Did Jesus Christ give christians license to sin ?

Kung Fu

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No worries.
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Answer: I sin no more.

In the Paul thread, you said you'll take Jesus' words any day. So here's His statement to the woman caught in adultery (John 8)

And Jesus said to her,
“Neither do I condemn you; go and sin no more.”

And how is it any different from what @rainerann said?
First off, the story of the adulteress woman is an interpolation and is not in your two oldest and most complete Bibles. But let's say it wasn't an interpolation did she then go and never sin again? Did she become perfect all of a sudden because she was "born again"?

Here I'll quote Rainerann again because you guys refuse to acknowledge it. Your pride is getting in the way so I understand.

Rainerann said:
You cannot be born again and continue to sin. There is not such thing as a person who continue committing adultery after becoming saved. It would make you miserable. If is like having an allergic reaction to sin when you are sealed with the Holy Spirit.
 

Kung Fu

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@Kung Fu -

Here is an interesting one - does the Bible teach that all believers are sinless and without fault the moment they believe and from then on? What do the Book of Acts and the letters of Paul indicate?
I'll answer your question after you answer mine which I have been asking forever but all of you seem to be beating around the bush and not giving me a clear answer.

Rainerann said:
You cannot be born again and continue to sin. There is not such thing as a person who continue committing adultery after becoming saved. It would make you miserable. If is like having an allergic reaction to sin when you are sealed with the Holy Spirit.
Once you become "born again" do you still continue to sin or do you sin no more?

If I lie before I become "born again" would I stop lying after I become "born again" or would I still lie?
 

Lisa

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I believe Hebrews 6:4-6 is talking about a person that is very close to being saved. They are enlightened to the truth, everything make sense, the power of God is there, the Holy Ghost is working through them, all they got to do is accept the free gift and received eternal life right that moment. BUT they walk away and straight up denied the free gift from Jesus Christ which put Him to open shame. This person instantly became a reprobate, thus un-repentable, thus impossible to be saved.

He desired all to be saved right? If we can lose it, why not teach those who are saved to kill themself now [instant heaven] rather than living and risking fallen away, becoming a reprobate, fallen from grace, taking the beast mark...etc

Once someone received the Gospel, next put a bullet in their head is probably the best choice IF they can lose it.
Read the verses again...
Hebrews 6:4-8
For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

They have been enlightened, they are partakers of the Holy Spirit...that is key. Does the Holy Spirit come to non believers? No, the Helper helps the saved person. These people are saved. I’d they weren’t saved they could still be renewed to faith...couldn’t they? I mean that would be the first time for them. They wouldn’t be recrucifying Jesus at that point.

Because God doesn’t work that way. YES! He wants all to be saved but it is your choice whether you want to be saved, He forces no one to be saved and He forces no one to keep it. It’s all our choice, and you know how humans can be....

To say kill yourself...well that act alone doesn’t save you does it?

That’s some seriously wrong stuff to say...why don’t you do what the Bible teaches and be a good berean, testing what you hear against it? Because the downfall seems to be deceit. Believing lies against the truth of scripture. We are warned over and over deceivers will come...why warn agains that at all if we are indeed once saved always saved? We are warned because it’s it’s deadly to our faith!! Think about it Floss. Are you wanting something to be true despite the verses telling you otherwise? Not just that verse, others as well.
 

Lisa

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@Lisa

What do you make of the Corinthian believer who is put out of the church for his sexual immorality with his mother in Law, given over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, (surely "fallen away"), and yet restored to repentance in 2 Corinthians 2

"4For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you.

5But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all. 6Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many. 7So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow. 8Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.9For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things. 10To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ; 11Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices."

This restoration is the experience of many a "prodigal son" and argues against the loss of salvation interpretation of the passage from Hebrews 6:4-6.

I am reminded of the words of a Keith Green song I heard years ago.

Yes, well falling away doesn’t happen on one thing does it? It’s a gradual disbelief in the truth of God’s word, the going the wrong path, taking that broader way, of you will, instead of staying on the narrow way...
 
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floss

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Would God saved somebody and knew full well down the road they would lose it?

I was using death as an extreme example to seal salvation since that is probably a lot easier than to maintaining salvation. There are many way one can die without killing themself.

When an unbeliever attend a spirit filled church and see amazing healing. Wouldn’t you consider them partaker of the Holy Spirit?

I believe it make way more sense that those who fallen away never placed 100% faith in Jesus. Not all Christians are saved. Not all Pastors are saved. But they are very close, like a few here that rely on faith + wonderful works.
 
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Lisa

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Would God saved somebody and knew full well down the road they would lose it?

I was using death as an extreme example to seal salvation since that is probably a lot easier than to maintaining salvation. There are many way one can die without killing themself.

When an unbeliever attend a spirit filled church and see amazing healing. Wouldn’t you consider them partaker of the Holy Spirit?

I believe it make way more sense that those who fallen away never placed 100% faith in Jesus. Not all Christians are saved. Not all Pastors are saved. But they are very close, like a few here that rely on faith + wonderful works.
Think about this verse....
Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. Romans 11:20-22

Its not as if God has just started this. And He warns us about it. People don’t like to believe it because that’s a scary thing to think about but forewarned is fore armed. How many times did God warn His people about stuff and they didn’t like it, and blew it off and then when the thing happened they were freaking out? God tells us, it can’t get any clearer than what He says, yet people still don’t want to believe it. There is nothing new under the sun....

About the Holy Spirit, the Helper...
I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17
So, you see, the person in the verse, does know God, that person is a believer and has fallen away. He can’t be redeemed because he would then put Christ to shame.

You’re right not all people that say they are Christians are Christians, but the Holy Spirit knows and the Spirit will only go to Christians, the world cannot receive Him....
 

floss

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Think about this verse....
Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. Romans 11:20-22
- spare not and cut off here could just mean physical death like King Saul

About the Holy Spirit, the Helper...
I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17
I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17

How can one fallen away if the Holy Spirit be with them Forever?

There are many unsaved Christians that are partaker of the Holy Spirit. They seen miracles in churches, seen the hand of God working in the church but does this mean they are saved? Not necessarily, these unsaved Christians can be considered partaker of the Holy Spirits and still fallen away because they have not placed 100% in Jesus.
 

Lisa

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- spare not and cut off here could just mean physical death like King Saul


I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17

How can one fallen away if the Holy Spirit be with them Forever?

There are many unsaved Christians that are partaker of the Holy Spirits. They seen miracles in churches, seen the hand of God working in the church but does this mean they are saved? Not necessarily, these unsaved Christians can be considered partaker of the Holy Spirits and still fallen away because they have not placed 100% in Jesus.
What did it mean for Israel to be cut off? They lost their place temporarily and are now in unbelief. Which happens to be a good thing for us Gentiles..but still.

Ya, He will be with you forever, IF you reman in His kindness, if you do not, you will be cut off. Or, put another way, if it yields only thorns and thistles it is worthless and close to being cursed and it ends up being burned. I don’t know that that sounds like physical death, but it does have connotations of the lake of fire.....Seems pretty cut and dried to me.

Do you think Ananias and Sapphira were cut off as you term it?
 

Damien50

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I'll answer your question after you answer mine which I have been asking forever but all of you seem to be beating around the bush and not giving me a clear answer.



Once you become "born again" do you still continue to sin or do you sin no more?

If I lie before I become "born again" would I stop lying after I become "born again" or would I still lie?
I still do.
 

Lisa

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@Lisa

"Do you think Ananias and Sapphira were cut off as you term it?"

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.gotquestions.org/amp/sin-unto-death.html
Well, I was asking Floss that question. For, me, I think that if it gets that bad that God has to take you out, you’ve got to be pretty bad, don’t you? Here they were making a mockery of God and thought they were going to get away with it. Do you think anyone sitting there that day thinks that God took them out but they are still believers and they will be with God? I find it highly doubtful myself.
 

floss

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Ya, He will be with you forever, IF you reman in His kindness,
I don't see that IF condition anywhere here. Unless forever does not mean forever. Please don't add to scriptures.

The Holy Spirits indwell you now and [forever] right? If you can lose it, then that make God a liar because it was NOT forever.

I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17
 

Lisa

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I don't see that IF condition anywhere here. Unless forever does not mean forever. Please don't add to scriptures.

The Holy Spirits indwell you now and [forever] right? If you can lose it, then that make God a liar because it was NOT forever.

I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. John 14:16-17
It was in the Romans verse I gave to you earlier. I was going by that as well.
Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. Romans 11:20-22

I don’t think it makes God a liar if you fall away. Forever with the Holy Spirit provided you don’t fall away. I don’t see a problem with that. Especially when it says that He may be with you forever, I don’t see it as He will be with you forever.
May- used to indicate possibility or probability <you may be right>
Its not a guarantee....
 

Kung Fu

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No worries.
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Answer: I sin no more.
LOL! Are you equating yourself to Jesus after you were born again? I can guarantee you sinned plenty of times more after you became "born again". You might not have wanted too but you did.
 

floss

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Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. Romans 11:20-22
Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith.

This here tell me they were never a believer to begin with [unsaved]. How can the Holy Spirit indwelled unbeliever? This is not talking about they goes from belief into unbelief, they were never saved. God will not spare ANY unbeliever. But he will spare those who are saved, believed, those who has the Holy Spirit indwelled in them Forever.
 
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