END TIMES - A thread for all christians

Lisa

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I believe that the Bible is rooted in something real and the truth of where this information originated is oppressed. I find it hard to understand how any Christian could argue that the church is not oppressed considering the presence of denominational conflicts.

However, it would seem like this is more than likely Zoroastrian writings.

From the Zend Avesta

"O Maker of the material world, thou Holy One! Can the eating vessels be made clean that have been touched by the carcase of a dog, or by the corpse of a man?
74 (184). Ahura Mazda answered: 'They can, O holy Zarathustra!'"

This whole section of Zoroastrian writings resembles the conversation that Abraham has before Sodom and Gomorrah is destroyed. Abraham asks how many righteous people would be enough to save the city.

"Then he said, “May the Lord not be angry, but let me speak. What if only thirty can be found there?”
He answered, “I will not do it if I find thirty there.”
31 Abraham said, “Now that I have been so bold as to speak to the Lord, what if only twenty can be found there?”
He said, “For the sake of twenty, I will not destroy it.” Genesis 18:30-31

"“The Dinkard, a ninth century Persian work says there were only ever two copies of Zoroaster’s monumental work, one of which was burned and the other was confiscated by the Greeks."


So there is a root that was replaced by something else created by the Greeks.
How do you say your a Christian then if your belief doesn’t include thinking the Bible is true?
 






rainerann

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So, you don’t believe Jesus is God and you don’t believe that God has/had a chosen people..yet you can still say you are a Christian? Yikes!
Lisa I've been saying this for a long time. Often times these things I have said have been ignored. I don't know if people think they are doing me favors or that they are somehow superior to an actual discussion on this subject, but I do know that if it were easy to prove me wrong, someone would have done it by now.

There is no evidence to respond with so, therefore, you make claims like this rather than posting anything that would tell a different story.
For the 7th or 8th time because I have said this many times and no one responds to it ever. I know this is because they have no real answer to respond with. Anyways, the Bible talks about healing paralytics. This never happens and has not happened in 2000 years. Information is either oppressed or this never happened. It is one or the other. You can ignore this reality as much as you want because it is not a discussion that is rehearsed as much as the one defending the trinity, but this is still going to be a reality.

There is information that is oppressed or this never happened because I can guarantee someone like yourself has never healed the blind. I would bet that you have never even encountered someone in a wheelchair where this was even something you wanted to do.

It is easy for hardened Christians like yourself to see someone in a wheelchair and brush it off as though it were just God's will for them to be this way. I just have a harder time with that so I am more willing to search in the crevices than you are to find something that would be legitimately useful to help someone instead of sitting back and judging them for their suffering.
 






Lisa

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Lisa I've been saying this for a long time. Often times these things I have said have been ignored. I don't know if people think they are doing me favors or that they are somehow superior to an actual discussion on this subject, but I do know that if it were easy to prove me wrong, someone would have done it by now.

There is no evidence to respond with so, therefore, you make claims like this rather than posting anything that would tell a different story.
For the 7th or 8th time because I have said this many times and no one responds to it ever. I know this is because they have no real answer to respond with. Anyways, the Bible talks about healing paralytics. This never happens and has not happened in 2000 years. Information is either oppressed or this never happened. It is one or the other. You can ignore this reality as much as you want because it is not a discussion that is rehearsed as much as the one defending the trinity, but this is still going to be a reality.

There is information that is oppressed or this never happened because I can guarantee someone like yourself has never healed the blind. I would bet that you have never even encountered someone in a wheelchair where this was even something you wanted to do.

It is easy for hardened Christians like yourself to see someone in a wheelchair and brush it off as though it were just God's will for them to be this way. I just have a harder time with that so I am more willing to search in the crevices than you are to find something that would be legitimately useful to help someone instead of sitting back and judging them for their suffering.
Why should you think that Christians can heel the lame? Is that something that God said we could do? I think the apostles could because they walked with Him and He gave them His power, but I don’t see where its a Christians job to heal or that they even can. Do we like to see people suffer, no, but we know where our strength comes from and its from God. God even tells us that we walk by faith not by sight..so healing in a wheelchair would be a sight thing..would it not?

So, in the second point then everyone suffers different things and struggles all their lives with things. They may not be in a wheelchair..but the suffering is there. What Christians know is true is that God is the One that helps you...God is the One you go to for healing..however that comes and whether its a get up and walk kind of thing..or more generally its going to be a walk with God while you lean upon Him for your strength to get through this life..and that is what the Bible teaches..more than a person being able to walk from their wheelchair.

I don’t think I ever brush off people’s sufferings as it is God’s will..but as a Christian I know that I couldn’t help anyone more than God can help them..I’m just a way for them to hear about God and when they believe than God takes over in their lives..He’s the helper not me.

A Christian‘s role is to share the Good News and to encourage one another in the Lord..meeting together to encourage and worship the Lord.
 






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Red Sky at Morning

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Why should you think that Christians can heel the lame? Is that something that God said we could do? I think the apostles could because they walked with Him and He gave them His power, but I don’t see where its a Christians job to heal or that they even can. Do we like to see people suffer, no, but we know where our strength comes from and its from God. God even tells us that we walk by faith not by sight..so healing in a wheelchair would be a sight thing..would it not?

So, in the second point then everyone suffers different things and struggles all their lives with things. They may not be in a wheelchair..but the suffering is there. What Christians know is true is that God is the One that helps you...God is the One you go to for healing..however that comes and whether its a get up and walk kind of thing..or more generally its going to be a walk with God while you lean upon Him for your strength to get through this life..and that is what the Bible teaches..more than a person being able to walk from their wheelchair.

I don’t think I ever brush off people’s sufferings as it is God’s will..but as a Christian I know that I couldn’t help anyone more than God can help them..I’m just a way for them to hear about God and when they believe than God takes over in their lives..He’s the helper not me.

A Christian‘s role is to share the Good News and to encourage one another in the Lord..meeting together to encourage and worship the Lord.
Perhaps it’s the gap between the expectations raised by the health and wealth crew and the varied reality of healings that we experience when praying for ourselves and others. Jim Sepulvida prayed for my brothers girlfriend 25 years ago and her twisted arthritic spine was completely healed. Jim’a son got HIV through an infected blood transfusion and lost him. Why was one healed and the other went home to the Lord?

Looking at it the other way, why would asking an imaginary God ever result in a healing. Is it not a miracle that miracles ever take place?
 






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Vixy

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Seriously pull your heads out of the sand and realize that the reason the truth about the history can’t be told is because the church would have the largest tantrum and the world is tiptoeing around causing this explosion.

it would literally be the thing to finally break up the United States so the Bible Belt could have their own country. The idea of being weak and persecuted is just ridiculous right now. The church is currently the winner writing the history books whether the information can be considered true or not.
I disagree completely. Skipping all religion and replacing it with a one world religion is exactly what the elite wants and we've known that for over a decade now. cant for my life believe Im actually reading this from an old member here on VC where people are supposed to be awake.
 






Lisa

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Perhaps it’s the gap between the expectations raised by the health and wealth crew and the varied reality of healings that we experience when praying for ourselves and others. Jim Sepulvida prayed for my brothers girlfriend 25 years ago and her twisted arthritic spine was completely healed. Jim’a son got HIV through an infected blood transfusion and lost him. Why was one healed and the other went home to the Lord?

Looking at it the other way, why would asking an imaginary God ever result in a healing. Is it not a miracle that miracles ever take place?
I think that healings can happen..however I don’t think they happen all the time. I also don’t think that healings one spine...or walking from a wheelchair are the healings that God always goes to..and like you said sometimes healing doesn’t come at all..just leaning on God. And its the leaning on God and finding out that God is our strength that could be the biggest miracle of all? Since He is invisible to us.

We follow God but don’t know His ways and thoughts well enough to predict what He will do in anyone’s life..least of all our own.
 






Lisa

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I disagree completely. Skipping all religion and replacing it with a one world religion is exactly what the elite wants and we've known that for over a decade now. cant for my life believe Im actually reading this from an old member here on VC where people are supposed to be awake.
Or Big Picture...that’s what the Bible says will happen...
 






Red Sky at Morning

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There is nothing in the prophecy about changing dna either. That is pure speculation.
There is not - the idea that the Mark will after DNA is certainly speculation. The stuff of conspiracy forums perhaps? I would suggest that the wisest heads would appraise themselves of the full spectrum of Biblical possibilities right now.
 






Lisa

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There is not - the idea that the Mark will after DNA is certainly speculation. The stuff of conspiracy forums perhaps? I would suggest that the wisest heads would appraise themselves of the full spectrum of Biblical possibilities right now.
I don’t think it alters people‘s dna as much as it marks them for God.

Revelation‬ ‭16:2‬ ‭
So the first angel went and poured out his bowl on the earth; and it became a loathsome and malignant sore on the people who had the mark of the beast and who worshiped his image.
‭‭​
 






A Freeman

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From: Is the Old Testament plagiarized from the Zoroastrian scriptures?


"Is the Old Testament plagiarized from the Zoroastrian scriptures?

Quite simply, no. Many wild theories are thrown about by theologians looking for something to put into their ThD theses, and this is one of these ideas. The Zend Avesta is the principle scripture of Zoroastrianism, the pseudo-monotheistic sun-worshiping religion which began in Persia in about the seventh century BCE. One principal problem with this theory is that most of the Old Testament was written long before the Zend Avesta.

The origins of the Zend Avesta are obscure, but the earliest evidence for its existence comes from about 600 BCE. Assuming that there are parallels between the Old Testament and the Zend Avesta which require one to conclude that one borrowed from the other (and this is a big assumption) the logical implication would be that the Persian scripture borrowed from the one which preceded it?the Old Testament! The reason theologians are not attracted to this theory is that it would not provide an interesting and controversial ThD thesis topic.

Another problem with this theory is that most of the original Zend Avesta has been completely lost. In fact, it is difficult to prove that Zoroaster (also known as Zarathustra) himself is even an historical person, as his origins and even the time of his life are controversial. The Zoroastrians now rely principally on the Gathas, which are supposed sayings of Zoroaster. I say supposed sayings of Zoroaster because this book was written hundreds of years after the Zend Avesta when most of the original writings had already been lost to posterity. For this reason, it is difficult to say what was in the Zend Avesta in the first place. This would make it hard to prove either that the Bible writers borrowed from the Zoroastrian scripture or vice versa. With little solid evidence in either direction, much room is left for those who like to speculate and who make a living out of finding supposed problems with the Bible. You
would do well to be extremely skeptical of such claims. You should look for some sort of solid evidence to back up the claim that the Bible writers borrowed from Zoroastrian scripture. To date, I have seen no reliable evidence to support the claim, but if you find something, I would request you send the information my way. I will not be holding my breath."

-------

Most, if not all of the claims of ancient religious writings pre-dating the Bible are based upon radiocarbon dating, which is sometimes thousands of years off and thus totally unreliable as the sole means of dating an artifact.

Over two-thirds of the Bible is prophecy*, over 99% of which has been fulfilled in exact and minute detail. Only a fool would look at that track record and question the historical accuracy of the Bible, or that the remaining >1% of the prophecies will not similarly be fulfilled in exact and minute detail.

*prophecy is future history, revealed in advance of it happening

The logical approach to any perceived differences between the Bible and secular "scientific" dating methods would be to assume the scientific dating methods are in error, as they have been proven to be time after time. But we live in a Godless world, where people will desperately do whatever they can to preserve and defend their fragile ego-boundaries, which is why the Bible is both the most attacked text on Earth as well as the most accurate historical text there is.

The Bible makes it crystal clear that those who refuse to accept its truth and follow its Commandments will burn. Why? Because following our Creator's Commandments, i.e. His Law, is the ONLY Way for everyone to live in true peace, harmony and prosperity, with liberty and justice for all. Respecting and truly loving one another can only happen when we all learn to always place the greater, common-good above our own selfish desires and aims.

We've all been given 6000 years to learn this simple and immutable truth. The rest, as is said, is HIS STORY.
 






A Freeman

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From: Is the Old Testament plagiarized from the Zoroastrian scriptures?


"Is the Old Testament plagiarized from the Zoroastrian scriptures?

Quite simply, no. Many wild theories are thrown about by theologians looking for something to put into their ThD theses, and this is one of these ideas. The Zend Avesta is the principle scripture of Zoroastrianism, the pseudo-monotheistic sun-worshiping religion which began in Persia in about the seventh century BCE. One principal problem with this theory is that most of the Old Testament was written long before the Zend Avesta.

The origins of the Zend Avesta are obscure, but the earliest evidence for its existence comes from about 600 BCE. Assuming that there are parallels between the Old Testament and the Zend Avesta which require one to conclude that one borrowed from the other (and this is a big assumption) the logical implication would be that the Persian scripture borrowed from the one which preceded it?the Old Testament! The reason theologians are not attracted to this theory is that it would not provide an interesting and controversial ThD thesis topic.

Another problem with this theory is that most of the original Zend Avesta has been completely lost. In fact, it is difficult to prove that Zoroaster (also known as Zarathustra) himself is even an historical person, as his origins and even the time of his life are controversial. The Zoroastrians now rely principally on the Gathas, which are supposed sayings of Zoroaster. I say supposed sayings of Zoroaster because this book was written hundreds of years after the Zend Avesta when most of the original writings had already been lost to posterity. For this reason, it is difficult to say what was in the Zend Avesta in the first place. This would make it hard to prove either that the Bible writers borrowed from the Zoroastrian scripture or vice versa. With little solid evidence in either direction, much room is left for those who like to speculate and who make a living out of finding supposed problems with the Bible. You
would do well to be extremely skeptical of such claims. You should look for some sort of solid evidence to back up the claim that the Bible writers borrowed from Zoroastrian scripture. To date, I have seen no reliable evidence to support the claim, but if you find something, I would request you send the information my way. I will not be holding my breath."

-------

Most, if not all of the claims of ancient religious writings pre-dating the Bible are based upon radiocarbon dating, which is sometimes thousands of years off and thus totally unreliable as the sole means of dating an artifact.

Over two-thirds of the Bible is prophecy*, over 99% of which has been fulfilled in exact and minute detail. Only a fool would look at that track record and question the historical accuracy of the Bible, or that the remaining >1% of the prophecies will not similarly be fulfilled in exact and minute detail.

*prophecy is future history, revealed in advance of it happening

The logical approach to any perceived differences between the Bible and secular "scientific" dating methods would be to assume the scientific dating methods are in error, as they have been proven to be time after time. But we live in a Godless world, where people will desperately do whatever they can to preserve and defend their fragile ego-boundaries, which is why the Bible is both the most attacked text on Earth as well as the most accurate historical text there is.

The Bible makes it crystal clear that those who refuse to accept its truth and follow its Commandments will burn. Why? Because following our Creator's Commandments, i.e. His Law, is the ONLY Way for everyone to live in true peace, harmony and prosperity, with liberty and justice for all. Respecting and truly loving one another can only happen when we all learn to always place the greater, common-good above our own selfish desires and aims.

We've all been given 6000 years to learn this simple and immutable truth. The rest, as is said, is HIS STORY.
 






rainerann

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I disagree completely. Skipping all religion and replacing it with a one world religion is exactly what the elite wants and we've known that for over a decade now. cant for my life believe Im actually reading this from an old member here on VC where people are supposed to be awake.
right except the point just went right over your head. There would be no one world religion because there would be no way to collectively centralize anything anymore, but you missed that part.
 






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@A Freeman

Zarathustra as in Nietzsche...

Lol, so educated that you think of Nietzsche when you hear the name of Zarathustra? lol :D

Zarathustra is another name of Zoroaster, the Prophet of Mazdeanism (circa 1500 BCE) better known as Zoroastrianism - which historically predates the Abrahamic religions by centuries.


Btw, for the record Cyrus the Great was a Zoroastrian leader who is mentioned many times in the book of Isaiah (such as Isaiah 45) and is likewise considered by that book to be one of the many Messiahs that have come. He is very positively viewed by the Tanakh.
Zoroastrianism is historically thought to be the origins of apocalypticism in Judaism leading up to Christianity. This also makes a lot of sense too because apocalypticism was simply absent from the Torah (and wider Tanakh) until around the period of the Exile.
 






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Lisa

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right except the point just went right over your head. There would be no one world religion because there would be no way to collectively centralize anything anymore, but you missed that part.
The one world religion is going to center around the antichrist.
Revelation‬ ‭13:11-15‬ ‭
Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon. He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life. And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.​
‭‭
 






rainerann

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Why should you think that Christians can heel the lame?

this is exactly the answer that I expected because I have read the Bible cover to cover and spent several years attending Christian college even. I already know that you have no good way to answer this question because I would have one if you were capable of having one.

the only answer you have is entirely based on your own speculations. Even though the Bible is supposed to be as the extension of our discernment on matters as significant as whether the church would continue to follow in the apostles footsteps and heal people, you are not able to support any of what you just said with a bible verse.

everything you just said was extrabiblical and according to the standard that the Bible is supposed to set, should be taken with a grain of salt.

a better answer would I don’t know or that it is possible that something has been oppressed, but this is not something you are capable of admitting.

this also further demonstrates that the Bible will ultimately not be sufficient in the role that people have given it in the future. However, this does not mean that people are going to go towards the idea of a one world religion. That is an absurd conclusion is you have any experience working with the public in America in the year 2020.
 






rainerann

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The one world religion is going to center around the antichrist.
Revelation‬ ‭13:11-15‬ ‭
Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon. He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life. And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.​
‭‭
right except there is no reason to not see the book of revelation the same way we currently see the Dead Sea scrolls. There is nothing that gives this text more authority if there is no historical reality of Israel that has been found after 200 years.
 






Red Sky at Morning

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right except the point just went right over your head. There would be no one world religion because there would be no way to collectively centralize anything anymore, but you missed that part.
Well, we may live to see that assertion tested...

 






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