Is chivalry dead?

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#22
Yes, I believe you that you love to test social norms.

I mean... like I said.... I think I would give a brief look of annoyance.

I think I'd dislike it but I don't think I'd actually say anything. I don't think it's serious enough to really say anything (unless it's repeated).

I'm not in favor of the elimination of gender boundaries and I assume he's not either. I view it as cultural Marxism.
He is southern so he believes that it is a mans role to do things like that. It doesn't quite annoy him, it's not how his parents raised him.
 





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#23
The best society is one where men and women follow the roles they are equipped for by nature. Men are providers and protectors, and women are the object of that provision and protection. The goal is family and a healthy society.

Men have aggression and a desire for power that needs to be directed and tamed, and women have the power to do that. When men are at their best, all their energies are directed toward making the women happy and safe.

This is modern chivalry.



Men from every class and standing went without complaint and died to protect their women and the way of life that benefited their families, because that's what good men do.
 





Lisa

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#24
wow I did not even notice that..... look how she's carrying the thing on her head.... I didn't see that.... I just sort of ignored it and didn't think about it..... I looked at it very quickly and I think I saw the smaller image in the google image thing

I think he should carry the heavier stuff and maybe she could carry a lighter thing... but I do think he should carry whatever is heaviest..... I don't agree with what is going on now that I see the more details
He could carry all of it and she could wrap her arm in his :) that would be sweet!
 





Lisa

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#26
He needs to be free to protect her.
Well...he could always drop their things, protect her, or even use the suitcase as a weapon...but it’s gentlemanly to carry things for the woman. Why do you think us women get married? ;):D
 





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#27
I don't think chivalry is dead. Nor is the code of the "Knight". I think they might be in a process of transformation. Of course, I know that transformation is mostly just a buzz word, but I do actually believe it.

Generally speaking, everything has good parts and bad parts. Take Chivalry, for example, it can be a great thing. However, it can also make women feel confined, or smothered. I'm just saying I think it's super important to distinguish between real threats and threats driven by ego, or paranoia.

I've spent more time than normal figuring out what threats are real or not. So I can confidently say most of "chivalry" can be fed to the birds. Most women don't need an air raid backing them up.
 





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#28
Well...he could always drop their things, protect her, or even use the suitcase as a weapon...but it’s gentlemanly to carry things for the woman. Why do you think us women get married? ;):D
This is why men are in charge of protection. When trouble comes, every second counts. Who has time to drop all the crap that women want us to carry? I guarantee you that's her stuff in the suitcase on her head.

Suitcase as a weapon, for Pete's sake.
 





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#29
That is a good point!

Do you think that women should be treated differently ("as a lady?")
There are ways to treat the either gender. They are both meant to be treated differently. Concept of Lady however is outdated and anyone still holding onto to needs to grow up and realize that this is not a fictional Victorian Era.

Are you saying women can be knights?

If so, I agree with you. Of course, women can be knights. Look at Joan of Arc, for example. There have been cases where women did fight as knights.

I think in some cases the women pretended be men. I think there have been multiple famous cases where women pretended to be men in order to fight as knights- maybe for some patriotic sense of duty. I mean there's the movie Mulan that I'm sure is familiar to people.

Chivalry is a code of conduct for knights.

"Chivalry, or the chivalric code, is an informal, varying code of conduct developed between 1170 and 1220, but never decided on or summarized in a single document. It was associated with the medieval Christian institution of knighthood;[1] knights' and gentlewomen's behaviours were governed[when?] by chivalrous social codes.[2] The ideals of chivalry were popularized in medieval literature, especially the Matter of Britain and Matter of France, the former based on Geoffrey of Monmouth's Historia Regum Britanniae, written in the 1130s, which introduced the legend of King Arthur.[3] All of these were taken as historically accurate until the beginnings of modern scholarship in the 19th century."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivalry

apparently, it also regulates the behavior of gentlewomen.... I mean I think obviously knights were mostly men but there's been cases where women served as knights....

so I think it applies to knights mostly..... if we are looking at it historically as you suggest...... and you're right that it's not necessarily specific to men.... but I think the only women it would apply to would be gentlewomen (which is a term I'm not familiar with, so I don't know who fits in that group) and women who are serving as knights.... but women who served as knights.... while they did exist..... would have been the exception rather than the norm (even today, the most feminist of women aren't calling for drafting women in armed forces).... it mostly applies to men.... but also to women in some cases... however, I doubt it would apply in the same exact way... I'm sure the codes of chivalry would have had somewhat different rules for a (almost always male) knight and for a gentlewoman
Ugh incels.
 





Lisa

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#30
This is why men are in charge of protection. When trouble comes, every second counts. Who has time to drop all the crap that women want us to carry? I guarantee you that's her stuff in the suitcase on her head.

Suitcase as a weapon, for Pete's sake.
I was only half serious and you were actually serious.

I think he could smash the suitcase into someone’s face..
 





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#33
If so, who killed it and can it come back?
chivalry is dead, and feminism killed it.

opening a door for a woman these days, and a guy can be called sexist or chauvinist because he would be accused of believing that the woman couldnt do it herself or she isnt strong enough. thats where we are today.

it will come back naturally once we squash 3rd wave feminism and return to our traditional male/female roles which have worked for thousands of years.
 





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#34
saps our moral energy, distracts from more important issues.
Nice to know you don't think equality is important.

makes men and women neurotically monitor gendered behavior
Not really. The only think feminism says on gendered

promotes distrust and tit for tat in relationships
This sort of thing existed long before feminism was even a thing.

promotes redistribution over creation
I also need you to explain this one since I don't quite understand your logic here.

turns altruism into something evil
Trying to be nice to get something out of someone isn't altruism.

unnecessarily makes each gender unfairly compete with the other
If you want to blame something for this, blame our economic system.

doubles work output per household
This is also the work of our economic system, not feminism.

gives parents less time to spend with kids
Also the fault of our economic system. You are blaming feminism for the exploitation of capitalsim.

encourages a taking advantage of each gender's proclivities (e.g. horny men, pliant women)
just to get you started
No, it doesn't?
 





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#35
If you mean the Knight class of feudalism, the enforcers of the nobilities’ illegal property claims, then no they no longer exist, they did however evolve into the police/military class and perhaps even the managerial/business class, just as feudalism evolved into capitalism.


https://www.britannica.com/topic/chivalry

“The concept of chivalry in the sense of “honourable and courteous conduct expected of a knight” was perhaps at its height in the 12th and 13th centuries and was strengthened by the Crusades, which led to the founding of the earliest orders of chivalry, the Order of the Hospital of St. John of Jerusalem (Hospitalers) and the Order of the Poor Knights of Christ and of the Temple of Solomon (Templars), both originally devoted to the service of pilgrims to the Holy Land. In the 14th and 15th centuries the ideals of chivalry came to be associated increasingly with aristocratic display and public ceremony rather than service in the field.”

Born in the savagery of the Crusades and later “embodied” by the elite. Hard pass on chivalry.
 





rex

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#36
Yes we get screwed from all sides. You could say feminism helps hold us down while the economic system gets busy.

What I meant by altruism is that both sexes make huge sacrifices and instead of celebrating selfless care with gratitude as is tradition, it becomes something you dole out with "I don't need your help" and "you don't deserve my help" sentiment abounding. To affirm your understanding, I don't think taking more from a spouse for the sake of equality is important. How does it sound to endlessly measure our contributions instead of going out to protest.

Anyway, I don't get in any sense that you're curious, like I'm curious about your train of thought on rapists. How would you feel if anything bad you said about chivalry, I blamed on feudalism instead, declaring chivalry untarnished.

The only think feminism says on gendered
 





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#39
If you mean the Knight class of feudalism, the enforcers of the nobilities’ illegal property claims, then no they no longer exist, they did however evolve into the police/military class and perhaps even the managerial/business class, just as feudalism evolved into capitalism.


https://www.britannica.com/topic/chivalry

“The concept of chivalry in the sense of “honourable and courteous conduct expected of a knight” was perhaps at its height in the 12th and 13th centuries and was strengthened by the Crusades, which led to the founding of the earliest orders of chivalry, the Order of the Hospital of St. John of Jerusalem (Hospitalers) and the Order of the Poor Knights of Christ and of the Temple of Solomon (Templars), both originally devoted to the service of pilgrims to the Holy Land. In the 14th and 15th centuries the ideals of chivalry came to be associated increasingly with aristocratic display and public ceremony rather than service in the field.”

Born in the savagery of the Crusades and later “embodied” by the elite. Hard pass on chivalry.
And now guys who cry at the thought of a woman talking back to them, talk about chivalry being endangered because of feminism.