End times vision, prophecies and dreams thread.

Helioform

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Isn't Wormwood an actual comet/asteroid falling to Earth? Seems so.

Revelation 8:10-11
The third angel blew his trumpet, and a great star fell from heaven, blazing like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. The name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters became wormwood, and many people died from the water, because it had been made bitter
 






Red Sky at Morning

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This is not biblical or true at all.
Revelation 8

10And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.

Sounds like an asteroid to me ;-)

Happens before...

Revelation 16:16

“And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.”

^ Looks like at least some people survived the impact.
 






phipps

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This passage from Revelation does give pause for thought (Not that I’m trying to prophecy or anything, certainly not):

The stars fell down to the earth, like unripe figs falling from the tree when a strong wind shakes it. 14 The sky disappeared like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved from its place. 15 Then the kings of the earth, the rulers and the military chiefs, the rich and the powerful, and all other people, slave and free, hid themselves in caves
What I meant by "This is not biblical or true at all" is everything @Red Sky at Morning posts about end time prophecy. Together its all lies and unbiblical because he believes in dispensationalism which is not biblical. A lot of it is not even written of at all in the Bible and is made up theology.

To explain a little of the verses you posted (it would help if you post the full scripture). The verses you posted are in the sixth seal before Jesus returns the second time. Most of the sixth seal has been fulfilled. Most of end time prophecy has already been fulfilled biblically. The end time started about 300 years ago biblically. You can't even squeeze most of end time prophecy of Revelation in 100 years. Its too short a period.

However falling stars are not asteroids. They are shooting stars. The most extensive display of falling stars which has ever been recorded in history happened on November 13, 1833 in the US. https://www.ancestry.com/contextux/historicalinsights/night-stars-fell-meteor-1833.

The part of the sixth seal that is not yet fulfilled is in Revelation 6:14-17, "Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, and said to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?” These events happen when Jesus returns the second time and the wicked who rejected Him will beg for the mountains to fall on them and hide them from his Face.
 






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phipps

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Revelation 8

10And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.

Sounds like an asteroid to me ;-)

Happens before...

Revelation 16:16

“And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.”

^ Looks like at least some people survived the impact.
What I meant is everything you post about end time prophecy is untrue because it is mixed with dispensationalism which is not biblical. You believe in theology that is not even written of at all in the Bible and mix it with truth which is still a lie.

Revelation 8 is about some of the seven trumpets. It is all written in symbolic language. Most of Revelation is written in symbolic language. Trumpets in biblical times were an important part of the daily life of Israel. Their sound reminded people of the worship in the temple; trumpets were also blown in battle, at harvest time, and during festivals, were used as a call for war, the priests blew trumpets to signal the upcoming Day of Atonement which was the annual day of judgement. So the seven trumpets are a warning to the world of the severe judgments of God. They are also a warning for all those who dwell on the earth to repent and come to Christ before it is too late.

The verses you posted are not talking about a literal star that fell from heaven. In scripture a star represents a leader, a falling star represents an apostate leader (Genesis 37:9-10, Jude 1:13, Revelation 1:20; 22:16 ). The “great star” that fell “from heaven” is symbolic of a great leader who was apostate. Wormwood is a bitter medicinal plant and is poisonous in large doses. So there was a leader who appeared suddenly bringing such bitterness to all who came across him. This happened hundreds of years ago before the time of the end happened. The time period of the the trumpets begins in John the Revelator's time. Its the same time period with the seven seals.

Revelation 16:16, is during the sixth plague. They are the seven last plagues that will be poured out on the wicked who hardened their hearts against God’s redeeming love and did not repent (Revelation. 16:11) just before Jesus returns for His people. Armageddon is a spiritual war between Christ and the forces of evil under Satan's rule.
 






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Red Sky at Morning

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What I meant is everything you post about end time prophecy is untrue because it is mixed with dispensationalism which is not biblical. You believe in theology that is not even written of at all in the Bible and mix it with truth which is still a lie.

Revelation 8 is about some the seven trumpets. It is all written in symbolic language. Most of Revelation is written in symbolic language. Trumpets in biblical times were an important part of the daily life of Israel. Their sound reminded people of the worship in the temple; trumpets were also blown in battle, at harvest time, and during festivals, were used as a call for war, the priests blew trumpets to signal the upcoming Day of Atonement which was the annual day of judgement. So the seven trumpets are a warning to the world of the severe judgments of God. They are also a warning for all those who dwell on the earth to repent and come to Christ before it is too late.

The verses you posted are not talking about a literal star that fell from heaven. In scripture a star represents a leader, a falling star represents an apostate leader (Genesis 37:9-10, Jude 1:13, Revelation 1:20; 22:16 ). The “great star” that fell “from heaven” is symbolic of a great leader who was apostate. Wormwood is a bitter medicinal plant and is poisonous in large doses. So there was a leader who appeared suddenly bringing such bitterness to all who came across him. This happened hundreds of years ago before the time of the end happened. The time period The trumpets begins in John the Revelator's time. Its the same time period with the seven seals.

Revelation 16:16, is during the sixth plague. They are the seven last plagues that will be poured out on the wicked who hardened their hearts against God’s redeeming love and did not repent (Revelation. 16:11) just before Jesus returns for His people. Armageddon is a spiritual war between Christ and the forces of evil under Satan's rule.
I’m not going to argue with you @phipps

I take a pre-millennial (there’s actually going to be a 1000 year reign of Jesus on the earth), pre-trib (those who are truly born again will not be here to see Daniels 7th week, though other “saints” may later be added who come to faith during the Tribulation) dispensationalist (God has and will deal with people in different ways at different turning points in history) point of view. I honestly feel that is the most plausible view and I am happy to own it.

To decide if such a view is “biblical” is a Berean study (I offer material I genuinely stand by on the topic):-


I also reject replacement theology yet I believe people may hold eschatological views quite counter to my own and still accept them as brothers and sisters in Jesus. I try to avoid calling them liars because we will all give account to Him and we all “see through a glass darkly“ to one degree or another.

Do you still broadly subscribe to an SDA view?

 






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phipps

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@Red Sky at Morning

I’m not going to argue with you @phipps
Don't want to argue either but sometimes I can't see untruths about God and continue to not say anything.

I take a pre-millennial (there’s actually going to be a 1000 year reign of Jesus on the earth), pre-trib (those who are truly born again will not be here to see Daniels 7th week, though other “saints” may later be added who come to faith during the Tribulation) dispensationalist (God has and will deal with people in different ways at different turning points in history) point of view. I honestly feel that is the most plausible view and I am happy to own it.
Feeling something is the most plausible and owning it does not make it the truth. The Word of God does. None of the events you mention above and more from dispensationalism are mentioned in the Old Testament by any prophets or God's great men, by Jesus, by the apostles and not even in the book of Revelation where we are told exactly what will happen before and after Jesus returns the second time. To this day you've failed to show me any direct scripture about any of these events which are very important to your doctrine. How could Jesus not say anything directly from His own Mouth or through His people about any of these events at all in both Testaments? He is not forgetful and end time events are not implied at all in the Bible. They are very important that there isn't such thing as scripture being indirect about end time events and what happens after Jesus returns until God's people are settled on the new earth. The truth is they are not mentioned because they are not going to happen.

I also reject replacement theology yet I believe people may hold eschatological views quite counter to my own and still accept them as brothers and sisters in Jesus. I try to avoid calling them liars because we will all give account to Him and we all “see through a glass darkly“ to one degree or another.
Reject it but its the truth and everything it teaches is biblical and not gotten from scripture that is not about end time events and assumed things that those scriptures are not even about which is what dispensationalism does. You have no leg to stand on without direct scripture. And you and I know God did not forget to write about those events. There is no 1000 year reign of Christ on earth in scripture anywhere. But there is direct scripture in the Bible of Jesus coming with all the angels of heaven for the saints.

Matthew 25:31, “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.” All the angels come with Christ.

Matthew 24:31, "And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other." The angels will gather together all of the righteous people in preparation for the trip back to heaven.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, "The Lord Himself will descend from heaven … and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.” The saints are not going to meet the Lord in the air then return to earth. That contradicts scripture. Jesus' feet do not touch the earth when He returns the Second time. The angels gather the saints, they meet Jesus in the air and they return to heaven.

Revelation 20:4-6, "And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished (the wicked, all the saints are with Christ). This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years." This is the only 1000 year period mentioned after Jesus returns and as we can see they are not on earth and neither is Jesus. We know this because in Revelation 21:2-3 the saints come back to earth with Jesus in the holy city, New Jerusalem. "Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God." This is Christ's third return to earth and this time His feet touch the earth. So when Jesus returns to earth the second time it will be for His saints, then the third will be with His saints.

Can you prove your 1000 years of earthly rule directly without assumptions or hints from scripture?

Also can you show me where the Word of God separates the 70 weeks where the last week will be at the end of time? As far as I know they are not separated. Daniel was told that this 70 week period/490 years was cut off specifically for the Jews. "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy" (Daniel 9:24). “Thy people” were God’s chosen people, Israel.

All the 70 weeks/490 years were appointed to the Jewish nation for these six reasons found in Daniel 9:24:
1. to finish the transgression
2. to make an end of sins
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness
5. to seal up vision and prophecy
6. to anoint the most Holy

We know they did not anoint the most Holy, they rejected Him and at the end of all the 70 weeks/490 years the Jews were no longer a chosen nation and the gospel was taken from them and preached to the Gentiles because they were not producing fruit (Matthew 21:43-44, 23:37-39). The last week was never separated biblically, only in man-made doctrine.

Do you still broadly subscribe to an SDA view?
You know the answer to that already and I explained why. I doubt you are that forgetful. Its is about the Word of God for me no matter how many times you try to deflect from that. You don't have scripture on your side with your beliefs in dispensationalism and you know that.

Of course Adventism has critics, who doesn't? Jesus and the apostles were criticised, were persecuted and killed. Millions of Christians over the centuries have been criticised, persecuted and killed by other "Christians" for preaching God's truth too. That never changes the truth of God's Word. The truth is always with a minority and that will never change till Jesus returns.

Though I don't know who these people are and I suspect you don't either. You've read just a little and posted the link here to prove me wrong but have no clue do you? Why do you keep doing this? Because you like Satan (these are his tactics) want to divert attention from the truth on this subject. You are wrong about dispensationalism. “To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isaiah 8:20).

How can direct biblical truths be alien to most Christians? This baffles me the most. God bless.
 






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phipps

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@phipps

I politely (but entirely) disagree and invite others to research their own conclusions.
Alright but you're wrong, you are rejecting biblical truths and have no proof from the Bible. I also invite others to do their research and to keep in mind that if its not written in the Word of God, it was not skipped or forgotten, it simply isn't going happen. They should prayerfully let the Holy spirit and the Word of God guide them, that is why I post a lot of scripture so people can read it and do more of their own research.
 






Red Sky at Morning

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Alright but you're wrong, you are rejecting biblical truths and have no proof from the Bible.
Again, whether I provide adequate support my perspective from the Bible or not is for others to judge.

p.s. I love this song!

 






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phipps

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Again, whether I provide adequate support my perspective from the Bible or not is for others to judge.
"is for others to judge" that Includes me and all other people who read yours and my public posts here. And I have judged you're wrong because dispensationalism is not biblical and you've failed to prove otherwise as you know.
 






A Freeman

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Most people have been led to believe that the 7 angels with the 7 trumpets in the Apocalypse (Revelation) are going to appear, in the distant future, at the end of time and blow their trumpets, which is wrong.

The 7 angels are 7 time periods and the first 5 have already gone, with the 6th. (Rev. 9:12) IMMINENT and the 7th being the LAST, for most of mankind. That's how asleep/spiritually blind people really are. BILLIONS have already died and people's hearts are still so rock-hard/stony that they refuse to "see" it.

Before YOU can understand the TRUTH of the Bible Prophecies, which take up 2/3 of it, or anything similarly complex, you have to decide to be TOTALLY objective and analytical about the FACTS presented and not distracted by irrelevant "clap-trap" from organised religions and "holier than thou" theories. The Bible itself warns you NOT to be led by the "blind guides" of Organised Religions and politics (Isaiah 3:12-15) (Matt. 23:13, 16 & 24).

Like reading "blue-prints" or "electrical circuit-diagrams" there is some learning to be done & fortunately the instruction for this is in the Bible, and, as you might expect, some of it is coded to stop idiots interfering with the meaning. So it is IMPERATIVE to get the BEST translation - the new "King of kings' Bible" by JAH - Authorised by God; or use the previous best - the king James 1611 original, which is the only human-kingly Authorised Version and not modernised Satanically corrupted translations done by successive churches.

Let's take a look at some of the codes to get you started, so you may agree when you look up the chapter and verse, if you care to check it out.

SUN - The Throne of David - (Psalm 89:36) - which is the British Throne. The "Stone of Scone" is Jacob's Pillar and Israel's Throne of David.

MOON - Reflects the light of the SUN. The SUN is the British Throne and the "Commonwealth" reflects her light and power (like the moon does to the sun).

STARS of heaven - U.S.A. (50 on their flag, "STAR spangled banner" etc.)

HEAVENS - Political systems (above the mountains).

MOUNTAIN - Government - (Micah 4:1, Isaiah 2:1, Matt. 21:21).

EARTH - Downtrodden people (oppressed and poor).

EARTH-QUAKE - Great upheaval of the EARTH (as above).

SEA - Restless, moving people who are not as oppressed and are free to move around (Psalm 65:6,7, Isa. 17:12-13).

WATERS - Peoples, multitudes, nations and tongues (languages) (Apocalypse/Revelation 17:15).

HORN - kingdom

UNICORN - Unique horn - "One Kingdom, world without end" - God's Kingdom on Earth - soon.

OLIVE - The "House of Israel" - (people not country - Zech. 4:11-14)

FIG tree - Jews (Matt. 21:19-20), Christ cursing Judaism for ever in verse 19.

DAY - Year in prophecy (Num. 14:34, Ezekiel 4:6) (Revelation 9:15).

MONTH - 30 years in prophecy (Rev. 11: 2-3 - 42 x 30 = 1260).

SEVEN - The number of completeness in Scripture.

You need to use your common-sense to see what is logical and sensible and whether the words are to be interpreted in their normal way or in God's code. A perfect example of this is when Christ said, "IF, you have enough faith and you say to this mountain, fall into the sea and it will (Matt. 21:21)", it obviously did not mean an actual mountain and the sea. It was coded. It is obviously possible for God to cast a mountain into the sea but why should He want to destroy a beautiful mountain that He Himself has created? It means government (mountain) and restless dis-satisfied people (sea).

Think about it. A mountain (govt.) towers over and looks down upon the sea (people) and the sea looks up at the mountain. The sea (people) cannot remove the mountain (govt.) without a tidal-wave. IF you have enough faith and tell the people the TRUTH of God's PerfectSystem of Government and Laws, you can create that tidal-wave with God's help, for everyone's benefit. SIMPLE.

Excerpt above from: The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse and the Two Witnesses

With what's been shared above in mind, look at the 7 trumpets again, realizing that 5 of them have already passed, and the 6th and 7th are now imminent.

1 WW1 - began in 1914, and was the first time that automatic weapons were used and bombs rained down from above using airplanes.

2 The Bolshevik Revolution - 1917. The great "mountain" was the Russian czar being overthrown into the "sea" (people) which resulted in a third of the world adopting red communism (blood). Over 20,000,000 Russian Christians were murdered.

3 Chernobyl (Wormwood) - 1986.

4 The decolonization and decline of the British Empire from 1945-1997, coupled with many of the U.S. overseas territories or occupations gaining independence after WW2. Examples include: the Philippines (1946), the Panama Canal Zone (1979), Palau (1981), the Federated States of Micronesia (1986), and the Marshall Islands (1986).

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire
And: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_imperialism

5 Woe #1: WW3 – Phase 1: The Invasion of Kuwait

6 Woe #2: WW3 – Phase 2: East v. West - Russia & China v. the U.S. & U.K., which the U.S. and U.K. LOSE

7 Woe #3: The Reaping (Matt. 24:28, Rev. 14:15-16)

This is where we actually stand - on the precipice of the second phase of WW3 - if anyone cares to take notice. And with regard to the rest of us who are still here today (see Rev. 9:20-21), how many have actually REPENTED of their sins? How many even know what that means?

Sin = the transgression (breaking) of The Law that God gave us, found in the first five books of the Bible (see 1 John 3:4 for the definition of sin).

The ONLY Way someone can truly repent of their sins is to STOP SINNING/BREAKING THE LAW.

IF everyone did that, there would be no reason for all of these horrific measures being allowed, all of which are to get us to take notice and stop this insanity. WOE, WOE, WOE!
 






phipps

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Ellen G White is not Biblical
It depends what you think is biblical. I've found most Christians here don't know what that means and mix man-made doctrine with biblical doctrine and think that is biblical. It isn't. Speaking according to God's Word and only God's Word is biblical and EW did. The Bible says, "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world" (1 John 4:1). We are not just to reject anyone who claims to be a prophet without testing them otherwise you could be rejecting God's true prophet. I tested the spirits and found nothing false in what she wrote and prophesied, have you?

Remember I posted how we should all know according to the Bible who is a true prophet of God and who isn't in this post. She passes.

Did Ellen White Exalt God's Word and Law? She wrote, "The Holy Scriptures are to be accepted as an authoritative, infallible revelation of His will. They are the standard of character, the revealer of doctrines, and the test of experience" (Manuscript 88a, 1900).

To those who criticized the Word of God, she wrote, "Cling to your Bible as it reads and stop your criticism in regard to its validity and obey the word, and not one of you will be lost...The Bible and the Bible alone is to be our creed, the role bond of union...God's word is infallible...lift up the banner on which is inscribed the Bible, our rule of faith and discipline" (Colporteur Ministry, 125).

She clearly recognised the role of the Holy Spirit in the interpretation of Scripture as outlined in the Westminster Confession. She wrote this: "We can attain to an understanding of God's word only through the illumination of that Spirit by which the word was given...The fact that God has revealed His will to men through His word, has not rendered needless the continued presence and guiding of the Holy Spirit. On the contrary, the Spirit was promised by our Saviour, to open the Word to His servants, to illuminate and apply its teachings" (Review and Herald, August 11, 1853, 53; Medical Ministry 88, 1904).

About God's law she wrote, "But it is ever the purpose of Satan to make void the law of God and to pervert the true meaning of the plan of salvation. Therefore, he has originated the falsehood that the sacrifice of Christ on Calvary's cross was for the purpose of freeing men from the obligation of keeping the commandments of God. He has foisted upon the world the deception that God has abolished His constitution, thrown away His moral standard, and made void His holy and perfect law. Had He done this, at what terrible expense would it have been to Heaven! Instead of proclaiming the abolition of the law, Calvary's cross proclaims in thunder tones its immutable and eternal character" (Early Writings, 118).

This is only a part of the tests I posted about true prophets.

I want to test the spirits and know about the people whose videos about their dreams you've posted here on this forum. I don't believe them because I don't know anything about them. I don't know if they live their lives according to God's law and if they transform the lives of others through their example and message so that they live godly lives too, if all their messages are in harmony with the Bible and the law of God etc.

There are going to be other true prophets in the end time but most Christians and the world will reject them because they will be saying biblical truths that most disagree with or don't know. The 144,000 will be rejected by most with their end time message. The truth is always alien to most people but sadly even to most Christians. "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams" (Acts 2:17)
 






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TokiEl

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Also can you show me where the Word of God separates the 70 weeks where the last week will be at the end of time?
The shepherde has shown you over ten times already... so o boy here we go again.




Daniel's 70 weeks prophecy is a countdown until the Christ and the antichrist.



Seven sevens and sixtytwo sevens from the going forth of the command to restore and build Jerusalem until the Christ.

7x360 weeks + 62x360 weeks counting from Nisan 444 BC come to Nisan 33 AD.


Then the sixtytwo sevens were spent... and seven sevens were waiting in time for the command to go forth again.


Seven sevens from the going forth of the command to restore jewish control over the Old City until the antichrist.

7x360 weeks counting from June 7 1967 come to the Day of Atonement Sept 23 2015.



On Sept 25 2015 the prince of the people who destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple... the pope of Rome came in his own name and confirmed Agenda 21 with Agenda 2030 about global governance in the United Nations.
 






Alanantic

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After skimming the last few comments, it's obvious you have a million things to dissagree about. why not restart with what you DO agree about? Just a suggestion...
 






Alanantic

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I thought you meant what us Christians agreed on..
The world is bigger than that. Have you noticed there are Jews, Muslims, Hindus, and even those that have no religious attachments, that come to this forum? There are billions of people on this planet that have never heard of your Jehoval or Jesus. Strangely enough, though, we all exist together in the same space and time.
 






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The world is bigger than that. Have you noticed there are Jews, Muslims, Hindus, and even those that have no religious attachments, that come to this forum? There are billions of people on this planet that have never heard of your Jehoval or Jesus. Strangely enough, though, we all exist together in the same space and time.
there is only one way
 






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