Revelation

Joined
Jan 22, 2018
Messages
2,169
Likes
3,040
#21
Or you could look at it like this...
I'm quite happy with the way I look at things Lisa.

Some pearls of wisdom from my very own book of proverbs....

Look before you leap....into a thread that is designed to waste your life.

Misery loves company.....miserable threads love company too. Let's talk Bible!!

Actions speak louder than words....unless you frequent religious forums where action is strongly prohibited. (Let's do nothing, God will sort it out)

Honesty is the best policy.....This is not applicable in politics or religion so you can lie through your teeth with impunity.

Practice what you preach....you really don't want to be seen as disingenuous...especially to your flock. (But what they don't know won't hurt them)

The Puffin Book of Proverbs (Edition 2)
 





Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
4,288
Likes
5,460
#22
All the seals have been opened by Jesus and Revelation 5:8-11 tells us that only the Lamb is worthy to open the seals. Then Revelation 6:1 says, "And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see." That is the first seal opened and when the second seal is opened Revelation 6:3 says, "And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see." The King James version doesn't use a capital H when describing God but other Bible versions do and "he" is is the lamb opening the second seal. If I use the NKJV to tell us when the third seal was opened it says, "When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come and see.” Revelation 6:5. Its clear to see that "He" is Jesus Himself the opens this seal. And it goes on like that with the rest of the seals.

All the seals have been opened as Revelation 5,6 and 8 tell us, that is why we can read what the seals say and understand them. The book of Revelation is completely revealed to us in these last days. Most of the Book of Revelation has also been fulfilled and its very little that needs to fulfilled before Jesus returns.
The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

When did THAT happen?

In the first chapter of Revelation, John is told by Jesus Christ to, "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter." John obeys, and writes chapter 1 (the things he had seen, that is, Jesus Christ standing among seven candlesticks), chapters 2 and 3 (the things which are, Jesus Christ's letters to the seven churches), and the rest of Revelation, which is the prophecy of the finale of God's plan.

In chapter 4, John is transported in time to Heaven's throne room, where he is witness to the Day of the Lord, which is the events he depicts. That's why things are written as if they have already happened. But it's pretty clear that nothing like that is described has actually taken place.
 





Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
7,029
Likes
10,682
#23
I'm quite happy with the way I look at things Lisa.

Some pearls of wisdom from my very own book of proverbs....

Look before you leap....into a thread that is designed to waste your life.

Misery loves company.....miserable threads love company too. Let's talk Bible!!

Actions speak louder than words....unless you frequent religious forums where action is strongly prohibited. (Let's do nothing, God will sort it out)

Honesty is the best policy.....This is not applicable in politics or religion so you can lie through your teeth with impunity.

Practice what you preach....you really don't want to be seen as disingenuous...especially to your flock. (But what they don't know won't hurt them)

The Puffin Book of Proverbs (Edition 2)
I suspect (and I may be wrong) that you will maintain your current outlook unless / until something clearly prophetic happens. Even then, I suspect that the “Elites using prophetic events as a template for global change” line will be very popular on this forum, should occasion arise when such explanations become necessary.
 





Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
4,288
Likes
5,460
#25
The ten kings without kingdoms are the ten royals in waiting to take over the ten world regions which the powerful players at the Club of Rome (who think humanity is the real enemy) divided the whole world into half a century ago.

g

http://www2.ministries-online.org/biometrics/rome.html
Revelation 17:12 - And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
 





Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
3,804
Likes
1,337
#26
Revelation 17:12 - And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
After the destruction of the great city Babylon which reigns over the kings of the earth... the ten kings in waiting take the reign of the ten world regions for one hour (however long that is)... before three of them are uprooted by the little horn.

The little horn is the ultimate shite.
 





Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
3,804
Likes
1,337
#27
Daniel the prophet had something to say about the times of the ten kings.

They will mingle with the seed of men.

Daniel 2 41 Whereas you saw the feet and toes, partly of potter’s clay and partly of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; yet the strength of the iron shall be in it, just as you saw the iron mixed with ceramic clay. 42 And as the toes of the feet were partly of iron and partly of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong and partly fragile. 43 As you saw iron mixed with ceramic clay, they will mingle with the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, just as iron does not mix with clay.


They not of the seed of men will mingle with the seed of men. There is today a mingling of machine and man called cyborgs but there is also a serpent seed... a hybridisation program going on between so called aliens and humans.

It's truly bizarre but biblical.
 





Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
3,804
Likes
1,337
#29
Have you met the little horn ?


No it's not just a movie.


The little horn is der Führer of the fourth revived Roman empire.


Sieg Heil.

Achtung Götterdämmerung.
 





Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
1,042
Likes
840
#31
The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

When did THAT happen?

In the first chapter of Revelation, John is told by Jesus Christ to, "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter." John obeys, and writes chapter 1 (the things he had seen, that is, Jesus Christ standing among seven candlesticks), chapters 2 and 3 (the things which are, Jesus Christ's letters to the seven churches), and the rest of Revelation, which is the prophecy of the finale of God's plan.

In chapter 4, John is transported in time to Heaven's throne room, where he is witness to the Day of the Lord, which is the events he depicts. That's why things are written as if they have already happened. But it's pretty clear that nothing like that is described has actually taken place.
The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.
When did THAT happen?
This is the first trumpet in Revelation 8. As I explained in another forum, in the Bible trumpets were mainly used to summon war (Judges 7:16-18). Revelation uses symbolic language from the Old Testament, so if we want to know what certain symbols mean we have to look for them first in the Old Testament and that will give us some understanding of what is written about in the last book of the Bible.

So the seven trumpets are the judgments which God pours out upon the persecutors of His people. The seven trumpets follow the pattern set by the seven seals and seven churches, but the trumpets focus on the judgments which God pours out upon the persecutors of His people.

John is in vision in Chapter 8 and he sees the heavenly Sanctuary or Temple. He sees the first compartment of the Heavenly Sanctuary. You remember when I tried to explain the heavenly sanctuary and explained that the earthly sanctuary was modelled on the heavenly sanctuary? The things John sees in the heavenly sanctuary are always in the holy room which is the first compartment. Verse 4 says, "The smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, ascended before God." So the altar of incense and the smoke represents the prayers of the saints. There was much prayer from the saints. The prayers of the saints were being heard and in verse 5 and 6, there is a change, an angel takes some of the fire from the altar, he puts it in the censer, but he does not add any incense. He takes it and he throws it down to the earth. That means the sounding of the trumpets are judgments that come upon the wicked. There is no incense mingled with the fire. It's just fire. Fire is often a symbol of judgment that God brings upon the wicked.

How do we know most of these things have come to pass? I really don't think this is something I can explain briefly as you can tell from what I've posted above. All I can say here is that in John's day, the greatest empire at the time was the Roman empire. John was a prisoner on the isle of Patmos, a victim of Roman oppression. The trumpets begin with the Roman empire and we know it had persecuted and would continue to persecute God's people or Church. The trumpets are God's judgements on the Roman empire.

In the first chapter of Revelation, John is told by Jesus Christ to, "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter." John obeys, and writes chapter 1 (the things he had seen, that is, Jesus Christ standing among seven candlesticks),
"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." Revelation 1:1-3. The book of Revelation is a loving message from Jesus Christ to His precious Church, revealing the things that must soon come to pass. It is meant to be understood by His people, with a blessing promised to those who read, hear and keep the things revealed in these prophecies.

Revelation 1:20 tells us that the seven golden candlesticks represent the seven churches. "The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches." There is a literal and prophetic application to the the seven Churches.

chapters 2 and 3 (the things which are, Jesus Christ's letters to the seven churches), and the rest of Revelation, which is the prophecy of the finale of God's plan.
Yes, Revelation 2 and 3 are Jesus' letters to the seven Churches. The Churches literally existed but the letters are about the history of the Church of God during different time periods until Jesus returns the second time. Each of the seven Churches is symbolic of what God’s people would face during the succeeding periods of its history. Other chapters tell us more about the persecution of God's people in the seven seals (chapters 4,5, 6 and 8), and the seven trumpets (chapters 8,9,10).


In chapter 4, John is transported in time to Heaven's throne room, where he is witness to the Day of the Lord, which is the events he depicts. That's why things are written as if they have already happened. But it's pretty clear that nothing like that is described has actually taken place.
Chapters 4 and 5 are an introductory scene to the vision of the seven seals.Yes John in vision sees Jesus in the heavenly sanctuary/temple. Revelation 4 focuses on Jesus’ work as our High Priest and the events that occur during and after the completion of His ministry. When the work is finished He will put on His kingly garments and return to Earth to claim His people. It is important to understand how the heavenly sanctuary works and what Jesus as our High Priest means. Its all in my forum on the subject.
 





Last edited:
Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
4,219
Likes
2,710
#32
I'm quite happy with the way I look at things Lisa.

Some pearls of wisdom from my very own book of proverbs....

Look before you leap....into a thread that is designed to waste your life.

Misery loves company.....miserable threads love company too. Let's talk Bible!!

Actions speak louder than words....unless you frequent religious forums where action is strongly prohibited. (Let's do nothing, God will sort it out)

Honesty is the best policy.....This is not applicable in politics or religion so you can lie through your teeth with impunity.

Practice what you preach....you really don't want to be seen as disingenuous...especially to your flock. (But what they don't know won't hurt them)

The Puffin Book of Proverbs (Edition 2)
Sorry, but you actually sound miserably bitter.
 





Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
4,288
Likes
5,460
#33
This is the first trumpet in Revelation 8. As I explained in another forum, in the Bible trumpets were mainly used to summon war (Judges 7:16-18). Revelation uses symbolic language from the Old Testament, so if we want to know what certain symbols mean we have to look for them first in the Old Testament and that will give us some understanding of what is written about in the last book of the Bible.

So the seven trumpets are the judgments which God pours out upon the persecutors of His people. The seven trumpets follow the pattern set by the seven seals and seven churches, but the trumpets focus on the judgments which God pours out upon the persecutors of His people.

John is in vision in Chapter 8 and he sees the heavenly Sanctuary or Temple. He sees the first compartment of the Heavenly Sanctuary. You remember when I tried to explain the heavenly sanctuary and explained that the earthly sanctuary was modelled on the heavenly sanctuary? The things John sees in the heavenly sanctuary are always in the holy room which is the first compartment. Verse 4 says, "The smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, ascended before God." So the altar of incense and the smoke represents the prayers of the saints. There was much prayer from the saints. The prayers of the saints were being heard and in verse 5 and 6, there is a change, an angel takes some of the fire from the altar, he puts it in the censer, but he does not add any incense. He takes it and he throws it down to the earth. That means the sounding of the trumpets are judgments that come upon the wicked. There is no incense mingled with the fire. It's just fire. Fire is often a symbol of judgment that God brings upon the wicked.

How do we know most of these things have come to pass? I really don't think this is something I can explain briefly as you can tell from what I've posted above. All I can say here is that in John's day, the greatest empire at the time was the Roman empire. John was a prisoner on the isle of Patmos, a victim of Roman oppression. The trumpets begin with the Roman empire and we know it had persecuted and would continue to persecute God's people or Church. The trumpets are God's judgements on the Roman empire.


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand." Revelation 1:1-3. The book of Revelation is a loving message from Jesus Christ to His precious Church, revealing the things that must soon come to pass. It is meant to be understood by His people, with a blessing promised to those who read, hear and keep the things revealed in these prophecies.

Revelation 1:20 tells us that the seven golden candlesticks represent the seven churches. "The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches." There is a literal and prophetic application to the the seven Churches.


Yes, Revelation 2 and 3 are Jesus' letters to the seven Churches. The Churches literally existed but the letters are about the history of the Church of God during different time periods until Jesus returns the second time. Each of the seven Churches is symbolic of what God’s people would face during the succeeding periods of its history. Other chapters tell us more about the persecution of God's people in the seven seals (chapters 4,5, 6 and 8), and the seven trumpets (chapters 8,9,10).



Chapters 4 and 5 are an introductory scene to the vision of the seven seals.Yes John in vision sees Jesus in the heavenly sanctuary/temple. Revelation 4 focuses on Jesus’ work as our High Priest and the events that occur during and after the completion of His ministry. When the work is finished He will put on His kingly garments and return to Earth to claim His people. It is important to understand how the heavenly sanctuary works and what Jesus as our High Priest means. Its all in my forum on the subject.
But ...

The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

When did THAT happen?
 





Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
1,042
Likes
840
#34
But ...

The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

When did THAT happen?
Read the history of the attacks of the Roman empire by barbaric tribes. Many think this coincided with the Goths who attacked Rome. Its important to understand the back ground of these trumpets before you try to understand them.

The language of the first trumpet suggests a violent hailstorm. What does hailstorm represent in prophecy? The Old testament on which Revelation is based gives the clue. In describing the invasion of the Assyrians into the land of Israel, prophet Isaiah declared, "Behold, the Lord has a mighty and strong one, Like a tempest of hail and a destroying storm, Like a flood of mighty waters overflowing, Who will bring them down to the earth with His hand." Isaiah 28:2. The storm as described in the first trumpet, denotes military invasion.

More symbolism suggests the destruction of the countryside. "the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up."
This indicates that forests, pastures and crops would be destroyed by the invasion. It also has "hail and fire mingled with blood" denoting carnage or the slaughter of both animals and people.

 





Last edited:
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
7,029
Likes
10,682
#35
I think the interpretation of events fitting into prophetic patterns is interesting.

When I was younger I used to imagine prophecy as a tick list. Once a fulfilment had occurred it was ticked off, never to be repeated.

20F9EA50-1189-4F9E-BC6C-6B60B0167CE1.jpeg

The more I studied it, the more it seemed to be pattern, I.e. something might happen which would have a resonance with a particular prophecy, then something later in history might connect in a more complete way.

To see this, consider interpretations of Psalm 83. Two people I have benefitted from hearing have two different perspectives. Amir Tsarfati believes it was fulfilled when the nations surrounding Israel attacked in the War of Independence in 1948. Certainly there are resonances, but perhaps, as Bill Salus believes, it’s ultimate fulfilment is yet future?

 





Joined
Jan 22, 2018
Messages
2,169
Likes
3,040
#36
Sorry, but you actually sound miserably bitter.
I shall refrain from saying how you sound

I suspect (and I may be wrong) that you will maintain your current outlook unless / until something clearly prophetic happens.
Can you define clearly prophetic please? Because my contention is that all these "prophecies" will be acts of men....not no God.
 





Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
7,029
Likes
10,682
#37
I shall refrain from saying how you sound



Can you define clearly prophetic please? Because my contention is that all these "prophecies" will be acts of men....not no God.
A good question. Perhaps reviewing fulfilled prophecies might give some clarity to this question. Take the OT prophecies fulfilled by Jesus. It is for you whether you think these might be events engineered by Man or known and revealed by God.

F3C78B7A-5BCC-44C9-9B7E-577109F5AB3F.jpeg
 





Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
3,804
Likes
1,337
#38
Revelation 13 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having]seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. 2 Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?


That mortal wound was from a loss in war... where the Third reich was dealt a death blow... but out of sight the head was healing.
 





Joined
Apr 25, 2019
Messages
25
Likes
0
#39
None of you people have the slightest idea what the book of Revelation is about. I forced Encyclopaedia Britannica to correct its identification of the beast with the name/number "666" by convincing the author of the article, Krister Stendahl, who was formerly dean of Harvard Divinity School, and later bishop of Stockholm and head of the Church of Sweden, that the mistake invalidated "The Ouzo Prophecy." Unfortunately, you lack the curiosity to ask for proof, contained in The Ouzo Papers, available upon request to me at ouzo.game@mail.com.