Arab Ex-Muslim Woman: Muhammad FALSE, Jesus Christ is TRUTH!

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#1
 





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#4
People need to just wise up and consider a few things

1) in the past, if muslims and christians engaged in interfaith dialogue, what was discussed and what survives of it today? imo not much. Even if that dialogue took place, was it on fair terms? imo no. Were both sides well versed in each other's religious scripture/beliefs? imo no.

2) as a muslim who's been exposed to sectarian divides, i have seen every shade of opinion within islam. Muslims always disagree on issues and that is okay. it's important to have diverse opinions.

3) in reality true interfaith dialogue is a recent phenomenon but the people who got there first, built a monopoly. Because very few have professionally entered that arena. YET due to current events ie yankistan bombing muslims, sponsored terrorism, israel etc..interfaith dialogue has become a very touchy subject and so, going against the status quo can be taken negatively when it isn't understood.
The established opinions (mostly Ahmad Deedat's) are not so diverse and have gone unchallenged because very few deal with these topics. Also because those opinions were mass printed, distrubuted, records in audio, video, dominate search rankings. They have spread far and wide like never before.
therefore people have lost the ability to think for themselves and are just repeating memes from the early 20th century without realising it.

This has gone 10000x worse when there is an entire generation of youth who are completely new to the internet and even the english language and want to know what is going on in the world in light of various conflicts in muslim countries...as a result they've fallen into the trap of trusting the established (but exceptionlly poor) opinions.
Also there are many dawah/missionary types who do it for ego. in all honesty i think some of these guys do it to meet gullible females they can nikah with. it's been known to happen. So if someone challenges their narrative, they can turn on that person.

so overall i think muslims have gone the wrong way about dawah BUT they have still been relatively successful, but moreso due to the merits of islam itself.




4) remember people like Ahmad Deedat became missionaries/dawah men primarily because they witnessed the lies and tactics practiced by christian missionaries that go back to colonial times.
Yet many christians later reacted to the narratives being spread by muslims esp when they were anti-bible narratives. So in a way i can understand why, but also have to highlight the bigger picture...BUT christians shot themselves in the foot by lying further and using paid actors amongst many other tactics.
For example christians were very quick to buy out as many islam based domain names, all in order to prevent muslims from setting up islamic websites. The christians set up many anti-islam websites with domain names that sound islamic ie 'islamic-awareness' 'wikislam' and many many more.
these are TACTICS that i can't forget...
they speak volumes about so called 'christians'.

in this video the so called 'former mooselimb' is making this argument
'they think christians and jews cannot love them until they become like us' (this is based on what is written in the Quran)...the implication being that currently muslims have a deep hatred or distrust of christians....and that christians are so pious and loving towards us muslims.

using this 'love' meme to promote christianity all under this false assumption that islam is nothing but hatred and distrust.
You know what this is? it's an attempt to dehumanise islam and muslims as suspicious/hateful people.

That woman in the video displayed absolutely no proof she has legit knowledge of islam. It reminds me of when one christian here recently (i think it may have been claire herself) claimed she was reading the Quran and had read upto Surah 4...then claimed the book was boring and followed no pattern...
even though Surahs 2-4 actually do follow a lot of story and are lengthy, containing a lot of israelite/jewish history within them.

Then proceeded to bring up arguments that are obv from anti-islam websites but presenting them as if she had personally 'noticed' them (even though the related verses are not in the first 4 surahs.

These type of moves...don't go unnoticed..and if i notice it God certainly notices it.

bunch of ergun caner's.
 





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#5
they need a mic on a speaker to raise the volume?
they need a paid actor to come in 'i think islam is dead' and then tell him (on mic/speakers) to leave islam and become christian?
like i can't see through that nonsense.


Also her argument is nonsense, verse 5:33
The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His apostle and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement,


this context doesn't exist in canada or america or britain or france, these are neither islamic lands nor is the prophet SAW here for you to wage war against him. This verse had it's context when the muslims were fighting a war against pagans and they regularly attacked civilians


oh wait, then they attack the guy 'this is Taqqiyah'
so a dude who is saying 'islam is dead' (dont forget he was a paid actor) in a completely free society where his life is not under threat, is doing taqqiyah and is secretly muslim?
everyone with an ounce of honesty knows taqqiyah is only allowed when a muslim's life is under threat and can deny being muslim.....otherwise a muslim can never claim to be a non-muslim?

oh and next she claims that verse (33) applies to her as an apostate.

but it doesn't.

anything else?
 





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#6
I get where you are coming from, perhaps in the same way "Episcopalian Minister converts to Islam - MUST SEE" style content slides by me.

From my conversations with Muslims, the key sticking issues appear to include the following:

-Original sin and the Fall
-Our need for atonement
-Just "who" Jesus is
-Jesus's death and resurrection
-God's relationship to the Jews and His future dealings with them
-What He will do and say when He returns
-What relationship we can one day hope for with God

There are more issues but I find my thinking diverges from Islam most significantly over these questions.
 





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#7
Also her argument is nonsense, verse 5:33
The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His apostle and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement,
Yes the god of this world does not tolerate any opposition to himself. No they must be murdered or mutilated.

No wonder the followers of this god are so aggressive and oppressive... but the truth is that this god does not care about anybody. Because he is also the god of the Western establishment who seems to be on a perpetual bombing campaign against his Eastern worshipers.
 





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#8
Yes the god of this world does not tolerate any opposition to himself. No they must be murdered or mutilated.

No wonder the followers of this god are so aggressive and oppressive... but the truth is that this god does not care about anybody. Because he is also the god of the Western establishment who seems to be on a perpetual bombing campaign against his Eastern worshipers.
You believe in the old testament mate.
You even specifically believe that Yahweh is Jesus.

And don't tell me the new testament is any different
Look at how the parable of tenants results in 1m dead.
As for being oppressive/aggressive lmfao how many wars have Christians fought? European history is one big killing spree and the worst of it after your supposed enlightenment.

According to the book of revelation God's saints would /will be oppressed in this world and demanding justice when they're in heaven.

The mere fact you made such poor arguments is proof you have no credibility left whatsoever. Typical faux Christian....it's no wonder Jesus wants nothing to do with you. I
 





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#9
I get where you are coming from, perhaps in the same way "Episcopalian Minister converts to Islam - MUST SEE" style content slides by me.

From my conversations with Muslims, the key sticking issues appear to include the following:

-Original sin and the Fall
-Our need for atonement
-Just "who" Jesus is
-Jesus's death and resurrection
-God's relationship to the Jews and His future dealings with them
-What He will do and say when He returns
-What relationship we can one day hope for with God

There are more issues but I find my thinking diverges from Islam most significantly over these questions.
Thing is man...I actually understand the Christian side here and agree with it.
But I don't believe Jesus is the Trancendence Essence.
I can't remember the exact verse but we're told the invisible Father' revealed Himself through the son.
This fits in perfectly with my understanding of God's essence and manifestation where I view the Logos as a 'prism' of sorts that reflects the attributes of God ..and yet these attributes are primarily there for the whole process of creation and judgement etc. I also believe in collective consciousness where this 'light/essence' is also projected as a manifestation of God even in the material world ie Yahweh.
The trouble is making these topics known to people in a way that doesn't get mixed up in these 20th century poor narratives.

Original sin is not hard to grasp.
We are born with a nafs/serpent nature that causes us to sin even when we are not accountable for sin. Like a greedy jealous child. That nature remains with us our entire life and it causes us to experience imprisonment in barzakh/the grave where we are punished by the serpent ie according to the extent of our love and attachments to the material world. This is death.

Jesus came as the incarnate logos so effectively it is God's Immanence revealed through a man....in order to show people a way to conquer death by putting that serpent to death. Hence the cross represented the death of the serpent and all who saw it and believed were healed.
Or at least this is the theory.
I think that is long gone.
It is clear to me that the serpent/flesh is at work in these types of 'chrisrians'...

Btw many who convert to Islam do so due to their ignorance of the things I've highlighted above and they find a lower level simple theology from those dawah men. But there are many many exceptions and you can see that in those who follow and teach Sufi Islam. Like Hakim Murad, Hakim archuletta, sheikh Hamza Yusuf, they're all white converts/reverts to Islam and their views are anything but basic.

As for God's relationship with Jews....you guys can't even see that mystery Babylon is Israel and the network of elite juice who control the west (literally the whore sitting on the beast).
I'm well aware of ezekiel and Zechariah prophecies and know God is with the legit Bani Israel but that is a remnant who are likely hidden for now.

Revelation, I think it's chapter 12, tells us all about the remnant...the serpent wages war on them and they are taken to the wilderness where they survive.
Revelation tells us that they "believe in the testimony of Jesus AND follow the commandments"
That means they aren't Jews or Christians but the only religion that can fit that is Islam or it could mean the messianic Jews...but they have no connection to the wilderness.

Islam is connected with the wilderness.
So ethnic Jews who follow Islam since the beginning (remember Jews were in madina and some converted to Islam) there must be millions of them but today that are 'arabs'.

Btw one last point I'm dead certain Muslims don't do paid actor conversion stories.
 





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#10
You believe in the old testament mate.
You even specifically believe that Yahweh is Jesus.

And don't tell me the new testament is any different
Look at how the parable of tenants results in 1m dead.
As for being oppressive/aggressive lmfao how many wars have Christians fought? European history is one big killing spree and the worst of it after your supposed enlightenment.

According to the book of revelation God's saints would /will be oppressed in this world and demanding justice when they're in heaven.

The mere fact you made such poor arguments is proof you have no credibility left whatsoever. Typical faux Christian....it's no wonder Jesus wants nothing to do with you. I

Islam serve the same god as Freemasonry.

Freemasonry began because of European aristocratic knights converted to Islam during the Crusades.

And ever so slowly the Freemasonry faction took control in Europe and the United States and indeed all over the world. Most imams are also Freemasons. And that's why Muslims are now in the millions in Europe and the United States.

But you serve the wrong god or a god who is destined for hell.
 





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#11
Whats with Christians' strange obsession with convert testimonies, we could post alot the other way around too but its just weird. Are you that insecure in your faith that you need other testimonials to prove it? Bible should be enough of a testimony for your faith, hold on to that and move on.
 





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#12
As for God's relationship with Jews....you guys can't even see that mystery Babylon is Israel and the network of elite juice who control the west (literally the whore sitting on the beast).
I'm well aware of ezekiel and Zechariah prophecies and know God is with the legit Bani Israel but that is a remnant who are likely hidden for now.
Why is it Islam seems incapable of conquering Israel ? Did you ever think about that ?



Revelation, I think it's chapter 12, tells us all about the remnant...the serpent wages war on them and they are taken to the wilderness where they survive.
Revelation tells us that they "believe in the testimony of Jesus AND follow the commandments"
That means they aren't Jews or Christians but the only religion that can fit that is Islam or it could mean the messianic Jews...but they have no connection to the wilderness.
Islam is the only religion which fits the description of "believe in the testimony of Jesus AND follow the commandments"...?

Are you out of your mind man ?
 





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#13
Whats with Christians' strange obsession with convert testimonies, we could post alot the other way around too but its just weird. Are you that insecure in your faith that you need other testimonials to prove it? Bible should be enough of a testimony for your faith, hold on to that and move on.
A testimony is an evidence that supports a truth.

So you are saying that you're not interested in truths... which explains why you're still a Muslim.
 





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#14
Why is it Islam seems incapable of conquering Israel ? Did you ever think about that ?





Islam is the only religion which fits the description of "believe in the testimony of Jesus AND follow the commandments"...?

Are you out of your mind man ?
1) incapable? Muslims have had the holy land for longer than Jews and Christians.
Over 1200 years.
Christians crusaded and had the holy land for over 90 yrs at one point....did it last?

2) the antichrist is going to built a temple on the temple Mt. For this to happen there has to be a Jewish state.

3) USA is a masonic country...everyone knows that...and they have been attacking Muslim countries.

4) read it and weep.

Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring —those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus. - Revelation 12:17 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation12:17&version=NIV

That goes against the Pauline doctrine. It doesn't refer to messianic Jews either because I can't recall them going into the wilderness.

There is a reason why Jews settled in arabia...it's because Rome/Christians persecuted them.
Many of them accepted islam which means they believe in Jesus without the polytheistic trinitarian nonsense and follow the God's law.
 





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#15
If a Jew became Christian in the 1st century would you recognise his decendants today as Jews or would they be Coptic Christians or regular Europeans (perhaps even athiest today).
If a Jew became a Muslim in the 7th century they would be Arab today...in fact many Palestinians have Jewish blood in them.
Just because they're not recognised as Jews doesn't mean God has forgotten them..and it makes sense why Satan would target them because they are the remnant.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_ibn_Salam

How many decendants does this man have today? Probably millions.
 





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#16
A testimony is an evidence that supports a truth.

So you are saying that you're not interested in truths... which explains why you're still a Muslim.
That is patently false. A testimony even in court can be falsified. I'm a Christian and I generally call shenanigans on these testimonies. Anyone can get saved but where's the fruit? Not in sketchy YouTube videos.

She could still be a Muslim simply on principle of avoiding Christians like yourself.
 





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#17
A testimony is an evidence that supports a truth.

So you are saying that you're not interested in truths... which explains why you're still a Muslim.
Bible should be the only truth a Christian should need, not youtube videos about people converting left and right.
 





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#18
Thing is man...I actually understand the Christian side here and agree with it.
But I don't believe Jesus is the Trancendence Essence.
I can't remember the exact verse but we're told the invisible Father' revealed Himself through the son.
This fits in perfectly with my understanding of God's essence and manifestation where I view the Logos as a 'prism' of sorts that reflects the attributes of God ..and yet these attributes are primarily there for the whole process of creation and judgement etc. I also believe in collective consciousness where this 'light/essence' is also projected as a manifestation of God even in the material world ie Yahweh.
The trouble is making these topics known to people in a way that doesn't get mixed up in these 20th century poor narratives.

Original sin is not hard to grasp.
We are born with a nafs/serpent nature that causes us to sin even when we are not accountable for sin. Like a greedy jealous child. That nature remains with us our entire life and it causes us to experience imprisonment in barzakh/the grave where we are punished by the serpent ie according to the extent of our love and attachments to the material world. This is death.

Jesus came as the incarnate logos so effectively it is God's Immanence revealed through a man....in order to show people a way to conquer death by putting that serpent to death. Hence the cross represented the death of the serpent and all who saw it and believed were healed.
Or at least this is the theory.
I think that is long gone.
It is clear to me that the serpent/flesh is at work in these types of 'chrisrians'...

Btw many who convert to Islam do so due to their ignorance of the things I've highlighted above and they find a lower level simple theology from those dawah men. But there are many many exceptions and you can see that in those who follow and teach Sufi Islam. Like Hakim Murad, Hakim archuletta, sheikh Hamza Yusuf, they're all white converts/reverts to Islam and their views are anything but basic.

As for God's relationship with Jews....you guys can't even see that mystery Babylon is Israel and the network of elite juice who control the west (literally the whore sitting on the beast).
I'm well aware of ezekiel and Zechariah prophecies and know God is with the legit Bani Israel but that is a remnant who are likely hidden for now.

Revelation, I think it's chapter 12, tells us all about the remnant...the serpent wages war on them and they are taken to the wilderness where they survive.
Revelation tells us that they "believe in the testimony of Jesus AND follow the commandments"
That means they aren't Jews or Christians but the only religion that can fit that is Islam or it could mean the messianic Jews...but they have no connection to the wilderness.

Islam is connected with the wilderness.
So ethnic Jews who follow Islam since the beginning (remember Jews were in madina and some converted to Islam) there must be millions of them but today that are 'arabs'.

Btw one last point I'm dead certain Muslims don't do paid actor conversion stories.
I don't agree with any this, but I understand where you're coming from now. You've done your homework.

Have you ever read The Gargoyle? It is fiction, but it covers a lot of what you're talking about... especially the serpent energy and ridding oneself of it (sacral something, I think?). It's an amazing story, if I'm being honest. Dangerous theology, but I couldn't put it down.
Anyway
.. +1 for clarity.
 





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#19
I don't agree with any this, but I understand where you're coming from now. You've done your homework.

Have you ever read The Gargoyle? It is fiction, but it covers a lot of what you're talking about... especially the serpent energy and ridding oneself of it (sacral something, I think?). It's an amazing story, if I'm being honest. Dangerous theology, but I couldn't put it down.
Anyway
.. +1 for clarity.
Do you tend to disagree with everything because i'm a muslim or is it due to actual theology? I try to present my views in a way where I could also back it entirely using either entirely christian sources or muslim sources if I have to.


For example
We are born with a nafs/serpent nature that causes us to sin even when we are not accountable for sin. Like a greedy jealous child. That nature remains with us our entire life and it causes us to experience imprisonment in barzakh/the grave where we are punished by the serpent ie according to the extent of our love and attachments to the material world. This is death.

The 'flesh' spoke of in the bible, our carnal nature, is interpreted as a serpent. That is why Jesus said
Just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.

This goes much deeper if you understand the story of Moses and the serpents who punished the israelites. For example the serpent who tempted Adam and Eve (we call him iblees but these days people call him lucifer), he was once an angel, yet he fell/rebelled. Why/how did this even occur and why were such beings made of fire in the first place?
How could someone believe in/follow christianity or islam and not have an interest in knowing the why and how of lucifer/iblees?
Fire symbolises desire...when the world of multiplicity was created and beings became aware of their individuality, desire was born. If you read about the seraphs, St Thomas Aquinas described their 'fire' with good qualities ie
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seraph
First, the movement which is upwards and continuous. This signifies that they are borne inflexibly towards God.
Secondly, the active force which is "heat," which is not found in fire simply, but exists with a certain sharpness, as being of most penetrating action, and reaching even to the smallest things, and as it were, with superabundant fervor; whereby is signified the action of these angels, exercised powerfully upon those who are subject to them, rousing them to a like fervor, and cleansing them wholly by their heat.
Thirdly we consider in fire the quality of clarity, or brightness; which signifies that these angels have in themselves an inextinguishable light, and that they also perfectly enlighten others.


from this, this point is very important
the movement which is upwards and continuous.

So when this desire was upwards ie towards God, then it was 'light'. The moment lucifer/iblees was told about Adam, especially that Adam was superior...that 'fire' was moved away from God. the name Adam means Earth ie the material world. So suddenly fire/desire directed downwards to the material world, became what? it became satanic...as in a 'feiry serpent'.

What was unique and superior about Adam actually is that he was made in the image of God..and we know the image of God is the Logos which is basically 'everything'. So 'everything' in creation is in Adam..and that includes all the bad. We have desire and again when it's 'upwards' it is light and when it is downwards ie desire for the material world, it is a serpent. When the serpent tempted Adam and Eve to eat the forbidden fruit, he was only provoking and influencing the natural desire in them.

Physical death is really only 'passing away'. The real death occurs in the grave and like I said before it is due to our carnal attachments to the material world. It is really only an imprisonment. It is not like souls are completely unconscious in the grave.
Look at how Jesus talked about hades (ie the grave/underworld/barzakh)

Luke 16
19 “There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’
25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’
27 “He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’
29 “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’
30 “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’
31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’”


we all go to hades don't we? our situation in hades depends on the state of this 'fire' within us, if we were desired the material world, then nothing in the next life..and vice versa.

BUT
the israelites/jews suffered under the law and trying to control the serpent/fire.

James 4:1
What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don’t they come from your desires that battle within you?
You desire but do not have, so you kill. You covet but you cannot get what you want, so you quarrel and fight. You do not have because you do not ask God. 3 When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.


in reality, it is an impossible ask for humans to tame our nafs/serpent. the circumcision path did fail.

What Christianity really really teaches is about putting the fire itself to death ie the serpent on the cross. NO DESIRE, Total acceptance!!
There are certain teachings related to this, for example Love God and love thy neighbour=unity in multiplicity. To perceive God in all thing. In unity, there is no 'desire' because everything is perfect/complete as it is.
someone slaps you? no problem, someone robs you? no problem.

Yet people living under desire cannot make sense of this because in our minds it means we're left with 'nothing' whereas what it really means is we're left with 'everything', nothing can be taken away if you understand that all consciousness is one and the same, the logos is in all of us.
Being 'in Christ' means unity of consciousness.
Jesus said you give and you'll have more. So it reminds me of this hindu quote I read
the Tree laden with the most abundant fruit, lowers itself so others can enjoy it's fruit'.
the thing about the tree is, it doesnt desire it's own fruit, it desires the light..and the good thing is God's light is not difficult to receive.
It's only desire that makes us desire fruit and not the light.
 





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#20
The other thing I said was about the accountability of sin vs the nature of sin.
A child is not accountable for sin yet clearly has the nature of sin.
Do you remember being a child and getting pissed off, jealous, craving etc? i do...and from what i have observed all the fucked up kids i ever knew...they were that way when i knew them in nursery and they never changed. Even as adults it's the same nature in them.
we become attached to it our identity and even religion and worship of God is just ameans to expand our identity without most of us realising we're still serving the nafs but through religion/God.


I've not read that book, don't know what it's about.