Prophet Muhammad (saw) in the Bible

Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
3,765
Likes
6,704
#1
These days, Islam is attacked not only by people who openly say that they follow other religions- Islam is under attack from all sides. People who are against Islam attack Islam and even claim to be Muslims in order to give themselves credibility when they attack Islam.

And so even people who claim to be Muslims are attacking Islam.

Therefore Islam is attacked from both inside and outside.

Why is Islam so relentlessly attacked? Why so much effort to attack Islam?

This effort is because Islam tells people the truth. And so Islam is attacked.

I expect this post and the knowledge that it shares will be attacked. There might be pages and pages of posts. Posts attacking the information, posts attempting to attack me.

In this day and age, we have to be careful. Wolves appear in sheep's clothes. You may see falsehoods spread by non-Muslims and you may see attempts at discrediting which come from the munafiqun. They may be direct or they may try to appear as though they have some great intellectual gravity behind their attacks and try to seem subte and intellectual.

Therefore, whoever is reading this thread- feel free to read whatever may be following this post. However- I ask that you make sure you watch the video.

Don't trust what the people here say. Don't even trust what I say. Watch the video. Study the evidence. Examine the evidence for yourself. Come to your own independent conclusion. What subject could be more important than ascertaining the truth about God?

 





Joined
Apr 20, 2017
Messages
650
Likes
2,300
#3
So, the Bible must be the Truth?
As I see it, the Bible, being a collection or compilation of books, might also be called a library. In that case, the faithful can say that the library is "true," that it contains only true books, but others, less convinced, can say that some of the books, or even certain paragraphs and sentences within the books, are true, credible, plausible, etc., but that the remainder of the books may be left on the shelf. The issue will be how, with what measure, what criterion, "truth" or veracity is determined.
 





Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
4,282
Likes
6,828
#4
@Etagloc

I have a great friend whose dress sense is frequently called into question. There is a reason for this criticism!

As to your advice:

"Study the evidence. Examine the evidence for yourself. Come to your own independent conclusion. What subject could be more important than ascertaining the truth about God?"

Could not agree more. Study both sides and come to your own conclusions.
 





Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
1,221
Likes
1,563
#5
As I see it, the Bible, being a collection or compilation of books, might also be called a library. In that case, the faithful can say that the library is "true," that it contains only true books, but others, less convinced, can say that some of the books, or even certain paragraphs and sentences within the books, are true, credible, plausible, etc., but that the remainder of the books may be left on the shelf. The issue will be how, with what measure, what criterion, "truth" or veracity is determined.
You gotta take a few step back and realized the whole Bible contained Red Letters. Then you’ll know who’s the author. And if you believe in this Author, you’ll accept everything in this Book as Truth. Instead of pick and choose what fit your reality, like OP.
 





Joined
Apr 20, 2017
Messages
650
Likes
2,300
#6
I said:
As I see it, the Bible, being a collection or compilation of books, might also be called a library. In that case, the faithful can say that the library is "true," that it contains only true books, but others, less convinced, can say that some of the books, or even certain paragraphs and sentences within the books, are true, credible, plausible, etc., but that the remainder of the books may be left on the shelf. The issue will be how, with what measure, what criterion, "truth" or veracity is determined.
You gotta take a few step back and realized the whole Bible contained Red Letters. Then you’ll know who’s the author. And if you believe in this Author, you’ll accept everything in this Book as Truth. Instead of pick and choose what fit your reality, like OP.
I understand that you rank among the faithful, those who claim that the library (Bible) contains only true books, maybe even written by only one author, and that is fine with me. To the less faithful in the Christian sense, however, it is not unusual to enter a library and pick only a few books, or even paragraphs and sentences within a book, and call them true without accepting the library in total. It is called "faith" for a reason, though faith is not necessarily built upon reason, and that, too, is fine with me. I am just sitting here in the library lounge, having a coffee, and am commenting upon those who enter and exit.
 





Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
1,221
Likes
1,563
#7
I understand that you rank among the faithful, those who claim that the library (Bible) contains only true books, maybe even written by only one author, and that is fine with me. To the less faithful in the Christian sense, however, it is not unusual to enter a library and pick only a few books, or even paragraphs and sentences within a book, and call them true without accepting the library in total. It is called "faith" for a reason, though faith is not necessarily built upon reason, and that, too, is fine with me. I am just sitting here in the library lounge, having a coffee, and am commenting upon those who enter and exit.
I don't doubt you're an intelligence man filled with wisdom, knowledge, and logic of this world. I would give you a 9.9/10 in this department. However you're missing a great deal in the unseen area, hence lesser faith on the Word. Maybe one day when you're facing a hopeless situation, then true faith may be born. Otherwise, you'll continue to doubt and suppressing faith due to your understanding and logic of this world.

For example.
Romans 8:16 King James Version (KJV)
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

I'm positive you understand what it mean but I highly doubt you've experiences this "phenomenon". Only through Faith can you experiences the liveliness of the Scriptures, it's the living Word of God literally dwelled inside you. I highly suggest meditating on the concept of The Trinity Godhead, day and night until something clicked in your spirit.

Peace
 





Joined
Apr 20, 2017
Messages
650
Likes
2,300
#9
@Etagloc

I read @Red Sky at Morning's statement as more a brilliant witticism, or aphorism, than an endorsement of an argumentum ad populum (I love, um, the poetry of Latin). It's very insightful, and doesn't really take sides ...

Red Sky at Morning said:
There are two distinct people who get attacked over the truth - those who tell the truth and those who don't!
That's good stuff. :cool:
 





Last edited:

friend

Established
Joined
Jul 26, 2017
Messages
293
Likes
501
#11
As I see it, the Bible, being a collection or compilation of books, might also be called a library. In that case, the faithful can say that the library is "true," that it contains only true books, but others, less convinced, can say that some of the books, or even certain paragraphs and sentences within the books, are true, credible, plausible, etc., but that the remainder of the books may be left on the shelf. The issue will be how, with what measure, what criterion, "truth" or veracity is determined.
simple Criterion is to look for contradictions within.
 





Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
4,282
Likes
6,828
#12
considered in the context of his previous post the implicit argumentum ad populum is easy to see
@Etagloc

I hope I didn't offend you - it just struck me that I had heard the "persecuted for the truth" line before.

GCB believes the Cathars of the Albergensian crusade by Innocent III were persecuted for telling the truth.

Here is an example of the kind of message Cathars were (and still are) promoting...


Certainly they had very different beliefs to the Catholic Church, and they argued with and embarrassed them. In the end they were brutally suppressed and killed as heretics.

Christians in Iran are also persecuted for their faith, e.g.


My point is that throughout history, the good and the bad, the wise and the foolish, men and women of truth and people of deception have all been persecuted.

As with the "novel" ideas of David Icke, persecution alone does not offer any special endorsement of the truth of their beliefs.

 





Last edited:
Joined
Mar 24, 2017
Messages
3,887
Likes
6,179
#13
Christians in Iran are also persecuted for their faith, e.g.
One of the biggest lies floating around by people who have never even been to Iran. I have been to Iran and have conversed with Christians and met Jews there and let me tell you they were extremely well off. Nothing about them was "persecuted". Not in the least bit.
 





Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
2,386
Likes
4,900
#14
Every prophet foretold of the coming of Muhammad, and his mention is in the previous revelations for those who have eyes to see, ears to hear and hearts with which to understand. All praise to God who sent his final revelation with his final Prophet for all of humanity.
 





Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
4,282
Likes
6,828
#15
One of the biggest lies floating around by people who have never even been to Iran. I have been to Iran and have conversed with Christians and met Jews there and let me tell you they were extremely well off. Nothing about them was "persecuted". Not in the least bit.
Let me rephrase -

"These Christians in Iran were also persecuted for their faith"

I can't comment on anyone else stories, but these girls certainly were.
 





Joined
Apr 20, 2017
Messages
650
Likes
2,300
#16
I said:
As I see it, the Bible, being a collection or compilation of books, might also be called a library. In that case, the faithful can say that the library is "true," that it contains only true books, but others, less convinced, can say that some of the books, or even certain paragraphs and sentences within the books, are true, credible, plausible, etc., but that the remainder of the books may be left on the shelf. The issue will be how, with what measure, what criterion, "truth" or veracity is determined.
simple Criterion is to look for contradictions within.
Usually, in the Bible, or, more accurately, the library, when Christians are willing to acknowledge that there are contradictions in the individual books, they are attributed to: 1) insignificant scribal errors; 2) the fact that, though uniformly the word of God, it is nevertheless transmitted through men, over vast time periods, and those men, having different viewpoints (hence "synoptic" gospels), report things differently but in overall consonance, or harmony, on the most significant doctrinal points; and 3) while mistaken for a contradiction, it is, in fact, sometimes rather a paradox, a mysterium tremendum, a tremendous mystery, and Christianity is full to the rim with mysterious paradoxes not to be discarded, but rather to be solved.


It is, to me, a truly fascinating library, with remarkable architecture. Thus far, and though there have been many attempts, from Julian the Apostate to Voltaire up to Nietzsche and Marx and beyond, the very gates of Hell, or Hades, have not yet prevailed against it. Another issue in discussions of this type will be how, through what process, these and these only books were permitted into the library and whether or not and why other books should have been included, at least as appendices and addenda. There is a good reason why Muslims, rather respectfully, it seems to me, refer to at least some of us as Ahlul Kitab, or People of the Book.
 





Joined
Mar 24, 2017
Messages
3,887
Likes
6,179
#17
Let me rephrase -

"These Christians in Iran were also persecuted for their faith"

I can't comment on anyone else stories, but these girls certainly were.
If they were jailed and or persecuted it was because of something they did (and nothing to do with their faith) or they're lying. If you don't break the law no one bothers you there. I was an atheist at the time I went there and nothing happened to me except for people being friendly and showing me great hospitality. Perhaps you should visit and find out for yourself.

In Iran there are a lot of undercover agents trying to bring down the government and considering how hated they are by America, Israel, and her other allies I wouldn't be surprised if they are the ones funding these lies. Kind of how they did to Venezuela under Chavez.

I'm not fan of the Iranian government or their brand of Islam (you should know the majority of the Muslims don't believe in Shiaism) but the amount of lies and propaganda against them from so-called persecuted women and men who live outside of Iran and Western media is absolutely absurd.
 





Joined
Dec 30, 2017
Messages
1,736
Likes
724
#18
These days, Islam is attacked not only by people who openly say that they follow other religions- Islam is under attack from all sides. People who are against Islam attack Islam and even claim to be Muslims in order to give themselves credibility when they attack Islam.

And so even people who claim to be Muslims are attacking Islam.

Therefore Islam is attacked from both inside and outside.

Why is Islam so relentlessly attacked? Why so much effort to attack Islam?

This effort is because Islam tells people the truth. And so Islam is attacked.

I expect this post and the knowledge that it shares will be attacked. There might be pages and pages of posts. Posts attacking the information, posts attempting to attack me.

In this day and age, we have to be careful. Wolves appear in sheep's clothes. You may see falsehoods spread by non-Muslims and you may see attempts at discrediting which come from the munafiqun. They may be direct or they may try to appear as though they have some great intellectual gravity behind their attacks and try to seem subte and intellectual.

Therefore, whoever is reading this thread- feel free to read whatever may be following this post. However- I ask that you make sure you watch the video.

Don't trust what the people here say. Don't even trust what I say. Watch the video. Study the evidence. Examine the evidence for yourself. Come to your own independent conclusion. What subject could be more important than ascertaining the truth about God?

Because Islam preaches to kill non-believers
 





Joined
Mar 24, 2017
Messages
3,887
Likes
6,179
#19
Usually, in the Bible, or, more accurately, the library, when Christians are willing to acknowledge that there are contradictions in the individual books, they are attributed to: 1) insignificant scribal errors; 2) the fact that, though uniformly the word of God, it is nevertheless transmitted through men, over vast time periods, and those men, having different viewpoints (hence "synoptic" gospels), report things differently but in overall consonance, or harmony, on the most significant doctrinal points; and 3) while mistaken for a contradiction, it is, in fact, sometimes rather a paradox, a mysterium tremendum, a tremendous mystery, and Christianity is full to the rim with mysterious paradoxes not to be discarded, but rather to be solved.

It is, to me, a truly fascinating library, with remarkable architecture. Thus far, and though there have been many attempts, from Julian the Apostate to Voltaire up to Nietzsche and Marx and beyond, the very gates of Hell, or Hades, have not yet prevailed against it. Another issue in discussions of this type will be how, through what process, these and these only books were permitted into the library and whether or not and why other books should have been included, at least as appendices and addenda. There is a good reason why Muslims, rather respectfully, it seems to me, refer to at least some of us as Ahlul Kitab, or People of the Book.
I have a question regarding the Bible and want your take on it. Why did the Romans decide that Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John should make up the "Word of God" when there were countless other books (Christian Apocrypha) that were just as legitimate (and by legitimate I mean from the same time era)?

I have my theories on it but I would love to know your perspective on this.
 





Joined
Mar 24, 2017
Messages
3,887
Likes
6,179
#20
Because Islam preaches to kill non-believers
Here we go again. You're a 17 year old who masturbates to porn frequently (your words not mine) so I don't expect you to really know anything but please tell us where in the Quran it tells Muslims to kill non-believers for no reason at all?

Stop listening to your mom and dad who watch CNN and FOX 24/7 and go and read the Quran.