Because iniquity will abound...........Matt. 24:8-12

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The visible church is blind to the sign of the times. The Liberals, progressive's, The left, George Soros, Black lives matter, Hollywood, popular music artist, Once Christian Colleges and universities turned liberal, Hillary Clinton, Maxine Waters, NAACP, TV millionaire preachers and to many more to count have brought this country to the description in Matthew 24:8-12 Because iniquity will abound, the love of many will grow cold. The Democratic party has called for civil disobedience against all who do not agree with them. They are heady, high minded, liars, truce breakers, backbiters, against all the is good, always stirring up turmoil with the News Stations helping them out. This November mid election will give a glimpse what is to come....everything is heading just the way Christ said it would, yet the visible church is clueless. He is coming! Iniquity IS abounding!!! And the civil services are breaking down with it....and the only love left....is Christ.
 

cfowen

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I can't see Mt 24 having anything to do with end times of the present age. It's all-Israel. It's much more suited to the last 3-1/2 years of the tribulation. For the last days of the present age, go to a book that deals with the present age, like 2Timothy. The 7th verse is easily proven by reading the writings of about 90% of the people on this forum or any other Christian Forum on the planet. By working hand in hand with the Denominational System, Satan has done a marvelous job of dumbing Christendom down! Most are saved, but most will end up on the New Earth, where people with NO calling, like Adam and the malefactor on the cross will go.
2Tim 3:1-7
1This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Christ is Coming (the parousia), but it will be at least 50 years before He comes, about 45 years until this present 2000 years, all-Gentile period is finished and then at the end of the tribulation, at the 7th trump of Revelation. Christ will then return and resurrect (rapture) the small Acts church, (which is all-Israel, since the Gentiles in Acts were all grafted into Israel) plus many, many of the elite of Israel throughout history. The resurrected Saints will meet Him in the air and then return with Him to the earth, to be there for the Millennium. If there is a pre-Millennium earthly Kingdom, which I think there will be, that could add as much as another 700 years before Christ returns. It is impossible that this raptured bunch will be taken to Heaven, because no Jew, except Christ, ever had a Calling to go to Heaven. The only people going to the uncreated Heaven are tofay's Gentiles. Search and See.

The old-wives tale that we can expect Him at any time is similar to the lies the Denominational Churches feed the sheep. Here's a few examples: There is a hell, Man HAS a soul, People go immediately to Heaven when they die, The church is Israel, Abraham is our father, We should be water baptized, We must take communion, The church is carrying out the Great Commission, and a jillion others.

The only people that are EVER said to have a Hope of going to Heaven are the present-day members of the Gentile Church found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles. No one living today will have a part in the all-Israel rapture. Our "rapture" is called the "Appearing" in Paul's latter books.The Greek word for the "coming" of Christ is "parousia", whereas the Greek for"appearing" is "epiphaneia". Different word, Different event .In the "parousia", He comes to earth to meet the Jewish Saints in the air and then takes them back to the earth. In the "epiphaneia", we resurrected Gentiles are translated to Him, to meet Him, when he first appears to His creation in Heavenly Places, the Heaven of Heavens, the Holy of Holies, the Highest Heaven, Far Above All Heavens, GLORY!

Except for the pre-Millennial Kingdom, everything I said above can be backed up directly with scripture. As far as the pre-Millennial Kingdom is concerned, there is plenty of circumstantial evidence in the Bible to make it about a 75% probability that it will take place. Besides Christ, the main topic of the Bible is Israel's earthly Kingdom, You can find it on most every page of the 59 all-Israel books - the OT, the Gospels, the Acts, all books written during Acts, and the Revelation. Today's truth for us Gentiles is found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts books.

Stuff I Forgot to Add:
(1)
The reason the 2nd Coming is impossible during this present 2000 years Gentile period is because Israel, as a nation, has not existed, in God's eyes, since about 63AD. For disbelief, Israel were set aside in Ac 28:28, when the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from them and given to the Gentiles, The Gentiles never had Jesus Christ during Acts, Ephesians 2:11-12. In Matthew 23:39 , Christ said He would not return until Israel accepted Him. Therefore, since Israel doesn't exist and won't exist until about 2063 it is impossible for them to repent and, therefore, Christ won't return, at least until Israel is back on the scene.

Israel's present situation is pretty much spelled out in the book of Hosea, Here is a very small portion of that scripture. In Hos 6:2, the 2 days are surely 2000 years, because it surely fits the reality. We'll see in 2063 or 2064.
Hosea 1:9
Then said God, Call his name Loammi: for ye are not my people, and I will not be your God.
Hosea 3:4-5
4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince, and without a sacrifice, and without an image, and without an ephod, and without teraphim:
5 Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the Lord their God, and David their king; and shall fear the Lord and his goodness in the latter days.
Hosea 6:2
After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

(2) The false idea that Christ will return TWICE, that there is a SECOND SECOND COMING COMING, is a doctrine conceived 100% by man. with lots of help by Satan (like in the visions Satan gave that little Scottish girl 200 years ago). There is nothing in scripture that will even start to prove that Christ will come once to pick up the Saints, the vast majority of which are Jews, take them to Heaven, and return later to rule in the Millennium. Satan doesn't want you to SEE your Calling to the Highest Heaven in Paul's post-Acts epistles, because, if you don't see it, believe it, and claim it, you don't get it. That's where Satan aspired to go but wasn't allowed to. So, his trick it to keep you in Acts, where NOBODY EVER had a Hope of Heaven, through the false belief that the rapture is yours. If you want Heaven, you must vacate Acts and focus on Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus, and Philemon.
 
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TokiEl

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He is Coming (the parousia), but it will be at least 50 years before He comes,
According to my knowledge and understanding the 70th and last week of Daniel began on September 23 2015 the Day of Atonement.

And so we don't have that luxury of time of kicking the can down the road another 50 years.
 

cfowen

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According to my knowledge and understanding the 70th and last week of Daniel began on September 23 2015 the Day of Atonement.

And so we don't have that luxury of time of kicking the can down the road another 50 years.
The present 2000 year period is parenthetical as far as ANYTHING involving Israel is concerned. Israel does not exist, in God's eyes. All prophecies from the OT ceased to be fulfilled,, from 63AD until this period is over with. In essence, it's as though this 2000 years never happened. Except for prophecy about Israel being set aside, in Hosea, I know of nothing in the Bible that even hints at anything that has happened in the last 1900+ years. If the nation of Israel had repented in the Gospels or the Acts, this present 2000 year period would not have ever happened.

The ONLY thing happening during this 2000 years is that the Gentiles are being called to ultimately be resurrected to fill the Highest Heaven, God's abode, the Holy of Holies, where Christ now sits at the right hand of God, Ephesians 1:20 (Christ), Ephesians 2:6 (Us).. EVERYTHING about this 2000 year period was hid in a Mystery (secret) in God ( Ephesians 3:9 , Colossians 1:26 ) from every age and generation, until Christ revealed it to Paul, Ephesian 3:3, and Paul revealed it to the world in his 7 post-Acts epistles. Everything Paul taught during Acts could be found in the OT, Acts 26:22. Nothing after Acts is found in the OT. Therefore, you must rightly divide (correctly Cut) God's word, 2 Timothy 2:15 to divide what belongs to us Gentiles, today, as found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts books, from what belongs to Israel, in those other 59 all-Israel books.

So, nothing Daniel prophesied or anyone else in the OT has prophesied has been fulfilled since 63AD. No prophecy will be fulfilled until the Gentile Church has been resurrected and Israel is back in God's graces, about 2063. The famous preachers that have prophecy ministries are literally robbing the sheep, through ignorance and lies, by feeding them 100% untruths.
 
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TokiEl

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The present 2000 year period is parenthetical as far as ANYTHING involving Israel is concerned. Israel does not exist, in God's eyes.
Right that is your record.


So, nothing Daniel prophesied or anyone else in the OT has prophesied has been fulfilled since 63AD. The people that have prophecy ministries are literally robbing the sheep, through ignorance and lies.
Well we will see i have put my head on the chopping block so to speak by saying that Daniel's 70th and last week began on September 23 2015... so within 4 or 5 months we would be in the middle of the week where some sort of destruction (nuclear i presume) is foretold to take place.
 

cfowen

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Right that is your record.
Well we will see i have put my head on the chopping block so to speak by saying that Daniel's 70th and last week began on September 23 2015... so within 4 or 5 months we would be in the middle of the week where some sort of destruction (nuclear i presume) is foretold to take place.
When a preacher I had, about 30 years ago, was preaching something he couldn't quite prove with scripture, he always said he was going to crawl out on this limb, and someone was bound to saw it off.
 

TokiEl

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When a preacher I had, about 30 years ago, was preaching something he couldn't quite prove with scripture, he always said he was going to crawl out on this limb, and someone was bound to saw it off.
It is possible to Scripturally prove that Daniel's 70th and last week began on September 23 2015.

And i have shown that proof more times than i can count so as i said i have put my head or credibility on the chopping block.

I am not a prophet but by God i can interpret the prophets.

We will see.
 

cfowen

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It is possible to Scripturally prove that Daniel's 70th and last week began on September 23 2015.

And i have shown that proof more times than i can count so as i said i have put my head or credibility on the chopping block.

I am not a prophet but by God i can interpret the prophets.

We will see.
And I have shown that, since there is no Israel in God's eyes today, it is 100% impossible for any OT prophecy to be fulfilled for at least another 45 years, or, until this present Gentile period is over. None has been fulfilled since about 63AD. 1948 was a sham that had nothing to do with God.

So, in essence, you're saying that the 3-1/2 years of the tribulation will start in February, 2019 and Christ will return in Sept. 2022? I see a few others on the internet that have picked the same start date. Many have picked 9/23/2017 as a start.

Reminds me of "88 reasons why the Rapture will be in 1988", or whatever the name of that worthless book was, that everyone back then bit into - including yours truly. Had I known, back then, the truth that no one living today will go through the rapture, I certainly wouldn't have bought that lousy book.
 
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TokiEl

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And I have shown that, since there is no Israel in God's eyes today, it is 100% impossible for any OT prophecy to be fulfilled for at least another 45 years, or, until this present Gentile period is over. None has been fulfilled since about 63AD. 1948 was a sham that had nothing to do with God.
I respectfully disagree dawg.


So, in essence, you're saying that the 3-1/2 years of the tribulation will start in February, 2019 and Christ will return in Sept. 2022? I see a few others on the internet that have picked the same start date. Many have picked 9/23/2017 as a start.
I don't know the day or hour when Jesus Christ returns.

But the prophetic timeline in Daniel 9 points to September 23 2015 as the start of the 70th and last week.

He the prince of the people who destroyed the city and the sanctuary confirmed a covenant with many exactly seven weeks after the Jews restored control over Jerusalem again.

So... what can i say... it's not writen in the stars this time but in the Scriptures.

And as He said the Scriptures cannot be broken !
 

cfowen

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I respectfully disagree dawg.




I don't know the day or hour when Jesus Christ returns.

But the prophetic timeline in Daniel 9 points to September 23 2015 as the start of the 70th and last week.

He the prince of the people who destroyed the city and the sanctuary confirmed a covenant with many exactly seven weeks after the Jews restored control over Jerusalem again.

So... what can i say... it's not writen in the stars this time but in the Scriptures.

And as He said the Scriptures cannot be broken !
But you do know He will return at the 7th trumpet, at the end of the 3-1/2 years.

So, you're basing it all on the very iffy wannabe-fact that 1948 fulfilled prophecy. What makes you think that it did fulfill prophecy? The prophesied return of Israel will involve them controlling all the LAND that was promised and, according to the map in the link, what they do control now is a tiny pittance of what was promised. All prophecy of their return involves the land, which they definitely don't possess.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible.
 

TokiEl

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But you do know He will return at the 7th trumpet, at the end of the 3-1/2 years.
Well isn't that what the Scriptures say... at the last trump ?



So, you're basing it all on the very iffy wannabe-fact that 1948 fulfilled prophecy.
No i'm basing it on the very specific prophetic timeline in Daniel 9.



What makes you think that it did fulfill prophecy?
Jews restoring control over Jerusalem demands a countdown in Daniel's timeline.
 

cfowen

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Well isn't that what the Scriptures say... at the last trump ?





No i'm basing it on the very specific prophetic timeline in Daniel 9.





Jews restoring control over Jerusalem demands a countdown in Daniel's timeline.
What is your starting point in the timeline, and why does it start at that time?

So, the fact that Israel only occupies and controls about 1% of the promised land doesn't bother you at all? Didn't the map say anything to you?

Can you provide prophecy where their return, when they're gathered by God, just involves their occupation of Jerusalem (actually, they still don't totally control all that red area) and not occupation and control of all the promised land?

I still maintain, with 100% confidence, that, since Israel are not God's people at the present time, it therefore is impossible for any prophecy involving Israel to be fulfilled until Israel are once again God's people. That won't happen until about 2063.

A teacher of mine set the beginning of Daniel's 70 week prophecy (not the 69 week one) at the dedication of the temple of 405BC. Add 490 years to that brings it up to 85AD, which would be the second coming of Christ, and, therefore, the end of the tribulation. However, time for EVERYTHING involving Israel stopped in 64AD, in Acts 28:28, when the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from Israel and given to the Gentiles, who had never had it (Him) before. Therefore, there are 85-64 = 21 years or 3 weeks left unfulfilled in this prophecy. It is impossible for ANY of those 3 weeks to be fulfilled until Israel is once again God's people which, at the earliest, will be 63AD or 64AD. At this point, I believe this analysis.

Israel will always have to keep the law. Israel can't keep the law right now because they have no temple and, of course, they can't sacrifice animals. Therefore, they are Loammi, "not My people", as in Hosea 1:9. There have been several other Loammi periods in Israel's history. For example, the 70 year Babylon captivity, another time when they weren't able to keep the law.

What about a temple? How can the abomination of desolation take place, to start the 2nd, 3-1/2 year part of the tribulation, without a temple? In your timeline, wouldn't it have to be fully constructed in the next 5 months? If the present day Jews have established a Holy Place, it is fake and certainly isn't sanctioned by God. God never does anything second-rate.
 
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TokiEl

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So, the fact that Israel only occupies and controls about 1% of the promised land doesn't bother you at all? Didn't the map say anything to you? Can you provide prophecy where their return just involves their occupation of Jerusalem and not occupation and control of all the promised land?
They are back in their own land just as foretold.

Will they get more land ?

Well if attacked they seem to end up with more land.
 

cfowen

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They are back in their own land just as foretold.

Will they get more land ?

Well if attacked they seem to end up with more land.

Where's the temple? Gotta have a temple to have a Holy Place. Gotta have a Holy Place for the last half of the trib to start. Gotta have a trib if it's Daniel's 70th week.
 

TokiEl

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Where's the temple? Gotta have a temple to have a Holy Place. Gotta have a Holy Place for the last half of the trib to start. Gotta have a trib if it's Daniel's 70th week.
Bodies are now the temple of God.

So it would be very strange if a temple was rebuilt to host God.
 

cfowen

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Bodies are now the temple of God.

So it would be very strange if a temple was rebuilt to host God.
Not yet,. As a nation, Israel is not even saved yet and won't be until they accept Christ. Please tell me how the abomination of desolation is going to stand in the Holy Place in the temple of bodies. You know as well as I do that only a literal temple will suffice in this discussion. You're reaching for straws.
 

TokiEl

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Not yet,. Israel is not even saved yet and won't be until they accept Christ. Please tell me how the abomination of desolation is going to sand in the Holy Place of bodies. You know as well as I do that only a literal temple will suffice.
The mark of the beast would then be an abomination of desolation.
 
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