Do all religions lead us to God?

[billy t]

@Daze

You said “What do you mean by "Christian concept of God"? There are more then a few million Christians who say Jesus is not God, are there not?”

Let me be very clear. There may well be a few million people who identify as Christians who say Jesus is not God. Jehovah’s Witnesses for this description very well. More recently, the Trifaith institute attempts interfaith unity by diminishing Jesus and elevating the Abrahamic connection.

I guess this touches on the trans debate too as there are many men who now identify as women. Even the outer appearance may change to reflect this self-identification but does that make them truly female?

One of the most interesting studies I have followed is on the attributes of God as revealed in the Bible. There are obviously many, but even taking some, attributes apply to Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I won’t try to instigate a spiritual tug of war (I often think the best way is to share a position and back it up with reasoning, like in maths where you show your working out), so here are some links to a series of studies that consider each of these characteristics, along with examples of where the Bible shows them applying to each member of the Godhead.

Spoiler: Does God exist? (Key question to start on!)

Roger Price - Does God Exist?

Roger Price - Does God Exist?. The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Spoiler: God, who is He?

Spoiler: God is eternal

Spoiler: God faithful and true

Spoiler: God never changes

Spoiler: God’s omniscience

Spoiler: God’s sovereignty

Roger Price - God's Sovereignty

Roger Price - God's Sovereignty. The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Spoiler: God’s holiness

Roger Price - God's Holiness

Roger Price - God's Holiness. The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Spoiler: God’s omnipotence

Roger Price God's Omnipotence

Roger Price - God's Omnipotence. The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Spoiler: The Trinity

Part 1

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part One)

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part One). The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Part 2

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part Two)

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part Two). The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

Part 3

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part Three)

Roger Price - The Trinity (Part Three). The Character of God. Basic Bible Studies.

youtu.be

^Anyone who is interested in the question can check out the above, open a Bible and come to their own conclusions. Or not ;-)

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

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^ I think this old advert says it well

You mention that God has the Attribute of Ete

I only believe in one God too... one God with Soul and Spirit who created man in His image with soul and spirit.

But i would not call me a muslim because that term is islamic... and the Bible outs the god or allah of islam as the devil.

No you don't TokiEI.

You worship 3 Gods. The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

These entities can not all be one because Christians believe that the Son died. So either 1) The Son died and the Father didn't die which would necessitate that God is alive and dead at the same time or 2) The Father also died and then He wouldn't be God because God is eternal.

Anyone with sound reasoning can see the Islamic concept of God makes more sense. Yet you are arguing we must believe something that makes no sense or we will burn in hellfire for eternity. Not only does it not make sense but this belief that our salvation is based upon according to Christians is not EXPLICTLY stated in the Bible. There is no clear verse about the trinity. However, there are multiple verses that indicate that God is one. For example, "hear oh Israel your Lord is One God" or where Jesus said "this is eternal life that you may know the ONLY TRUE GOD and Jesus Christ who he sent".

These are clear evidences and you will only be able to reply with verbal gymnastics.

 

[TokiEl]

You worship 3 Gods. The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

Absolutely not.

Only One God with Soul and Spirit.


You guys even believe in soul and spirit?

 

[billy t]

A soul/spirit is not from the Attributes of Allah. The Islamic texts that mention the "soul of Allah" are not understood to mean that Allah has the attribute of a soul. This is similar to when Allah says the House of Allah or the “she-camel of Allaah or the servants of Allah. The texts that mention a spirit is referring to the angel who is assigned the task of delivering revelation to messengers of God.

 

[TokiEl]

These entities can not all be one because Christians believe that the Son died. So either 1) The Son died and the Father didn't die which would necessitate that God is alive and dead at the same time or 2) The Father also died and then He wouldn't be God because God is eternal.

God can do anything.

You limit God according to your understanding... but even i have more understanding than you.

Nothing is impossible for God.

Anyone with sound reasoning can see the Islamic concept of God makes more sense.

It doesn't matter... because God's book the Bible outs the allah of islam as the devil.

 

[billy t]

Let me put it another way. We believe that Jesus received revelation via an angel which the Islamic texts refer to as a "ruh" (soul). So we have 3 distinct entities here. Allah (God), Angel Gabriel and Jesus who received the message. This is the same in regard to other Messengers of God. So yeah, they are separate entities. They are not all one being.

 

[AmazingGrace]

A soul/spirit is not from the Attributes of Allah. The Islamic texts that mention the "soul of Allah" are not understood to mean that Allah has the attribute of a soul. This is similar to when Allah says the House of Allah or the “she-camel of Allaah or the servants of Allah. The texts that mention a spirit is referring to the angel who is assigned the task of delivering revelation to messengers of God.

Do I understand it correctly that you don't believe human is body, soul and spirit?
How do you explain astral travel/astral projection?

 

[billy t]

God can do anything.

You limit God according to your understanding... but even i have more understanding than you.

Nothing is impossible for God.




It doesn't matter... because God's book the Bible outs the allah of islam as the devil.

As Muslims we make a distinction between who God is and what God does.

God does not have the Attribute of forgetfulness for example so for someone to ask "can God forget" is an illogical question in the first place because God doesn't forget by default.

 

[billy t]

Do I understand it correctly that you don't believe human is body, soul and spirit?
How do you explain astral travel/astral projection?

Yes, correct. We believe every human being has a body and soul. The physical body dies but the soul is eternal. This is why Allah says "do not say those who are killed in the way of Allah are dead verily they are alive but you perceive not". Allah says "they ask you (Muhammad) about the soul, say it is from the affairs of my Lord and you have not been given knowledge about it except a very little".

 

[TokiEl]

Let me put it another way. We believe that Jesus received revelation via an angel which the Islamic texts refer to as a "ruh" (soul). So we have 3 distinct entities here. Allah (God), Angel Gabriel and Jesus who received the message. This is the same in regard to other Messengers of God. So yeah, they are separate entities. They are not all one being.

Hindus believe the veda and buddhists believe the sutras and muslims believe the quran etc etc... they are all the devil's deceptions.

God's book is the Bible.

 

[Tidal]

Let me put it another way. We believe that Jesus received revelation via an angel..

Not exactly, because when Jesus was in heaven before coming to earth, he got his instructions directly from God himself-

Jesus said- "No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven - me" (John 3:13)
"For I have not spoken on my own authority; but the Father who sent me gave me a command, what I should say and what I should speak" (John 12:49)

That sets him totally apart from all other religious founders because they only got their instructions from an "angel" or whatever, which of course could have been satan in disguise-

"..for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." (2 Cor 11:13/14)

 

[AmazingGrace]

Speaking of contradictions. The trinity theory contradicts itself.

View attachment 55901 How is this possible? Short answer, its not.

"How can I stand
Before a mystery
And claim I comprehend
The maker of all things?"

I believe it does make sense, even tho it can be difficult to grasp. It doesn't necessary makes triune God a contradiction, just probably a human living in 3 dimensions can never fully comprehend something so much 'higher'. I think our minds are very limited in this matter.

Maybe it's not the best argument to support my point but by using some drugs people claim you can come to a state of mind where the mind is not limited and all this makes total sense. Not that I would try

 

[Maldarker]

Anyone here of quantum mechanics? This field for one describes the script of JESUS appearing to many people after his resurrection at the same time. We are so limited in our view of things.

 

[Daze]

"How can I stand
Before a mystery
And claim I comprehend
The maker of all things?"

I believe it does make sense, even tho it can be difficult to grasp. It doesn't necessary makes triune God a contradiction, just probably a human living in 3 dimensions can never fully comprehend something so much 'higher'. I think our minds are very limited in this matter.

Maybe it's not the best argument to support my point but by using some drugs people claim you can come to a state of mind where the mind is not limited and all this makes total sense. Not that I would try

It is impossible to grasp. Jesus is god, the Father is god. However Jesus is not the father? The Father is not Jesus?

How does this make since to anyone that hasn't been indoctrinated with it from the cradle?
That's what it boils down to, cognitive dissonance.

Recall when Jesus said...
By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.
(John 5:30)
..exactly like every prophet before and after him.

Not only does Jesus admit to being completely powerless without God, he also says God sent him.
He also highlights how they are DIFFERENT. "Not myself but Him who sent me" Re-read that.

"Not Myself but Him who sent me"..
Read it again
"Not Myself but Him who sent me"

WHO SENT JESUS?????????

As i have repeatedly mentioned there are over 90 verses in the Bible that reject the divinity of Jesus while there is not a single one.. Not One verse where Jesus says.. "worship me".

You are free to believe what you like, but you should know those who break the first commandment will return to an angry Lord when they find the grave.

God guides whomever he wills.

 

[TokiEl]

It is impossible to grasp. Jesus is god, the Father is god. However Jesus is not the father? The Father is not Jesus?

Is it impossible to grasp that man is body soul and spirit ?

You perceive God from your human perspective tainted by the devil's dictation called the quran.

In God's book the Bible... He is the Word of God who became the only begotten Son of God to pay the price for our sins... so we can be forgiven if we repent.



John 1 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made...

9The true Light who gives light to every man was coming into the world. 10He was in the world, and though the world was made through Him, the world did not recognize Him...

14The Word became flesh and made His dwelling among us. We have seen His glory, the glory of the only begotten Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.

 

[AmazingGrace]

It is impossible to grasp. Jesus is god, the Father is god. However Jesus is not the father? The Father is not Jesus?

How does this make since to anyone that hasn't been indoctrinated with it from the cradle?
That's what it boils down to, cognitive dissonance.

Recall when Jesus said...
By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.
(John 5:30)
..exactly like every prophet before and after him.

Not only does Jesus admit to being completely powerless without God, he also says God sent him.
He also highlights how they are DIFFERENT. "Not myself but Him who sent me" Re-read that.

"Not Myself but Him who sent me"..
Read it again
"Not Myself but Him who sent me"

WHO SENT JESUS?????????

As i have repeatedly mentioned there are over 90 verses in the Bible that reject the divinity of Jesus while there is not a single one.. Not One verse where Jesus says.. "worship me".

You are free to believe what you like, but you should know those who break the first commandment will return to an angry Lord when they find the grave.

God guides whomever he wills.

You picked beautiful passage, but no, you didn't get it the examples with different dimensions explain it well.

God the Father is the The Will, the main brain (for lack of better word).
Jesus is The Word spoken by The Will - the word has to be first thought by the brain to be spoken, that's why it cannot do anything without The Will.
As John starts his gospel:
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it."

 

[AmazingGrace]

Anyone here of quantum mechanics? This field for one describes the script of JESUS appearing to many people after his resurrection at the same time. We are so limited in our view of things.

Sounds interesting, would you mind to elaborate it more?

 

[Daze]

You picked beautiful passage, but no, you didn't get it the examples with different dimensions explain it well.

God the Father is the The Will, the main brain (for lack of better word).
Jesus is The Word spoken by The Will - the word has to be first thought by the brain to be spoken, that's why it cannot do anything without The Will.
As John starts his gospel:
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it."

Jesus is the creation sent to spread Gods will and that's just a fact.
Just like every prophet before him. Just like every prophet after him.

Back to the question you failed to answer. Who sent Jesus in John 5:30?

Jesus clearly says in the Bible he was sent. The question is who can dictate to "God"?
Who can tell thee ultimate authority to go anywhere?

I hope my one and only question is not lost. Who sent Jesus in John 5:30?

 

[Maes17]

I only believe in one God too... one God with Soul and Spirit who created man in His image with soul and spirit.

But i would not call me a muslim because that term is islamic... and the Bible outs the god or allah of islam as the devil.

I won’t argue your beliefs nor islamic beliefs. Religion is a ground I won’t tread on. Other than I only worship one God/Allah whomever you prefer to call the higher being

 

[AmazingGrace]

Jesus is the creation sent to spread Gods will and that's just a fact.
Just like every prophet before him. Just like every prophet after him.

Back to the question you failed to answer. Who sent Jesus in John 5:30?

Jesus clearly says in the Bible he was sent. The question is who can dictate to "God"?
Who can tell thee ultimate authority to go anywhere?

I hope my one and only question is not lost. Who sent Jesus in John 5:30?

This depends on where you believe Jesus was when God send him.
If he was just a man living his life when God sent him, your conclusion would make sense.

But from what Jesus say in other parts of scripture, you can see it was not so.
One of the things that angered Jews the most was when Jesus said:
“Very truly I tell you, before Abraham was born, I AM!”

This statement says a lot. Jews made fun of him, how could he met Abraham when he wasn't even 50, and then he dropped this bomb,
1. where he claims to be God - I AM was name God introduced himself to Moses when he sent him to get Israelites out of Egypt.

Spoiler

BTW "I AM" is used a lot in Marvel movies as a mockery of God, a compilation should be made. The characters often make a dramatic pause and say I AM! This one with Thanos and Iron Man is just one of many examples.

2. He, Jesus, claimed to exist before Abraham.

Jesus, The Word of God, was with God from the beginning, way before Abraham was born, way before everything was created, because through him (The Word/ Jesus) all things were made; without him (The Word/Jesus) nothing was made that has been made. (Genesis: And then God SAID "Let there be light")

So in the moment when God sent his WORD to become flesh, to become a man, the WORD was with God.
Just like my words are with me, in my mind, before they separate from me and appear in digital form as letters and words, and are sent to you or whoever will read them.

 

[Tidal]

No doubt people asked Jesus to explain the Big Picture, but he knew our human minds hadn't the horsepower to take it all in-
"You hardly believe me when I tell you earthly things, so how would you believe me if I told you heavenly things?....
....I know where I came from and where I am going, but you have no idea where I come from or where I am going..You are from below, I am from above. You are of this world, I am not of this world" (John 3:12,John 10:38,8:14,8:23)

Nevertheless he did give us some interesting glimpses like when he was asked about husbands and wives in heaven and he replied-
"At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage, they will be like the angels in heaven" (Matt 22:30)
Thereby saying we'll be 'spiritual beings' up there without physical bodies.

As for how to get there, here's an interesting passage-
"Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?”
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me" (John 14:2-6)

So in modern terms we have to 'lock on' or 'mindmeld' with him while we're still alive in order to get him and God into our heads, so that when we die our souls automatically home in on him-
"On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you" (John 14:20)