passed on to us through about 40 Holy Spirit-inspired writers; and that our Heavenly Father cannot, nor will not lie for any reason (Titus 1:2; 2 Timothy 3;16-17; 2 Peter 1:20-21).

Jesus had no illusions of what this earth would be like toward the end of this age that we are living in. In Matthew 7:13-14, He talks about the two paths; one leads to destruction, and the other to Salvation. His comments were that the pathway to destruction is wide, and many will be on it. The path to life, or Salvation, is narrow, and few will be on it. We’re seeing this quite clearly today.

John 16:33 Jesus said, “I have said these things to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world, you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world.” Today, it’s become fashionable for the secular world to label the followers of Jesus as “haters.” We represent some conceived threat to all the alphabet groups because we don’t accept their lifestyles. False prophets are being found more and more in the pulpits of “evangelical” churches, and antichrists are causing laws to be made that “criminalize” many of our beliefs. The thing is, we do not hate anyone, just as our Savior commanded. However, we do not have to like or accept their abominations.

One thing is for certain, Satan and his forces are more active today than ever before as he knows his next to last hurrah is very close. That will be the 7-year tribulation. His final act will be at the end of the Millennial Reign of Jesus on earth when he will be cast into the lake of fire forever (Revelation 20:10).

Evil in the world today is increasing and at all levels that we have not seen before. More and more people are being drawn into the things of this earth rather than consider where they will spend eternity. Paul said in 1 Corinthians 1:18, “For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved, it is the power of God.”

The “new world order” is getting bolder by the day, and there’s talk of gaining more and more control of our everyday lives. This is not just in one area but involves the whole world. Cash money is on the brink of being removed, and all ability to buy or sell will be computerized. Right now, in some countries, parents face criminal prosecution for speaking out against all the gender and sexual-related issues to their children. It’s getting very close to this in America today.

Evil is abounding. There are violent episodes taking place more and more that were rare in the past. Yes, there has always been evil since the fall of humans in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 3), but today the incidents are gaining in volume and becoming more widespread than ever.

Isaiah 5:20, which was written about 2,700 years ago, is just about a perfect description of the radical left’s attitude today. “Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; who put darkness for light, and light for darkness; who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter.” Without giving the long list, the “Godlessness” actions and attitudes listed for the last days are all here as well (2 Timothy 3).

Again, the sheer volume should be shouting that Jesus will be calling all His flock up to meet Him very soon. For anyone who believes that they have plenty of time to make their decision, please consider 1 Corinthians 15:52; “in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead shall be raised imperishable, and we shall all be changed.” Qualified mathematicians have calculated this to be considerably less than one second.
One day soon, all the true believers will hear that trumpet of God and the shout from the archangel, and we’ll be taken up to meet our Savior in the air. Those left behind will probably notice that something happened, but the full impact will not be realized until a short time later. They will be about to enter the worst period of time that this earth has ever seen or has ever experienced.

Sadly, all who remain will have chosen to be here. Now is the time to really consider that you have a choice of Salvation or Destruction. Yes, there will be those who will call out to Jesus to save them during the tribulation/wrath, but most likely, the cost of this will be martyrdom. The majority will go along with the evil leader and will voluntarily take his mark in order to be able to buy anything.

Jesus paid in full for each and every human soul on this earth, if they will have faith and believe in Him. All who confess they are sinners in need of a Savior and who believe that Savior is Jesus and call out for forgiveness will be saved (Romans 10:9-13).
All who leave this earth without Jesus as their Savior will end up in the Lake of Fire, as given in Revelation 20:11-15. There are no other options in spite of what false prophets are saying.

Therefore, the choice is up to each and every person to make. Will it be eternal Salvation with the Savior, or will it be eternal Destruction with the devil and all his demons (fallen angels)? Our Heavenly Father will force no one to receive and accept His Son but will turn no one away who truly calls on Him. No one has sinned so greatly that they cannot be covered by the gift of the shed blood of our Shepherd.
It is totally your choice, as no one can make it for you. The results of your decision will be made known very soon. We don’t know the day, hour, or even minute that the call will come, but from all the signs present, it will not be very much longer. In Luke 21:28, Jesus said when these things “begin” to happen to look up, as our redemption draws near. All the signs started just a decade or so ago and are speeding up every single day.

Today is the absolute right time to decide your eternal fate: Jesus or the world; Rapture or tribulation. In the end, nothing of this earth will be worth spending eternity in hell for.

Shalom! Come, Lord Jesus!
 

Maldarker

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Go ahead and be angry. Bring them to justice. In my youth, I championed many worthwhile causes. Now I let karma do the work.

"All these sufferings are man-made and it is within man's power to put an end to them. God helps by facing man with the results of his actions and demanding that the balance should be restored. Karma is the law that works for righteousness; it is the healing hand of God." -- Nisargadatta
Maybe this will sum up what happens when you don't take a stand against evil actions.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

"Whenever one person stands up and says "Hey wait a minute that is wrong or this is wrong." Will help others to do the same."

And in this day and ago go look out the window & tell me what happened when "TOLERANCE" was the new normal no one was speaking up or if they where it was a small voice. Did that help the world? or is that the results we are seeing. KARMA not?

Since your fond of quotes:

The world is a dangerous place not because of those that do evil but because of those who look on and do nothing.

When you don't fight against evil you to are to be blamed as much as the evil itself. You have two choice accept the evil & be the evil or fight against it.

Good luck
God Bless
 

Alanantic

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Maybe this will sum up what happens when you don't take a stand against evil actions.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

"Whenever one person stands up and says "Hey wait a minute that is wrong or this is wrong." Will help others to do the same."

And in this day and ago go look out the window & tell me what happened when "TOLERANCE" was the new normal no one was speaking up or if they where it was a small voice. Did that help the world? or is that the results we are seeing. KARMA not?

Since your fond of quotes:

The world is a dangerous place not because of those that do evil but because of those who look on and do nothing.

When you don't fight against evil you to are to be blamed as much as the evil itself. You have two choice accept the evil & be the evil or fight against it.

Good luck
God Bless
Evil is everywhere and in every time. Good/Evil is a universal concept intrinsic to life. I try to work on the evil in myself. That's where I do the most good.

"It is better to conquer yourself than to win a thousand battles. Then the victory is yours. It cannot be taken from you, not by angels or by demons." -- Buddha

"There's no reason to fight.
We both know that we're right."
- Supertramp
 

Maldarker

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Evil is everywhere and in every time. Good/Evil is a universal concept intrinsic to life. I try to work on the evil in myself. That's where I do the most good.

"It is better to conquer yourself than to win a thousand battles. Then the victory is yours. It cannot be taken from you, not by angels or by demons." -- Buddha

"There's no reason to fight.
We both know that we're right."
- Supertramp
Then be the stone that you are. I guess you are just dead then according to your quotes.

“A man dies when he refuses to stand up for that which is right. A man dies when he refuses to stand up for justice. A man dies when he refuses to take a stand for that which is true.”
 

Red Sky at Morning

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Some time ago, I recognised in myself the desire to seek consensus rather than truth. I was challenged by this poem to reconsider my position….

“You have no enemies, you say? Alas, my friend, the boast is poor. He who has mingled in the fray of duty that the brave endure, must have made foes. If you have none, small is the work that you have done. You’ve hit no traitor on the hip. You’ve dashed no cup from perjured lip. You’ve never turned the wrong to right. You’ve been a coward in the fight.”

Charles Mackay
 

Alanantic

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Some time ago, I recognised in myself the desire to seek consensus rather than truth. I was challenged by this poem to reconsider my position….
“You have no enemies, you say? Alas, my friend, the boast is poor. He who has mingled in the fray of duty that the brave endure, must have made foes. If you have none, small is the work that you have done. You’ve hit no traitor on the hip. You’ve dashed no cup from perjured lip. You’ve never turned the wrong to right. You’ve been a coward in the fight.”

Charles Mackay
Saved to my quotes! :)

"Can't we all just get along?" - Rodney King
 

akay

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The wrongdoer may receive part of the justice that is due to him in this world, but it will remain incomplete.
The same is true of someone who deserves great reward and repayment - who has done much good, helped or taught many people, saved lives, suffered to uphold truth or patiently endured much hardship or injustice. No earthly compensation is adequate for such relentless courage and effort. These types of deeds can only be repaid in full in an eternal life where every individual affected by one's actions will testify for or against that person, and where one's innermost thoughts and intentions, known only to Allah, will be exposed and judged precisely and perfectly.

Belief in the Hereafter is completely logical. Allah has made certain things pleasing and desirable to us in this worldly life, such as justice, although it is usually unattainable. Though a person may obtain a good portion of earthly pleasures and many of his objectives, one remains convinced that the world is unjust.

Now, why would the Creator implant in us the love for something we may not experience? The answer is that this life is only one portion of our existence and the Hereafter is the necessary conclusion which balances everything out. Whatever is missing here will be found there; and similarly, whatever is gained unlawfully here will result in deprivation there. That is the perfect and absolute justice Allah has promised.

Finally, Allah is able to create and re-create as He wills. He creates whatever He wills, however He wills, whenever He wills. Allah, the Exalted, says “even as We produced the first creation, so shall We produce a new one: a promise We have undertaken: truly shall We fulfil it.” (Quran 21:104)

احمد ديدات يثبت إن القراَن كلام الله شاهد وكًبر - YouTube


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فيديو عن الشيخ احمد ديدات-قصة نشوء الكون (موجودة في القرآن منذ١٤٠٠سنه)مترجم

 

Alanantic

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The wrongdoer may receive part of the justice that is due to him in this world, but it will remain incomplete.
The same is true of someone who deserves great reward and repayment - who has done much good, helped or taught many people, saved lives, suffered to uphold truth or patiently endured much hardship or injustice.
"All these sufferings are man-made and it is within man's power to put an end to them. God helps by facing man with the results of his actions and demanding that the balance should be restored. Karma is the law that works for righteousness; it is the healing hand of God." -- Nisargadatta
 

A Freeman

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Thank God not all Muslims are like you. You’re a disgrace to Islam!
Ad hominem is a logical fallacy that involves a personal attack: an argument based on the perceived failings of an adversary rather than on the merits of the case.

From: https://fee.org/articles/5-reasons-to-avoid-ad-hominem-arguments/ -

...ad hominem attacks are generally viewed as a sign of low intelligence. Even Urban Dictionary—hardly a forum for high brows—recognizes that ad hominem arguments are generally used “by immature and/or unintelligent people because they are unable to counter their opponent using logic and intelligence.”
 

A Freeman

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Evil is everywhere and in every time. Good/Evil is a universal concept intrinsic to life. I try to work on the evil in myself. That's where I do the most good.

"It is better to conquer yourself than to win a thousand battles. Then the victory is yours. It cannot be taken from you, not by angels or by demons." -- Buddha
From The Diamond Sutra:-
"How do I know this? Because this person must have discarded all arbitrary notions of the existence of a personal self (Luke 9:23, Sura 6:162)

The Buddha replied:

"Subhuti, a good son or daughter who wants to give rise to the highest, most fulfilled, and awakened mind must create this resolved attitude of mind: 'I must help to lead all beings to the shore of awakening, but, after these beings have become liberated, in truth I know that not even a single being has been liberated (John 3:13).' Why is this so? If a disciple cherishes the idea of a self, a person, a living being or a universal self, then that person is not an authentic disciple (Matt. 10:37-38, Mark 8:34, Luke 9:23, Luke 14:26-27, Gal. 2:20, Sura 6:162, Sura 92:18-21).


Sacrifice/Crucify the “self” DAILY, as taught throughout the Holy Scriptures
(Matt. 10:38, Mark 8:34, Luke 9:23, Luke 14:26-27, Gal. 2:20, Sura 6:162, Sura 92:18-21).

Matthew 10:37-40
10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter (or anyone or anything) more than me is not worthy of me.
10:38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
10:39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
10:40 He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth Him that sent me.

Mark 8:34-35
8:34 And when he had called the people [unto him] with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny his "Self", and take up his cross, and follow me.
8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Luke 9:23-25
9:23 And he said to [them] all, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
9:24 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.
9:25 For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?

Luke 14:26-27
14:26 If any [man] come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own (human) life also, he can NOT be my disciple.
14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, can NOT be my disciple.

Galatians 2:20 My "Self" is crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I (the "Self"), but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Sura 6:162. Say: "Truly, my prayer and my (daily) service of "Self" sacrifice (Luke 9:23; 14:26-27), my life (of selflessness) and my death (to "Self"), are (all) for "I AM", the Cherisher of the Worlds:

Sura 92:18-21
92:18. Those who spend their wealth for increase in "self"-purification,
92:19. And have in their minds no favour to anyone for which a reward is expected in return,
92:20. But only the desire to seek for the Countenance of their Lord Most High;
92:21. And soon will they attain (complete) satisfaction.


From the Bhagavad Gita:-
8:28 A person who accepts the path of devotional service is not bereft of the results derived from studying the Vedas, performing austere sacrifices (Matt. 10:38, Mark 8:34, Luke 9:23, Gal. 2:20, Sura 6:162), giving charity or pursuing philosophical and fruitive activities. At the end he reaches the supreme abode.

12:9 My dear Arjuna, O winner of wealth (Matt. 5:3), if you cannot fix your mind upon Me without deviation, then follow the regulated principles of bhakti-yoga [loving adoration through the keeping of the Commandments (John 14:15, Rev. 12:17) and daily “self” crucifixion - Matt. 10:38, Mark 8:34, Luke 9:23, Gal. 2:20, Sura 6:162]. In this way you will develop a desire to attain to Me.

18:66 ABANDON ALL VARIETIES OF RELIGION (Enoch 104:8, Jer. 23:1-6, Ezek. 34:1-10, 23, Matt. 6:5-8, Matt. 7:21-27, Acts 7:48, Acts 17:24, Rev. 2:20-23, Rev. 18:4, Sura 7:55, Sura 9:107-111) and just surrender unto Me (Matt. 23:8-10, Luke 9:23, John 10:7-11, 1 Tim. 2:5, Heb. 6:20, Sura 3:45-55, Sura 43:61). I shall deliver you from all sinful reaction (John 1:29, Rev. 1:5). Do not fear (1 John 4:18).

"Sinful reactions" are criminal acts, i.e. breaking The Law that our Creator gave us (1 John 3:4), found ONLY in the first five books of the Bible. Namely: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.

Through self-discipline and self sacrifice the (false) ego/"self" will gradually be destroyed, until the beauty and wisdom inherent in The Law our Creator gave us become self-evident.

ALL ROADS LEAD TO CHRIST, the ultimate and perfect example of "self"-sacrifice/"self"-crucifixion, and the resurrection and spiritual rebirth that follows for all that overcome the ego/"self".
 
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TempestOfTempo

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Thank God not all Muslims are like you. You’re a disgrace to Islam!
Humans cant disgrace Islam. You and your ped-agenda pushers make Muslims look bad and therefore push people away from true Islam... but even your cast of miserable souls cant "disgrace" Islam. You only disgrace yourselves...
 

akay

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Jesus, peace be upon him, was not killed, nor was he crucified, and he will not bear the sins of people

The most common belief among Christians is the belief that Jesus died for our sins, but the question is:
Who said that Jesus died for our sins?

Actually when we look at the verses Christians use to prove this belief, we find that 95% of these verses are from Paul’s epistles, and the verses used to prove this belief from the Gospels are very few, which puts a question mark on its source and whether Jesus really told that he would die on the cross for our sins.


we as Muslims don’t need to believe that God needs to be a man or to be crucified for our sins, because God is mightier than that, we actually believe that this is a blasphemy and an insult against God. For sin to be forgiven by God, mans should repent faithfully to God, and acknowledge his sins, and God is the All Forgiver and All Merciful who will forgive him if He really knew he is really intending to repent and stop the sin:

110. And whoever does a wrong or wrongs himself but then seeks forgiveness of Allāh will find Allāh Forgiving and Merciful. ( Holy Quran 4:110)
Doesn’t God forgive sins without Jesus dying?

No need for all that so that God forgives my sins, and this is what is also said by the Old Testament:

Eze 18:21″But if a wicked person turns away from all his sins that he has committed and keeps all my statutes and does what is just and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die.

Eze 18:22None of the transgressions that he has committed shall be remembered against him; for the righteousness that he has done he shall live.
Did Jesus know that he came to die for our sins?


God only punishes the guilty in Islam and does not harm the innocent
Muslims do not believe in blood sacrifice and they do not believe that a holy man like Jesus should die such a cruel and humiliating death. He bears the sins of mankind while he is innocent

It is better for God to forgive without bloodshed, because He is able to do so, as in Islam, God forgives without killing an innocent person and shedding blood.
God only punishes those who commit a sin, and does not punish the oppressed



Logically, rationally and scientifically, sin is not inherited from the father to his son because it is one of the acquired actions that are not inherited. If your father committed a sin, do you inherit his sin as you inherit the color of his eyes. ? If the father chose to be a criminal, does this mean that his son will inherit from him this nature that is in the father? Likewise, if the father is good, it does not necessarily mean that the son will be so, because he inherited the nature of his father


The belief the inherited sin. contradicts divine justice. This is because the just God punishes a person for what he did, not for what his father or grandparents did. The Bible says in Ezekiel 18/20-21: The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child. The righteousness of the righteous will be credited to them, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against them.

This text indicates the responsibility of each individual for his sin and thus denies the inherited sin.

And in Matthew 16-27: and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.
. Christ Himself decides that each person will be rewarded according to his deeds. This contradicts inherited sin and salvation by crucifixion, because the text indicates that salvation is through work and not by crucifixion

CONCEPT OF ORIGINAL SIN IN ISLAM & CHRISTIANITY dr zakir naik


هل الإيمان يُبنى على الموقع الجغرافي؟ - حوار هادئ لعباس مع شاب محترم

 

Daze

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Thank God not all Muslims are like you. You’re a disgrace to Islam!
Honestly, Tempo has no claim to Islam, like a Christian who rejects Jesus. But you see all of the non-Muslims love him regardless because he spits at the wind with them.

Amazing how many non-Muslims have posted in this thread. Indeed the devil only has one enemy and he is merely uniting his troops.
 

TempestOfTempo

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Honestly, Tempo has no claim to Islam, like a Christian who rejects Jesus. But you see all of the non-Muslims love him regardless because he spits at the wind with them.

Amazing how many non-Muslims have posted in this thread. Indeed the devil only has one enemy and he is merely uniting his troops.
You cant quit posting about me... yet you claim to be "living in my head" lol
Good thing you hypocrites havent showed up in the SC abortion ruling thread.
 

Alanantic

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ALL ROADS LEAD TO CHRIST, the ultimate and perfect example of "self"-sacrifice/"self"-crucifixion, and the resurrection and spiritual rebirth that follows for all that overcome the ego/"self".
[/QUOTE]
I see no difference between "Christ", Buddha, Lao Tzu, or Krishna.

"Whenever there is a decay of righteousness, O Bharata, and a rise of unrighteousness, then I manifest Myself. For the protection of the good, for the destruction of the wicked, and for the establishment of righteousness, I am born in every age." -- Krishna

“I was, am, and will be enlightened, together with the whole of the great earth and all its sentient beings, simultaneously." -- Buddha
 

TrollingTroubles

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Honestly, Tempo has no claim to Islam, like a Christian who rejects Jesus. But you see all of the non-Muslims love him regardless because he spits at the wind with them.

Amazing how many non-Muslims have posted in this thread. Indeed the devil only has one enemy and he is merely uniting his troops.
Reminds me of a verse in the Quran.

‘O believers! Take neither Jews nor Christians as guardians—they are guardians of each other. Whoever does so will be counted as one of them. Surely Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.’ 5:51

looks like ToT is gonna be counted among that lot.
 

Daze

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Reminds me of a verse in the Quran.

‘O believers! Take neither Jews nor Christians as guardians—they are guardians of each other. Whoever does so will be counted as one of them. Surely Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.’ 5:51

looks like ToT is gonna be counted among that lot.
It's not just the constant siding with the polytheists. Tempo has literally attacked every Muslim here while the believers are brothers.
I've tried talking to him in private before but he refuses. It seems this is all about scoring points for him. He is not interested in reason.

Imagine the hadith that speaks of ibadah not being accepted after 3 days for the one who wars with his brother? Imagine years of dhikr, prayers, fasting and none of it being accepted.
 

TempestOfTempo

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It's not just the constant siding with the polytheists. Tempo has literally attacked every Muslim here while the believers are brothers.
I've tried talking to him in private before but he refuses. It seems this is all about scoring points for him. He is not interested in reason.

Imagine the hadith that speaks of ibadah not being accepted after 3 days for the one who wars with his brother? Imagine years of dhikr, prayers, fasting and none of it being accepted.
You idiot, you tried your "daze psychoanalysis" routine with me in an unwelcome/unrequested PM, asking if I had been raped and etc.
If I wasnt who I say I am, and if I wasnt speaking the truth, your ship of fools wouldnt react the way you do.
Edit: You are so stupid and dishonest, you apparently dont understand the meaning of the word you took the trouble to type in bold font... "literally" lol
 
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