If the Vatican is the antichrist, then why do you trust the Bible?

Lisa

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Wait, so now the Bible is conveniently talking metaphorically? right :rolleyes:



But impregnated by God.



Then in the future, please avoid stating things like:



When Jesus was clearly a human that you worship.
Did the disciples eat Jesus and drink His blood? And if not, why not when He told them too...right?

Yep she was impregnated by three Holy Spirit but not in the the way men impregnate women, it was supernatural.

Mary was human, Jesus was human and also God.


You're no more "Christian" than they are.
I am Christian, catholics aren’t.

And you want him to follow you and your whims.
However the fact remains that the Catholic Church does not justify itself through the kind of relativistic and arbitrary discord that you Protestants do.
They use the name of Jesus to justify themselves and then add myths to their beliefs, just to have their own followers for their greed and power.
 

Robin

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Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.



Hence Christianity (especially Evangelical Protestantism with it's heavy-fisted fascism), saved only through Jesus, all other religions are false and the rest of the script.

Also, inclusivity negates having to follow a single ideology or get your head blown off (such as Evangelical and Baptist Protestantism) because it means that by it's very nature it must respect other views (which is not something you exclusivist Protestants are willing to do, hence severing your ability to entertain rational discourse)
Matthew 7:13-14
The Narrow Way

13 “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."

You use as accusation against "Protestant" what Jesus himself said.
 
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The fact that you claim to know all about the pagan symbology and practices of Catholicism and still somehow claim that that they are closer to following the teachings of Jesus without taking into account that the early "Catholic" church itself was vastly different to the RCC throughout latter history and today is . . . Man. I don't know what to say anymore. You're obviously a very intelligent guy. But here comes another thread that involves Christianity. I really used to have some respect for your claim to seek an unbiased intellectual and philosophical discourse (seeing as how you kept talking on about the lack of respect, abundance of arrogance and non-existent open-mindedness that you detest about Christians) . . . But now I'm seriously thinking you use that claim to mask YOUR polemic against Christianity and Christians while crying victim and then painting Christians as the bullies. Why not a thread about your discovery of the beauty and history of Buddhism? Or inviting Buddhists on this forum to share their perspective? Why not a thread on what drew you to Islam or about checking the misconceptions you think people make about your religion. Why is the nexus of your time and energy here always directed at trying to tear down Christianity instead of building up other faiths if you feel the way you do about them being underrepresented? I don't understand it and I'm disappointed tbh. There are Christians here who have their beliefs, are content with their walk and don't feel the need to forcefully proselytize anyone and will share their opinions when prompted. But the way you speak on all is tantamount to hatred regardless of which "kind" of Christian tried to engage with you.
Why do you exaggerate things so much?
 

Lisa

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Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.



Hence Christianity (especially Evangelical Protestantism with it's heavy-fisted fascism), saved only through Jesus, all other religions are false and the rest of the script.

Also, inclusivity negates having to follow a single ideology or get your head blown off (such as Evangelical and Baptist Protestantism) because it means that by it's very nature it must respect other views (which is not something you exclusivist Protestants are willing to do, hence severing your ability to entertain rational discourse)
There will be a one world religion except for Christians, real Christians won’t be a part of that.

You got it, all other religions are false. They were created to confuse people and draw them away from salvation in Jesus only.

I respect that people have other views, I just know they are wrong.
 
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You use as accusation against "Protestant" what Jesus himself said.
No, that was my response against her accusation about "one world religion", that in fact is very much what Jesus is saying if you want to take him literally. If you're not open to taking Jesus literally, then perhaps you should switch from Protestant to Catholic? :)
 
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I respect that people have other views, I just know they are wrong.
So you mean that you are more correct in your own relative, subjective interpretation of things than the tradition that brought you the texts you use to make such relative, subjective and arbitrary interpretations to base your worldview? right..
 

Lisa

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So you mean that you are more correct in your own relative, subjective interpretation of things than the tradition that brought you the texts you use to make such relative, subjective and arbitrary interpretations to base your worldview? right..
I am correct according to the Bible, that’s where I get my theology. And that’s where I learned catholicism isn’t Christianity. Their teachings don’t match what the Bible says.

If they really did bring those texts...they should have changed them to reflect what they teach. They only deceive people as to what the Bible says they don’t go by it. But they can’t change God’s word without having a true Bible. Sort of like how on the OT there were many false prophets around but God always had a true prophet of His and they were always the people no one wanted to listen to..go figure.
 

Lisa

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Why not? I thought Jesus was the savior of the world?
We won’t bow down to any other God and will be martyred for it.

Jesus is the savior of the world. Anyone can believe on Him and be saved from the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.
 
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I am correct according to the Bible, that’s where I get my theology.
So you're telling me that you know what the Bible teaches better than anyone else? who taught you to interpret the Bible? what else do you take symbolically? (aside from eating Jesus' flesh) what do you take literally? what applies to you and what is historical? how do you determine these things? does the Bible teach your position?
 

Robin

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Why do you exaggerate things so much?
That, is what I like to call a cop-out. And that statement from a man who has created a handful of threads within one week. Care to respond to anything I actually said?
No, that was my response against her accusation about "one world religion", that in fact is very much what Jesus is saying if you want to take him literally. If you're not open to taking Jesus literally, then perhaps you should switch from Protestant to Catholic? :)
No, because it's very obvious that when Jesus mentions he is the "only way", he is making a truth claim. That has nothing to do with a one-world religious order (which I dont even recall Jesus mentioning) especially not in the vein of eschatology and you know this, you're just being facetious. And unlike you, I believe that any objective spiritual reality must exist outside of the conveniently packaged categories we've constructed -protestant this, catholic that. All neat labels that enforce a collective identity instead of focusing on one's personal spiritual walk with God. Look, you clearly have an axe to grind with Christians. Go ahead, have at it. I really don't have the time or energy for it right now. Have a good day.
 
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We won’t bow down to any other God and will be martyred for it.
Historically thousands have been martyred for not agreeing over interpretations of the Bible or not even following the same religious tradition. You're saying anything that Christians themselves don't have on their hands collectively.

Jesus is the savior of the world.
I thought you had stated this before:

There will be a one world religion except for Christians, real Christians won’t be a part of that.
Seems now that you think Jesus isn't the savior of the world.



Anyone can believe on Him and be saved from the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.
And you agree with this idea?
 

Lisa

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So you're telling me that you know what the Bible teaches better than anyone else? who taught you to interpret the Bible? what else do you take symbolically? (aside from eating Jesus' flesh) what do you take literally? what applies to you and what is historical? how do you determine these things? does the Bible teach your position?
I’m telling you that I’ve read and studied the Bible but more importantly I have the Holy Spirit and He teaches me.

You keep avoiding my comment...if it was literal, why didn’t the disciples chop up Jesus right there and then and eat Him and drink His blood...seriously.
 
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That, is what I like to call a cop-out. And that statement from a man who has created a handful of threads within one week. Care to respond to anything I actually said?
Not really because you are just being emotional there. If you encountered me more level-headed, I would have more room for comment there.

No, because it's very obvious that when Jesus mentions he is the "only way", he is making a truth claim.
Or more specifically; is attributed to have, and under certain interpretations, to have made such truth claims which can further be interpreted in the aforementioned context.

Look, you clearly have an axe to grind with Christians. Go ahead, have at it. I really don't have the time or energy for it right now. Have a good day.
Not even that, I'm just examining fallacies that the protestants uphold here.
 

Lisa

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Historically thousands have been martyred for not agreeing over interpretations of the Bible or not even following the same religious tradition. You're saying anything that Christians themselves don't have on their hands collectively.



I thought you had stated this before:



Seems now that you think Jesus isn't the savior of the world.





And you agree with this idea?
There is one God and a real Christian won’t bow down/worship any false God. There will be a one world religion and people will bow/worship before that god.

Jesus is the savior of the world, anyone can believe in Him and be saved but there are false religions that people can and do believe rather than believing on Jesus.

Yes, I agree that the Bible says that there is a lake of fire where sinners will be thrown and there is weeping and gnashing of teeth there.
 
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There is one God and a real Christian won’t bow down/worship any false God. There will be a one world religion and people will bow/worship before that god.
How do you know Jesus isn't that false god? afterall, the Bible vehemently speaks against idolatry.

Jesus is the savior of the world, anyone can believe in Him and be saved but there are false religions that people can and do believe rather than believing on Jesus.
Why Jesus instead of just through God? millions of people believe in God but not Jesus. Why are people who believe in God damned to hell?

Yes, I agree that the Bible says that there is a lake of fire where sinners will be thrown and there is weeping and gnashing of teeth there.
What is your process for determining if that is metaphor or not?
 

Robin

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Not really because you are just being emotional there. If you encountered me more level-headed, I would have more room for comment there.
Questions to your intentions are not driven by emotion. They're driven by curiosity to better understand why you do what you do. But I get why you might not want to answer them.

Or more specifically; is attributed to have, and under certain interpretations, to have made such truth claims which can further be interpreted in the aforementioned context.
John 14
The Way, the Truth, and the Life

14 “Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; thatwhere I am, there you may be also. 4 And where I go you know, and the way you know.”

5 Thomas said to Him, “Lord, we do not know where You are going, and how can we know the way?”

6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Full context. Feel free to offer up any interpretation outside of the straightforward reading.

Not even that, I'm just examining fallacies that the protestants uphold here.
Right lol. That's why you leave certain arguments unfinished and change the goalposts.
 

Lisa

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How do you know Jesus isn't that false god? afterall, the Bible vehemently speaks against idolatry.
And your point is what?

Why Jesus instead of just through God? millions of people believe in God but not Jesus. Why are people who believe in God damned to hell?
Jesus came from heaven and took our punishment for sin, He was the once for all sacrifice for sin.

What is your process for determining if that is metaphor or not?
The Bible says people will be thrown into the lake of fire...sounds real to me. Jesus does so people who believe on Him won’t have to be thrown into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.
 
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And your point is what?
Clearly the Old Testament warns against taking idols (such as men) as God, idolatry is a core message condemned by the Old Testament.

Jesus came from heaven and took our punishment for sin, He was the once for all sacrifice for sin.
And you believe that makes sense? in light of that salvation through God-alone?

sounds real to me.
So that's your process for determining how you interpret your inherited texts? right...
 
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