Human Beings Are The Fallen Angels Who Fought Alongside Lucifer

Robin

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Strong's Concordance
ekklésia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekklésia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Definition: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Usage: an assembly, congregation, church; the Church, the whole body of Christian believers.
HELPS Word-studies
1577 ekklēsía(from 1537 /ek, "out from and to" and 2564 /kaléō, "to call") – properly, people called out from the world and to God, the outcome being the Church (the mystical body of Christ) – i.e. the universal (total) body of believers whom God calls out from the world and into His eternal kingdom.

[The English word "church" comes from the Greek word kyriakos, "belonging to the Lord" (kyrios). 1577 /ekklēsía ("church") is the root of the terms "ecclesiology" and "ecclesiastical."]

You are using distraction tactics via word definition games.
It doesn't matter whether the word is congregation, meeting, assembly, church or any other word - it refers to the place of worship and preaching.

Throughout your entries you have suggested that the bible said women were to be silent at all times, to never be in any type of leadership and to be subservient to men in all types of situations and settings. You were proved wrong.

P.S. Do you know who Jediknight is? I have found his blog.
Hebrews 10:24-25
"And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, 25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching."

Matthew 18:20
"For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.”

It's the way that people naturally tend to choose, despite some people having tried to turn it around (Is that what you are trying to do?) which is why it's called a "clue". It means look around you and then, if you want, you could "see" the clues and learn something, instead of trying to fight against it (and learn nothing). When girls wear pink clothing there's nothing wrong with it, but it does not suit men. Your own eyesight tells you this, or at least, it should.
I am sorry but really this is not an argument. You cannot make a spiritual point using phrases like "it's the way people naturally tend to choose" when that preference is very subjective and changes according to what's in fashion at that time period.
 






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A Freeman

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Strong's Concordance
ekklésia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekklésia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Definition: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Usage: an assembly, congregation, church; the Church, the whole body of Christian believers.
HELPS Word-studies
1577 ekklēsía(from 1537 /ek, "out from and to" and 2564 /kaléō, "to call") – properly, people called out from the world and to God, the outcome being the Church (the mystical body of Christ) – i.e. the universal (total) body of believers whom God calls out from the world and into His eternal kingdom.

[The English word "church" comes from the Greek word kyriakos, "belonging to the Lord" (kyrios). 1577 /ekklēsía ("church") is the root of the terms "ecclesiology" and "ecclesiastical."]

You are using distraction tactics via word definition games.
It doesn't matter whether the word is congregation, meeting, assembly, church or any other word - it refers to the place of worship and preaching.

Throughout your entries you have suggested that the bible said women were to be silent at all times, to never be in any type of leadership and to be subservient to men in all types of situations and settings. You were proved wrong.

P.S. Do you know who Jediknight is? I have found his blog.
In what you posted it states the following:

The English word "church" comes from the Greek word kyriakos, "belonging to the Lord" (kyrios).

It then tries to REDEFINE where the word "church" came from as "ecclesia/ekklēsía ("church") is the root of the terms "ecclesiology" and "ecclesiastical."

So you have not only given us the proof that the word for "church" in Greek is NOT "ecclesia/ekklēsía , but also that the churches redefined "ecclesia/ekklēsía to mean "church" to continue their evil existence, in contradiction to the rest of Scriptures.

Matthew 6:5-8
6:5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt NOT be as the hypocrites [ARE]: for they love to pray standing in the churches and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward (they have been seen by men, but God will not answer them).
6:6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and WHEN THOU HAST SHUT THY DOOR, pray to thy Father in private (Enoch 56:5; Sura 7:55); and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly (by answering you).
6:7 But when ye pray, use NOT vain repetitions, as the heathen [DO]: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
6:8 Be NOT ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, BEFORE ye ask Him.

Acts 7:48 Howbeit the Most High dwelleth NOT in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,

Acts 17:24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that He is Lord of heaven and Earth, dwelleth NOT in temples made with hands;


Temples = Churches = Synagogues = Mosques = places of worship for organized religions.

If God does NOT dwell there, then who exactly are they worshiping? SATAN.

2 Corinthians 11:13-15
11:13 For such [are] false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the Apostles of Christ.
11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
11:15 Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

It is God Who has said -- through His Prophets -- He does NOT dwell in temples made with human hands, just as it is God Who has said -- through His Prophets -- that the head of woman is the man.

And God, despite your satanic claims to the contrary, is NEVER WRONG.

Every one of God's Messengers throughout the ages has been attacked, just as you and others are doing on this forum whenever His Word is shared. Learn some humility while there's still time to do so. For your benefit and for everyone else as well.

God Bless.
 






A Freeman

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Matthew 18:20 For where two OR three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

Two or three means two or three; it does NOT mean dozens, or hundreds or thousands like there are in churches, temples, synagogues, mosques. It means two OR three (which is why it doesn't say "two or more").

Likewise, there is ONE Teacher (Matthew 23:10), ONE Mediator (1 Timothy 2:5), ONE Good Shepherd (John 10:11-14) and ONE High-Priest for ALL-time (Hebrews 6:20): Christ. ONE MEANS ONE; it does NOT mean hundreds of thousands of priests, pastors, etc.

When the Bible says "one" it MEANS "one".
When the Bible says "two" it MEANS "two".
When the Bible says "three" it MEANS "three".

When Satan comes along and tries to con you into thinking these numbers mean something other than what they really say and mean, DON'T BELIEVE HIM.
 






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I am sorry but really this is not an argument. You cannot make a spiritual point using phrases like "it's the way people naturally tend to choose" when that preference is very subjective and changes according to what's in fashion at that time period.
Nothing that happens here is by coincidence or by chance, everything that happens in life happens for a reason. If you're unable to see it, then I'm not sure if there is anything more I can say to try and help you to and especially, since you seem to really want it to be the opposite way (why ?). It's up to you to see it but first of all you have to be open to being shown. If you're not open to being shown, then you will never be able to be shown it as in that case, being shown would be a violation of your Free-will and our Free-will choice (which includes whether we wish to be able to "see" the truth about something, or not) is always respected. So, it comes down to choosing if you want to be able to see it or not, in the end.
 






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@Robin

Perhaps this article written from a female perspective may prove to be more helpful. Pink hat navigators descend on DC: Women Rule

 






Robin

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Nothing that happens here is by coincidence or by chance, everything that happens in life happens for a reason. If you're unable to see it, then I'm not sure if there is anything more I can say to try and help you to and especially, since you seem to really want it to be the opposite way (why ?). It's up to you to see it but first of all you have to be open to being shown. If you're not open to being shown, then you will never be able to be shown it as in that case, being shown would be a violation of your Free-will and our Free-will choice (which includes whether we wish to be able to "see" the truth about something, or not) is always respected. So, it comes down to choosing if you want to be able to see it or not, in the end.
@Robin

Perhaps this article written from a female perspective, might prove to be more helpful. Pink hat navigators descend on DC

But this logic about things always "being this way" doesn't apply when I bring up any of the other things I did in my previous posts to you? This is the problem. Because your logic is inconsistent. You want to talk about carnality but when I bring up patterns of male carnality being greater than that of females, you balk. You talk of spirituality and not focusing on the world but then bring up things like nursery rhymes and the colour of the inside of a woman (a completely idiotic response considering ALL human beings have pink tissue in their bodies) as proof of gendered colour distinctions. How does that make sense?
 






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But this logic about things always "being this way" doesn't apply when I bring up any of the other things I did in my previous posts to you? This is the problem. Because your logic is inconsistent. You want to talk about carnality but when I bring up patterns of male carnality being greater than that of females, you balk. You talk of spirituality and not focusing on the world but then bring up things like nursery rhymes and the colour of the inside of a woman (a completely idiotic response considering ALL human beings have pink tissue in their bodies) as proof of gendered colour distinctions. How does that make sense?
Wait a minute. As I recall the conversation, it was you who brought up and wanted to talk about carnality not me and I then said that I didn't wish to talk about it. You are the one who insists on wanting to keep nagging about it. I told you I'll pass, when you started it, and quoted what Scripture has to say on the subject, which should have been enough and end of story by putting all of that into it's proper perspective. But, you didn't seem to want to hear it.

In the Pink Hat Navigators article linked to above, it says:

'It has become commonplace for these “anarchy against God” guilds to scoff at Scripture. To some protesters, you can’t bring up “religion”. While there are many reasons this is true, nothing rings truer than the fact that the Holy Bible puts women in their place – and most women simply don’t want to hear it.'
 






Robin

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Wait a minute. As I recall the conversation, it was you who brought up and wanted to talk about carnality not me and I then said that I didn't wish to talk about it. You are the one who insists on wanting to keep nagging about it. I told you I'll pass, when you started it, and quoted what Scripture has to say on the subject, which should have been enough and end of story by putting all of that into it's proper perspective. But, you didn't seem to want to hear it.

In the Pink Hat Navigators article linked to above, it says:

'It has become commonplace for these “anarchy against God” guilds to scoff at Scripture. To some protesters, you can’t bring up “religion”. While there are many reasons this is true, nothing rings truer than the fact that the Holy Bible puts women in their place – and most women simply don’t want to hear it.'
I brought it up because it was a large part of the post YOU made. You and several others have made a point in talking about it. You didn't wish to talk about it because this particular subject exposes the error of your doctrine and you know it. I accept now that you just don't want to acknowledge the flaws that shouldn't exist in a doctrine supposedly given by the son of God.
 






Robin

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A further quote, for this great article that was written by a woman :-

'...While the Bible tells us women are not equal to men, it does not tell us God loves women less. What one must understand is we are at war – it’s a spiritual war that started in the Heavens before the world was. We were cast here to Earth, this reform school, with our good buddy Lucifer, to prove we will not listen to him who is “d-evil” anymore and that we would follow God (good). Thus, gender represents a hierarchy of souls within the bodies – where souls in men’s bodies outrank the souls in women bodies. For a detailed understanding of this read The Way home or face The Fire.

You have to decide what army you want to be in. If your soul was put in a female body, there is a reason and lessons your soul must learn. Deciding to be manly in a female body isn’t learning anything from your Creator. It would be the same as a sergeant in the army demanding, and expecting, to be the general after a day or so. The first rank in the army is private; and the disciple training is also private (Matt. 6:5-6) and can be difficult, but narrow and strait is The Way.

Souls in female bodies must learn humility and to give up control to a higher power.

upside-down-world

This means accepting authority from someone who outranks you. Thus, can you prove you can be a female and all that entails? Or are you going to do it your Satanically inspired way and end up with Satan in Hellfire for eternity? Remember, the body your soul is in is quite temporary.

Turning the world upside down was not your task from God.

Acts 17:6 And when they found them not, they drew Jason and certain brethren unto the rulers of the city, crying, These that have turned the world upside down are come here also;

God loves His daughters and He has told us how to be lovely, quiet, supportive, caring and FEMININE. If we could concentrate on How He Wants us to be, our world would be far simpler. We cannot be female and male at the same time. If God’s army would be in the correct rank and file order, we’d stand a better chance of winning the war against Lucifer; but instead we have followed Luciferians who dominate us in worldly positions of power and control. If you are in a female body, wouldn’t you rather be a daughter in God’s army than a manly-mutant in Satan’s?

The Bible gives us examples of women who followed God’s orders, and who gained favor in His eyes, like Sarah, Rebecca, Esther and Mary. Their lives were not without punishments, but they had to be taught, refined. Are you willing to be taught by The Master? Women can be warriors for God. Joan of Arc and Teia Tephi are examples. But they warred in order to facilitate His Will, not their own. And His Will is for us to reinstate His Law – His Commandments, Judgements and Statutes – but we should never forget our place or rank.

If you want to know how to be more graceful, read “The Different Effects of Nature and Grace”.

If you need guidance on how to be a wife, read “This is a Great Mystery: Marriage Guide”.

Humility is a must-learn lesson for souls in female bodies; and it can’t be stressed enough. Some women fight for The Lord; and they try to use their experience to help others, like described in “Is Your World Turning Upside Down” which is a story of one woman’s failures and successes.

You can also read, study and practice The 13 Aspects of Humility, good for spiritual growth for all souls. It is featured below and will conclude this article.

Men, you are not doing your female partners any good by letting them rule the roost; because you are failing your own set of tests and letting them turn the world upside-down...'

Forgive me if I don't take anything seriously when it stems from a doctrine that needs to rely on fear tactics and insults when it's representatives fail to provide decent counter arguments. Ironically, this is commonplace in mainstream religious systems attempting to proselytize unbelievers. One thing that could up your credibility though -provide your leader's linguistic qualifications and actual scripture talking about the colour situation. That would be a start.
 






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A further quote/extract from this great article, which was written by a woman :-

'...While the Bible tells us women are not equal to men, it does not tell us God loves women less. What one must understand is we are at war – it’s a spiritual war that started in the Heavens before the world was. We were cast here to Earth, this reform school, with our good buddy Lucifer, to prove we will not listen to him who is “d-evil” anymore and that we would follow God (good). Thus, gender represents a hierarchy of souls within the bodies – where souls in men’s bodies outrank the souls in women bodies. For a detailed understanding of this read The Way home or face The Fire.

You have to decide what army you want to be in. If your soul was put in a female body, there is a reason and lessons your soul must learn. Deciding to be manly in a female body isn’t learning anything from your Creator. It would be the same as a sergeant in the army demanding, and expecting, to be the general after a day or so. The first rank in the army is private; and the disciple training is also private (Matt. 6:5-6) and can be difficult, but narrow and strait is The Way.

Souls in female bodies must learn humility and to give up control to a higher power.

upside-down-world

This means accepting authority from someone who outranks you. Thus, can you prove you can be a female and all that entails? Or are you going to do it your Satanically inspired way and end up with Satan in Hellfire for eternity? Remember, the body your soul is in is quite temporary.

Turning the world upside down was not your task from God.

Acts 17:6 And when they found them not, they drew Jason and certain brethren unto the rulers of the city, crying, These that have turned the world upside down are come here also;

God loves His daughters and He has told us how to be lovely, quiet, supportive, caring and FEMININE. If we could concentrate on How He Wants us to be, our world would be far simpler. We cannot be female and male at the same time. If God’s army would be in the correct rank and file order, we’d stand a better chance of winning the war against Lucifer; but instead we have followed Luciferians who dominate us in worldly positions of power and control. If you are in a female body, wouldn’t you rather be a daughter in God’s army than a manly-mutant in Satan’s?

The Bible gives us examples of women who followed God’s orders, and who gained favor in His eyes, like Sarah, Rebecca, Esther and Mary. Their lives were not without punishments, but they had to be taught, refined. Are you willing to be taught by The Master? Women can be warriors for God. Joan of Arc and Teia Tephi are examples. But they warred in order to facilitate His Will, not their own. And His Will is for us to reinstate His Law – His Commandments, Judgements and Statutes – but we should never forget our place or rank.

If you want to know how to be more graceful, read “The Different Effects of Nature and Grace”.

If you need guidance on how to be a wife, read “This is a Great Mystery: Marriage Guide”.

Humility is a must-learn lesson for souls in female bodies; and it can’t be stressed enough. Some women fight for The Lord; and they try to use their experience to help others, like described in “Is Your World Turning Upside Down” which is a story of one woman’s failures and successes.

You can also read, study and practice The 13 Aspects of Humility, good for spiritual growth for all souls. It is featured below and will conclude this article.

Men, you are not doing your female partners any good by letting them rule the roost; because you are failing your own set of tests and letting them turn the world upside-down...'

 






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Forgive me if I don't take anything seriously when it stems from a doctrine that needs to rely on fear tactics and insults when it's representatives fail to provide decent counter arguments. Ironically, this is commonplace in mainstream religious systems attempting to proselytize unbelievers. One thing that could up your credibility though -provide your leader's linguistic qualifications and actual scripture talking about the colour situation. That would be a start.
Again, the observation regarding colour affinity is obvious to those with the eyes to see it.

You've asked several questions that I and others have attempted to answer for you, so, if you now don't mind me asking you, what is your interpretation of the following verse and what it is saying, please?

1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God.
 






Robin

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Again, the observation regarding colour affinity is obvious to those with the eyes to see it.

You've asked several questions that I and others have attempted to answer for you, so, if you now don't mind me asking you, what is your interpretation of the following verse and what it is saying, please?

1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God.
There is a LOT of study that has gone into this which I could share with you as the source language and it's nuances are incredibly fascinating. Would you like me to share it with you? I only ask because it's quite a lot to digest.

Also, with regards to the colour affinity thing, do you have anything more concrete than that? You might wanna look up the history of the colour red then.
 






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There is a LOT of study that has gone into this which I could share with you as the source language and it's nuances are incredibly fascinating. Would you like me to share it with you? I only ask because it's quite a lot to digest.

Also, with regards to the colour affinity thing, do you have anything more concrete than that? You might wanna look up the history of the colour red then.
But why would anyone need to go to such great lengths in order to look for nuances in the source language of a simple verse such as this, which is a very straightforward statement? Unless they are not satisfied with it's meaning and want to look for ways they could possibly make it say something other than what it is? Besides, that's not really giving an answer. What I'm interested in knowing what does 1 Corinthians 11:3 mean to you, and do you accept it or reject it as doctrine?

It's up to you if you wish to post additional material, but again the question is the same. What exactly is it that would prompt someone to want to look for nuances in the language? Other than the simple fact, that you really feel like you cannot accept what it is saying?
 






Robin

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But why would anyone need to go to such great lengths in order to look for nuances in the source language of a simple verse such as this, which is a very straightforward statement? Unless they are not satisfied with it's meaning and want to look for ways they could possibly make it say something other than what it is? Besides, that's not really giving an answer. What I'm interested in knowing what does 1 Corinthians 11:3 mean to you, and do you accept it or reject it as doctrine?

It's up to you if you wish to post additional material, but again the question is the same. What exactly is it that would prompt someone to want to look for nuances in the language? Other than the simple fact, that you really feel like you cannot accept what it is saying?
Rich coming from someone who based most of their own beliefs on INTERPRETATIONS and not the simple straightforward reading. Selective truths. You can choose to not believe it but the bible wasn't written in English . . . And if you know anything about Greek then you'll know that it's a far more complex language that often struggles to find accurate English realizations. Is it more important to listen to someone's personal interpretation or what the scripture says in it's original language?
 






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Rich coming from someone who based most of their own beliefs on INTERPRETATIONS and not the simple straightforward reading. Selective truths. You can choose to not believe it but the bible wasn't written in English . . . And if you know anything about Greek then you'll know that it's a far more complex language that often struggles to find accurate English realizations. Is it more important to listen to someone's personal interpretation or what the scripture says in it's original language?
Greek text analysis:
Comments?
 






Robin

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Thanks for the link. Using that, we start here:

κεφαλὴ
kephalē

The Greek word translated as "head". To discount Greco-Roman background (1 Cor. as a whole and 1 Cor. 11 in particular), lexicography and word semantics is to be intellectually dishonest about the book you hold as scripture. The literature on "head" (Greek, kephale) is immense! There were many debates for dozens of years among scholars, grammarians and lexicographers.
Kephale has various meanings. In my words, it has subtle nuances that are hard to represent in English because they overlap. So, it's hard to detect what Paul had in mind when he used it in Ephesians and 1 Cor 11.
If you'd feel more comfortable taking a man's research over my word, look up Anthony C. Thiselton, The First Epistle to the Corinthians: A Commentary on the Greek Text (New International Greek Testament Commentary; Grand Rapids, MI: W.B. Eerdmans, 2000).

Thiselton explains in length that the English "head" is an acceptable translation, but that it might wrongly communicate the idea of "leader" or "authority", as in the woman is subordinate to the man. But, in context, that doesn't seem to be Paul's point. Paul's point seems to be sex differentiation and position--i.e., the man was created before the woman and thus has prominence. The man is "first" and the woman is "second". In some sense, it's equally true that the woman was taken out of the man ("source") as Paul says elsewhere, and so man first and woman second.

This makes sense considering the context of the rest of this passage revolves around traditional head coverings for men vs women and Paul's added:

"Nevertheless, neither is man independent of woman, nor woman independent of man, in the Lord. 12 For as woman came from man, even so man also comes through woman; but all things are from God."

This strengthens the idea of the scripture revolving around order and structure. Nowhere in the bible is it said that every woman is to submit to every man. If you refer to the scripture about wives and husbands, note that if that is to mean all women are to submit to all men, then the natural extrapolation is that every man should love every woman because that was the reciprocal command. Why would God instruct every woman to obey every man when that would include unbelievers, criminals, abusers and sinners?
 






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Thanks for the link.
You're welcome.
Why would God instruct every woman to obey every man when that would include unbelievers, criminals, abusers and sinners?
He does not. Even in the case of her husband (if he is trying to get her to do wrong).

TWH 3:143 That is why a woman should love; honour; cherish and OBEY her husband (unless he is trying
to get her to do wrong), through good and bad times (and not leave a sinking-ship - but help with the
bailing-out), until death, and learn from him, and help and encourage him to be good.
 






Robin

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You're welcome.
Comments?

He does not. Even in the case of her husband (if he is trying to get her to do wrong).
But I thought you guys kept bolding every scripture where a woman was told to be obedient to men?

TWH 3:143 That is why a woman should love; honour; cherish and OBEY her husband (unless he is trying
to get her to do wrong), through good and bad times (and not leave a sinking-ship - but help with the
bailing-out), until death, and learn from him, and help and encourage him to be good.
This in scripture or found somewhere else? Because Paul's advice was for wives to submit and obey their husbands and for husbands to love and cherish their wives.
 






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I won't speak for others, but personally find no disagreement with this:
This strengthens the idea of the scripture revolving around order and structure.
As that is exactly what we believe the Scripture is saying as well and why it is saying it. That's the whole reason, because as it said in the article, that I posted for you earlier on, we are at war. So, God is showing us the optimal order and structure, because He knows what our situation is. It's shown to us for our benefit. God, knowing everything about our situation wants us to be able to succeed, so the structure and order is not just to make it as easy as possible for us, it's actually vital for our survival because it is the ONLY way that will work. It is Intelligence and it is help, that we need because we are in a war.
But I thought you guys kept bolding every scripture where a woman was told to be obedient to men?
Not if a man (any man) is trying to get you to do wrong. Because, that then is the right time for you to not obey him.

The Scripture quotes, as you know, do not only talk about the women and how their behaviour should be, but it also talks about the men and how they should behave. But if a man is not following that, and wants you to do something that you know is wrong, then that is the correct time when you should not obey him, because God is telling you that whatever it is he wants you to do, is wrong and that it would be wrong for you.
This in scripture or found somewhere else? Because Paul's advice was for wives to submit and obey their husbands and for husbands to love and cherish their wives.
If we look, then I'm sure we should be able to find an example (or examples).

This guidance is not there in order to give men a blank check to be able to abuse or mistreat women.

It's gives the general structure to believers on how we should be organizing ourselves, which we should realise, is God doing all of this because He wants to help us. He wants to see us succeed (like with the previously given example, of the ship). He knows the situation, and what will work and what won't, so He gave it to us. But WE have to choose to trust it (and therefore show we are trusting Him) and use it.

Satan (the Enemy) on the other hand tries to con-vince people that God is wrong and that it won't work, but he is the Liar, and so, that is just another lie.
 






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