How Do You Get Sins Erased From Your Record?

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Most of us have had experiences with God so its not as simple as picking up a book and deciding its true.
That's awesome, and I wouldn't discount your experiences whatsoever. I just find it highly dubious that this god (or gods plural perhaps, it's kinda ambiguous if you ask me) of the ancient hebrew tribe claims to be the creator of the entire universe. I'm sure that the stories reflect some true events that are a part of our human history and anthropology, but this god or gods could possibly be a any number or variety of entities attempting to control early humans, and maybe isn't something to actually be worshiping. Just my two cents. I think I will butt out of this topic now, have fun though. (obviously I'm not an atheist or hard skeptic, by the way)
 

Red Sky at Morning

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@Faker He-Man - Do you think that if God existed, and if the people he created had been separated from him by sin, he would wait till our culture was really advanced before bothering to reveal himself?
 

floss

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What part of Islam doesn't make sense to you? sucking of penises.
References of falsephet regarding sucking penises... :eek::eek::eek:

Hadith Number 16245, Volume Title: “The Sayings of the Syrians,” Chapter Title: “Hadith of Mu’awiya Ibn Abu Sufyan”:

“I saw the prophet – pbuh – sucking on the tongue or the lips of Al-Hassan son of Ali, may the prayers of Allah be upon him. For no tongue or lips that the prophet sucked on will be tormented (by hell fire)

He (the Prophet) lift up his (al Hassan’s) shirt and kissed his (little) penis..”
روى أنه صلى الله عليه و سلم قبل زبيبة الحسن أو الحسين
He (the prophet) kissed the (little) penis of al Hassan or al Husein
رأيت النبي صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
He (the prophet) put Husein’s legs apart and kissed his (little) penis

Another Hadith. Majma al-Zawa’id, Ali ibn Abu Bakr al-Haythami, 299/9 مجمع الزوائد لعلي بن أبى بكر الهيثمي

رأيت رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
رواه الطبراني و إسناده حسن
translated into English: “I saw the Messenger of Allah pbuh putting Husein’s legs apart and kissing his (little) penis.”

Related by Al-Tabarani and it’s authentication is fully validated by Islamic scholars.
 

rainerann

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The difference is that your intention after you sin has to be genuine. You can't really just sin and think ok I'm going to repent extra hard tonight and then do it all again. God wants us to believe in ourselves as much as he believes in us so the Islamic belief is to achieve a state where you abstain from sin as much as you can. The higher your faith in God the more you abstain from serious sins. Of course we're prone to general sins hence why we are always asked to repent and ponder on our actions, in order to learn and become better people.

Deeds are weighed on scales on judgement day. A scale for the good deeds and a scale for the bad. Islam is about achieving that balance and making sure you have some enough good to outweigh the bad. We are also encouraged to repent often because God may just have mercy on us even if we were bad people.
No, I don't think you caught what I was trying to illustrate. In either case I described a situation where the person repented genuinely. The first example I gave was where the person repented for acting in such a way because they thought they could just ask for forgiveness afterward.

Do you see the difference? I am not saying this person repents of what they did and is forgiven because we are forgiven for sin. I am saying they repent because they did something like this and because they were excusing sin because they were planning to repent. Therefore, this is genuine.

They are both genuine and they both receive the same response. They both receive the gift of forgiveness when the confession is made. Not according to some differing timeline where you would have to abstain from this behavior and not because someone repents extra hard.

This is because creating differing timelines to repent of sin requires depending on other fallible human beings to continually be responsible for determining these requirements as new situations arise, which leads to oppression.

Therefore, in Christianity, we are not able to differentiate between each other based on the penalty for sin. We are never given the authority to justify punishment because they have committed sin. We can tell no one that God is punishing them for this. So spiritual consequences are removed from the legal system and the opportunity for someone to oppress others with this sort of spiritual authority is removed. This does not mean a legal system cannot be established, but spiritual authority is not given to this legal system.

Therefore, no one can determine that you deserve a penalty because God is punishing your sin. This is why Christianity does not seek to establish a theocracy. We cannot punish someone and justify this behavior as spiritual punishment for sin because establishing a legal system is always imperfect and requires modifications over time that can vary in the integrity of their creation.
 
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Kung Fu

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References of falsephet regarding sucking penises... :eek::eek::eek:
Related by Al-Tabarani and it’s authentication is fully validated by Islamic scholars.
Is it now?

As usual you know nothing. All you ever do is bring up hadiths which contradict the Quran or are clearly not authentic by any means. You need to stop visiting Answering-Islam or whatever other website you constantly copy and paste from without ever looking into it yourself to see if it's actually true lol. You also need to stop with the lying because there are plenty of scholars that disagree with those hadiths and are clear fabrications that never happened.

http://icraa.org/a-false-hadith-the-prophet-kissed-the-genitals-of-his-little-grandson/

Now please stop responding to me. You know nothing and all you do is copy and paste. I don't got time to fact check all the nonsense you copy and paste on here.
 
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Daciple

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Regarding:
(The)" notion of "purgatory" -- another worldly place between heaven and hell which appeared in Western Christian literature around the middle of the 12th century CE. [See on this "The Birth of Purgatory" (La Naissance du Purgatoire) by the eminent French medievalist Jacques Le Goff whose classes I was honored to attend while at the Ecole Normale Superieure in Paris.]
" As a means of recording the passage of time, the 12th century is the period from 1101 to 1200 in accordance with the Julian calendar in the Common Era."
Please note Waraqa lived before that time....
Where exactly are you pulling this information from? I ask because its wholly incorrect, Purgatory has been a thought in forms of Christianity longggggg before the 12th Century....

the Roman Catholic tradition of Purgatory as a transitional condition has a history that dates back, even before Jesus Christ, to the worldwide practice of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief, found also in Judaism,[10] which is considered the precursor of Christianity, that prayer for the deadcontributed to their afterlife purification. The same practice appears in other traditions, such as the medieval Chinese Buddhist practice of making offerings on behalf of the dead, who are said to suffer numerous trials.[6] Roman Catholic belief in after-life purification is based on the practice of praying for the dead, which is mentioned in what the Roman Catholic Church has declared to be part of Sacred Scripture,[11][12] and which was adopted by Christians from the beginning,[13] a practice that presupposes that the dead are thereby assisted between death and their entry into their final abode.[6]

Belief in after-life "temporary punishments agreeable to every one's behaviour and manners" was expressed in the early Christian work in Greek known as Josephus's Discourse to the Greeks concerning Hades, which was once attributed to Josephus (37 – c. 100) but is now believed to be by Hippolytus of Rome (170–235).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory

St. Cyprian of Carthage who lived from 200 A.D. to 258 A.D.
Mini-bio: North African; bishop; biblical scholar, martyr

"It is one thing to hope for forgiveness, and another to enter into eternal glory; one thing to be cast into prison and not to go out from thence until the last farthing is paid, and another immediately to receive the reward of faith and virtue; one thing to be tortured for sins by long-lasting pains and purged by fire, and another to have already expiated sin [here below] by martyrdom."

"It is one thing to be cast into prison not to be released until the last farthing is paid, and another thing through the ardor of faith immediately to attain to the reward."

St. Ephrem [Syrus | of Syria] who lived from 306 A.D. to 373 A.D.
Mini-bio: Syrian; deacon, hymnist, poet

"Instead of shedding useless tears over the grave, let them flow at prayers in church, for in these there is help and comfort for the dead as well as for the living." And ... "If the Jewish priests were able by their sacrifices to help those fallen in battle [2 Maccabees 12:38-45 ] , how much more will the priests of the Son of God by their Holy Sacrifice and prayers efface the sins of the departed!"

St. Basil the Great who lived from 329 A.D. to 379 A.D.
Mini-bio: Cappadocian; bishop, theologian, monk

"I consider that the active athletes of God, who have fought bravely with invisible enemies during all their life, when arrived at the end of life, shall be examined by the prince of the world, so that if they may be found to have retained either wounds after the contest, or any stains or relics of sin, they should be detained; but if they may be found without wounds and slains, as victorious and free, they would be translated by Christ to rest.

Therefore, David prays for the present and the future life."

St. Basil speaks of sin:

"that the purgatorial fire may entirely feed on and devour it."


St. Augustine of Hippo who lived from 354 A.D. - 430 A.D.

Mini-bio: North African; bishop, theologian, Doctor of the Church

St. Augustine speaks repeatedly in his writings of the doctrine of Purgatory and intercession for the dead. Forty passages in his books treat of this matter. Dogmatically the most precise statement is found in the Enchiridion (c. 109; al.c.30), which reads as follows:

During the time which intervene between the death of man and his resurrection, the soul finds itself in certain hidden places, according to each soul's merits during its life in the flesh, either enjoying rest or suffering tribulations. Neither can it be denied that the souls of the dead are granted refreshment and relief through the piety of their beloved ones on earth, whenever the sacrifice of the Mediator is offered, or alms are distributed for them. But it will benefit only those who have lived so that it can benefit them afterwards. For there is a certain manner of living which is neither so good, that after death such would no longer be needed, nor so bad, that it could no longer be of any use. When the sacrifice of the altar or alms are offered for all the departed that had been baptized, they are thank-offerings for the very good, atonements for those not very bad; for the very bad, even though they do not help the dead, they afford consolation to the living."

St. John l who lived from c. 470 A.D. - 526 A.D.
Mini-bio: Tuscan, by birth and the son of Constantius, Pope, 52th successor to St. Peter

He traces liturgical prayer for the dead back to the Apostles, nay, to the inspiration of the Holy Ghost and says:

"The Apostles knew full well that it works much good for the departed: for whenever all the people stand with hands raised in prayer, together with the whole assembly of the priests, and the tremendous Victim lies on the altar, should we not by our petitions in their behalf move the heart of God?"

and again:

"You ought to hasten to his aid, not by tears, but by prayers, alms, and offerings. For not without reason has this been introduced, not in vain do we remember the dead at the sacred mysteries, approach the altar for them, and implore the Lamb Which is present, and Which takes away the sins of the world, but in order that the dead may receive some alleviation ... Therefore we pray with confidence for the whole world, and remember the dead together with the martyrs and the confessors and priests. For we all constitute but one body, although one member is superior to another, and so it is possible that by prayer and sacrifice we may obtain full forgiveness for those whose names we mention."

St. Caesarius of Arles who lived from 470 A.D. - 543 A.D.

Mini-bio: French, Bishop, theologian, renowned as a popular preacher, wrote two monastic rules

St. Caesar, Archbishop of Arles, who presided over many councils in France, bears witness to the same doctrine in the sixth century, that Paulinius, Augustine and Jerome witnessed to in the fourth and fifth centuries. His mind is very clear on the point. He gives us not only the substance and name, but even the very manner of Purgatory. It's pains shall be severer than the greatest torments that can be imagined in this life. No one among us knows how long he many have to endure them, whether for days or months or even years.

Here are the words of St. Caesar:

"If we neither return thanks to God in tribulation, nor redeem sins with good works, we shall stay in the Purgatorial fire until the above-named small sins be consumed like wood, hay and stubble ... But some one says:

I don't mind how long I stay there if at length I shall arrive at eternal life.

Let no one say this dearest brethren, because that Purgatory fire shall be severer than any punishment that can be either thought of, or seen, or felt in this world. How can anyone know whether he is about to pass through that fire for days and months or perhaps even for years?"

So by the sixth century, the word "Purgatory" was a well-known word; nevertheless today some of our separated brethren falsely believe it is an invention of the Church.

http://www.helpersoftheholysouls.com/purgatory_corner/FirstChristiansOnPurgatory.htm

What you quoted above is the fact that it wasnt considered an offical doctrine until the 12 Century being confirmed by the Council of Trent, as stated in the Wiki Article referenced before hand:

While use of the word "Purgatory" (in Latin purgatorium) as a noun appeared perhaps only between 1160 and 1180, giving rise to the idea of purgatory as a place[8] (what Jacques Le Goff called the "birth" of purgatory),[9]

So yes the concept of Purgatory was understood and expressed by Catholics for centuries before Muhammad and Waraqa lived, again I dont necessarily believe Waraqa was a Catholic but I now see another point in possible favor of it because I am completely sure that he influenced Muhammad in the creation of Islam, as was discussed in another thread:

https://vigilantcitizenforums.com/threads/who-was-jesus.567/page-9#post-28453

https://vigilantcitizenforums.com/threads/who-was-jesus.567/page-14#post-29348

There is a discussion there concerning the information about his belief system, which now I believe he would have spoken to Muhammad about Purgatory because regardless of the label of the idea, the concept of the dead going to a place to burn off their Sins or Bad Deeds before they enter Heaven is the literal ideology of Purgatory, which as I have shown existed well before Muhammad..
 

Daciple

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Listen, there is no place that people wait. You either go hell or heaven. Stop trying to redefine things you have no knowledge of.
What are you talking about? You literally just said that:

Hell is not eternal for someone who believed in one God, his last messenger and his final book. You are punished for what you didn't repent for, then eventually will be granted entry into a level of paradise
That is the exact concept of Purgatory, you go somewhere to burn off your Sins, it doesnt matter the name or the place you "burn your sins off" or "punished for what you didnt repent for" its the exact same idea, but if you dont want to acknowledge the fact that what you are expressing is identical to the ideology of Purgatory so be, I am sure others who hear that Islam has a place you to go in which you burn off your sins, or are punished for unrepentant sins and then eventually are let into Heaven will see the parallels to that and Purgatory...
 

Red Sky at Morning

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Colossians 2 answers the question of this thread as well as anything I can find...

8Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: 11In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
 

Daciple

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@Daciple

I'm so sick of you belittling me every time I contribute to a religious thread. English is my first language, there's no need to constantly talk down to me. I'm tired of your rude and confrontational approach to discussions and quite frankly I'm tired of reading your endless waffle

You'll be put on ignore and I'll be engaging in no further discussion with your venomous mouth

Pathetic excuse for a Christian
Look I am not trying to belittle you and I apologize if it comes across that way, I was being serious as to why I thought English was not your first language which is because many times when people tell you things you seemingly are not able to understand what they are saying. I personally dont understand why it would be such a difficult thing for you to grasp the concepts others are trying their hardest and restating many times to get across to you, just as in the post I quoted to DesertRose where you could not understand what I and like 4 other people were trying to express to you, as tho it was almost purposefully that you refused to acknowledge what was being said. I see the same thing in this thread, where someone gives you an answer and you completely misunderstand what is being said and restate it back in a completely and totally different way than was expressed and hold firm to this misunderstanding no matter how many ways and how many people restate the original idea to get you to comprehend the meaning behind it.

Here is what I am talking about:

You ask:

So how are you guys held accountable for sins you do after accepting Jesus?
Floss answers you:

You gonna get a good ass whooping, possibly death. Like parent spanking their kids.

Hebrews 12
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
Floss restates his answer in the Thread again for even more clarification:

Really, do you have a source for this, from the bible?
- Once you've become the children of God by accepting Jesus's blood atonement, death, burial, resurrection (The Gospel) and you continue to sins, there will be consequences in your life because Father God will spank you.

Hebrews 12
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
You dont seem to understand what Floss says misunderstanding him, then stating his response incorrectly and asking the same question again:

Jesus died for your sins, so as other Christians on here stated, if you sin post accepting Jesus you will still be burned in the fire.
So what's the point of Jesus dying for your sins, if you were going to sin anyway (inevitable that man will sin), since you're going to tried for your sins anyway
Which again this was addressed in my first post but you ask it another time:

But you guys believe Jesus died for your sins yet you're still punished for the sins that you do
So I give you a more definitive answer:

No we will not be burned in the fire, I dont think whomever said that understands the verse in which would have been used to even begin that ideology. This I would assume is what they are referencing:

1 Cor 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.


The Christian will not ever experience Fire in the afterlife Himself, however our works will be tested by fire, all the works we have that have been built on the foundation of Christ will remain and turned into reward, all the works built upon anything other than Christ will be burnt up and we shall suffer loss, however we will be saved.
And try and explain it for you yet another time in that same post:

So let me ask, are you capable of understanding the difference between punishment in this life aka consequences for sin as opposed to punishment or consequences in the afterlife for sin aka going to Hell?

If one sins, lets say one steals from a store, this is a sin right? This Sin is going to have a fleshly earthly consequence correct? However one can repent of this Sin and be forgiven in the afterlife correct?

Let me ask you in your Religion would Allah punish you in this lifetime via physical consequences for your Sins but then if you repent and ask forgiveness, offer you forgiveness in the afterlife? I mean we know you cant really know if you will be forgiven, but isnt it a possibility?
I apologize that my frustration was showing but this isnt the first time that I have witnessed you have 5-8 different people explain the exact same ideology to you and you still act as tho it is impossible for you to comprehend. Hence the questioning of English being your first language because THAT would make total sense, if you dont natively speak English then I could see why it may a bit difficult for someone to understand what is being said and need to have the identical question and answers restated numerous times. However if English IS your first language which apparently it is, then I personally dont grasp how you have such difficulty understanding what it is that is being said to you. The only thing I can ascertain from watching and participating in conversations with you is that this is a purposefully done action. You purposefully act as tho what is being stated is so impossible to comprehend, because see I actually do not believe you are ignorant or incompetent, I believe you must be an intelligent person so I am at a loss as to why on Earth you are not able to understand the ideologies expressed to you, very clearly, over and over again...

And of course you can choose to put me on ignore, but I feel that you are doing this as to not have to deal with answers and questions I pose to you concerning what you ask and your religion because I dont see you actually acknowledging the points I have made in this Thread, let alone others. Its much easier to act offended, label me as being venomous in my speech and pathetic than deal with the answers and questions posed to you.

Regardless if you can see it or not, I do apologize that I let my frustration boil up and if I offended you in expressing my frustration and inability to grasp why you seem to not be able to understand what I and other Christians say to you concerning Doctrine. I hope one day you do see this and forgive me, I am sorry Haich...
 

DesertRose

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This concept predates Christianity, it is actually a very ancient concept and we believe that Islam came with Prophet Adam peace be upon him. This concept may have come with every renewal of Islam and every Prophet who corrected the worship of others or even the worship of ideas among other things.

"Therefore Allah has sent 124.000 prophets and finally the last prophet, Master of the believers, Sayyidunâ Muhammad
(may Allah bless him and grant him peace) and with him the Holy Quran, as a reminder of the eternal message, a confirmation of (the messages) which came before it, a salvation for mankind and a healing and mercy for the believers."

"While use of the word "Purgatory" (in Latin purgatorium) as a noun appeared perhaps only between 1160 and 1180, giving rise to the idea of purgatory as a place[7] (what Jacques Le Goff called the "birth" of purgatory),"the Roman Catholic tradition of Purgatory as a transitional condition has a history that dates back, even before Jesus Christ, to the worldwide practice of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief, found also in Judaism,[9] which is considered the precursor of Christianity, that prayer for the dead contributed to their afterlife purification.
The same practice appears in other traditions, such as the medieval Chinese Buddhist practice of making offerings on behalf of the dead, who are said to suffer numerous trials.[5] Roman Catholic belief in after-life purification is based on the practice of praying for the dead, which is mentioned in what the Roman Catholic Church has declared to be part of Sacred Scripture,[10][11] and which was adopted by Christians from the beginning,[12] a practice that presupposes that the dead are thereby assisted between death and their entry into their final abode.[5]
Belief in after-life "temporary punishments agreeable to every one's behaviour and manners" was expressed in the early Christian work in Greek known as Josephus's Discourse to the Greeks concerning Hades, which was once attributed to Josephus (37 - c. 100) but is now believed to be by Hippolytus of Rome (170-235).[13]
https://quizlet.com/168435856/purgatory-flash-cards/

From Wikipedia:
Islam
Main article: Barzakh
Islam has a concept similar to that of purgatory in Christianity. Barzakh is thought to be a realm between paradise (Jannah) and hell (Jahannam) and according to Ghazali the place of those who go neither to hell or to heaven.[117] But because it does not purify the souls it resembles more the Christian limbo than the purgatory.

In some cases, the Islamic concept of hell may resemble the concept of Catholic doctrine of Purgatory, for Jahannam just punishes people according to their deeds, and releases them after their habits are purified. A limited duration in Jahannam is not universally accepted in Islam."

Anyway this discussion was about Salvation. (Hope you watched my video on the People of Paradise and Hell and I re-posted again because of the excellent points made).

{ And give glad tidings to those who believe and do good works, that for them are gardens beneath which flow streams. }
Quran, 2:25

Once again this is an excellent video explaining our stance:
 
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Haich

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6,645
This concept predates Christianity, it is actually a very ancient concept and we believe that Islam came with Prophet Adam peace be upon him. This concept may have come with every renewal of Islam and every Prophet who corrected the worship of others or even the worship of ideas among other things.

"Therefore Allah has sent 124.000 prophets and finally the last prophet, Master of the believers, Sayyidunâ Muhammad
(may Allah bless him and grant him peace) and with him the Holy Quran, as a reminder of the eternal message, a confirmation of (the messages) which came before it, a salvation for mankind and a healing and mercy for the believers."

"While use of the word "Purgatory" (in Latin purgatorium) as a noun appeared perhaps only between 1160 and 1180, giving rise to the idea of purgatory as a place[7] (what Jacques Le Goff called the "birth" of purgatory),"the Roman Catholic tradition of Purgatory as a transitional condition has a history that dates back, even before Jesus Christ, to the worldwide practice of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief, found also in Judaism,[9] which is considered the precursor of Christianity, that prayer for the dead contributed to their afterlife purification.
The same practice appears in other traditions, such as the medieval Chinese Buddhist practice of making offerings on behalf of the dead, who are said to suffer numerous trials.[5] Roman Catholic belief in after-life purification is based on the practice of praying for the dead, which is mentioned in what the Roman Catholic Church has declared to be part of Sacred Scripture,[10][11] and which was adopted by Christians from the beginning,[12] a practice that presupposes that the dead are thereby assisted between death and their entry into their final abode.[5]
Belief in after-life "temporary punishments agreeable to every one's behaviour and manners" was expressed in the early Christian work in Greek known as Josephus's Discourse to the Greeks concerning Hades, which was once attributed to Josephus (37 - c. 100) but is now believed to be by Hippolytus of Rome (170-235).[13]
https://quizlet.com/168435856/purgatory-flash-cards/

From Wikipedia:
Islam
Main article: Barzakh
Islam has a concept similar to that of purgatory in Christianity. Barzakh is thought to be a realm between paradise (Jannah) and hell (Jahannam) and according to Ghazali the place of those who go neither to hell or to heaven.[117] But because it does not purify the souls it resembles more the Christian limbo than the purgatory.

In some cases, the Islamic concept of hell may resemble the concept of Catholic doctrine of Purgatory, for Jahannam just punishes people according to their deeds, and releases them after their habits are purified. A limited duration in Jahannam is not universally accepted in Islam."

Anyway this discussion was about Salvation. (Hope you watched my video on the People of Paradise and Hell and I re-posted again because of the excellent points made).

{ And give glad tidings to those who believe and do good works, that for them are gardens beneath which flow streams. }
Quran, 2:25

Once again this is an excellent video explaining our stance:
I don't think a lot of people will watch these videos but thanks for posting them I enjoyed them :)
 

Daciple

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This concept predates Christianity, it is actually a very ancient concept and we believe that Islam came with Prophet Adam peace be upon him. This concept may have come with every renewal of Islam and every Prophet who corrected the worship of others or even the worship of ideas among other things.

"Therefore Allah has sent 124.000 prophets and finally the last prophet, Master of the believers, Sayyidunâ Muhammad
(may Allah bless him and grant him peace) and with him the Holy Quran, as a reminder of the eternal message, a confirmation of (the messages) which came before it, a salvation for mankind and a healing and mercy for the believers."

"While use of the word "Purgatory" (in Latin purgatorium) as a noun appeared perhaps only between 1160 and 1180, giving rise to the idea of purgatory as a place[7] (what Jacques Le Goff called the "birth" of purgatory),"the Roman Catholic tradition of Purgatory as a transitional condition has a history that dates back, even before Jesus Christ, to the worldwide practice of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief, found also in Judaism,[9] which is considered the precursor of Christianity, that prayer for the dead contributed to their afterlife purification.
The same practice appears in other traditions, such as the medieval Chinese Buddhist practice of making offerings on behalf of the dead, who are said to suffer numerous trials.[5] Roman Catholic belief in after-life purification is based on the practice of praying for the dead, which is mentioned in what the Roman Catholic Church has declared to be part of Sacred Scripture,[10][11] and which was adopted by Christians from the beginning,[12] a practice that presupposes that the dead are thereby assisted between death and their entry into their final abode.[5]
Belief in after-life "temporary punishments agreeable to every one's behaviour and manners" was expressed in the early Christian work in Greek known as Josephus's Discourse to the Greeks concerning Hades, which was once attributed to Josephus (37 - c. 100) but is now believed to be by Hippolytus of Rome (170-235).[13]
https://quizlet.com/168435856/purgatory-flash-cards/

From Wikipedia:
Islam
Main article: Barzakh
Islam has a concept similar to that of purgatory in Christianity. Barzakh is thought to be a realm between paradise (Jannah) and hell (Jahannam) and according to Ghazali the place of those who go neither to hell or to heaven.[117] But because it does not purify the souls it resembles more the Christian limbo than the purgatory.

In some cases, the Islamic concept of hell may resemble the concept of Catholic doctrine of Purgatory, for Jahannam just punishes people according to their deeds, and releases them after their habits are purified. A limited duration in Jahannam is not universally accepted in Islam."

Anyway this discussion was about Salvation. (Hope you watched my video on the People of Paradise and Hell and I re-posted again because of the excellent points made).

{ And give glad tidings to those who believe and do good works, that for them are gardens beneath which flow streams. }
Quran, 2:25

Once again this is an excellent video explaining our stance:
So essentially I was correct, Islam has a state that resembles Purgatory, yet the both of you rejected me making this comparison. This personally is the first time I was made aware that an ideology that resembles Purgatory is in Islam. I guess the reason why this is the first time in a decade of speaking to Muslims I have heard about this is because as you quoted limited duration in Jahannam is not universally accepted in Islam. I was always under the impression that if one rejected Islam, Muhammad, the Pillars, have more Bad Works than Good then they go to Hell and stay there forever. I have never been under the impression that one can escape Hell in Islam.

And yes this is about Salvation, and the Doctrine of Purgatory or in Islam, Jahannam is apart of this umbrella of Salvation is it not?
 
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