Crazy how Christians have so many varied beliefs all under one umbrella.Personally I think only Christianity leads to God, and only Catholicism is the true form of Christianity.
You ignored the second part of his statement to ask this question but you just couldn't resist another opportunity for your asinine rhetoric of misrepresenting Christianity. The organization cited in the article for the 45,000 denominations claim is the Center for the Study of Global Christianity which in its research lists four "Christian Traditions", Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Independents. That means that those "45,000 paths" would have to belong to one of these four traditions, and as to which one is the most fragmented, that is basically answered in the article.Which flavor of Christianity leads to God? Seeing there are 45,000 paths in Christianity alone.
But after the Protestant Reformation in 1517, the number of denominations really began to multiply.
Sure, but Catholicism can be traced back to Christ! from Christ to St Peter the first Pope.Crazy how Christians have so many varied beliefs all under one umbrella.
Red said it best, "we can't both be right", while Tidal says Catholics are not Christians at all.
Which flavor of Christianity leads to God? Seeing there are 45,000 paths in Christianity alone.
I'm not really sure why you feel the need to attack Muslims Snowfall other then the devil only having one enemy. Did you know the Quran calls Jesus righteous while there is an entire chapter in the Quran named Mary?
Watch it, even if for only a few moments. Perhaps it will benefit you.
Sure, but Catholicism can be traced back to Christ! from Christ to St Peter the first Pope.
I’ve no interest in attacking Muslims personally but they are simply wrong!
Muslims may call Christ Righteous but they deny his divinity and that he died for our sins.
they may have a chapter on Mary but they don’t honor her as Queen of Heaven and earth!
I’m sorry but I’m not going to watch the video you have posted.
Islam has many proofs. Have you ever looked into them? I made a thread showing only a few a little while ago. Check it out if you like.I’ve no interest in attacking Muslims personally but they are simply wrong!
Jesus himself denies divinity.Muslims may call Christ Righteous but they deny his divinity and that he died for our sins.
Sad, because i think you would have really liked the voice. He's one of my favorite reciters. Granted the video 19 minutes long if you listened to the chapter in its entirety, but no one asked you to do that.they may have a chapter on Mary but they don’t honor her as Queen of Heaven and earth!
I’m sorry but I’m not going to watch the video you have posted.
Christ is God in human form!Islam has many proofs. Have you ever looked into them? I made a thread showing only a few a little while ago. Check it out if you like.
Jesus himself denies divinity.
“Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. (Mark 10:18)
Did you know Jesus prayed to God with his head on the ground?
"he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, My Father,"... (Matthew 26:39)
Does this sound like a Lord or a servant?
It is not my desire to chastise you, only to open your eyes. But honestly none will find truth until the Almighty allows it.
Sad, because i think you would have really liked the voice. He's one of my favorite reciters. Granted the video 19 minutes long if you listened to the chapter in its entirety, but no one asked you to do that.
Muslims do not worship Mary, nor Jesus. Indeed God is one, alone without partner.
May God guide you.
Peace.
I can quote just as many verses from your own book that state the opposite. Have you given thought to this?Christ is God in human form!
John 14:7-10
If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; from now on you know Him, and have seen Him.” Philip *said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.” Jesus *said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?r
Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.
John 16:15
All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.
Luke 22:69
But from now on the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the power of God.”
Luke 22:70
And they all said, “Are You the Son of God, then?” And He said to them, “Yes, I am.”
John 10:30
I and the Father are one.”
John 10:37
If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me;
John 10:38
but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”
John 12:45
He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me.
Matthew 16:16
Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2
He was in the beginning with God.
Romans 1:4
who was declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead, according to the Spirit of holiness, Jesus Christ our Lord,
Romans 9:5
whose are the fathers, and from whom is the Christ according to the flesh, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen.
Colossians 1:15
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
Colossians 2:9
For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,
If veneration means praise what would you call an entire chapter in the Quran named after Mary?Also we don’t worship the Holy Virgin, we venerate her.
Nope, i told you before and feel free to ask any Muslim on the planet. We do not worship Mary or Jesus. The example of them to God is that of Adam and Eve.one of the biggest issues I have with the teachings of Islam is they think our Holy Trinity is The Father, The mother and The Son.
The Holy Trinity actually is God The Father, God The Son and God The Holy Spirit.
peace to you also.
So Christians are ok with Jews who consider Jesus Christ PBUH a false Prophet but hate Muslims who venerate Jesus Christ PBUH.Sure, but Catholicism can be traced back to Christ! from Christ to St Peter the first Pope.
I’ve no interest in attacking Muslims personally but they are simply wrong!
Muslims may call Christ Righteous but they deny his divinity and that he died for our sins.
they may have a chapter on Mary but they don’t honor her as Queen of Heaven and earth!
I’m sorry but I’m not going to watch the video you have posted.
Well for one the Holy Bible doesn’t contradict itself at all, people misunderstand it!I can quote just as many verses from your own book that state the opposite. Have you given thought to this?
Why is the Bible so contradictory? This is the problem, your eternal soul depends on that book and instead of asking the Creator for guidance, most will arrogantly reject any narrative that conflicts with the one they were indoctrinated with from the cradle. Its sad to be perfectly honest.
What is this life of 100 years compared to the next that is endless? Do you think those who spent their entire life in violation of the first commandment will ever see heaven?
The problem is you won't reflect on none of this until judgement day, when its too late.
If veneration means praise what would you call an entire chapter in the Quran named after Mary?
You know, that video above that you refused to push play on?
Why is that? Are your demons afraid some truth might get through?
Nope, i told you before and feel free to ask any Muslim on the planet. We do not worship Mary or Jesus. The example of them to God is that of Adam and Eve.
The God of Islam is God the Father alone. Yes no doubt you will not accept this. If you did you might actually have to admit Muslims are upon the truth worshiping God alone, without partner. You know, kinda like the first commandment tells you to do.
Sadly, i can see this will go no where. Think of me on judgement day when the angels ask.. Did there not come to you a warner?
well for one I don’t hate Muslims or Jews but I do have a problem with what they teach.So Christians are ok with Jews who consider Jesus Christ PBUH a false Prophet but hate Muslims who venerate Jesus Christ PBUH.
Yes we don't believe he was divine because There is only one God worthy of worship God the Father in the Bible also we don't consider him to be "just" a "righteous man" the concept of Prophets in Islam is very different from Bible. Prophets aren't just people who prophesize by the grace of God they are role models for us and we can't call ourselves Muslims if we do not believe and venerate them they are innocent and free from sin. Muslims might actually kill someone for blasphemy against Jesus Christ PBUH and we do venerate Mary Pbuh and consider her one of the Queens of Jannah (heaven)
"The best women of the world are four: Mary the daughter of Heli, Aasiyah the wife of Pharaoh, Khadeejah bint Khuwaylid (The wife of the Prophet Muhammad), and Fatimah, the daughter of Muhammad, the Messenger of God.” (Al-Tirmidhi)
I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.” — Genesis 32:30Well for one the Holy Bible doesn’t contradict itself at all
Ignoring the insult, "prone to ignorance".. why does the one you worship never ask for it?same goes for the scripture you could quote, without understanding the whole context of what’s happening you will be prone to ignorance, which unfortunately, it seems you are.
You may believe this, but your god has 3 inseparable names with 3 distinctly different personalities.Catholics (and other Christians in general) do pray to God and we receive guidance from him.
Once again, you worship the created prophet Jesus.Christians don’t reject the first commandment in fact we worship God completely and utterly in his three holy forms, The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
So, god died? Killed by his own creation even.I’d argue you are rejecting God by rejecting Christ! Christ died on the Cross for the sins of all people, including you and by rejecting him you reject the pardon for your sins and you reject God himself.
Islam does not teach anything about Catholicism specifically. But when you call Mary "mother of god", to my own ears sounds incredibly blasphemous.also I mean that it is falsely taught in Islam (If I’m correct) that Catholics Worship Mary and she is part of the Holy Trinity which is completely false.
Idk if you know but i was a Christian for 30 years before i converted to Islam.if I do have demons in me I know a Catholic priest will remove them, I doubt Islam has the same power! Also I think you need to be careful of demons yourself considering you are following a heretic like Mohammad.
I am in perfect agreement that arrogance is evil. Yet never have i claimed that I'm going to heaven. I could be the most pious man on the planet today and die in a strip club tomorrow. None of us know what kind of ending we will receive. Why we seek Gods guidance daily.Also my friend, perhaps you shouldn’t be so presumptuous that you are worthy of heaven! I don’t know about Islam but Christians know arrogance is a big sin.
I suggest you take an actual look at Islam with an open heart as alot of Catholics tend to convert to it.finally I hope you realise that as much as I disagree with Islam, I do not hate you or any Muslim.
No, you glorify God and his sovereignty, and restore Jesus's dignity (and message), if you deny the obviously false notion of him being divine (and worse, coequal with God).secondly you reject God and Christ if you deny Christ’s divinity.
It’s been a while Saracen, but I’m back now.I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.” — Genesis 32:30
“No man hath seen God at any time…”– John 1:18
Honestly if the Bible was not contradictory you would have no Unitarians/Trinitarians. You would only have one narrative.
But due to mankind's edits you have 45,000 Christian sects today. All pointing to the Bible as thee source, much like you and Tidal who have some radically different beliefs.
Ignoring the insult, "prone to ignorance".. why does the one you worship never ask for it?
Why does the one you worship, worship another?
One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God. (Luke 6:12)
You may believe this, but your god has 3 inseparable names with 3 distinctly different personalities.
I mean Jesus talks to God in the Bible and you still say they are one entity.
Jesus even asks God why he has forsaken him.. your beliefs are just.. inconceivable.
Once again, you worship the created prophet Jesus.
For as the Father has life in Himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself. (John 5:26)
(Take notice that i am only quoting your book here throughout, not mine)
So, god died? Killed by his own creation even.
This is something that takes years of indoctrination to accept.
Islam does not teach anything about Catholicism specifically. But when you call Mary "mother of god", to my own ears sounds incredibly blasphemous.
Idk if you know but i was a Christian for 30 years before i converted to Islam.
While that was a main selling point for me, direct connection to God himself.
In Islam I don't need a priest or a prophet to reach him.
I am in perfect agreement that arrogance is evil. Yet never have i claimed that I'm going to heaven. I could be the most pious man on the planet today and die in a strip club tomorrow. None of us know what kind of ending we will receive. Why we seek Gods guidance daily.
What do you think of the man who bows before a stone statue. Do you think he will enter heaven? What would you say if a Christian called Moses his god, or Noah, or Solomon? Do you think they will enter into heaven?
Will God somehow not mind if his followers worshiped his prophets?
Imagine if you met a man on judgement day who said throughout his life the prophet Abraham was god incarnate. What do you think will happen to him?
Obviously this is meant for inner reflection. As i implied earlier, you need to ask God for guidance.
These back and forth posts don't help either one of us because it comes down to ego. As i said, Islam has the proofs. Why are you hesitant to look into them?
I suggest you take an actual look at Islam with an open heart as alot of Catholics tend to convert to it.
Alas God guides whom he wills.
You need to stop denying the diving of Christ who is God the Son.No, you glorify God and his sovereignty, and restore Jesus's dignity (and message), if you deny the obviously false notion of him being divine (and worse, coequal with God).
Normally I'd ignore such a long post, but since I'm on the couch with a broken leg i might as well reply to it.It’s been a while Saracen, but I’m back now.
1. once again, there is no contradiction in the Holy Bible, only people ignorantly misunderstanding it. Here’s the answer to your argumenthttps://answersingenesis.org/who-is-god/face-to-face/
2. the Holy Trinity isn’t a contradiction at all and it is absolutely consistent.
3. there are three major forms of Christianity, Catholicism, Orthodox and Protestant. Catholicism has the only claim to the early church as it comes from st Peter. Thethee bunch of Christian sects come from Protestant splinter groups, which are heretical.
4.https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-pray-God.html also Jesus had to fulfil the prophecies on earth
5.God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are One God, three persons.
https://www.stbensduluth.org/blog/fr-joel-hastings/why-does-jesus-say-he-is-forsaken also Christ cried out “why have you forsaken me?” To fulfil the mission and suffer for our sins. Everything from the mental and emotional suffering in the garden, the the physical torture and suffering to hopelessness and sorrow he felt were part of the price to be paid for the sins of the world. This is why Christ said “it is accomplished” afterwards.
6. I think you mean Son of God Jesus Christ.
I’ve already given you scripture that says Christ and God are one and the same.
7. No it takes much ignorance and lies taught by a heretical group (like Islam) to misunderstand
Christ the son came to earth to fulfil the laws and the prophecies and died on the Cross as a sacrifice for the sins of the whole world. He allowed himself to be crucified for when St. Peter told Christ to flee because of him being killed he said “But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art a stumbling-block unto me: for thou mindest not the things of God, but the things of men.”
Christ shed his blood for us and then by his own power rose from the dead three days later.
8. The Holy Virgin Mary is the Mother of God for she carried and gave birth to Christ the Son. She is also the ark of the new covenant and the bridge between God and men.
9. you don’t need a priest to be connected to God in Catholicism either
10. Does he worship the statue? If so he’d be an idolater. If he called anyone but God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit a God he’d be a heretic.
of course, it’s a sin to worship prophets, it’s just a good job Catholics only worship God.
11. show me these “proofs” of Islam and I’ll show you the falsehoods and lies of Islam.
12. On the contrary, I’d say Muslims NEED to convert to Catholicism. The only Catholics who would convert to Islam would be worldly and unbelieving ones.
You need to repent, convert and pray the Rosary my friend and leave the lies of the heretic Mohammad behind, for as St. Louis De Montfort says in his book True Devotion to Mary:
“God, then, wishes to reveal and discover Mary, the masterpiece of His hands, in these latter times:
§ 1. Because she hid herself in this world, and put herself lower than the dust by her profound humility, having obtained of God and of His Apostles and Evangelists that she should not be made manifest.
§ 2. Because, being the masterpiece of the hands of God, as well here below by grace as in heaven by glory, He wishes to be glorified and praised in her by those who are living upon the earth.
§ 3. As she is the aurora which precedes and discovers the Sun of Justice, who is Jesus Christ, she ought to be recognised and perceived, in order that Jesus Christ may be so.
§ 4. Being the way by which Jesus Christ came to us the first time, she will also be the way by which He will come the second time, though not in the same manner.
§ 5. Being the sure means and the straight and immaculate way to go to Jesus Christ, and to find Him perfectly, it is by her that the holy souls, who are to shine forth especially in sanctity, have to find our Lord. He who shall find Mary shall find life; that is, Jesus Christ, who is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. But no one can find Mary who does not seek her; and no one can seek her, who does not know her: for we cannot seek or desire an unknown object. It is necessary, then, for the greater knowledge and glory of the Most Holy Trinity, that Mary should be more known than ever.
§ 6. Mary must shine forth more than ever in mercy, in might, and in grace, in these latter times: in mercy, to bring back and lovingly receive the poor strayed sinners who shall be converted and shall return to the Catholic Church; in might, against the enemies of God, idolaters, schismatics, Mahometans (Islam), Jews, and souls hardened in impiety, who shall rise in terrible revolt against God to seduce all those who shall be contrary to them, and to make them fall by promises and threats; and, finally, she must shine forth in grace, in order to animate and sustain the valiant soldiers and faithful servants of Jesus Christ, who shall do battle for His interests.
§ 7. And, lastly, Mary must be terrible to the devil and his crew, as an army ranged in battle, principally in these latter times, because the devil, knowing that he has but little time, and now less than ever, to destroy souls, will every day redouble his efforts and his combats. He will presently raise up new persecutions, and will put terrible snares before the faithful servants and true children of Mary, whom it gives him more trouble to surmount than it does to conquer others.
51. It is principally of these last and cruel persecutions of the devil, which shall go on increasing daily till the reign of Antichrist, that we ought to understand that first and celebrated prediction and curse of God, pronounced in the terrestrial Paradise against the serpent. It is to our purpose to explain this here, for the glory of the most holy Virgin, for the salvation of her children, and for the confusion of the devil. Inimicitias ponam inter te et mulierem, et semen tuum et semen illius; ipsa conteret caput tuum, et tu insidiaberis calcaneo ejus (Gen. 3:15),—“I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed; she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.”
52. God has never made or formed but one enmity; but it is an irreconcilable one, which shall endure and develop even to the end. It is between Mary, His worthy Mother, and the devil,—between the children and the servants of the Blessed Virgin and the children and instruments of Lucifer. The most terrible of all the enemies which God has set up against the devil is His holy Mother, Mary. He has inspired her, even since the days of the earthly Paradise, though she existed then only in His idea, with so much hatred against that cursed enemy of God, with so much industry in unveiling the malice of that old serpent, with so much power to conquer, to overthrow, and to crush that proud impious rebel, that he fears her not only more than all Angels and men, but in some sense more than God Himself. It is not that the anger, the hatred, and the power of God are not infinitely greater than those of the Blessed Virgin, for the perfections of Mary are limited, but it is, first, because Satan, being proud, suffers infinitely more from being beaten and punished by a little and humble handmaid of God, and her humility humbles him more than the Divine power; and, secondly, because God has given Mary such a great power against the devils, that, as they have often been obliged to confess, in spite of themselves, by the mouths of the possessed, they fear one of her sighs for a soul more than the prayers of all the Saints, and one of her menaces against them more than all other torments.
53. What Lucifer has lost by pride, Mary has gained by humility. What Eve has damned and lost by disobedience, Mary has saved by obedience. Eve, in obeying the serpent, has destroyed all her children together with herself, and has delivered them to him; Mary, being perfectly faithful to God, has saved all her children and servants together with herself, and has consecrated them to His Majesty.
54. God has not only set an enmity but enmities, not simply between Mary and the devil, but between the race of the holy Virgin and the race of the devil; that is to say, God has set enmities, antipathies, and secret hatreds between the true children and the servants of Mary, and the children and servants of the devil. They do not love each other mutually. They have no inward correspondence with each other. The children of Belial, the slaves of Satan, the friends of the world (for it is the same thing), have always up to this time persecuted those who belong to our Blessed Lady, and will in future persecute them more than ever; just as of old Cain persecuted his brother Abel, and Esau his brother Jacob, who are the figures of the reprobate and the predestinate. But the humble Mary will always have the victory over that proud spirit, and so great a victory that she will go the length of crushing his head, where his pride dwells. She will always discover the malice of the serpent. She will always counterwork his infernal mines and dissipate his diabolical counsels, and will guarantee even to the end of time her faithful servants from his cruel claw. But the power of Mary over all the devils will especially break out in the latter times, when Satan will lay his snares against her heel; that is to say, her humble slaves and her poor children, whom she will raise up to make war against him. They shall be little and poor in the world’s esteem, and abased before all, like the heel, trodden underfoot and persecuted as the heel is by the other members of the body. But in return for this, they shall be rich in the grace of God, which Mary shall distribute to them abundantly. They shall be great and exalted before God in sanctity, superior to all other creatures by their animated zeal, and leaning so strongly on the divine succour, that, with the humility of their heel, in union with Mary, they shall crush the head of the devil, and cause Jesus Christ to triumph.”
It's not that I don't understand the appeal (superman figures are more attractive than the transcendent singular YHWH, hence the predominance of Paganism rather than the worship of YHWH) but fundamentally it is a useless belief that is grounded in a reading of scripture foreign to scripture combined with the import of Greek philosophy (nominally Platonism for the Church Fathers and then later Aristotleanism for Catholic reformers like Aquinas).You need to stop denying the diving of Christ who is God the Son.
1. There’s no contradiction at all! I can link more if you’ll actually take the time to understand it!Normally I'd ignore such a long post, but since I'm on the couch with a broken leg i might as well reply to it.
1. Its interesting how you link to that one contradiction when there are dozens and dozens. I'd give more but one makes my point.
As I've already pointed out, 45,000 sects all from One book. Obviously it is contradictory, especially when you compare "Christians" like you and Tidal with some pretty different opinions on core beliefs. To the point where he says you're not a Christian while you probably say the same to him.
2. If it was absolutely constant you wouldn't have millions of Christians rejecting the divinity of prophet Jesus.
3. I get it, you are Christian, other Christians are not. This is what they all say, only You have the truth, yes? So where are your proofs? Something tangible that would make an Atheist say you've shown him the light?
4. All prophets had miracles. Moses split the red sea, some 500 miles across today. Why do you not worship him?
5. I don't have time for your mental gymnastics. Let us go find a 1st grader and see if we can find out what 1+1+1 equals.
6. When there are over 90 verses in the Bible refuting the divinity of prophet Jesus best i can do is wish you good luck. As a Muslim i refuse to bow before the creation.
7. Are insults necessary? Have i mentioned the millions of Christians who don't understand the way you do? Perhaps they are heretics as well because God knows you could never be wrong.
8... honestly, I've read enough. Pretty sure i said at the end of my last post these back and forths are a waste for both of us. Good day.
"Me thinks thou doth protest too much."Topic title: Do all religions lead us to God?
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Haha not a chance!
Here's the road taken by nonchristians and atheists, and it leads precisely nowhere..