Nations taking their places for Ezekiel 38 / Psalm 83 / Isaiah 17

[AspiringSoul]

Amazon's new boss, is also a jew.

 

[Nikōn]

I think the “tick box” as opposed to “pattern” understanding of prophecy is where the difference of perspective comes from here.

I've already asked before for you to actually explain WHAT I'm wrong about and WHY, but you never reply. Would you please explain to me WHY you think I'm wrong instead of just asserting it? thank you.

Please cite the aforementioned post and break down what I am wrong about. If your hermeneutics are correct then you will be able to explain it without resorting to vague ambiguities, in my posts I have outlined my points.

 

[SomeNOBODY0]

Actually @AspiringSoul that was me with the blood of the prohpets part lol I remembered the blood of the saints and forgot the prophets. I did respond, and I still hold the same position I stated.

 

[AspiringSoul]

Actually @AspiringSoul that was me with the blood of the prohpets part lol I remembered the blood of the saints and forgot the prophets. I did respond, and I still hold the same position I stated.

do you care to address each of the points ive made in my post above then? it seems to me you are more invested in rooting for 'your side' and effectively making this an islam vs xtianity topic rather than a mutual one. i see that through the way you selectively like posts.


we both believe in the same prophecies in Revelation here.

im being told to 'accept im wrong' on the mystery babylon = jews viewpoint, but what im being offered in return as far as it's identity, are awful arguments.


i just addressed the one on 'saudi arabia' which was in Red's list as 'a candidate for the whore'. Saudi being a 'kingdom' would be 'committing adultery with her' ie saudi wouldnt be the whore itself but a man, in the symbolic sense.

how come i have to point this out? where are the legit xtians who would counter those type of weak arguments for the sake of their own integrity?


you cant deny the 'whore' connection to jews. you cannot deny the babylon connection via zech 5.
you cannot deny the murder connection. or the economic connection (remember the rabbis in the temple itself were money lending at interest when Jesus kicked them out...and it goes right back to Babylon ie Nehemiah 5 revealed that fact, right after their return from exile, the rabbis became money lenders to their own people).
the tabernacle itself matches the scroll of 20 cubits by 10 cubits in Zech 5.
many many connections that also have literally come true in our lifetime.

i think it was you who was discussing the Black Horse of Rev 6
i presented a perfect context

the 4th Beast of Daniel was the Roman empire. The end times Beast is 'the feet of iron/clay' representing the end times re-emergence of the same empire. The colonial powers eg Britain, Spain, Portugal, France, etc were original Roman colonies. So the rise of colonial powers was the beginning of end times Beast..and it makes perfect sense why Revelation's prophecies would begin on that note, in Rev 6.

hence
white horse = colonialism.
red horse = the consequence of colonialism, BLOODSHED ie world wars, the bolshevik revolution, the holocoast..

so then it leads to the end of ww2, what happened? America became the number 1 superpower and you had Capitalism vs Communism hence the Black horse prophecy of the scales makes sense..
and right along it, you had the creation of a jewish state.
'do not harm the oil and wine' is not just some random part of prophecy, it literally refers to the jews/israel ie they are protected by the Beast.
the whole conext we learn of communism and the bolshevik revolution is that the mass looting of the orthodox church and destruction of religion there....was that the wealth of the soviet union was then inherited by jewish oligarchs eg roman abramovic, len blavantik and many more who have since supported israel financially.



and yet the best response you guys can conjure up, albeit with all of you constantly empowered by the holy spirit, is
'i disagree with you'
...
come on, do better!!!


legitimately, id love to know a christian on this forum i could have grown up real convos with..and he/she wouldnt need to agree with me, but just have rock solid well intended arguments that cover every base..
not these weak ones like what you guys are putting up so far.
if both of us believe in the same prophecies, how come we cant agree on the any of them?


i also have to point out here, that my understanding is that there's 'jewish identity' and that does not truely make one a 'jew' by spirit.
jew by blood perhaps.

example
in islam, there are bloodline decendants of prophet Mohammad.
throughout history, they have often been the best of muslims, but also the worst. they are similar to jews in that respect, spiritually capable but too easily corruptable.

when 'i' challenged them a long time back, on the fact that they are involved in some satanic shit. they effectively started pushing the 'blasphemy' argument against me and then shouting about their magical bloodline
'we are decendants of...'
and i was like 'being 'of the house of Abraham and Mohammad' is not about BLOOD..but spirit.

and this was before id even touched the bible...
so when i got to this topic in the Gospel and i read what Jesus had to say, Jesus who is THE promise itself...i guess i became attached.
yet it's so ironic that i now try to make this point about jews and it gets rejected.

so again let me repeat a previous point
Zechariah 13
'strike the shepherd and the sheep will be scattered'
this is clearly a post Jesus context..the roman invasion of Jerusalem/the holy land.

2/3 would perish or escape..(and that inc the modern 'jew identity')
1/3 would REMAIN and would be 'God's people'.
Yet we both know that the survivors were actually jewish by blood and christian in spirit..
they remained there, they didnt leave. they became palestinian in identity..and eventually muslim.
hence Rev 12's islam/wilderness connection which is also apparent in Rev 11.

they would 'believe in the testimony of Jesus and obey the commandmants'.
^^
and even on that it extends by Isaiah 42...
the new song prophecy which also indicated islam...is followed by the condemnation of the jews. God calls them 'deaf and blind'
and further God says '

It pleased the Lord
for the sake of his righteousness
to make his law great and glorious.

this coming in a post Jesus context, the 'law' is a reference to the law of islam that's effectively 'for all people' not just a jewish law..and leads to it's fulfillment by Jesus.
the natural progression goes like
israelites under Faith
Israelites losing the way and coming into The Law through Moses
Jesus fulfilling the law
Gentiles under faith...

so it makes common sense that once the christians lost the way through innovation and idolatory/polythiesm via rome, that a new gentile prophet (since there cannot be a jewish prophet after Jesus) would come...and it would be an ishmaelite ie Mohammad, fulfilling 'the promise' to Ishmael, going ful circle and bringing the LAW.
it would culminate in the second coming of Jesus..

connecting this with Revelation 12, the true jews, are prob not even jewish in identity but in blood/spirit and they came into islam.
so im not a jew hater...there's a key point here
there are the true jews who are the remnant, chosen by God..
and then there are the false ones who proclaim themselves as 'jews' by blood..
we know what happened when Jesus encountered that variety..he called them 'sons of SATAN!!!'
so it seems me and Jesus are on the same page on that.

what's your angle then?

 

[SomeNOBODY0]

do you care to address each of the points ive made in my post above then? it seems to me you are more invested in rooting for 'your side' and effectively making this an islam vs xtianity topic rather than a mutual one. i see that through the way you selectively like posts.


we both believe in the same prophecies in Revelation here.

im being told to 'accept im wrong' on the mystery babylon = jews viewpoint, but what im being offered in return as far as it's identity, are awful arguments.


i just addressed the one on 'saudi arabia' which was in Red's list as 'a candidate for the whore'. Saudi being a 'kingdom' would be 'committing adultery with her' ie saudi wouldnt be the whore itself but a man, in the symbolic sense.

how come i have to point this out? where are the legit xtians who would counter those type of weak arguments for the sake of their own integrity?


you cant deny the 'whore' connection to jews. you cannot deny the babylon connection via zech 5.
you cannot deny the murder connection. or the economic connection (remember the rabbis in the temple itself were money lending at interest when Jesus kicked them out...and it goes right back to Babylon ie Nehemiah 5 revealed that fact, right after their return from exile, the rabbis became money lenders to their own people).
the tabernacle itself matches the scroll of 20 cubits by 10 cubits in Zech 5.
many many connections that also have literally come true in our lifetime.

i think it was you who was discussing the Black Horse of Rev 6
i presented a perfect context

the 4th Beast of Daniel was the Roman empire. The end times Beast is 'the feet of iron/clay' representing the end times re-emergence of the same empire. The colonial powers eg Britain, Spain, Portugal, France, etc were original Roman colonies. So the rise of colonial powers was the beginning of end times Beast..and it makes perfect sense why Revelation's prophecies would begin on that note, in Rev 6.

hence
white horse = colonialism.
red horse = the consequence of colonialism, BLOODSHED ie world wars, the bolshevik revolution, the holocoast..

so then it leads to the end of ww2, what happened? America became the number 1 superpower and you had Capitalism vs Communism hence the Black horse prophecy of the scales makes sense..
and right along it, you had the creation of a jewish state.
'do not harm the oil and wine' is not just some random part of prophecy, it literally refers to the jews/israel ie they are protected by the Beast.
the whole conext we learn of communism and the bolshevik revolution is that the mass looting of the orthodox church and destruction of religion there....was that the wealth of the soviet union was then inherited by jewish oligarchs eg roman abramovic, len blavantik and many more who have since supported israel financially.



and yet the best response you guys can conjure up, albeit with all of you constantly empowered by the holy spirit, is
'i disagree with you'
...
come on, do better!!!


legitimately, id love to know a christian on this forum i could have grown up real convos with..and he/she wouldnt need to agree with me, but just have rock solid well intended arguments that cover every base..
not these weak ones like what you guys are putting up so far.
if both of us believe in the same prophecies, how come we cant agree on the any of them?


i also have to point out here, that my understanding is that there's 'jewish identity' and that does not truely make one a 'jew' by spirit.
jew by blood perhaps.

example
in islam, there are bloodline decendants of prophet Mohammad.
throughout history, they have often been the best of muslims, but also the worst. they are similar to jews in that respect, spiritually capable but too easily corruptable.

when 'i' challenged them a long time back, on the fact that they are involved in some satanic shit. they effectively started pushing the 'blasphemy' argument against me and then shouting about their magical bloodline
'we are decendants of...'
and i was like 'being 'of the house of Abraham and Mohammad' is not about BLOOD..but spirit.

and this was before id even touched the bible...
so when i got to this topic in the Gospel and i read what Jesus had to say, Jesus who is THE promise itself...i guess i became attached.
yet it's so ironic that i now try to make this point about jews and it gets rejected.

so again let me repeat a previous point
Zechariah 13
'strike the shepherd and the sheep will be scattered'
this is clearly a post Jesus context..the roman invasion of Jerusalem/the holy land.

2/3 would perish or escape..(and that inc the modern 'jew identity')
1/3 would REMAIN and would be 'God's people'.
Yet we both know that the survivors were actually jewish by blood and christian in spirit..
they remained there, they didnt leave. they became palestinian in identity..and eventually muslim.
hence Rev 12's islam/wilderness connection which is also apparent in Rev 11.

they would 'believe in the testimony of Jesus and obey the commandmants'.
^^
and even on that it extends by Isaiah 42...
the new song prophecy which also indicated islam...is followed by the condemnation of the jews. God calls them 'deaf and blind'
and further God says '

It pleased the Lord
for the sake of his righteousness
to make his law great and glorious.

this coming in a post Jesus context, the 'law' is a reference to the law of islam that's effectively 'for all people' not just a jewish law..and leads to it's fulfillment by Jesus.
the natural progression goes like
israelites under Faith
Israelites losing the way and coming into The Law through Moses
Jesus fulfilling the law
Gentiles under faith...

so it makes common sense that once the christians lost the way through innovation and idolatory/polythiesm via rome, that a new gentile prophet (since there cannot be a jewish prophet after Jesus) would come...and it would be an ishmaelite ie Mohammad, fulfilling 'the promise' to Ishmael, going ful circle and bringing the LAW.
it would culminate in the second coming of Jesus..

connecting this with Revelation 12, the true jews, are prob not even jewish in identity but in blood/spirit and they came into islam.
so im not a jew hater...there's a key point here
there are the true jews who are the remnant, chosen by God..
and then there are the false ones who proclaim themselves as 'jews' by blood..
we know what happened when Jesus encountered that variety..he called them 'sons of SATAN!!!'
so it seems me and Jesus are on the same page on that.

what's your angle then?

Well I could argue that you selectively like just as much as you say I do I agree with Red on many of these points, and I reflect that in my likes. I think humanity in general has been and always will be (until the end of time and the dead are risen) adulterous towards the Lord, and I ain't banking too heavily on any one person being mystery Babylon the Great. I do, however, waver on it being U.S. because we have brought far more evil to the world than Israel has, and we have far more power and influence used towards wickedness than they. I'm not dedicated to it being the U.S., but I do waver . I respect your belief on there needing to be a gentile prophet considering how you view it, but I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and came to redeem anybody whosoever who believes, and I will of course view some of these things differently. Regarding the riders of the horses in Revelation, and particularly the black horse, a quart of wheat for a denarius and 3 quarts of barley for a denarius, and harm not the oil or the wine strikes me as hyperinflation if taken at face value, as a denarius was a days wage and if bread runs for that and wine and oil are unharmed, I can think nothing but hyperinflation, so we will have to agree to disagree . I also believe that the feet of iron and clay coalesce into the ten Kings given power for one hour that is mentioned in Revelation, those also b iteing the toes in Nebuchadnezzar's dream, and I think that is yet future as the giant rock hasn't come and smashed it and grown to overtake everything for the rest of history. We simply can't agree because we expect and believe different things regarding the Gospel. I probably missed some things to respond to, but cut me some slack I have kids to attend to lol. For what it's worth, you know quite a bit of the O.T. and have put a lot of thought into this, but on some pretty key points we will naturally not agree. I am simply stating my position differs regarding the identity and mission of Jesus Christ ( He's the Son of God and came to die for our sins and rose from the grave), the purpose and timing of the Ezekiel 38 war, and a few thing in Revelation. Probably other stuff too, but I don't have the time right now lol.

 

[AspiringSoul]

Well I could argue that you selectively like just as much as you say I do I agree with Red on many of these points, and I reflect that in my likes. I think humanity in general has been and always will be (until the end of time and the dead are risen) adulterous towards the Lord, and I ain't banking too heavily on any one person being mystery Babylon the Great. I do, however, waver on it being U.S. because we have brought far more evil to the world than Israel has, and we have far more power and influence used towards wickedness than they. I'm not dedicated to it being the U.S., but I do waver . I respect your belief on there needing to be a gentile prophet considering how you view it, but I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and came to redeem anybody whosoever who believes, and I will of course view some of these things differently. Regarding the riders of the horses in Revelation, and particularly the black horse, a quart of wheat for a denarius and 3 quarts of barley for a denarius, and harm not the oil or the wine strikes me as hyperinflation if taken at face value, as a denarius was a days wage and if bread runs for that and wine and oil are unharmed, I can think nothing but hyperinflation, so we will have to agree to disagree . I also believe that the feet of iron and clay coalesce into the ten Kings given power for one hour that is mentioned in Revelation, those also b iteing the toes in Nebuchadnezzar's dream, and I think that is yet future as the giant rock hasn't come and smashed it and grown to overtake everything for the rest of history. We simply can't agree because we expect and believe different things regarding the Gospel. I probably missed some things to respond to, but cut me some slack I have kids to attend to lol. For what it's worth, you know quite a bit of the O.T. and have put a lot of thought into this, but on some pretty key points we will naturally not agree. I am simply stating my position differs regarding the identity and mission of Jesus Christ ( He's the Son of God and came to die for our sins and rose from the grave), the purpose and timing of the Ezekiel 38 war, and a few thing in Revelation. Probably other stuff too, but I don't have the time right now lol.

1) no one else was called 'adulteress' though. so when you say 'we're all a bit adulterous to the Lord' it's a cop out argument and ignores actual scripture.
plus, the bible even the NT is still judaism centric and hence connects with them the most.

2) who owns israel though?

america didnt kill the prophets and saints.
america didnt cause the bolshevik revolution which was the biggest human massacre of all time (and i cant believe how little you care about the mass murder of 61m CHRISTIANS) it was opposed to it.
i view america as an extention or one of the heads of the end times beast...
and the whore 'rides the beast'.
get it? she is given power over the entire beast system for a time, until it destroys her.
if america invades iran, it wont be for it's own interests but israel's interests.

furthermore, you have to be more specific when talkiing about america. for example hollywood, tv, music, news, porn, even sports, are controlled on the higher level by jews.

eg

Al Goldstein - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

View on Christianity
In his book XXX-Communicated: A Rebel Without a Shul, Luke Ford wrote about a conversation with Goldstein, in which Ford asked Goldstein why Jews were dramatically overrepresented in the porn industry. He answered, "The only reason that Jews are in pornography is that we think that Christ sucks. Catholicism sucks. We don't believe in authoritarianism. Pornography thus becomes a way of defiling Christian culture and, as it penetrates to the very heart of the American mainstream (and is no doubt consumed by those very same WASPs), its subversive character becomes more charged. " Ford then asked, "What does it mean to you to be a Jew?" To which Goldstein responded, "It doesn't mean anything. It means that I'm called a kike." Ford also asked, "Do you believe in God?" Goldstein said, "I believe in me. I'm God. Screw God. God is your need to believe in some super being. I am the super being. I am your God, admit it. We're random. We're the flea on the butt of the dog."

make of it what you will, but dont excuse this shit man.


'by the WINE OF HER ADULTERIES THE NATIONS WERE LED ASTRAY'
it's a global problem, look at japan.

plus, going back to the 4 horseman prophecy in Rev 6
the black horse symbolising capitalism vs communism, in a post ww2 context..
you have the creation of israel and the rise of america...

the powers that be, the elite, merely deferred the face of global domination to america. however america does the bidding for their agenda.
the biggest one of all being to defend it...fight its wars etc
hence 'do not harm the oil and wine'.



3) I respect your belief on there needing to be a gentile prophet considering how you view it, but I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and came to redeem anybody whosoever who believes, and I will of course view some of these things differently.

ive said this many times but ill repeat it again
back in the day during the hellenistic era, the greeks persecuted jews and it led to the maccabean revolt.
This was the fulfillment of Daniel 8 and 11's prophecies, the rise of Antiochus Epiphaines.
some reading material on this if you're interested,. the 2 books of the Maccabees.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Maccabees 1 - Good News Translation

Alexander the Great - This history begins when Alexander the Great, son of Philip of Macedonia, marched from Macedonia and attacked Darius, king of Persia and Media. Alexander enlarged the Greek Empire by defeating Darius and seizing his throne. He fought many battles, captured fortified cities...

www.biblegateway.com

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Maccabees 1 - Good News Translation

A Letter to the Jews in Egypt - From the Jews of Jerusalem and Judea to those in Egypt, warm greetings. May God be good to you and keep the covenant he made with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, his faithful servants. May he fill each of you with the desire to worship him and to do his will eagerly...

www.biblegateway.com

take this as a historical source of information, obv it isnt scripture but it is an important part of jewish history and is very very important in understanding how the messianic ideal was shaped later.

The greeks conquered territories upto present day pakistan (which was india back then), aswell as the whole of egypt.
they absorbed indian, persian and egyptian mythology/philosophy..
the key one was Vishnu, the universal consciousness and it's incarnations.
long story short, the Greeks also inc egyptian and persian concepts and called it 'the LOGOS'.

the jewish hellenised philosophy, Philo, who was living in the time of Jesus, actually merged the concept of the Logos into judaism. However knowing the history of jewish perception from the greeks, this concept was not easily acceptable to jews. As such, he adopted the term 'Ben Elohim' in the metaphorical/symbolic sense to it.
He actually connected it to the term 'IMAGE OF GOD'

Hence, The WORD (greek LOGOS) is the IMAGE OF GOD and only metaphorically/symbolically speaking, 'the only begotten son of God'.
it was philo who came up with this term in the messianic context.
the philosophers plant the seeds on a higher metaphysical level of consciousnes and as such, it becomes a big idea that later materialises...eg Jesus became that person..but the truth is the whole region, under greek hellenistic and persian i nfluences was already believing in such things. it's why the 3 magians came. Why Paul spoke about how the truth didnt come to the wise in the end but to the seemingly unwise.
you see, all the philosophers put together, didnt have a certain quality the jews posessed, that is, the jews were a persecuted race and the others were not.

the point is that when you just say 'he is the Son'
and whilst muslims reject the term..
it's just hebrew language, ben elohim. i dont take it literally at all but i do believe Jesus is the incarnation of the LOGOS/IMAGE.
the Quran and prophet Mohammad said so.

however all of that aside, the partriarchs/israelites were under faith, just like the gentile christians..
and yet God saw fit to give them the law so that Jesus can complete it.
the law made God's grace even greater
'the law was not revealed to conceal sin, but to make it known, so God's grace could be revealed'

this becomes even more significant through islam since islamic law is similar to torah law, but is for all people, gentile and jew.
the point here is, islam leads to Jesus and makes him even greater..
for Jesus to come and 'fulfill ALL the law' in the way the NT teaches, means the gentiles also go full circle as the israelites/jews did.
besides when Jesus came he only came to judea but the israelites havent returned yet, so clearly that part of Jesus's mission ie 'fulfilling the law' is not complete until he does so for all of the 12 tribes and extend that to all the gentiles who become part of Abraham by faith.

of course this isnt actually on topic, its an extra point i made connecting it with themes in Revelation 11 and 12
I was given a reed like a measuring rod and was told, “Go and measure the temple of God and the altar, with its worshipers.
2 But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months.

1260 days = 1260 yrs (lunar yrs in jewish prophecy).

Muslims conquered Jerusalem in
637AD
first crusade where it was lost to Christians..
1099AD
Muslims took it back in 1187 and held it till 1948. 761 years and 462 years
Total 1223 years of Muslim control.
In lunar years that is 1223 X 1.03068
That comes to exactly 1260 years.

side note: the actual 'al aqsa' in islam is the entire temple mount. the third holiest site in islam.
the structure by that name, is the 'al jami al aqsa' and is actually on the outer court of where the jewish temple stood. this structure is a mosque built by the ummayads and is not really essential to islam, but it's obv important as a symbol of muslim rule.
my belief is that 1948 onwards, the muslim era ended..

However where we go full circle again is that in Rev 12 it once again references the 1260 days in the context of the wilderness.
says the 'woman and her children' fled to the wilderness to be 'taken care of' away from satans reach..
when the 1260 days were over, then war was made against them.

Connect that with Zechariah 13..the 1/3 remnant who remained in the holy land after roman persecution..they were 'God's people'
yet these guys actually were absorbed into a palestinian identity, as christians and then most likely as muslims.
quite literally the real remnant, are not 'jews' in identity but amongst the palestinians..and post 1948 war is made on them just as the prophecy states.
the modern day 'jews' by identity, are the branch that left the holy land in 70AD, part of the 2/3 in Zech 13...they are not 'God's people'.

pay attention!!!


4)
Regarding the riders of the horses in Revelation, and particularly the black horse, a quart of wheat for a denarius and 3 quarts of barley for a denarius, and harm not the oil or the wine strikes me as hyperinflation if taken at face value, as a denarius was a days wage and if bread runs for that and wine and oil are unharmed, I can think nothing but hyperinflation, so we will have to agree to disagree

so if the white horse is conquest..and there has never been an era of conquest like the age of colonliasm
the black horse is war/bloodshed..and there has never been an era of bloodshed like the 20th century...the consequence of colonialism

it is EASY to see that the 3rd horse is a post ww2 context..
and what do we see? capitalism vs communism
america vs russia/china
and within all of that, the creation of israel

as i showed you before 'oil and wine' are powerful symbols of Judaism
this isnt me making it up, it's here from a jewish source

https://www.chabad.org/holidays/purim/article_cdo/aid/2815/jewish/Oil-and-Wine.htm

Chanukah is oil,
Purim is wine.

you think these prophecies are all for nothing? it is always jewish centric...
the 4 beasts ruled over the jewish temples.
the rise of end times Rome/the beast of the sea, is connected to jerusalem and the temple...it is the biggest plotline of the lot.
so of course they would want jerusalem...hence the creation of israel and 'do not harm the oil of wine' ie 'we have to protect israel'.

your version, is okay, im not taking that out, but this prophecy is much bigger than that. 'hyper inflation' itself is only a context of capitalism anyway.
the rich get richer, the poor get poorer.
walmart n shit...loot the poor countries, drive down prices so they cannot afford even basics..and overvalue the luxuries..
yet the jews are central to that plot as ive covered already..as per Rev 18's references to 'wealth/luxuries' etc.


5)
I also believe that the feet of iron and clay coalesce into the ten Kings given power for one hour that is mentioned in Revelation, those also b iteing the toes in Nebuchadnezzar's dream, and I think that is yet future as the giant rock hasn't come and smashed it and grown to overtake everything for the rest of history.

i dont disagree with that..
however i did point out that in Daniel 7
there are 10 horns and 1 little horn..
and this was fulfilled by the 10 emperors of rome from Augustus Cesar to Vespasian..and the 'little horn' was Titus, son of Vespasian.
the horns were relevant to the jewish temple.

Red was arguing that the 'little horn' is the antichrist. i was pointed out that he wsnt, he was Titus..and daniel 7 is not about the antichrist.
in Revelation we are told there are 10 kings who rule ALONG WITH THE BEAST (of the earth, the false messiah/prophet).
ie in Revelation he isnt called 'a horn'. he is only known as the false prophet or the Beast.

of course we both agree that there will be 10 kings/rulers who will rule alongside the antichrist/false messiah when the jewish temple is built. the jewish temple is essential to the 'horns' (as per Daniel).
The rock is Jesus.

the reason i spoke about islam was that islam is a microcosmic expressiion of the messianic kingdom.
that is because the holy spirit is the microcosmic expression of the Logos/Son (which incarnated in Jesus).
so in John 16 when Jesus said he was sending the holy spirit/comforter/spirit of truth etc..
the holy spirit eventually brought along islam to fulfill key messianic type themes, reflecting messianic archetypes

i can go on and on on this topic man
eg Jesus was the suffering servant, passive..and then he left the world
on the microcosmic version...Mohammad was persecuted/suffered in Mecca, passive..and then he left to go to Madina
Jesus will return as the conquerer/active..and this also happend when Mohammad conquered Mecca after ruling in Madina. Madina to muslims is symbolic of heaven..but this is not an essential point btw, i like to see these connections..and i wish christians began to appreciate the role of islam instead of turning antagonistic against it. that's not the 'plan' in the bible.
in the bible, God had a greater plan that inc ishmael becoming a great nation. Jesus has a purprose for all the world
'a light for the gentiles' and so it makes sense that the gentiles would go through the same transformation/experience the jews did. from faith to law to grace. so it does lead to the second coming of Jesus.


the truth is, the areas you dont agree on, fundamentally..are on modern israel and where it stands in the bible and how the muslim world revolves around that
behind that, is an inherent hatred of islam and it's backstory...
and that is messed up considering the promise God made to ishmael.

'a great nation' and '12 princes'
princes are Caliphs..
and the 12 caliphs are a prophecy in islam, with the 12th being the imam mahdi figure...who is not a 'prophet' but a caliph, remember that..
he is a figure coming from khorosan, present day afghanistan..and it's why your buddies bombed the shit out of afghanistan..

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

I've already asked before for you to actually explain WHAT I'm wrong about and WHY, but you never reply. Would you please explain to me WHY you think I'm wrong instead of just asserting it? thank you.

Please cite the aforementioned post and break down what I am wrong about. If your hermeneutics are correct then you will be able to explain it without resorting to vague ambiguities, in my posts I have outlined my points.

I am not a great believer in text based trench warfare. You have your view, I have mine. I try to share reasons why I see things as I do, but I will not overstep and call you a fool for holding a different view.

As for preterism, I found this critique helpful:-

A Critique of Preterism | Evidence Unseen

www.evidenceunseen.com

 

[Nikōn]

I am not a great believer in text based trench warfare. You have your view, I have mine.

Yes, we all have our views. I'm asking you to explain yours, so I can better understand your position. Why do you keep refusing?

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

Yes, we all have our views. I'm asking you to explain yours, so I can better understand your position. Why do you keep refusing?

I have had this discussion before - no refusal from me ;-)

Multiple prophetic fulfillment in the Bible (and why it matters)

Everyone comes at the Bible from a different route and we bring out own ideas on the right way to interpret it with us. One of the things that has helped my appreciation of fulfilled and unfulfilled prophecy is the principle of multiple fulfilment. Why this matters may become clear later, but...

www.vigilantcitizenforums.com

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

Iran Goes on the Offensive as the U.S. Retreats From Afghanistan and Elsewhere

The Taliban’s seizure of power in Afghanistan, while swift and dramatic, is neither the first nor the sole challenge to the U.S. and its allies taking place in and around the region. Iran is mounting another, no less significant push. Behind both offensives is the perception that the regional order is failing and the U.S. is retreating.

The factor underlying the Mideast violence earlier this summer seems clear: Iran is trying to assert power across several fronts. It is wielding a variety of assets, proxies and franchises against the full range of enemies it perceives in the region.

Part of the escalation was last month’s fatal drone attack on the merchant vessel Mercer Street in the Gulf of Oman. The Liberian-flagged oil tanker belongs to Zodiac Maritime, a London-based firm owned by Israeli shipping magnate Eyal Ofer. Two people were killed: a British crewman and the Romanian captain. Responsibility for the attack “clearly points to Iran,” according to a Group of Seven statement Aug. 6. Foreign Ministry spokesman Saeed Khatibzadeh called the accusation “baseless.”

Opinion | Iran Goes on the Offensive as the U.S. Retreats From Afghanistan and Elsewhere

Tehran’s proxies unleash violence on several fronts in the Mideast as it senses weakness in adversaries.

www.wsj.com

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

With Collapse in Afghanistan, Russia Takes Charge in Central Asia

DUSHANBE, Tajikistan — As the Afghan government collapsed this week in Kabul and the United States scrambled to speed up its evacuation effort, hundreds of Russian armored vehicles and artillery pieces were clearly visible hundreds of miles away, on the border with Tajikistan.

^ I didn’t see this one coming but it makes sense…

 

[LifeisaPsyop]

With Collapse in Afghanistan, Russia Takes Charge in Central Asia

DUSHANBE, Tajikistan — As the Afghan government collapsed this week in Kabul and the United States scrambled to speed up its evacuation effort, hundreds of Russian armored vehicles and artillery pieces were clearly visible hundreds of miles away, on the border with Tajikistan.

^ I didn’t see this one coming but it makes sense…

I've got a feeling that in terms of fulfillment of prophecy this thread is going to age well.

 

[Tidal]

All Jews are going up the spout, unless they become Christians BEFORE judgement day, no ifs and buts.

In fact the same applies to the heathen nations-
"Lord, pour out your wrath upon the heathen that have not known you, and upon the kingdoms that have not called upon your name" (Psalm 79:6)

 

[Vmort]

unless they become Christians

All religious organisations are financed from Rothshields. So it doesn't matter how they named themselves.

 

[Tidal]

All religious organisations are financed from Rothshields. So it doesn't matter how they named themselves.

Yes, and many people think they need rel orgs to teach them.
I prefer to stick with Jesus..

Jesus said:-"You have one teacher, me" (Matt 23:10)
"And the common people heard him gladly" (Mark 12:37)
"There is one mediator between God and men- the man Jesus Christ" (1 Tim 2:5)
"Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith" (Heb 12:2)
"There is no other name under heaven that can save us" (Acts 4:12)

 

[seekinheart]

Israel Miracle? Gaza Strip Hamas Complain, ‘Their God Changes The Paths Of Our Rockets In Mid-Air’

Headlines in Israel claim miracles are protecting the Jews during the Gaza Strip ground war, with one headline proclaiming that Hamas terrorists are complaining about God changing the direction of rockets in mid-air.


Good luck trying to destroy Israel...

 

[AspiringSoul]

Israel Miracle? Gaza Strip Hamas Complain, ‘Their God Changes The Paths Of Our Rockets In Mid-Air’

Headlines in Israel claim miracles are protecting the Jews during the Gaza Strip ground war, with one headline proclaiming that Hamas terrorists are complaining about God changing the direction of rockets in mid-air.


Good luck trying to destroy Israel...

looked it up, it's fake news with no real source, just a made up name/story/quote.

they themselves say so here

Arabs recognise Hashems watchfull hand over Klal Yisroel

I heard that recently an Arab officer claimed that they are competent with aiming their missiles but that Hashem is helping Eretz Yisroel Does anyone know a source for this [online or other]?

judaism.stackexchange.com

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

looked it up, it's fake news with no real source, just a made up name/story/quote.

they themselves say so here

Arabs recognise Hashems watchfull hand over Klal Yisroel

I heard that recently an Arab officer claimed that they are competent with aiming their missiles but that Hashem is helping Eretz Yisroel Does anyone know a source for this [online or other]?

judaism.stackexchange.com

I remember another incident from a number of years ago…

Israeli Iron Dome operator says gust of wind blew missile into sea

The commander claims that the divine intervention stopped the death of hundreds of Israeli citizens last week after a rocket was headed towards Tel Aviv.

www.dailymail.co.uk

People will debate these incidents back and forth, depending on their perspectives. If or perhaps when the Ezekiel 38 prophecies happen, I suspect the world will watch open mouthed.

 

[AspiringSoul]

I remember another incident from a number of years ago…

Israeli Iron Dome operator says gust of wind blew missile into sea

The commander claims that the divine intervention stopped the death of hundreds of Israeli citizens last week after a rocket was headed towards Tel Aviv.

www.dailymail.co.uk

People will debate these incidents back and forth, depending on their perspectives. If or perhaps when the Ezekiel 38 prophecies happen, I suspect the world will watch open mouthed.

There wont be an iron dome then and it wint be THIS state so pur your dick away.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

There wont be an iron dome then and it wint be THIS state so pur your dick away.

Rudeness doesn’t change anything other than peoples interest in interacting with you @AspiringSoul